Front bike rack on buses, heavy bikes

On Monday, September 18, 2017 at 8:19:19 AM UTC-7, sms wrote:
On 9/17/2017 7:54 AM, Joerg wrote:
Thinking about doing rides farther away without carting the bike there
in my car. Or riding out farther and using a bus for some of the way
back. Buses out here have racks for two bikes up front, like this:

http://www.sacbike.dreamhosters.com/...us_No_2395.jpg


Unfortunately the top-holding bar goes over the front wheel where the
emergency dynamo is on my road bike instead of over the seat. Ok, I can
remove that dynamo. However, both my road bike and my MTB are
"rear-heavy" with panniers that contain lots of water, tools and such.
Are they still safe in those racks?

The other question is, El Dorado Transit and others state to "remove
panniers and other baggage to allow safe operation of the bus". My
panniers look detachable but they are not, there is a lot of stuff
underneath that bolts and cinches them in place.

While panniers that attach with stretch cord or springs will routinely
bounce off on rough roads or trails, there are panniers that don't have
that problem. I use the defunct Kangaroo Baggs which have never fallen
off on rough terrain. They're more of a pain to put on and take off but
not terribly difficult.

Arkel has a camlock system that is secure, and they sell a retrofit kit
for other panniers, see
https://www.arkel-od.com/en/cam-lock-hook-kit-pair.html.

But if you want panniers that thieves can't easily steal, bolt-on is a
good idea I guess.

Thieves would cut the lock and take the whole bike, assuming they were in the market for a bike appropriate to the Mad Max post-apocalypse world of Cameron Park -- something with toasted pivots, swing-arms and shocks -- destroyed by the relentless pounding and mountain lion pounces. My commute bike is much more simple and durable: https://cnet1.cbsistatic.com/img/PuI...-skeletron.jpg

-- Jay Beattie.

On Mon, 18 Sep 2017 08:19:12 -0700, sms
wrote:

But if you want panniers that thieves can't easily steal, bolt-on is a
good idea I guess.

I had a similar problem. When I went on service calls on my bicycle,
I was forced to lock the bicycle to something, remove everything that
can be easily removed, and drag everything into my customers office to
prevent theft. While shopping for suitable panniers, I noticed that
they look very much like laptop bags. I had a fair collection of
those, so instead of panniers, I tried various laptop bags. I had to
sew D rings in various places and add cardboard and wire stiffeners.
In general, they work just fine. I usually take a laptop or
Chromebook with me, which I wrap in bubble pack for extra shock
resistance. Also tried brief cases, but they were too big, bulky and
heavy.

I have no idea how they will survive on a bus and I no longer do
service calls on my bicycle.



--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On 9/18/2017 11:25 AM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-09-18 08:19, sms wrote:
On 9/17/2017 7:54 AM, Joerg wrote:
Thinking about doing rides farther away without carting
the bike there
in my car. Or riding out farther and using a bus for some
of the way
back. Buses out here have racks for two bikes up front,
like this:

http://www.sacbike.dreamhosters.com/...us_No_2395.jpg



Unfortunately the top-holding bar goes over the front
wheel where the
emergency dynamo is on my road bike instead of over the
seat. Ok, I
can remove that dynamo. However, both my road bike and my
MTB are
"rear-heavy" with panniers that contain lots of water,
tools and such.
Are they still safe in those racks?

The other question is, El Dorado Transit and others state
to "remove
panniers and other baggage to allow safe operation of the
bus". My
panniers look detachable but they are not, there is a lot
of stuff
underneath that bolts and cinches them in place.

While panniers that attach with stretch cord or springs
will routinely
bounce off on rough roads or trails, there are panniers
that don't have
that problem. I use the defunct Kangaroo Baggs which have
never fallen
off on rough terrain. They're more of a pain to put on and
take off but
not terribly difficult.

Arkel has a camlock system that is secure, and they sell a
retrofit kit
for other panniers, see
https://www.arkel-od.com/en/cam-lock-hook-kit-pair.html.


That only works if the cam has good spring action and holds
with a lot of force. Else it'll jump and rattle, and
eventually fail. A whole lot of force. The other problem is
the bungee which will allow a loaded pannier to flop and
bang sideways during rough rides. On my MTB 80-90% of miles
are rough.

My panniers have four hooks and I slid in a thick Perspex
plate above. It is nicely rounded so won't chafe. Has two
big M6 bolts to a home-made rack "undercarriage". That way
it cannot jump or rattle up an down. The hooks have thick
bicycle tubing over them for nice cushioning. The bungees
are not used but the panniers are solidly affixed to the
vertical struts of the racks.

On the MTB it would take tools and half an hour to assemble
and re-assemble. Not gonna happen, then I keep using my car
instead of changing to public transit.


But if you want panniers that thieves can't easily steal,
bolt-on is a
good idea I guess.


They can still easily open them or slit them with a knife.
This is why I never leave the bike unattended. If a store
doesn't allow me to carry the bike inside I will shop
elsewhere. This is one reason why I only buy online at
Walmart, not in stores. And only when they free-ship to the
house, no ship-to-store because they made me park the bike
outside even there.

On the road bike the battery for lights and stuff rides in
the right pannier so I'd also have to disconnect that. I was
also thinking about carrying a large drinking water
container in the left pannier when I find one with a fitting
shape, with the hose tied to the top tube. That way I
wouldn't have to stop for transfers into the bottle.


Panniers with a bunji which fall off after a bump are so
last century. Since the first Kirtland positive-lock pannier
(c.1987?) almost all quality panniers have a locking feature
of some sort (Lone Peak, Jandd, Ortleib etc). You have to
get down to chinese crapinabox level to find lift-n-drop
panniers nowadays.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

DIG HOLE COVER WITH STICKS

Canadins are inedible

once again we have a glith

the prosed goal is not whining abt design features and your idea of fun ..this is not fun this is discipline as in loading n unloading a sea kayak.

the goal is bus trip to a distant area n ride trail route a recommended by California's experts.

not whining abt design features that will not get you there

the IDEA IS TO GET THERE

like build boats invading England.

NRS has in remote Moscow morhed into kayak/raft/bike

we recommend a Bills Bag for short term protection of a large haul

you can get a weekend in there no prob.

https://www.outdoorplay.com/gear/bac...king-backpacks

On 2017-09-18 10:51, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/18/2017 11:25 AM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-09-18 08:19, sms wrote:
On 9/17/2017 7:54 AM, Joerg wrote:
Thinking about doing rides farther away without carting
the bike there
in my car. Or riding out farther and using a bus for some
of the way
back. Buses out here have racks for two bikes up front,
like this:

http://www.sacbike.dreamhosters.com/...us_No_2395.jpg




Unfortunately the top-holding bar goes over the front
wheel where the
emergency dynamo is on my road bike instead of over the
seat. Ok, I
can remove that dynamo. However, both my road bike and my
MTB are
"rear-heavy" with panniers that contain lots of water,
tools and such.
Are they still safe in those racks?

The other question is, El Dorado Transit and others state
to "remove
panniers and other baggage to allow safe operation of the
bus". My
panniers look detachable but they are not, there is a lot
of stuff
underneath that bolts and cinches them in place.

While panniers that attach with stretch cord or springs
will routinely
bounce off on rough roads or trails, there are panniers
that don't have
that problem. I use the defunct Kangaroo Baggs which have
never fallen
off on rough terrain. They're more of a pain to put on and
take off but
not terribly difficult.

Arkel has a camlock system that is secure, and they sell a
retrofit kit
for other panniers, see
https://www.arkel-od.com/en/cam-lock-hook-kit-pair.html.


That only works if the cam has good spring action and holds
with a lot of force. Else it'll jump and rattle, and
eventually fail. A whole lot of force. The other problem is
the bungee which will allow a loaded pannier to flop and
bang sideways during rough rides. On my MTB 80-90% of miles
are rough.

My panniers have four hooks and I slid in a thick Perspex
plate above. It is nicely rounded so won't chafe. Has two
big M6 bolts to a home-made rack "undercarriage". That way
it cannot jump or rattle up an down. The hooks have thick
bicycle tubing over them for nice cushioning. The bungees
are not used but the panniers are solidly affixed to the
vertical struts of the racks.

On the MTB it would take tools and half an hour to assemble
and re-assemble. Not gonna happen, then I keep using my car
instead of changing to public transit.


But if you want panniers that thieves can't easily steal,
bolt-on is a
good idea I guess.


They can still easily open them or slit them with a knife.
This is why I never leave the bike unattended. If a store
doesn't allow me to carry the bike inside I will shop
elsewhere. This is one reason why I only buy online at
Walmart, not in stores. And only when they free-ship to the
house, no ship-to-store because they made me park the bike
outside even there.

On the road bike the battery for lights and stuff rides in
the right pannier so I'd also have to disconnect that. I was
also thinking about carrying a large drinking water
container in the left pannier when I find one with a fitting
shape, with the hose tied to the top tube. That way I
wouldn't have to stop for transfers into the bottle.


Panniers with a bunji which fall off after a bump are so last century.
Since the first Kirtland positive-lock pannier (c.1987?) almost all
quality panniers have a locking feature of some sort (Lone Peak, Jandd,
Ortleib etc). You have to get down to chinese crapinabox level to find
lift-n-drop panniers nowadays.


Look at the high-end Arkel mount above that Steven posted. That is not a
cheapo vendor but ... bungees.

The "modern" click-and-lock plastic mounts do not provide true clamping.
They lock but have some play and that rattles and wears. Anything that
moves on bikes used off-road a lot wears surprisingly fast. Yesterday I
noticed that my plastic (!) water bottle has managed to abrade a third
of the aluminum off of the inward bottle holder tip.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On Sunday, September 17, 2017 at 10:54:10 AM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
Thinking about doing rides farther away without carting the bike there
in my car. Or riding out farther and using a bus for some of the way
back. Buses out here have racks for two bikes up front, like this:

http://www.sacbike.dreamhosters.com/...us_No_2395.jpg

Unfortunately the top-holding bar goes over the front wheel where the
emergency dynamo is on my road bike instead of over the seat. Ok, I can
remove that dynamo. However, both my road bike and my MTB are
"rear-heavy" with panniers that contain lots of water, tools and such.
Are they still safe in those racks?

The other question is, El Dorado Transit and others state to "remove
panniers and other baggage to allow safe operation of the bus". My
panniers look detachable but they are not, there is a lot of stuff
underneath that bolts and cinches them in place.

What's your experience?

I use OC TRanspo's Rack and Roll occasionally. It works well for me, but our
bicycles are not complicated by panniers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGfz0II6_L8
--
Andrew Chaplin
SIT MIHI GLADIUS SICUT SANCTO MARTINO

On 9/18/2017 12:25 PM, Joerg wrote:


My panniers have four hooks and I slid in a thick Perspex plate above.
It is nicely rounded so won't chafe. Has two big M6 bolts to a home-made
rack "undercarriage". That way it cannot jump or rattle up an down. The
hooks have thick bicycle tubing over them for nice cushioning. The
bungees are not used but the panniers are solidly affixed to the
vertical struts of the racks.

On the MTB it would take tools and half an hour to assemble and
re-assemble. Not gonna happen, then I keep using my car instead of
changing to public transit.


But if you want panniers that thieves can't easily steal, bolt-on is a
good idea I guess.


They can still easily open them or slit them with a knife. This is why I
never leave the bike unattended. If a store doesn't allow me to carry
the bike inside I will shop elsewhere. This is one reason why I only buy
online at Walmart, not in stores. And only when they free-ship to the
house, no ship-to-store because they made me park the bike outside even
there.

On the road bike the battery for lights and stuff rides in the right
pannier so I'd also have to disconnect that. ...

Wow.

I've toured and/or traveled with up to four panniers plus handlbar bag,
in something like 12 countries so far. I shop almost daily using one
bike or another. I've done this for about 45 years now.

So far, my total losses from parked bikes totals three cyclometers -
once from my daughter's bike and my bike parked in front of a restaurant
in Ireland, and once from my bike parked at the local grocery store.
Without the Avocet sensor rings and mounts, they're useless, so I
suspect it was 12-year-old boys in both cases.

In our village, I no longer bother to even lock the bike. I just jam
something into the front brake lever to keep that brake applied.

In less familiar areas, I use a homemade cable that's 1/4" diameter,
with a tiny padlock. I do think carefully about where I park the bike,
though.

(Of course, my lights are permanently bolted on.)

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Sunday, September 17, 2017 at 7:54:10 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
Thinking about doing rides farther away without carting the bike there
in my car. Or riding out farther and using a bus for some of the way
back. Buses out here have racks for two bikes up front, like this:

Dude. Are you not married. Stop turning around and start calling your wife.

On 2017-09-18 13:55, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/18/2017 12:25 PM, Joerg wrote:


My panniers have four hooks and I slid in a thick Perspex plate above.
It is nicely rounded so won't chafe. Has two big M6 bolts to a
home-made rack "undercarriage". That way it cannot jump or rattle up
an down. The hooks have thick bicycle tubing over them for nice
cushioning. The bungees are not used but the panniers are solidly
affixed to the vertical struts of the racks.

On the MTB it would take tools and half an hour to assemble and
re-assemble. Not gonna happen, then I keep using my car instead of
changing to public transit.


But if you want panniers that thieves can't easily steal, bolt-on is a
good idea I guess.


They can still easily open them or slit them with a knife. This is why
I never leave the bike unattended. If a store doesn't allow me to
carry the bike inside I will shop elsewhere. This is one reason why I
only buy online at Walmart, not in stores. And only when they
free-ship to the house, no ship-to-store because they made me park the
bike outside even there.

On the road bike the battery for lights and stuff rides in the right
pannier so I'd also have to disconnect that. ...

Wow.

I've toured and/or traveled with up to four panniers plus handlbar bag,
in something like 12 countries so far. I shop almost daily using one
bike or another. I've done this for about 45 years now.

So far, my total losses from parked bikes totals three cyclometers -
once from my daughter's bike and my bike parked in front of a restaurant
in Ireland, and once from my bike parked at the local grocery store.
Without the Avocet sensor rings and mounts, they're useless, so I
suspect it was 12-year-old boys in both cases.

In our village, I no longer bother to even lock the bike. I just jam
something into the front brake lever to keep that brake applied.


You probably life in a secluded Amish village :-)

I've had a lot of stuff stolen, including a complete road bike which was
tied to a thick wrought iron fence with a massive chain and a
professioanal-grade ABUS pad lock. I have a hunch who it was but
couldn't prove it plus the bike was nowhere to be found.

The topper in the next street was a guy with a fairly old BMW
motorcycle. One morning he came down ... both Bing carburetors gone.
The guy who stole them must have been a BMW lover because he draped
something over the intakes so rain would not enter the cylinders.


In less familiar areas, I use a homemade cable that's 1/4" diameter,
with a tiny padlock. I do think carefully about where I park the bike,
though.


At our larger stores there are often some shady folks milling about,
with nothing to do all day long. Leaving a nice bike or one with
enticing accessories unattended is calling for trouble. I just don't
want to have my tool set or other stuff pilfered.


(Of course, my lights are permanently bolted on.)


That makes no difference to a serial thief. They will instantly know
whetehr the light is a ritzy-glitzy one or a $10 light and then decide.
No matter how it is mounted.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On 2017-09-18 13:41, wrote:
On Sunday, September 17, 2017 at 10:54:10 AM UTC-4, Joerg wrote:
Thinking about doing rides farther away without carting the bike there
in my car. Or riding out farther and using a bus for some of the way
back. Buses out here have racks for two bikes up front, like this:

http://www.sacbike.dreamhosters.com/...us_No_2395.jpg

Unfortunately the top-holding bar goes over the front wheel where the
emergency dynamo is on my road bike instead of over the seat. Ok, I can
remove that dynamo. However, both my road bike and my MTB are
"rear-heavy" with panniers that contain lots of water, tools and such.
Are they still safe in those racks?

The other question is, El Dorado Transit and others state to "remove
panniers and other baggage to allow safe operation of the bus". My
panniers look detachable but they are not, there is a lot of stuff
underneath that bolts and cinches them in place.

What's your experience?

I use OC TRanspo's Rack and Roll occasionally. It works well for me, but our
bicycles are not complicated by panniers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGfz0II6_L8


Only from May to October? Are you guys all fair weather riders? :-)

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/