New Brooks B17 Conditioning Question

I found that new Brooks saddles are comfortable enough so a little bit
of Proofide is sufficient. However, I picked up several old Brooks
saddles on Ebay which were uniformly hard as rocks, and even soaking
one of those in neatsfoot oil overnight did nothing but turn the honey
leather an ugly dull black without any softening whatsoever.

Tim McNamara wrote:
In article om,
wrote:

neetsfoot oil works with repeated applications. Turn the bike or
saddle upside down and use a 1" paint brush to brush a liberal amount
on the entire raw leather. Repeat this 6 to 15 times and letting it
soak in overnight between applications. After the first 3 or 4
ride thesaddle to work the oil in. If,by some miracle it gets too
soft tighten the bolt underrneath the nose of the saddle.

This is a recipe for a ruined Brooks saddle.

wrote:

[snip]

I have a farm/ranch background, and as far as I know, saddles for
horses are still exclusively made of leather. I'm thinkin', there must
be a good reason for this, since those guys are riding for days /
weeks, in all kinds of weather. They can't be obsessed with whether it
will rain or not. Leather must be a time-tested material for quality
saddles (horse or bike).

[snip]

Dear JB,

Er . . . that may be last century thinking.

Google for saddle and kevlar, and you'll find plenty of companies
making saddles for horses out of materials that seem to work better
than leather. Here's a lengthy spec sheet that details both leather and
non-leather saddles:

http://www.avocet.com/saddlepages/saddlespecs.html

The same is true for sheaths and holsters:

http://www.holsterusa.com

Even buggy whips use modern materials:

http://www.aswgt.com/buggywhip.html

Cheers,

Carl Fogel

On 6 Sep 2006 18:59:11 -0700, wrote:


wrote:

[snip]

I have a farm/ranch background, and as far as I know, saddles for
horses are still exclusively made of leather. I'm thinkin', there must
be a good reason for this, since those guys are riding for days /
weeks, in all kinds of weather. They can't be obsessed with whether it
will rain or not. Leather must be a time-tested material for quality
saddles (horse or bike).

[snip]

Dear JB,

Er . . . that may be last century thinking.

Google for saddle and kevlar, and you'll find plenty of companies
making saddles for horses out of materials that seem to work better
than leather. Here's a lengthy spec sheet that details both leather and
non-leather saddles:

http://www.avocet.com/saddlepages/saddlespecs.html

The same is true for sheaths and holsters:

http://www.holsterusa.com

Even buggy whips use modern materials:

http://www.aswgt.com/buggywhip.html

Cheers,

Carl Fogel

Aaargh! That's what I get for not checking links from my clipboard.
That's a bicycle saddle page, not a horse saddle page.

Rather than try to find the horse page again, I just googled once more
and grabbed the first one that I saw:

http://www.horse.com/products/sku-WKA40__dept-17.html

This link I checked--genuine synthetic western saddle.

CF

Hi Carl,

I am so sorry to hear this. The smell of authentic leather in a saddle
shop is near and dear to my heart, from early childhood. My uncle owned
such a shop.

Nevertheless, I think a Brooks saddle is the best solution for what I
need. I will, of course, report back, after I give it a go.

- Jay


wrote:
wrote:

[snip]

I have a farm/ranch background, and as far as I know, saddles for
horses are still exclusively made of leather. I'm thinkin', there must
be a good reason for this, since those guys are riding for days /
weeks, in all kinds of weather. They can't be obsessed with whether it
will rain or not. Leather must be a time-tested material for quality
saddles (horse or bike).

[snip]

Dear JB,

Er . . . that may be last century thinking.

Google for saddle and kevlar, and you'll find plenty of companies
making saddles for horses out of materials that seem to work better
than leather. Here's a lengthy spec sheet that details both leather and
non-leather saddles:

http://www.avocet.com/saddlepages/saddlespecs.html

The same is true for sheaths and holsters:

http://www.holsterusa.com

Even buggy whips use modern materials:

http://www.aswgt.com/buggywhip.html

Cheers,

Carl Fogel

On 6 Sep 2006 19:27:25 -0700, "
wrote:

Hi Carl,

I am so sorry to hear this. The smell of authentic leather in a saddle
shop is near and dear to my heart, from early childhood. My uncle owned
such a shop.

Nevertheless, I think a Brooks saddle is the best solution for what I
need. I will, of course, report back, after I give it a go.

- Jay


wrote:
wrote:

[snip]

I have a farm/ranch background, and as far as I know, saddles for
horses are still exclusively made of leather. I'm thinkin', there must
be a good reason for this, since those guys are riding for days /
weeks, in all kinds of weather. They can't be obsessed with whether it
will rain or not. Leather must be a time-tested material for quality
saddles (horse or bike).

[snip]

Dear JB,

Er . . . that may be last century thinking.

Google for saddle and kevlar, and you'll find plenty of companies
making saddles for horses out of materials that seem to work better
than leather. Here's a lengthy spec sheet that details both leather and
non-leather saddles:

http://www.avocet.com/saddlepages/saddlespecs.html

The same is true for sheaths and holsters:

http://www.holsterusa.com

Even buggy whips use modern materials:

http://www.aswgt.com/buggywhip.html

Cheers,

Carl Fogel

Dear Jay,

I think that you'll be pleased with a Brooks saddle.

Many posters on RBT--heavy, hard-riding, long-distance cyclists--are
passionate about their leather Brooks saddles.

How much is the leather, how much is the design, and how much is the
mystique and nostalgia doesn't matter if the bike seat feels good to
the rider.

Here's a link to a modern tack company:

http://www.wintec.net.au/products/index.html

To get an idea of how widespread synthetic horse saddles are, browse
he

http://www.wintec.net.au/whereToBuy/index.html

If you look at bicycle stuff, ski equipment, and outdoor camping gear,
leather has pretty much vanished where fashion and tradition don't
support it.

But leather Brooks bicycle saddles support riders quite well (as long
as the leather stays dry), so you should do fine.

Cheers,

Carl Fogel

In article ,
"(PeteCresswell)" wrote:

Per Tim McNamara:
My next saddle of choice is the Lepper Voyageur, which is very
similar in construction, but with hollow steel rails and frame.

Does measure any wider than a B-17?

Nope, it's narrower. About like a Brooks Pro.

Hello, Jay. I'm coming late to this thread, so my contribution may be
redundant. In any event, here it is: if the weather looks threatening,
stuff a plastic baggie (of the supermarket/convenience store variety)
under your Brooks saddle. A little rain won't hurt the leather, but if
the rain starts to come down too hard, slip the baggie over the saddle,
tie the handles underneath, and you've got a quite satisfactory rain
cover at an unbeatable price.

FWIW, my B17 was comfortable right out of the box (the B17 has been
aptly described as "like sitting in a hammock" ); after some miles, my
Swift is fine; I apply Proofride to both saddles once or twice a year.
My second suggestion is not to obsess about your Brooks too much:
simply ride it to give it a chance to break in. Regards, Roy Zipris

On 6 Sep 2006 17:02:20 -0700, "
wrote:

Leather saddles require a little EFFORT
and THOUGHT on the part of the rider/owner. They also require a little
time spent with the prospective bike owner at bike sale time, by a bike
salesman who probably has little more than a friendly smile working for
him (little technical knowledge of saddles or any other bike
components). So this is just another example of our USA society/culture
being dumbed down to the lowest common denominator.

If the leather saddle is the only thing that will work for the rider,
then your comments are well taken. But if other, easier to
own/manage/pick saddles work just as well, I don't see the point.

There are all sorts of skill people had in the past that I have no
need for myself because some things are simpler/easier. As long as we
spend the attention that this simplification spares on other useful
things, that's good. That's progress.

JT


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On 6 Sep 2006 18:59:11 -0700, wrote:

Even buggy whips use modern materials:

Kids these days are forgetting how to take care of leather buggy whips
and it's a shame, a damn shame.

JT

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wrote in message
ups.com...
I am anxiously awaiting delivery of a Brooks B17 CS
http://www.wallbike.com/b17cscopper.html . My stock OEM Velo seat is
not terribly uncomfortable for rides less than 30 minutes, but any
longer than that, I suspect I am sitting on a piece of junk. I am not
in terrible pain at that point, but there is some discomfort. I am
6'4", 225lbs. I use this bike mainly to commute on city streets, 5
miles twice daily.

I am trying to get a feel for how many people have trouble adjusting
to
new Brooks saddles. There are certainly many previous threads in RBT
about Brooks saddles. Some people report they can use these saddles
with little or no break-in. Others report that no matter what they do,
they can't get used to the saddle, despite their best efforts at
conditioning the leather.

Sheldon Browne suggests the fastest way to break in a new leather
saddle is to *soak* it in neatsfoot oil
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/leather.html . I already ordered the
Proofide, so I could do that as an alternative.

snip

Use caution with "neatsfoot oil". The real stuff is a waxy fatty product
rendered from calf's feet bones. Most of the stuff I've seen or used was
a petroleum based oil that trashed several good saddles. If you do a web
search you can find real neatsfoot oil.

I've been using Brooks Profhide for years on my leather saddles. I put
enough on the underside to completely cover the exposed leather. I use
an old tooth brush to get it into the areas covered by the metal frame.
I also hit it briefly with a little heat from a hair drier to make sure
it gets into those areas.

Good luck,

Chas.