Ross Signature Frame

I purchased a small Ross Signature frame to build a bike for my wife. It still has the original decals on it, but the black paint is far from perfect and I'd like
to paint it a prettier color for her, like lavender or something. If I strip it and paint it, will it automatically lose value or does it matter, if at some future point when we might want to sell it if it has the original decals or not. Also, the components, I'll be putting on it will not all be correct to the original (I'm making it more of an upright). Thanks for your input!

On 2/8/2021 12:09 PM, Diana King wrote:
I purchased a small Ross Signature frame to build a bike for my wife. It still has the original decals on it, but the black paint is far from perfect and I'd like
to paint it a prettier color for her, like lavender or something. If I strip it and paint it, will it automatically lose value or does it matter, if at some future point when we might want to sell it if it has the original decals or not. Also, the components, I'll be putting on it will not all be correct to the original (I'm making it more of an upright). Thanks for your input!


Everyone will have an opinion, there is no objective correct
answer.

IMHO, a nice glossy color you like is a good choice. My
daughter's formerly boring silver grey bike is now purple pearl:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...st/raly19i.jpg

in re 'lavender or something'
This was custom matched to the bedroom wall paint sample
card of the 14 year old girl who rides it:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/uni15f.jpg

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 10:09:52 AM UTC-8, Diana King wrote:
I purchased a small Ross Signature frame to build a bike for my wife. It still has the original decals on it, but the black paint is far from perfect and I'd like
to paint it a prettier color for her, like lavender or something. If I strip it and paint it, will it automatically lose value or does it matter, if at some future point when we might want to sell it if it has the original decals or not. Also, the components, I'll be putting on it will not all be correct to the original (I'm making it more of an upright). Thanks for your input!

If it is a hand-built frame by Tom Kellogg or Jim Redcay and has one of their signatures, a collector may want to see that and may want the frame untouched -- you would also want to sell it to a collector and get your wife something else. https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...lds-531-a.html If you keep it and its a gift to your wife, let her make the decision.

If its a later Taiwanese or Japanese frame, then paint away IMO. https://i..redd.it/s9jremym8jz41.jpg

-- Jay Beattie.

On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 10:27:59 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
On 2/8/2021 12:09 PM, Diana King wrote:
I purchased a small Ross Signature frame to build a bike for my wife. It still has the original decals on it, but the black paint is far from perfect and I'd like
to paint it a prettier color for her, like lavender or something. If I strip it and paint it, will it automatically lose value or does it matter, if at some future point when we might want to sell it if it has the original decals or not. Also, the components, I'll be putting on it will not all be correct to the original (I'm making it more of an upright). Thanks for your input!

Everyone will have an opinion, there is no objective correct
answer.

IMHO, a nice glossy color you like is a good choice. My
daughter's formerly boring silver grey bike is now purple pearl:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...st/raly19i.jpg

in re 'lavender or something'
This was custom matched to the bedroom wall paint sample
card of the 14 year old girl who rides it:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/uni15f.jpg

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
I might like to make a point - the problem with paint is that it is thin and easily scratches even with a very good paint job. If you live in a somewhat metropolitan area you can probably find a powder coating shop. While they normally stick to blacks and whites powder coating is available in pretty much any color you like including pearl and metallic. Strip the frame down and put temperature resistant tape in and over any threads and you can usually get a very good powder coating job for $150 as opposed to a $1200 job from D&D custom bike paint shop with new decals and covered in clear coat to prevent the decals from peeling over time. It is pretty difficult to scratch powder coat and usually you can even get two tone for a slight extra cost. The new decals are usually available om-line for about $40.

On 2/8/2021 12:54 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 10:27:59 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
On 2/8/2021 12:09 PM, Diana King wrote:
I purchased a small Ross Signature frame to build a bike for my wife. It still has the original decals on it, but the black paint is far from perfect and I'd like
to paint it a prettier color for her, like lavender or something. If I strip it and paint it, will it automatically lose value or does it matter, if at some future point when we might want to sell it if it has the original decals or not. Also, the components, I'll be putting on it will not all be correct to the original (I'm making it more of an upright). Thanks for your input!

Everyone will have an opinion, there is no objective correct
answer.

IMHO, a nice glossy color you like is a good choice. My
daughter's formerly boring silver grey bike is now purple pearl:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...st/raly19i.jpg

in re 'lavender or something'
This was custom matched to the bedroom wall paint sample
card of the 14 year old girl who rides it:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/uni15f.jpg


I might like to make a point - the problem with paint is that it is thin and easily scratches even with a very good paint job. If you live in a somewhat metropolitan area you can probably find a powder coating shop. While they normally stick to blacks and whites powder coating is available in pretty much any color you like including pearl and metallic. Strip the frame down and put temperature resistant tape in and over any threads and you can usually get a very good powder coating job for $150 as opposed to a $1200 job from D&D custom bike paint shop with new decals and covered in clear coat to prevent the decals from peeling over time. It is pretty difficult to scratch powder coat and usually you can even get two tone for a slight extra cost. The new decals are usually available om-line for about $40.


A great example of taste.
Powder has its own collection of troubles and I for one want
no part of it.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

AMuzi wrote:
On 2/8/2021 12:09 PM, Diana King wrote:
I purchased a small Ross Signature frame to build a bike for my wife.
It still has the original decals on it, but the black paint is far from
perfect and I'd like
to paint it a prettier color for her, like lavender or something. If I
strip it and paint it, will it automatically lose value or does it
matter, if at some future point when we might want to sell it if it has
the original decals or not. Also, the components, I'll be putting on it
will not all be correct to the original (I'm making it more of an
upright). Thanks for your input!


Everyone will have an opinion, there is no objective correct
answer.

IMHO, a nice glossy color you like is a good choice. My
daughter's formerly boring silver grey bike is now purple pearl:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...st/raly19i.jpg

in re 'lavender or something'
This was custom matched to the bedroom wall paint sample
card of the 14 year old girl who rides it:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/uni15f.jpg


Andrew, nice colours on those frames. What type of paint do you use? I
keep going back to the Dupli-color rattle cans because it seems that all
the “good� paints require SCBA gear and paint booths to avoid killing
yourself (or family members) off.

On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 2:17:09 PM UTC-6, Ralph Barone wrote:
AMuzi wrote:
On 2/8/2021 12:09 PM, Diana King wrote:
I purchased a small Ross Signature frame to build a bike for my wife.
It still has the original decals on it, but the black paint is far from
perfect and I'd like
to paint it a prettier color for her, like lavender or something. If I
strip it and paint it, will it automatically lose value or does it
matter, if at some future point when we might want to sell it if it has
the original decals or not. Also, the components, I'll be putting on it
will not all be correct to the original (I'm making it more of an
upright). Thanks for your input!


Everyone will have an opinion, there is no objective correct
answer.

IMHO, a nice glossy color you like is a good choice. My
daughter's formerly boring silver grey bike is now purple pearl:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...st/raly19i.jpg

in re 'lavender or something'
This was custom matched to the bedroom wall paint sample
card of the 14 year old girl who rides it:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/uni15f.jpg

Andrew, nice colours on those frames. What type of paint do you use? I
keep going back to the Dupli-color rattle cans because it seems that all
the “good� paints require SCBA gear and paint booths to avoid killing
yourself (or family members) off.
Thanks for the advice. The question is whether or not to strip the paint and redo the frame in another color regardless of the technique. It's a 294s frame with Ishiwata tubing, the decals are in nice shape, but the ROSS on the sides of the down tubes look painted on. The paint is okay in places but there is evidence of rust on the chain stays and certain other areas. There is there is no indication of anybody's signature. I wonder if I can remove and replace the decals or if they are available as replacements or if it's worth it. I have another XL Ross frame with really nice Shimano group set, that I intend to swap over to the smaller frame.. What do you think?

On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 1:09:52 PM UTC-5, Diana King wrote:
I purchased a small Ross Signature frame to build a bike for my wife. It still has the original decals on it, but the black paint is far from perfect and I'd like
to paint it a prettier color for her, like lavender or something. If I strip it and paint it, will it automatically lose value or does it matter, if at some future point when we might want to sell it if it has the original decals or not. Also, the components, I'll be putting on it will not all be correct to the original (I'm making it more of an upright). Thanks for your input!


Hi Diana,
It would be helpful if you could give us just a little bit more information.. If there are any numbers on the bottom bracket, post those. It will tell us what model and what year. There are two models of the Ross Signature, the 508 and the 290 series. The 508 could be of value to a collector, the 290s, not so much. Still, the 508 paint would have to be near perfect in order for it to have any real value. Based on what you've told us, repainting probably won't hurt it, and decals are available from Velocal https://velocals.com/ross-bicycle-do...choose-colors/

The 508 was originally designed by Tom Kellog and built by Jeff Duser. Kellog left Ross in '83 (I think) to start Spectrum Cycles and left Jeff running the hand-built line under Jim Redcay. A couple of years later, Kellog hired Duser to work for him exclusively. That's when Redcay hired a couple of other builders and a master painter (the 'triad'). So, the early 508 is of value is because it's essentially a Tom Kellog frame hand built by Jeff Duser, I was told those ones were Columbus SL tubing. The later 508s aren't worth as much, since they weren't built Duser, and Jim Redcay switched over to Ishiwata 022 tubing. In terms of quality, the Ishiwata tubing is as good as the Columbus SL (even Tom Kellog called Ishiwata 022 "some of the finest tubing made"), but it doesn't carry the 'cache' of columbus tubing. The 508s came with Campy NR components, or Shimano 600, depending on the year.

The 290s were mass produced in Taiwan. It's the same geometry as the 508, but with more generic high carbon steel. It's still a very nice riding bike, just not up to the 508 level.

The reason I know all this is that I have a 1984 model 508. It was built by Duser. I got all this information from Tom Kellog after I bought the bike.. Kellog is an exceptional frame designer. He was hired by Merlin Metalworks in Cambridge MA to design their first titanium road frame. I have one of those too, a 1989 model. I'm not exaggerating when I tell you that ross frame feels nearly as nice as the merlin. For the most part, I can't really tell the difference.

On 2/8/2021 2:17 PM, Ralph Barone wrote:
AMuzi wrote:
On 2/8/2021 12:09 PM, Diana King wrote:
I purchased a small Ross Signature frame to build a bike for my wife.
It still has the original decals on it, but the black paint is far from
perfect and I'd like
to paint it a prettier color for her, like lavender or something. If I
strip it and paint it, will it automatically lose value or does it
matter, if at some future point when we might want to sell it if it has
the original decals or not. Also, the components, I'll be putting on it
will not all be correct to the original (I'm making it more of an
upright). Thanks for your input!


Everyone will have an opinion, there is no objective correct
answer.

IMHO, a nice glossy color you like is a good choice. My
daughter's formerly boring silver grey bike is now purple pearl:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...st/raly19i.jpg

in re 'lavender or something'
This was custom matched to the bedroom wall paint sample
card of the 14 year old girl who rides it:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/uni15f.jpg


Andrew, nice colours on those frames. What type of paint do you use? I
keep going back to the Dupli-color rattle cans because it seems that all
the “good� paints require SCBA gear and paint booths to avoid killing
yourself (or family members) off.


We use aerosol hardware store primer and color (free) over
minor braze repairs. Krylon's not expensive and it's not
excellent but free is a very good price:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...st/cantsv2.jpg

We shoot actual paint by Akzo(DuPont) same as body shops
shoot but we charge for it.
http://www.yellowjersey.org/g'boue1.jpg

Real paint isn't cheap in itself but labor is 80% of the
cost, just as in painting a car.

As with many processes (lead or cadmium work, cotton
polishing wheels, asbestos, benzene, metyl chloride and so
on) if you have health concerns then by all means follow the
various safety protocols suggested.


--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 2/8/2021 2:43 PM, Diana King wrote:
On Monday, February 8, 2021 at 2:17:09 PM UTC-6, Ralph Barone wrote:
AMuzi wrote:
On 2/8/2021 12:09 PM, Diana King wrote:
I purchased a small Ross Signature frame to build a bike for my wife.
It still has the original decals on it, but the black paint is far from
perfect and I'd like
to paint it a prettier color for her, like lavender or something. If I
strip it and paint it, will it automatically lose value or does it
matter, if at some future point when we might want to sell it if it has
the original decals or not. Also, the components, I'll be putting on it
will not all be correct to the original (I'm making it more of an
upright). Thanks for your input!


Everyone will have an opinion, there is no objective correct
answer.

IMHO, a nice glossy color you like is a good choice. My
daughter's formerly boring silver grey bike is now purple pearl:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/photosfr...st/raly19i.jpg

in re 'lavender or something'
This was custom matched to the bedroom wall paint sample
card of the 14 year old girl who rides it:
http://www.yellowjersey.org/uni15f.jpg

Andrew, nice colours on those frames. What type of paint do you use? I
keep going back to the Dupli-color rattle cans because it seems that all
the “good� paints require SCBA gear and paint booths to avoid killing
yourself (or family members) off.
Thanks for the advice. The question is whether or not to strip the paint and redo the frame in another color regardless of the technique. It's a 294s frame with Ishiwata tubing, the decals are in nice shape, but the ROSS on the sides of the down tubes look painted on. The paint is okay in places but there is evidence of rust on the chain stays and certain other areas. There is there is no indication of anybody's signature. I wonder if I can remove and replace the decals or if they are available as replacements or if it's worth it. I have another XL Ross frame with really nice Shimano group set, that I intend to swap over to the smaller frame.. What do you think?


Speaking only for myself, it's a Ross.

I'd strip it, clean up the rusty bits, spend a day
reflecting on any brazed bits to add or remove and then acid
wash, primer, wetsand and some color you and/or the rider
like better.

If you think it looks naked without graphics, aftermarket
vinyl replicas can stick over your paint any time.

If it were a mid-1950s Cinelli with some little scuffs on
original paint, my opinion would be to wash it and then wax it.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971