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Everybody is Out
On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 15:22:15 -0500, AMuzi wrote:
Oh, yes. Chemicals! Like COOH and H2O and the dread O2, right? Killers all COOH as in a carboxyl ion? Methinks you might mean CO2 as in carbon dioxide, the dreaded gas that produces global warming and soda water bubbles. Also, CO2 and O2 are both gases, not chemicals. I guess you could call H20 (dihydrogen monoxide) a chemical, but it seem a little odd: https://www.dhmo.org/facts.html -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
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#22
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Everybody is Out
On 3/23/2020 3:27 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Monday, 23 March 2020 16:22:22 UTC-4, AMuzi wrote: On 3/23/2020 2:58 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, 23 March 2020 15:47:39 UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 08:59:17 -0700, sms wrote: Remember to think outside the box when buying stuff like bleach and alcohol. Stores may be out of bleach but there is no shortage of pool chlorine which is the same thing, just more highly concentrated. I bought some 99.9% isopropyl alcohol at an electronics store, and it's better to use the higher concentration because you can use more aloe vera and it's less watery. NO, NO, NO! Pool chlorine is HCl (Hydrochrloric Acid) and is not the same as bleach NaClO (Sodium hypochlorite). These are very different chemicals. If you wash your countertops or furniture with even dilute HCl, you're going to wreck the finish, your hands, or both. Neither of these is a suitable substitute for alcohol or ethenol in electronics. I don't know where you found this wrong and dangerous information, but I suggest you go back to the source and tell them its wrong before someone gets hurt.. -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 https://www.pooldone.com/bleach-vs-c...ts-difference/ "Both chlorine and bleach contain calcium hypochlorite chlorine , which are disinfecting materials. There is about 5.25% chlorine content in bleach, while the remaining percentage is water and salt to keep the bleach in a liquid state. Whereas for chlorine, it contains calcium hypochlorite chlorine at around a 65% strength, made of solid instead of any other matter. Chlorine also contains more inert ingredients to add power into disinfecting pools." -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- https://www.compoundchem.com/2014/07...ning-products/ "Sodium hypochlorite is a solid white powder, but is more commonly used dissolved in water. Solutions of sodium hypochlorite are commonly referred to as bleach, although household bleach also contains small amounts of several other compounds, including sodium hydroxide and calcium hypochlorite. Sodium hypochlorite generally makes up 3-8% of the volume; dissolved in water, it has a strongly alkaline pH, which can irritate the skin. The idea of strong acids causing burns is common knowledge, but in fact, strong alkalis can be just as dangerous, and concentrated bleach is at a high enough pH to cause burns to the skin on contact. Sodium hypochlorite dissolved in water also forms hypochlorous acid, HOCl, a weak acid but strong oxidising agent which is responsible for bleach’s bleaching effect. Hypochlorous acid can react with dyes in clothes, breaking bonds and preventing the molecule from absorbing visible light. It also has antimicrobial activity, as it can react with proteins and DNA of bacteria, as well as breaking down their cell membranes. A very low concentration of hypochlorous acid is required to achieve this effect. You’re probably aware that it’s common advice not to mix household cleaning products, due to the potentially dangerous reactions that can take place. As an example, some toilet cleaners may contain hydrochloric acid. If these are mixed with bleach, it can react with sodium hypochlorite, and form toxic chlorine gas. Even mixing small amounts of these cleaners can result in the production of a volume of chlorine gas, a lung irritant, above safe levels. Ammonia containing cleaning products can also react with bleach to produce toxic chloroamines." ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Be very careful using chemicals. Oh, yes. Chemicals! Like COOH and H2O and the dread O2, right? Killers all HAH, HAH! Actually, under the right conditions it can take very little H2o to kill a person. LOL In USA, 3500+ drown not involving boats, another 300+ in (or maybe not actually in!) boats: http://www.classicrendezvous.com/Fra...dourdoigne.htm The occasional dead hyponatremic athlete gets all the headlines but water, a dangerous chemical, kills every day. -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
#23
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Everybody is Out
On 3/23/2020 3:47 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 15:22:15 -0500, AMuzi wrote: Oh, yes. Chemicals! Like COOH and H2O and the dread O2, right? Killers all COOH as in a carboxyl ion? Methinks you might mean CO2 as in carbon dioxide, the dreaded gas that produces global warming and soda water bubbles. Also, CO2 and O2 are both gases, not chemicals. I guess you could call H20 (dihydrogen monoxide) a chemical, but it seem a little odd: https://www.dhmo.org/facts.html Thank you; I was wrong. Ethanol : CH3CH2OH -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
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Everybody is Out
On Monday, March 23, 2020 at 12:53:35 PM UTC-7, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 12:16:57 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich wrote: On Monday, March 23, 2020 at 12:12:18 PM UTC-7, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 10:19:05 -0700, "Mark J." wrote: Watch for fever. The advice I've seen is that if you see COVID symptoms, you should curtail vigorous exercise which might push it deeper into your lungs, though I grant that's mostly speculative. Mark J. Also, watch out for loss of sense of smell and taste: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/22/health/coronavirus-symptoms-smell-taste.html It's only in about 30% of confirmed cases, but it might be a useful indicator. Man's DNA makes everyone unique and generally symptoms very quite a bit from individual to individual. Very true. Here's a good video on the initial symptoms and some numbers: "What Coronavirus Symptoms Look Like, Day By Day" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOJqHPfG7pA I had two PEs following a DVT resulting from an ankle surgery (fractured skiing), the second PE following early termination of anticoagulants after the first. I can say based on personal knowledge that not being able to breathe sucks. It is exactly the way I don't want to go out. My second PE was a giant saddle embolus with a really high mortality rate, and I chalk-up my survival to cycling and otherwise good lung function -- and heparin. Drugs and cycling will keep you alive -- ask any TdF rider. BTW, getting a contrast chest CT is an experience with the whirring apparatus, and the dual cylinders pushing contrast in your veins which, for some reason, concludes with the sensation of having a hot poker in your ass. You want to avoid that, or pay extra for it (depending on who you are). At least I didn't get a ventilator or ECMO. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJUhlRoBL8M On my next ride, I'm wearing my Corona jersey. https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/cNgAA...gj~/s-l300.jpg One of my few Eurotrash jerseys. -- Jay Beattie. |
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On 3/23/2020 4:20 PM, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/23/2020 3:27 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, 23 March 2020 16:22:22 UTC-4, AMuzi wrote: On 3/23/2020 2:58 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, 23 March 2020 15:47:39 UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 08:59:17 -0700, sms wrote: Remember to think outside the box when buying stuff like bleach and alcohol. Stores may be out of bleach but there is no shortage of pool chlorine which is the same thing, just more highly concentrated. I bought some 99.9% isopropyl alcohol at an electronics store, and it's better to use the higher concentration because you can use more aloe vera and it's less watery. NO, NO, NO! Pool chlorine is HCl (Hydrochrloric Acid) and is not the same as bleach NaClO (Sodium hypochlorite). These are very different chemicals. If you wash your countertops or furniture with even dilute HCl, you're going to wreck the finish, your hands, or both. Neither of these is a suitable substitute for alcohol or ethenol in electronics. I don't know where you found this wrong and dangerous information, but I suggest you go back to the source and tell them its wrong before someone gets hurt.. -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 https://www.pooldone.com/bleach-vs-c...ts-difference/ "Both chlorine and bleach contain calcium hypochlorite chlorine , which are disinfecting materials. There is about 5.25% chlorine content in bleach, while the remaining percentage is water and salt to keep the bleach in a liquid state. Whereas for chlorine, it contains calcium hypochlorite chlorine at around a 65% strength, made of solid instead of any other matter. Chlorine also contains more inert ingredients to add power into disinfecting pools." -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- https://www.compoundchem.com/2014/07...ning-products/ "Sodium hypochlorite is a solid white powder, but is more commonly used dissolved in water. Solutions of sodium hypochlorite are commonly referred to as bleach, although household bleach also contains small amounts of several other compounds, including sodium hydroxide and calcium hypochlorite. Sodium hypochlorite generally makes up 3-8% of the volume; dissolved in water, it has a strongly alkaline pH, which can irritate the skin. The idea of strong acids causing burns is common knowledge, but in fact, strong alkalis can be just as dangerous, and concentrated bleach is at a high enough pH to cause burns to the skin on contact. Sodium hypochlorite dissolved in water also forms hypochlorous acid, HOCl, a weak acid but strong oxidising agent which is responsible for bleach’s bleaching effect. Hypochlorous acid can react with dyes in clothes, breaking bonds and preventing the molecule from absorbing visible light. It also has antimicrobial activity, as it can react with proteins and DNA of bacteria, as well as breaking down their cell membranes. A very low concentration of hypochlorous acid is required to achieve this effect. You’re probably aware that it’s common advice not to mix household cleaning products, due to the potentially dangerous reactions that can take place. As an example, some toilet cleaners may contain hydrochloric acid. If these are mixed with bleach, it can react with sodium hypochlorite, and form toxic chlorine gas. Even mixing small amounts of these cleaners can result in the production of a volume of chlorine gas, a lung irritant, above safe levels. Ammonia containing cleaning products can also react with bleach to produce toxic chloroamines." ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Be very careful using chemicals. Oh, yes. Chemicals! Like COOH and H2O and the dread O2, right? Killers all HAH, HAH! Actually, under the right conditions it can take very little H2o to kill a person. LOL In USA, 3500+ drown not involving boats, another 300+ in (or maybe not actually in!) boats: http://www.all_f**ked_up.com The occasional dead hyponatremic athlete gets all the headlines but water, a dangerous chemical, kills every day. drat. Pasted link from a different conversation. Should have been: https://www.colinshope.org/water-saf...ng-statistics/ -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
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Everybody is Out
On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 17:25:33 -0500, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/23/2020 4:20 PM, AMuzi wrote: On 3/23/2020 3:27 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, 23 March 2020 16:22:22 UTC-4, AMuzi wrote: On 3/23/2020 2:58 PM, Sir Ridesalot wrote: On Monday, 23 March 2020 15:47:39 UTC-4, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 08:59:17 -0700, sms wrote: Remember to think outside the box when buying stuff like bleach and alcohol. Stores may be out of bleach but there is no shortage of pool chlorine which is the same thing, just more highly concentrated. I bought some 99.9% isopropyl alcohol at an electronics store, and it's better to use the higher concentration because you can use more aloe vera and it's less watery. NO, NO, NO! Pool chlorine is HCl (Hydrochrloric Acid) and is not the same as bleach NaClO (Sodium hypochlorite). These are very different chemicals. If you wash your countertops or furniture with even dilute HCl, you're going to wreck the finish, your hands, or both. Neither of these is a suitable substitute for alcohol or ethenol in electronics. I don't know where you found this wrong and dangerous information, but I suggest you go back to the source and tell them its wrong before someone gets hurt.. -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 https://www.pooldone.com/bleach-vs-c...ts-difference/ "Both chlorine and bleach contain calcium hypochlorite chlorine , which are disinfecting materials. There is about 5.25% chlorine content in bleach, while the remaining percentage is water and salt to keep the bleach in a liquid state. Whereas for chlorine, it contains calcium hypochlorite chlorine at around a 65% strength, made of solid instead of any other matter. Chlorine also contains more inert ingredients to add power into disinfecting pools." -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- https://www.compoundchem.com/2014/07...ning-products/ "Sodium hypochlorite is a solid white powder, but is more commonly used dissolved in water. Solutions of sodium hypochlorite are commonly referred to as bleach, although household bleach also contains small amounts of several other compounds, including sodium hydroxide and calcium hypochlorite. Sodium hypochlorite generally makes up 3-8% of the volume; dissolved in water, it has a strongly alkaline pH, which can irritate the skin. The idea of strong acids causing burns is common knowledge, but in fact, strong alkalis can be just as dangerous, and concentrated bleach is at a high enough pH to cause burns to the skin on contact. Sodium hypochlorite dissolved in water also forms hypochlorous acid, HOCl, a weak acid but strong oxidising agent which is responsible for bleach’s bleaching effect. Hypochlorous acid can react with dyes in clothes, breaking bonds and preventing the molecule from absorbing visible light. It also has antimicrobial activity, as it can react with proteins and DNA of bacteria, as well as breaking down their cell membranes. A very low concentration of hypochlorous acid is required to achieve this effect. You’re probably aware that it’s common advice not to mix household cleaning products, due to the potentially dangerous reactions that can take place. As an example, some toilet cleaners may contain hydrochloric acid. If these are mixed with bleach, it can react with sodium hypochlorite, and form toxic chlorine gas. Even mixing small amounts of these cleaners can result in the production of a volume of chlorine gas, a lung irritant, above safe levels. Ammonia containing cleaning products can also react with bleach to produce toxic chloroamines." ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Be very careful using chemicals. Oh, yes. Chemicals! Like COOH and H2O and the dread O2, right? Killers all HAH, HAH! Actually, under the right conditions it can take very little H2o to kill a person. LOL In USA, 3500+ drown not involving boats, another 300+ in (or maybe not actually in!) boats: http://www.all_f**ked_up.com The occasional dead hyponatremic athlete gets all the headlines but water, a dangerous chemical, kills every day. drat. Pasted link from a different conversation. Should have been: https://www.colinshope.org/water-saf...ng-statistics/ https://dhmo.org/truth/Dihydrogen-Monoxide.html Dihydrogen monoxide is colorless, odorless, tasteless, and kills uncounted thousands of people every year. Most of these deaths are caused by accidental inhalation of DHMO, but the dangers of dihydrogen monoxide do not end there. Prolonged exposure to its solid form causes severe tissue damage. Symptoms of DHMO ingestion can include excessive sweating and urination, and possibly a bloated feeling, nausea, vomiting and body electrolyte imbalance. For those who have become dependent, DHMO withdrawal means certain death. Dihydrogen monoxide is also known as hydric acid, and is the major component of acid rain, contributes to the Greenhouse Effect, contributes to the erosion of our natural landscape, accelerates corrosion and rusting of many metals, may cause electrical failures and decreased effectiveness of automobile brakes, has been found in excised tumors of terminal cancer patients. -- cheers, John B. |
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Everybody is Out
On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 13:20:13 -0700, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
Hydrochloric Acid Use in Home Pools https://sensorex.com/blog/2019/09/17/hydrochloric-acid-home-pools/ Both bleach and hydrochloric acid are commonly referred to as "pool chlorine". Thanks for clearing that up, otherwise, since we do not have a pool, i'd have to break the demanded social isolation requirements here and visit either of the neighbours who do have a pool. I'm not sure if bleach is a good replacement for alchohol in hand sanitizer, It is. The medical advice here on hand sanitation was; best is 20 seconds of washing with soap(destroys lipid bonds in virus), second is bleach, contain odium hypochorite, and 66% ethanlhand sanitiser wll worrk as well. The only reason for hand sanitizer really is convenience as it self dries. but I'm very sure that hydrochloric acid is a really bad idea for hand sanitizer. |
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Everybody is Out
On Mon, 23 Mar 2020 10:24:08 -0700, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Monday, 23 March 2020 13:19:06 UTC-4, Mark J. wrote: Watch for fever. The advice I've seen is that if you see COVID symptoms, you should curtail vigorous exercise which might push it deeper into your lungs, though I grant that's mostly speculative. Mark J. Apparently some people have caught this virus and NEVER had the fever. Well, it is a flu, and like the common flus, the effect on many people can vary. BTW, it was said last night(medical doctor),that 85% of the elderly that get covid-19 do recover, but the real problem is those that get it may require medical intervention, which could be in short supply. The other thing I've noticed is that the recovery figures are slow and it is taking a long time for people to be counted as recovered. It seems that for some people,of any age, this can be an extremely bad flu event. Recovery in 9 days seems to be optimistic. There are so many conflicting reports even from the health experts that i's hard to know what's really going on. So much of the news has really turned to opinion where the hands and mouth just gabble to fill the pages. contenthas become one factoid and rest waffle. Take care people and cheers |
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Everybody is Out
snip?
Very true. Here's a good video on the initial symptoms and some numbers: "What Coronavirus Symptoms Look Like, Day By Day" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOJqHPfG7pA -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 Thanks for this link, Jeff. As I like them...fairly short, to the point. pH |
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Everybody is Out
On Sunday, March 22, 2020 at 5:16:00 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
It's the last beautiful day before we go into a streak of rain, and its nuts cutting through MUPs or parks. People seem to be outside a lot more during the COVID apocalypse -- so much so that the Governor has instructed people not to crowd into the parks. snip Lots of people out and about in Santa Cruz/Aptos as well. I think I saw another Rohloff hub in the wild....drool, drool. I was driving, but don't think it was a hub motor. Saw no evidence of a battery bank anywhere. I'm seeing a *lot* of battery assist bikes around here, now. Pure or not, I think it's a good thing that people are out there on bikes. Families out recreating together is a good thing. Hopefully that too will not soon become verboten. (I'm uneasy how quickly we all acquiesce to believing doing as we're told by our benevolent leaders. Makes it easy to see how past evils happened, doesn't it.) the only ebike/kit I would consider would have to have the throttle-only option. I don't like being "told" I have to pedal to have motor assist. I want it whenever I feel like it if I want it at all. (Curmudgeon alert.) pH in Aptos -- Jay Beattie. |
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