any experience with these bikes.

"Callistus Valerius" wrote ...

Kind of like why mopeds never took off. Too heavy to be a bike, and
too slow to be a scooter. I think why they are selling, is because
they're
cheap ($500). Have no idea how safe or unsafe they are.

They look like souped up Electras.

JF

--
http://spaces.msn.com/members/flomblog/

Callistus Valerius wrote:
Any experience with these types of bikes
http://www.spookytoothcycles.com/ . They've been selling like hotcakes
around here. The price is right.

They look pretty cool, and they sure are cheap. But if you want a
practical commuting vehicle that you don't have to pedal, then I think
electrics are the way to go. Very simple and probably much longer
lasting... essentially silent, too. I know somebody who has the Ego and
loves it:

http://www.egovehicles.com/

I'd vote for letting these on the bike paths, but not gas powered
vehicles.

On 28 Sep 2005 03:12:44 -0700, "Ron Ruff" wrote:

They look pretty cool, and they sure are cheap. But if you want a
practical commuting vehicle that you don't have to pedal, then I think
electrics are the way to go. Very simple and probably much longer
lasting... essentially silent, too. I know somebody who has the Ego and
loves it:

The battery pack generally costs $300-$600 depending on SLA or NiMH based,
and will wear out a long time before the 2stroke needs much servicing.

There is no valid reason to distinguish between mopeds and electric mopeds
for the locations they can ride -- speed and weight is the key issue for
severity of accidents. Not whether they make a noise and smell or not.


Jasper

They look pretty cool, and they sure are cheap. But if you want a
practical commuting vehicle that you don't have to pedal, then I think
electrics are the way to go. Very simple and probably much longer
lasting... essentially silent, too. I know somebody who has the Ego and
loves it:

The battery pack generally costs $300-$600 depending on SLA or NiMH based,
and will wear out a long time before the 2stroke needs much servicing.

Maybe on some, but I doubt this particular beast is built that well. Check
out this section from their website on service requirements-

==============================
#6. Cylinder Head Bolts

Tighten all fasteners after each five hours of operation. Most
important is to check the Cylinder head bolts: Tighten in a X pattern to 8
to 9 ft/lb. for 48cc models; 12 ft/lb for 80cc engines using a torque
wrench. A two-piece cylinder and head design engine requires head bolts be
kept tight. Important: Check head bolts before each and every long ride;
vibration can cause them to loosen and blow a head gasket. Caution: Do not
over torque or head bolts may break off. (Twisted or broken head bolts due
to over tightening are not covered by warranty.)

==============================

Re-torque the cylinder head bolts every five hours???!!! I could see having
to do that after the initial break-in period, but every five hours implies
this engine isn't particularly sturdy.

Also, as you pointed out, it *is* a 2-stroke. Screw up the oil-gas mix and
you've wrecked the piston and cylinder. On these cheapies, the oil-gas mix
is done manually, meaning you mix it in a gas can before putting it into the
gas tank. So you're dealing with something that can't be gassed up on the
road (make sure you've always got a full tank before leaving home?) and if
you lose track of whether you've already added oil to the gas can, you could
either fry the engine or do the James Bond smokescreen thing.

The problem with battery-run bicycles usually comes from the implementation
of the technology, not the technology itself. Plenty of cars running
rechargeable batteries that don't need to be replaced all the time, but they
get away with it because the charging/discharging circuitry is dramatically
better (better regulated) and there's a lot less vibration (which batteries
don't like) or they're built tougher (heavier) to take the abuse, and on a
bicycle weight is not your friend.

Battery technology is constantly improving, so I suspect we will see
more-useful implementations of battery-powered bicycles down the road.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com



"Jasper Janssen" wrote in message
...
On 28 Sep 2005 03:12:44 -0700, "Ron Ruff" wrote:

They look pretty cool, and they sure are cheap. But if you want a
practical commuting vehicle that you don't have to pedal, then I think
electrics are the way to go. Very simple and probably much longer
lasting... essentially silent, too. I know somebody who has the Ego and
loves it:

The battery pack generally costs $300-$600 depending on SLA or NiMH based,
and will wear out a long time before the 2stroke needs much servicing.

There is no valid reason to distinguish between mopeds and electric mopeds
for the locations they can ride -- speed and weight is the key issue for
severity of accidents. Not whether they make a noise and smell or not.


Jasper

Callistus Valerius wrote:

WHY?? Do you want to be smacked by a 100 pounds of bicycle? These
things have no place on the bike paths/lanes. If you want a
'scooter', buy a scooter and ride them on the road. If you want to
use bike paths and lanes, buy a bicycle.

Ditto.

Kind of like why mopeds never took off. Too heavy to be a
bike, and too slow to be a scooter. I think why they are selling, is
because they're cheap ($500). Have no idea how safe or unsafe they
are.

Mopeds *did* take off. Back in the 70s they were everywhere, at least where I
lived. Scooters too, thus the whole mod/Quadrophenia craze. Usage peaked with
gasoline prices in about 1980-84, a peak we're just now approaching again (in
inflation adjusted terms).

I often wonder what happened to them all. They do seem to be making a comeback.
Unfortunately, the cheap 2-stroke motors in these things are an environmental
menace.

A friend of mine has an electric Oxygen scooter, which is neato. But everything
I'd use a scooter for, I can just as easily use a bicycle.

Matt O.

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
They look pretty cool, and they sure are cheap. But if you want a
practical commuting vehicle that you don't have to pedal, then I think
electrics are the way to go. Very simple and probably much longer
lasting... essentially silent, too. I know somebody who has the Ego and
loves it:

The battery pack generally costs $300-$600 depending on SLA or NiMH based,
and will wear out a long time before the 2stroke needs much servicing.

Maybe on some, but I doubt this particular beast is built that well. Check
out this section from their website on service requirements-

==============================
#6. Cylinder Head Bolts

Tighten all fasteners after each five hours of operation. Most
important is to check the Cylinder head bolts: Tighten in a X pattern to 8
to 9 ft/lb. for 48cc models; 12 ft/lb for 80cc engines using a torque
wrench. A two-piece cylinder and head design engine requires head bolts be
kept tight. Important: Check head bolts before each and every long ride;
vibration can cause them to loosen and blow a head gasket. Caution: Do not
over torque or head bolts may break off. (Twisted or broken head bolts due
to over tightening are not covered by warranty.)

==============================

Re-torque the cylinder head bolts every five hours???!!! I could see having
to do that after the initial break-in period, but every five hours implies
this engine isn't particularly sturdy.

Also, as you pointed out, it *is* a 2-stroke. Screw up the oil-gas mix and
you've wrecked the piston and cylinder. On these cheapies, the oil-gas mix
is done manually, meaning you mix it in a gas can before putting it into the
gas tank. So you're dealing with something that can't be gassed up on the
road (make sure you've always got a full tank before leaving home?) and if
you lose track of whether you've already added oil to the gas can, you could
either fry the engine or do the James Bond smokescreen thing.

The problem with battery-run bicycles usually comes from the implementation
of the technology, not the technology itself. Plenty of cars running
rechargeable batteries that don't need to be replaced all the time, but they
get away with it because the charging/discharging circuitry is dramatically
better (better regulated) and there's a lot less vibration (which batteries
don't like) or they're built tougher (heavier) to take the abuse, and on a
bicycle weight is not your friend.

Battery technology is constantly improving, so I suspect we will see
more-useful implementations of battery-powered bicycles down the road.

True batteries are improving all the time. I think even the regular
alkalines are getting better. I remember when portable cd-players came
out and you could only listen to 1 or 2 cds before you had to replace
the batteries. Now I have one that can play like 10 hours or more on a
set.


--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com



"Jasper Janssen" wrote in message
...
On 28 Sep 2005 03:12:44 -0700, "Ron Ruff" wrote:

They look pretty cool, and they sure are cheap. But if you want a
practical commuting vehicle that you don't have to pedal, then I think
electrics are the way to go. Very simple and probably much longer
lasting... essentially silent, too. I know somebody who has the Ego and
loves it:

The battery pack generally costs $300-$600 depending on SLA or NiMH based,
and will wear out a long time before the 2stroke needs much servicing.

There is no valid reason to distinguish between mopeds and electric mopeds
for the locations they can ride -- speed and weight is the key issue for
severity of accidents. Not whether they make a noise and smell or not.


Jasper

Jasper Janssen wrote:

The battery pack generally costs $300-$600 depending on SLA or NiMH based,
and will wear out a long time before the 2stroke needs much servicing.

Q: How long will the batteries last before they must be replaced?
A: If they are properly maintained, they will last between 600 and 800
discharge cycles. If you ride 10 miles per cycle, that's around 8000
miles.

-I very much doubt that the motor on those bikes will last this long.

Q: If the batteries do need to be replaced, how much and how easy?
A: A replacement battery pack for the eGO Cycle 2 will cost around $150
and can be installed in 5 minutes.

-That is not expensive. You could probably get them for less elsewhere.

There is no valid reason to distinguish between mopeds and electric mopeds
for the locations they can ride -- speed and weight is the key issue for
severity of accidents. Not whether they make a noise and smell or not.

I can think of a few valid reasons... air and noise pollution, and a
desire to promote environmentally sound transportation. I think that
the biggest obsticle to using efficient transportation is that we have
to share the road with huge vehicles that can easily kill us. Separate
paths that would allow bikes and small electrics (up to 25mph or so)
make sense to me. You could even make small enclosed vehicles so rainy
days are no problem.

pulloverlemmeseeyour...

In article .com,
says...
True batteries are improving all the time. I think even the regular
alkalines are getting better. I remember when portable cd-players came
out and you could only listen to 1 or 2 cds before you had to replace
the batteries. Now I have one that can play like 10 hours or more on a
set.

The new players use much less power than the first ones.
Alkaline batteries have got a bit better but the that is not the main
reason behind your observation.

On Thu, 29 Sep 2005 18:06:26 +1000, Bruce Graham
wrote:
In article .com,
says...
True batteries are improving all the time. I think even the regular
alkalines are getting better. I remember when portable cd-players came
out and you could only listen to 1 or 2 cds before you had to replace
the batteries. Now I have one that can play like 10 hours or more on a
set.

The new players use much less power than the first ones.
Alkaline batteries have got a bit better but the that is not the main
reason behind your observation.

Yeah. Duracell M3 Power alkalines are only like a few dozen percent at
most better than cheap alkalines from the 80s, certainlty not a factor of
5-10. ALthough it's hard to figure given that they always have the
commercials say "5 times better than ordinary zinc-carbon!"... yeah, that
goes for all alkalines, idjits.


Jasper