Your favourite piece of VINTAGE BICYCLE equipment?

On 6/13/2014 5:15 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, June 13, 2014 12:27:15 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:


The thing is, most bike parts last a really long time, on the order of
decades. Newer stuff may be better by some measurements (lighter?
easier to use?), but IMO the incremental benefit is minor.


Example: When I have to adjust the cantilever brakes I have on most
bikes, it's an exercise in patience to get all 10 degrees of freedom (or
however many there are) simultaneously correct. But it's an operation
I have to do only once per year. I'm willing to endure the fussiness in
return for the tremendous adjustability.

And ****ty stopping, particularly with STI levers -- at least compared to practically
any dual pivot.

As I've said, I don't have much of a connoisseur mentality. But I'd
have a hard time characterizing my canti's stopping as "****ty." I
squeeze the levers. I stop. If I want to stop more quickly, I squeeze
harder. It all seems to work. And for me, panic braking is pretty much
nonexistent.

(Confession: I did once get in a sort of crash because I couldn't stop
in time. My wife and I were waiting to turn left. She started forward
to go through a gap in oncoming traffic. I started after her. But she
changed her mind and stopped. I guess it was more a bump than a crash,
because I _almost_ stopped in time, and neither of us came close to
falling. That was in ... let's see, 1975, I think.)

To me, dual pivots kind of remind me of the power brakes on 1960s cars.
It was like you were operating a switch or a button; a little too much
pressure and they locked up. On a bike, I prefer having to squeeze at
least a _little_ hard in order to stop fast.

(I did once watch a woman do an endo the first time she tried to do a
fairly quick stop with dual pivots, for the reason just described.)

In the time it takes you to adjust your cantis, I can change the pads
on four bikes, including one with discs.

I don't doubt that. Heck, it must save you ten minutes per year! ;-)

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 6/13/2014 5:05 PM, Lou Holtman wrote:


Just put together my new Uberbike. Look at the tire clearance. A 23 mm tire
in mounted.

http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-oC...o/IMG_2315.JPG

Hard to see the clearance in that view. How wide of a tire can you run
on that bike?

--
- Frank Krygowski

Hard to see the clearance in that view. How wide of a tire can you run
on that bike?

.................


uber urban....and down Wind.

kinda like painting yourself in....

flexible was uber.

teveel ?

Op zaterdag 14 juni 2014 04:21:40 UTC+2 schreef Frank Krygowski:
On 6/13/2014 5:05 PM, Lou Holtman wrote:





Just put together my new Uberbike. Look at the tire clearance. A 23 mm tire

in mounted.



http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-oC...o/IMG_2315.JPG



Hard to see the clearance in that view. How wide of a tire can you run

on that bike?



--

- Frank Krygowski

Hard to see? Come on Frank. 28 mm for sure and I pretty sure it can take a 32 mm tire. I was surprised myself.

Lou

On 6/13/2014 9:19 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/13/2014 5:15 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, June 13, 2014 12:27:15 PM UTC-7, Frank
Krygowski wrote:


The thing is, most bike parts last a really long time, on
the order of
decades. Newer stuff may be better by some measurements
(lighter?
easier to use?), but IMO the incremental benefit is minor.


Example: When I have to adjust the cantilever brakes I
have on most
bikes, it's an exercise in patience to get all 10 degrees
of freedom (or
however many there are) simultaneously correct. But
it's an operation
I have to do only once per year. I'm willing to endure
the fussiness in
return for the tremendous adjustability.

And ****ty stopping, particularly with STI levers -- at
least compared to practically
any dual pivot.

As I've said, I don't have much of a connoisseur mentality.
But I'd have a hard time characterizing my canti's stopping
as "****ty." I squeeze the levers. I stop. If I want to
stop more quickly, I squeeze harder. It all seems to work.
And for me, panic braking is pretty much nonexistent.

(Confession: I did once get in a sort of crash because I
couldn't stop in time. My wife and I were waiting to turn
left. She started forward to go through a gap in oncoming
traffic. I started after her. But she changed her mind and
stopped. I guess it was more a bump than a crash, because I
_almost_ stopped in time, and neither of us came close to
falling. That was in ... let's see, 1975, I think.)

To me, dual pivots kind of remind me of the power brakes on
1960s cars. It was like you were operating a switch or a
button; a little too much pressure and they locked up. On a
bike, I prefer having to squeeze at least a _little_ hard in
order to stop fast.

(I did once watch a woman do an endo the first time she
tried to do a fairly quick stop with dual pivots, for the
reason just described.)

In the time it takes you to adjust your cantis, I can
change the pads
on four bikes, including one with discs.

I don't doubt that. Heck, it must save you ten minutes per
year! ;-)


http://www.cityofmadison.com/police/...t.cfm?id=15413

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

http://www.cityofmadison.com/police/...t.cfm?id=15413

NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN

too slow. too much brake. difficult compensating. are you the wrench ?

dose the Uber have an American market model ?

would you like rosewood or black walnut for your baskets ?

On Friday, June 13, 2014 7:19:31 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 6/13/2014 5:15 PM, jbeattie wrote:

On Friday, June 13, 2014 12:27:15 PM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:





The thing is, most bike parts last a really long time, on the order of

decades. Newer stuff may be better by some measurements (lighter?

easier to use?), but IMO the incremental benefit is minor.





Example: When I have to adjust the cantilever brakes I have on most

bikes, it's an exercise in patience to get all 10 degrees of freedom (or

however many there are) simultaneously correct. But it's an operation

I have to do only once per year. I'm willing to endure the fussiness in

return for the tremendous adjustability.



And ****ty stopping, particularly with STI levers -- at least compared to practically

any dual pivot.



As I've said, I don't have much of a connoisseur mentality. But I'd

have a hard time characterizing my canti's stopping as "****ty." I

squeeze the levers. I stop. If I want to stop more quickly, I squeeze

harder. It all seems to work. And for me, panic braking is pretty much

nonexistent.



(Confession: I did once get in a sort of crash because I couldn't stop

in time. My wife and I were waiting to turn left. She started forward

to go through a gap in oncoming traffic. I started after her. But she

changed her mind and stopped. I guess it was more a bump than a crash,

because I _almost_ stopped in time, and neither of us came close to

falling. That was in ... let's see, 1975, I think.)



To me, dual pivots kind of remind me of the power brakes on 1960s cars.

It was like you were operating a switch or a button; a little too much

pressure and they locked up. On a bike, I prefer having to squeeze at

least a _little_ hard in order to stop fast.

I've never found dual pivots to be grabby, at least using my selection of brake pads (either OEM or Koolstop salmons).

I had cantis on my tandem and on my T1000 -- and various other bikes over the years. With endless fussing, I could get them to work reasonably well with STI/Ergo (I know that's not your deal). They were never great and often squealed. The are known for their mud-shedding and tire clearance, but even cross racers are trending towards discs these days. And oddly enough, the T1000 was spec'd with 27" inch wheels (1987), and with fenders, you could barely get a 1.25" tire in there. That bike had a fairly low crown. Great bike, but that was an odd mistake.

Sure, you can get cantis to work O.K., but it is a technology that has no real upside unless you're using beyond 32mm tires. I rode across the US on a steel touring bike with long-reach Campy NR side-pulls, and they stopped a fully loaded bike with no problem and accommodated 32mm tires and fenders. In the modern world, I use discs. My commuter can accommodate 35mm studs and fenders, and it actually stops in the snow and rain (to the extent I can get traction).

-- Jay Beattie.

On 6/14/2014 9:59 AM, jbeattie wrote:

I've never found dual pivots to be grabby, at least using my selection of brake pads
(either OEM or Koolstop salmons).

They're certainly controllable enough. But the low lever force isn't my
preference.

I had cantis on my tandem and on my T1000 -- and various other bikes over
the years. With endless fussing, I could get them to work reasonably well
with STI/Ergo (I know that's not your deal).

True, it's not my deal. (However, I don't find adjusting cantis to be
_that_ difficult, at least when using normal levers.)

When I think about it, a lot of my equipment choices harken to "the old
days" when almost all components worked well together, regardless of
brand name. A lot of component designs have abandoned that idea.

Jobst mentioned the design changes that altered the mechanical advantage
of brakes, effectively disallowing certain combinations. STI was made
to fit that new scheme, making it difficult to use with most existing
brake calipers. Since I don't use STI, I get more choices.

They were never great and often squealed. The are known for their
mud-shedding
and tire clearance, but even cross racers are trending towards discs
these days.

As I said, one factor is that bike stuff keeps working for decades
(provided you don't get stuck with, say, a proprietary component design
that they stop making - like perhaps an obscure disk brake pad). To me,
that means I'd need to see pretty extreme improvements to justify a
switch.

For example, I've got classic cantilevers on four bikes. For me,
they've always been as "great" as I ever needed. I could switch to
disks - but why? Even if I found them to be marginally better, it
wouldn't be worth the trouble.

And oddly enough, the T1000 was spec'd with 27" inch wheels (1987),
and with fenders, you could barely get a 1.25" tire in there.
That bike had a fairly low crown. Great bike, but that was an odd mistake.

Mine's a 1986. IIRC, it was a bit tight originally, although I did fine
with 1 1/4" tires. I usually rode 1 1/8". When I went to 700c rims, it
allowed 37mm tires with fenders. Well, except the chainstay space was
quite tight. It was on the bumpy C&O trail that I learned that tires
can grow in width as they wear. I was down to zero chainstay clearance
after that trip segment.

Sure, you can get cantis to work O.K., but it is a technology that
has no real upside unless you're using beyond 32mm tires.

To me, universal availability of spare parts is an upside. The ability
to do a complete overhaul in the middle of a remote tour using a single
multi-tool is an upside. (I did have to do that once.) Adjustability of
mechanical advantage (via straddle cable length) is an upside. So is
elegant simplicity.

I really do have this taped up in my workshop:
https://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto
I don't like that bike components are moving away from its philosophy.

I rode across the US on a steel touring bike with long-reach Campy NR
side-pulls,
and they stopped a fully loaded bike with no problem and accommodated
32mm tires
and fenders.

There you go! Same is true for cantilevers.

In the modern world, I use discs. My commuter can accommodate 35mm studs
and
fenders, and it actually stops in the snow and rain (to the extent I can
get traction).

I agree that your commuting conditions justify disks.


--
- Frank Krygowski

Lou Uber ?

Uber Uber ! cool. we doahn get Uber it here.

but look !


http://goo.gl/yoDjCh


villians !

if remembered correctly, maybe not, JB has evolved on discs over time from caution to promotion.

Portland's streets gotta be washed clean of everything but slime molds.

not a harsh environment ? I dunno.

JB, does your chain fill with rained in road grit after 10 miles ?

does here but this s the beach. we are butt deep in grinding compound.

Occasionally read CDT blogs off GooImages. The literarcy level is fairly hi. No one sez....we were 11 miles from Oonahachie in the Goduvian Gorge when the discs looked up...in facto malfunction whining is really low.