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  #21  
Old March 13th 18, 05:26 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,967
Default New bike path

On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 19:55:30 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

On Monday, March 12, 2018 at 7:32:27 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 19:58:03 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

On 3/12/2018 7:35 PM, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 09:38:15 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-03-11 16:12, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2018 5:49 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, March 11, 2018 at 9:08:15 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2018 8:42 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, March 10, 2018 at 5:47:04 PM UTC-8, Gregory Sutter wrote:
On 2018-03-10, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, March 9, 2018 at 12:22:52 PM UTC-8,
wrote:
On todays route, to Dutch standards through the middle of
nowhere, I noticed that a new bike path is constructed (about 3-4
km long) along a quiet road. Even I was surprised that we go to
this kind of trouble.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/gAFqDSnOECBcxETP2

Wow, I guess that's what you get when you don't have to pay for
cruise missiles. I think we should conquer NL and take the bike
paths.

Jay, you win the Internet today. Here's your Unca Sam chapeau.

r==i
|**|
L==|
-======-

Aw right! A new hat! I'll wear it leading the charge into Amsterdam!
Which way to the coffee shop?

If I recall, 'coffee shop' in Nederlanderese means 'pot
vendor'. You needn't bother since you're in Oregon already.
Dutch buy coffee in an 'espresso bar' I think.

Lou, is that right?

Yes, I was using the term "coffee shop" to mean dispensary of the evil
weed with its roots in hell. Invading foreign countries is
stressful. You need something to take the edge off.

Speaking of getting high in NL, the flatness there is staggering. 50
meters in 85km? Dang.

My son JUST GOT OUT OF HIS WHEELCHAIR! He was cleared to stand last
Wednesday, and one of the first things he did was get on his trainer.
If you forgot, he shattered both of his ankles skiing on Christmas Eve.

I set him up with the recovered Roubaix -- complete with the flat
pedals the meth tweakers had put on the bike. I also put some bright
blue duct tape on the crank arms to keep them from being scuffed the
ortho boots. The bike looks like something right out of a homeless camp.

Today, he rode outside for the first time. A few times around the
neighborhood streets. 3.5km and 80 meters of climbing -- in ortho
boots. I think he can still beat me even with two surgically repaired
ankles.

The weather was perfect today -- 65F, blue skies. I was headed out to
the Columbia River Gorge but turned back before Crown Point because
the f****** wind. I got tired of thrashing myself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GcP8qK_CSZA 00:39 is why you don't
want a light bike.

What I hate about the wind is that it often shifts after mid-day when
central Oregon warms up. If you mis-time your ride, you can end up
with a headwind both ways. The wind remained out of the east for me
today, and I had a screaming tail wind going home down Marine Drive --
which made me feel like Cancellara with a Gruber assist. It was great
until I ran over a cement board screw and tore up my front tire. I
had to boot it with a $1. I think Park sells $1 bills as tire boots.
They're $2.

And not to sound too cranky, but I get tired of guys riding by and
asking if I'm O.K. One guy actually stopped and was cross-examining me
about the flat. Do you have this, do you have that? I just kept
saying, "I've got it. I'm O.K.; I've got it." He wouldn't go away. He
was wearing tights with pink flamingos on them. I kid you not. I
once had a guy stop and basically take over fixing a flat -- it was so
surrealistic that I just stood there and let it happen. It the
officious flat fixing people. Another Portland trope.



"The bike looks like something right out of a homeless camp."

Maybe for your Portland homeless camps. The pros are in LA:

http://ktla.com/2018/03/10/eye-poppi...ss-encampment/


Within weeks all that will probably be back :-(


Out of curiosity where do the "homeless" go when they are "cleared
out", as the article describes?

After all they are "homeless" so they don't have a home and one
assumes that they can't pay for a hotel room. So where do they go?


They are what Hitchcock called 'the McGuffin', a device to
move the plot along. Doesn't really matter.

In this case, the important principle of governance is,
"Once the problem's solved, the money stops."

https://nypost.com/2018/03/06/everyo...meless-policy/

https://nypost.com/2018/02/24/de-bla...ing-explosion/

Solving problems is anathema to anyone in politics.


Back when I was a young Airman I worked with a guy - probably had 10
or 12 total years service - but he had mentioned that his first hitch
he had been in the Horse Drawn Field Artillery which was pretty far
back. I asked him about that and he said yes, that his first
enlistment was in 1930-something. When I asked him why he wasn't
already retired he said that when he'd finished an enlistment he'd get
out and work for a while but when he couldn't find a job he had
reenlisted.

Maybe we should re-discover this solution for the problem of the
homeless.


The armed services used to be an alternative to serving time for petty crimes, but I don't think any branch wants known drug addicts, psychotics, schizophrenics, etc., etc. I would guess than only a small fraction of the homeless are there because they lost a job -- at least based on my observations.


My last assignment in the A.F. I had a confessed drug addict assigned
to the shop. He went to the Hospital every morning for a shot and as
he was a dope addict had no security clearance which meant he couldn't
work on any of the aircraft. As a result he could only work straight
days and on projects that were not associated with either the B-52's
or the Tankers. Not a really welcome addition to a shop that is
working days, nights, and Sundays fixing airplanes :-)

I spent considerable effort on trying to get him removed from the shop
so I could indent for a replacement who could work on the flight line
but the guy finally solved my problem by deserting.


-- Jay Beattie.


But even people sleeping on a park bench have to eat. Where does that
money come from? Unemployment payments?
--
Cheers,

John B.

Ads
  #22  
Old March 13th 18, 02:36 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,206
Default New bike path

On 2018-03-12 22:26, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 19:55:30 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

On Monday, March 12, 2018 at 7:32:27 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 19:58:03 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

On 3/12/2018 7:35 PM, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 09:38:15 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-03-11 16:12, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2018 5:49 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, March 11, 2018 at 9:08:15 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2018 8:42 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, March 10, 2018 at 5:47:04 PM UTC-8, Gregory Sutter wrote:
On 2018-03-10, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, March 9, 2018 at 12:22:52 PM UTC-8,
wrote:
On todays route, to Dutch standards through the middle of
nowhere, I noticed that a new bike path is constructed (about 3-4
km long) along a quiet road. Even I was surprised that we go to
this kind of trouble.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/gAFqDSnOECBcxETP2

Wow, I guess that's what you get when you don't have to pay for
cruise missiles. I think we should conquer NL and take the bike
paths.

Jay, you win the Internet today. Here's your Unca Sam chapeau.

r==i
|**|
L==|
-======-

Aw right! A new hat! I'll wear it leading the charge into Amsterdam!
Which way to the coffee shop?

If I recall, 'coffee shop' in Nederlanderese means 'pot
vendor'. You needn't bother since you're in Oregon already.
Dutch buy coffee in an 'espresso bar' I think.

Lou, is that right?

Yes, I was using the term "coffee shop" to mean dispensary of the evil
weed with its roots in hell. Invading foreign countries is
stressful. You need something to take the edge off.

Speaking of getting high in NL, the flatness there is staggering. 50
meters in 85km? Dang.

My son JUST GOT OUT OF HIS WHEELCHAIR! He was cleared to stand last
Wednesday, and one of the first things he did was get on his trainer.
If you forgot, he shattered both of his ankles skiing on Christmas Eve.

I set him up with the recovered Roubaix -- complete with the flat
pedals the meth tweakers had put on the bike. I also put some bright
blue duct tape on the crank arms to keep them from being scuffed the
ortho boots. The bike looks like something right out of a homeless camp.

Today, he rode outside for the first time. A few times around the
neighborhood streets. 3.5km and 80 meters of climbing -- in ortho
boots. I think he can still beat me even with two surgically repaired
ankles.

The weather was perfect today -- 65F, blue skies. I was headed out to
the Columbia River Gorge but turned back before Crown Point because
the f****** wind. I got tired of thrashing myself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GcP8qK_CSZA 00:39 is why you don't
want a light bike.

What I hate about the wind is that it often shifts after mid-day when
central Oregon warms up. If you mis-time your ride, you can end up
with a headwind both ways. The wind remained out of the east for me
today, and I had a screaming tail wind going home down Marine Drive --
which made me feel like Cancellara with a Gruber assist. It was great
until I ran over a cement board screw and tore up my front tire. I
had to boot it with a $1. I think Park sells $1 bills as tire boots.
They're $2.

And not to sound too cranky, but I get tired of guys riding by and
asking if I'm O.K. One guy actually stopped and was cross-examining me
about the flat. Do you have this, do you have that? I just kept
saying, "I've got it. I'm O.K.; I've got it." He wouldn't go away. He
was wearing tights with pink flamingos on them. I kid you not. I
once had a guy stop and basically take over fixing a flat -- it was so
surrealistic that I just stood there and let it happen. It the
officious flat fixing people. Another Portland trope.



"The bike looks like something right out of a homeless camp."

Maybe for your Portland homeless camps. The pros are in LA:

http://ktla.com/2018/03/10/eye-poppi...ss-encampment/


Within weeks all that will probably be back :-(


Out of curiosity where do the "homeless" go when they are "cleared
out", as the article describes?


Into other similar areas until they are either kicked out there or the
old turf is low enough in the police presence to move back.


After all they are "homeless" so they don't have a home and one
assumes that they can't pay for a hotel room. So where do they go?


They are what Hitchcock called 'the McGuffin', a device to
move the plot along. Doesn't really matter.

In this case, the important principle of governance is,
"Once the problem's solved, the money stops."

https://nypost.com/2018/03/06/everyo...meless-policy/

https://nypost.com/2018/02/24/de-bla...ing-explosion/

Solving problems is anathema to anyone in politics.

Back when I was a young Airman I worked with a guy - probably had 10
or 12 total years service - but he had mentioned that his first hitch
he had been in the Horse Drawn Field Artillery which was pretty far
back. I asked him about that and he said yes, that his first
enlistment was in 1930-something. When I asked him why he wasn't
already retired he said that when he'd finished an enlistment he'd get
out and work for a while but when he couldn't find a job he had
reenlisted.

Maybe we should re-discover this solution for the problem of the
homeless.


The armed services used to be an alternative to serving time for petty crimes, but I don't think any branch wants known drug addicts, psychotics, schizophrenics, etc., etc. I would guess than only a small fraction of the homeless are there because they lost a job -- at least based on my observations.


My last assignment in the A.F. I had a confessed drug addict assigned
to the shop. He went to the Hospital every morning for a shot and as
he was a dope addict had no security clearance which meant he couldn't
work on any of the aircraft. As a result he could only work straight
days and on projects that were not associated with either the B-52's
or the Tankers. Not a really welcome addition to a shop that is
working days, nights, and Sundays fixing airplanes :-)

I spent considerable effort on trying to get him removed from the shop
so I could indent for a replacement who could work on the flight line
but the guy finally solved my problem by deserting.


-- Jay Beattie.


But even people sleeping on a park bench have to eat. Where does that
money come from? Unemployment payments?


Sometimes. Also welfare payments, food pantries, soup kitchens,
shelters, begging, theft. Many older homeless also get social security
payments. For a long time our church members cooked for homeless and
brought dinner to a "tolerated camp".

Scramento has a huge homeless problem and especially so along the
American River bike path. To the point where it isn't always safe riding
there anymore. It is largely a homemade problem. The mayor they have now
doesn't understand that with all his throwing moeny and resources at
this he is enticing ever more homeless to move to Sacramento. Free
stuff! When he started this I could notice a substantial drop in the
number of homeless I see along the El Dorado Trail yet the guy does not
get it.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #23  
Old March 13th 18, 07:23 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,149
Default New bike path

On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 7:36:16 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-12 22:26, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 19:55:30 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

On Monday, March 12, 2018 at 7:32:27 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 19:58:03 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

On 3/12/2018 7:35 PM, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 09:38:15 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-03-11 16:12, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/11/2018 5:49 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, March 11, 2018 at 9:08:15 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/10/2018 8:42 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, March 10, 2018 at 5:47:04 PM UTC-8, Gregory Sutter wrote:
On 2018-03-10, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, March 9, 2018 at 12:22:52 PM UTC-8,
wrote:
On todays route, to Dutch standards through the middle of
nowhere, I noticed that a new bike path is constructed (about 3-4
km long) along a quiet road. Even I was surprised that we go to
this kind of trouble.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/gAFqDSnOECBcxETP2

Wow, I guess that's what you get when you don't have to pay for
cruise missiles. I think we should conquer NL and take the bike
paths.

Jay, you win the Internet today. Here's your Unca Sam chapeau.

r==i
|**|
L==|
-======-

Aw right! A new hat! I'll wear it leading the charge into Amsterdam!
Which way to the coffee shop?

If I recall, 'coffee shop' in Nederlanderese means 'pot
vendor'. You needn't bother since you're in Oregon already.
Dutch buy coffee in an 'espresso bar' I think.

Lou, is that right?

Yes, I was using the term "coffee shop" to mean dispensary of the evil
weed with its roots in hell. Invading foreign countries is
stressful. You need something to take the edge off.

Speaking of getting high in NL, the flatness there is staggering.. 50
meters in 85km? Dang.

My son JUST GOT OUT OF HIS WHEELCHAIR! He was cleared to stand last
Wednesday, and one of the first things he did was get on his trainer.
If you forgot, he shattered both of his ankles skiing on Christmas Eve.

I set him up with the recovered Roubaix -- complete with the flat
pedals the meth tweakers had put on the bike. I also put some bright
blue duct tape on the crank arms to keep them from being scuffed the
ortho boots. The bike looks like something right out of a homeless camp.

Today, he rode outside for the first time. A few times around the
neighborhood streets. 3.5km and 80 meters of climbing -- in ortho
boots. I think he can still beat me even with two surgically repaired
ankles.

The weather was perfect today -- 65F, blue skies. I was headed out to
the Columbia River Gorge but turned back before Crown Point because
the f****** wind. I got tired of thrashing myself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GcP8qK_CSZA 00:39 is why you don't
want a light bike.

What I hate about the wind is that it often shifts after mid-day when
central Oregon warms up. If you mis-time your ride, you can end up
with a headwind both ways. The wind remained out of the east for me
today, and I had a screaming tail wind going home down Marine Drive --
which made me feel like Cancellara with a Gruber assist. It was great
until I ran over a cement board screw and tore up my front tire. I
had to boot it with a $1. I think Park sells $1 bills as tire boots.
They're $2.

And not to sound too cranky, but I get tired of guys riding by and
asking if I'm O.K. One guy actually stopped and was cross-examining me
about the flat. Do you have this, do you have that? I just kept
saying, "I've got it. I'm O.K.; I've got it." He wouldn't go away. He
was wearing tights with pink flamingos on them. I kid you not. I
once had a guy stop and basically take over fixing a flat -- it was so
surrealistic that I just stood there and let it happen. It the
officious flat fixing people. Another Portland trope.



"The bike looks like something right out of a homeless camp."

Maybe for your Portland homeless camps. The pros are in LA:

http://ktla.com/2018/03/10/eye-poppi...ss-encampment/


Within weeks all that will probably be back :-(


Out of curiosity where do the "homeless" go when they are "cleared
out", as the article describes?


Into other similar areas until they are either kicked out there or the
old turf is low enough in the police presence to move back.


After all they are "homeless" so they don't have a home and one
assumes that they can't pay for a hotel room. So where do they go?


They are what Hitchcock called 'the McGuffin', a device to
move the plot along. Doesn't really matter.

In this case, the important principle of governance is,
"Once the problem's solved, the money stops."

https://nypost.com/2018/03/06/everyo...meless-policy/

https://nypost.com/2018/02/24/de-bla...ing-explosion/

Solving problems is anathema to anyone in politics.

Back when I was a young Airman I worked with a guy - probably had 10
or 12 total years service - but he had mentioned that his first hitch
he had been in the Horse Drawn Field Artillery which was pretty far
back. I asked him about that and he said yes, that his first
enlistment was in 1930-something. When I asked him why he wasn't
already retired he said that when he'd finished an enlistment he'd get
out and work for a while but when he couldn't find a job he had
reenlisted.

Maybe we should re-discover this solution for the problem of the
homeless.

The armed services used to be an alternative to serving time for petty crimes, but I don't think any branch wants known drug addicts, psychotics, schizophrenics, etc., etc. I would guess than only a small fraction of the homeless are there because they lost a job -- at least based on my observations.


My last assignment in the A.F. I had a confessed drug addict assigned
to the shop. He went to the Hospital every morning for a shot and as
he was a dope addict had no security clearance which meant he couldn't
work on any of the aircraft. As a result he could only work straight
days and on projects that were not associated with either the B-52's
or the Tankers. Not a really welcome addition to a shop that is
working days, nights, and Sundays fixing airplanes :-)

I spent considerable effort on trying to get him removed from the shop
so I could indent for a replacement who could work on the flight line
but the guy finally solved my problem by deserting.


-- Jay Beattie.


But even people sleeping on a park bench have to eat. Where does that
money come from? Unemployment payments?


Sometimes. Also welfare payments, food pantries, soup kitchens,
shelters, begging, theft. Many older homeless also get social security
payments. For a long time our church members cooked for homeless and
brought dinner to a "tolerated camp".


Don't forget picking through trash cans. Lots of good eats there.


Scramento has a huge homeless problem and especially so along the
American River bike path. To the point where it isn't always safe riding
there anymore. It is largely a homemade problem. The mayor they have now
doesn't understand that with all his throwing moeny and resources at
this he is enticing ever more homeless to move to Sacramento. Free
stuff! When he started this I could notice a substantial drop in the
number of homeless I see along the El Dorado Trail yet the guy does not
get it.


I've been buying bus tickets to Sacramento for the dudes camped along our giant MUP, the Springwater Corridor. I'm glad to see its paying off -- that and the periodic "sweeps." http://pamplinmedia.com/go/42-news/3...ingwater-sweep

I was riding back from the Gorge on Sunday and cut over on the 205 bike path and hit a spot under an over-pass where I could barely squeeze by all the tents -- and garbage and needles, etc., etc. F****** incredible pigsty.

Let me know if you come up with a solution. I sure don't have one -- at least one that doesn't sound like something out of the Old Testament, or perhaps a modern book on recycling organic matter.

-- Jay Beattie.

  #24  
Old March 13th 18, 07:58 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,206
Default New bike path

On 2018-03-13 12:23, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 7:36:16 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-12 22:26, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 19:55:30 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

On Monday, March 12, 2018 at 7:32:27 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 19:58:03 -0500, AMuzi
wrote:

On 3/12/2018 7:35 PM, John B. wrote:


[...]



After all they are "homeless" so they don't have a home
and one assumes that they can't pay for a hotel room. So
where do they go?


They are what Hitchcock called 'the McGuffin', a device to
move the plot along. Doesn't really matter.

In this case, the important principle of governance is,
"Once the problem's solved, the money stops."

https://nypost.com/2018/03/06/everyo...meless-policy/



https://nypost.com/2018/02/24/de-bla...ing-explosion/

Solving problems is anathema to anyone in politics.

Back when I was a young Airman I worked with a guy - probably
had 10 or 12 total years service - but he had mentioned that
his first hitch he had been in the Horse Drawn Field
Artillery which was pretty far back. I asked him about that
and he said yes, that his first enlistment was in
1930-something. When I asked him why he wasn't already
retired he said that when he'd finished an enlistment he'd
get out and work for a while but when he couldn't find a job
he had reenlisted.

Maybe we should re-discover this solution for the problem of
the homeless.

The armed services used to be an alternative to serving time
for petty crimes, but I don't think any branch wants known drug
addicts, psychotics, schizophrenics, etc., etc. I would guess
than only a small fraction of the homeless are there because
they lost a job -- at least based on my observations.


My last assignment in the A.F. I had a confessed drug addict
assigned to the shop. He went to the Hospital every morning for a
shot and as he was a dope addict had no security clearance which
meant he couldn't work on any of the aircraft. As a result he
could only work straight days and on projects that were not
associated with either the B-52's or the Tankers. Not a really
welcome addition to a shop that is working days, nights, and
Sundays fixing airplanes :-)

I spent considerable effort on trying to get him removed from the
shop so I could indent for a replacement who could work on the
flight line but the guy finally solved my problem by deserting.


-- Jay Beattie.

But even people sleeping on a park bench have to eat. Where does
that money come from? Unemployment payments?


Sometimes. Also welfare payments, food pantries, soup kitchens,
shelters, begging, theft. Many older homeless also get social
security payments. For a long time our church members cooked for
homeless and brought dinner to a "tolerated camp".


Don't forget picking through trash cans. Lots of good eats there.


So far I have only seen folks looking for booze in there.


Scramento has a huge homeless problem and especially so along the
American River bike path. To the point where it isn't always safe
riding there anymore. It is largely a homemade problem. The mayor
they have now doesn't understand that with all his throwing moeny
and resources at this he is enticing ever more homeless to move to
Sacramento. Free stuff! When he started this I could notice a
substantial drop in the number of homeless I see along the El
Dorado Trail yet the guy does not get it.


I've been buying bus tickets to Sacramento for the dudes camped along
our giant MUP, the Springwater Corridor. I'm glad to see its paying
off -- that and the periodic "sweeps."
http://pamplinmedia.com/go/42-news/3...ingwater-sweep

I was riding back from the Gorge on Sunday and cut over on the 205
bike path and hit a spot under an over-pass where I could barely
squeeze by all the tents -- and garbage and needles, etc., etc.
F****** incredible pigsty.

Let me know if you come up with a solution. I sure don't have one --
at least one that doesn't sound like something out of the Old
Testament, or perhaps a modern book on recycling organic matter.


The solution would be our country becoming more conservative. Work
requirements for welfare, less unconditional free stuff, and so on. The
difference in the rate of homelessness in liberal versus conservative
states is striking and Oregon looks worse than even California (which I
hadn't thought was possible).

http://nlihc.org/article/ten-highest...ess-state-2012

Nevada is kind of an exception, probably because a lot of hermits and
loners live there. They chose that lifestyle and the low amount of
regulations and little enforcement allows them to spend their days
baking in a dilapidated trailer out in the desert.

The other solution is to starve the beast (big government). High tax
states make housing so expensive that too many people are forced to drop
out into the streets. California is a prime example of that. Try getting
a building permit out here, let alone pay for it. Socialism does not work.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #25  
Old March 13th 18, 08:21 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,489
Default New bike path

On 3/13/2018 2:58 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-13 12:23, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 7:36:16 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-12 22:26, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 19:55:30 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

On Monday, March 12, 2018 at 7:32:27 PM UTC-7, John B.
wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 19:58:03 -0500, AMuzi
wrote:

On 3/12/2018 7:35 PM, John B. wrote:


[...]



After all they are "homeless" so they don't have a home
and one assumes that they can't pay for a hotel
room. So
where do they go?


They are what Hitchcock called 'the McGuffin', a
device to
move the plot along. Doesn't really matter.

In this case, the important principle of governance is,
"Once the problem's solved, the money stops."

https://nypost.com/2018/03/06/everyo...meless-policy/




https://nypost.com/2018/02/24/de-bla...ing-explosion/


Solving problems is anathema to anyone in politics.

Back when I was a young Airman I worked with a guy -
probably
had 10 or 12 total years service - but he had
mentioned that
his first hitch he had been in the Horse Drawn Field
Artillery which was pretty far back. I asked him about
that
and he said yes, that his first enlistment was in
1930-something. When I asked him why he wasn't already
retired he said that when he'd finished an enlistment
he'd
get out and work for a while but when he couldn't find
a job
he had reenlisted.

Maybe we should re-discover this solution for the
problem of
the homeless.

The armed services used to be an alternative to serving
time
for petty crimes, but I don't think any branch wants
known drug
addicts, psychotics, schizophrenics, etc., etc. I
would guess
than only a small fraction of the homeless are there
because
they lost a job -- at least based on my observations.


My last assignment in the A.F. I had a confessed drug
addict
assigned to the shop. He went to the Hospital every
morning for a
shot and as he was a dope addict had no security
clearance which
meant he couldn't work on any of the aircraft. As a
result he
could only work straight days and on projects that were not
associated with either the B-52's or the Tankers. Not a
really
welcome addition to a shop that is working days, nights,
and
Sundays fixing airplanes :-)

I spent considerable effort on trying to get him removed
from the
shop so I could indent for a replacement who could work
on the
flight line but the guy finally solved my problem by
deserting.


-- Jay Beattie.

But even people sleeping on a park bench have to eat.
Where does
that money come from? Unemployment payments?


Sometimes. Also welfare payments, food pantries, soup
kitchens,
shelters, begging, theft. Many older homeless also get
social
security payments. For a long time our church members
cooked for
homeless and brought dinner to a "tolerated camp".


Don't forget picking through trash cans. Lots of good eats
there.


So far I have only seen folks looking for booze in there.


Scramento has a huge homeless problem and especially so
along the
American River bike path. To the point where it isn't
always safe
riding there anymore. It is largely a homemade problem.
The mayor
they have now doesn't understand that with all his
throwing moeny
and resources at this he is enticing ever more homeless
to move to
Sacramento. Free stuff! When he started this I could
notice a
substantial drop in the number of homeless I see along
the El
Dorado Trail yet the guy does not get it.


I've been buying bus tickets to Sacramento for the dudes
camped along
our giant MUP, the Springwater Corridor. I'm glad to see
its paying
off -- that and the periodic "sweeps."
http://pamplinmedia.com/go/42-news/3...ingwater-sweep


I was riding back from the Gorge on Sunday and cut over
on the 205
bike path and hit a spot under an over-pass where I could
barely
squeeze by all the tents -- and garbage and needles, etc.,
etc.
F****** incredible pigsty.

Let me know if you come up with a solution. I sure don't
have one --
at least one that doesn't sound like something out of the Old
Testament, or perhaps a modern book on recycling organic
matter.


The solution would be our country becoming more
conservative. Work requirements for welfare, less
unconditional free stuff, and so on. The difference in the
rate of homelessness in liberal versus conservative states
is striking and Oregon looks worse than even California
(which I hadn't thought was possible).

http://nlihc.org/article/ten-highest...ess-state-2012


Nevada is kind of an exception, probably because a lot of
hermits and loners live there. They chose that lifestyle and
the low amount of regulations and little enforcement allows
them to spend their days baking in a dilapidated trailer out
in the desert.

The other solution is to starve the beast (big government).
High tax states make housing so expensive that too many
people are forced to drop out into the streets. California
is a prime example of that. Try getting a building permit
out here, let alone pay for it. Socialism does not work.



Who are you and what have you done with The Real Joerg, who
likes high taxes for expensive elaborate kiddy paths paid
for by the long suffering working man?

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #26  
Old March 13th 18, 08:26 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,206
Default New bike path

On 2018-03-13 13:21, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/13/2018 2:58 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-13 12:23, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 7:36:16 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:


[...]


Scramento has a huge homeless problem and especially so
along the
American River bike path. To the point where it isn't
always safe
riding there anymore. It is largely a homemade problem.
The mayor
they have now doesn't understand that with all his
throwing moeny
and resources at this he is enticing ever more homeless
to move to
Sacramento. Free stuff! When he started this I could
notice a
substantial drop in the number of homeless I see along
the El
Dorado Trail yet the guy does not get it.

I've been buying bus tickets to Sacramento for the dudes
camped along
our giant MUP, the Springwater Corridor. I'm glad to see
its paying
off -- that and the periodic "sweeps."
http://pamplinmedia.com/go/42-news/3...ingwater-sweep



I was riding back from the Gorge on Sunday and cut over
on the 205
bike path and hit a spot under an over-pass where I could
barely
squeeze by all the tents -- and garbage and needles, etc.,
etc.
F****** incredible pigsty.

Let me know if you come up with a solution. I sure don't
have one --
at least one that doesn't sound like something out of the Old
Testament, or perhaps a modern book on recycling organic
matter.


The solution would be our country becoming more
conservative. Work requirements for welfare, less
unconditional free stuff, and so on. The difference in the
rate of homelessness in liberal versus conservative states
is striking and Oregon looks worse than even California
(which I hadn't thought was possible).

http://nlihc.org/article/ten-highest...ess-state-2012



Nevada is kind of an exception, probably because a lot of
hermits and loners live there. They chose that lifestyle and
the low amount of regulations and little enforcement allows
them to spend their days baking in a dilapidated trailer out
in the desert.

The other solution is to starve the beast (big government).
High tax states make housing so expensive that too many
people are forced to drop out into the streets. California
is a prime example of that. Try getting a building permit
out here, let alone pay for it. Socialism does not work.



Who are you and what have you done with The Real Joerg, who likes high
taxes for expensive elaborate kiddy paths paid for by the long suffering
working man?


I never liked high taxes. All I want is that taxes are invested wisely.
Investment in bikes paths and bike lanes is wise, investment in a bullet
train to nowhere is not.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #27  
Old March 13th 18, 08:41 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,149
Default New bike path

On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 12:58:11 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-13 12:23, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 7:36:16 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-12 22:26, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 19:55:30 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

On Monday, March 12, 2018 at 7:32:27 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 12 Mar 2018 19:58:03 -0500, AMuzi
wrote:

On 3/12/2018 7:35 PM, John B. wrote:


[...]



After all they are "homeless" so they don't have a home
and one assumes that they can't pay for a hotel room. So
where do they go?


They are what Hitchcock called 'the McGuffin', a device to
move the plot along. Doesn't really matter.

In this case, the important principle of governance is,
"Once the problem's solved, the money stops."

https://nypost.com/2018/03/06/everyo...meless-policy/



https://nypost.com/2018/02/24/de-bla...ing-explosion/

Solving problems is anathema to anyone in politics.

Back when I was a young Airman I worked with a guy - probably
had 10 or 12 total years service - but he had mentioned that
his first hitch he had been in the Horse Drawn Field
Artillery which was pretty far back. I asked him about that
and he said yes, that his first enlistment was in
1930-something. When I asked him why he wasn't already
retired he said that when he'd finished an enlistment he'd
get out and work for a while but when he couldn't find a job
he had reenlisted.

Maybe we should re-discover this solution for the problem of
the homeless.

The armed services used to be an alternative to serving time
for petty crimes, but I don't think any branch wants known drug
addicts, psychotics, schizophrenics, etc., etc. I would guess
than only a small fraction of the homeless are there because
they lost a job -- at least based on my observations.


My last assignment in the A.F. I had a confessed drug addict
assigned to the shop. He went to the Hospital every morning for a
shot and as he was a dope addict had no security clearance which
meant he couldn't work on any of the aircraft. As a result he
could only work straight days and on projects that were not
associated with either the B-52's or the Tankers. Not a really
welcome addition to a shop that is working days, nights, and
Sundays fixing airplanes :-)

I spent considerable effort on trying to get him removed from the
shop so I could indent for a replacement who could work on the
flight line but the guy finally solved my problem by deserting.


-- Jay Beattie.

But even people sleeping on a park bench have to eat. Where does
that money come from? Unemployment payments?


Sometimes. Also welfare payments, food pantries, soup kitchens,
shelters, begging, theft. Many older homeless also get social
security payments. For a long time our church members cooked for
homeless and brought dinner to a "tolerated camp".


Don't forget picking through trash cans. Lots of good eats there.


So far I have only seen folks looking for booze in there.


Scramento has a huge homeless problem and especially so along the
American River bike path. To the point where it isn't always safe
riding there anymore. It is largely a homemade problem. The mayor
they have now doesn't understand that with all his throwing moeny
and resources at this he is enticing ever more homeless to move to
Sacramento. Free stuff! When he started this I could notice a
substantial drop in the number of homeless I see along the El
Dorado Trail yet the guy does not get it.


I've been buying bus tickets to Sacramento for the dudes camped along
our giant MUP, the Springwater Corridor. I'm glad to see its paying
off -- that and the periodic "sweeps."
http://pamplinmedia.com/go/42-news/3...ingwater-sweep

I was riding back from the Gorge on Sunday and cut over on the 205
bike path and hit a spot under an over-pass where I could barely
squeeze by all the tents -- and garbage and needles, etc., etc.
F****** incredible pigsty.

Let me know if you come up with a solution. I sure don't have one --
at least one that doesn't sound like something out of the Old
Testament, or perhaps a modern book on recycling organic matter.


The solution would be our country becoming more conservative. Work
requirements for welfare, less unconditional free stuff, and so on. The
difference in the rate of homelessness in liberal versus conservative
states is striking and Oregon looks worse than even California (which I
hadn't thought was possible).

http://nlihc.org/article/ten-highest...ess-state-2012

Nevada is kind of an exception, probably because a lot of hermits and
loners live there. They chose that lifestyle and the low amount of
regulations and little enforcement allows them to spend their days
baking in a dilapidated trailer out in the desert.


This map gives Oregon better numbers: https://www.usich.gov/tools-for-action/map/#fn[]=1500&fn[]=2900&fn[]=6100&fn[]=10100&fn[]=14100&all_types=true&year=2017


The other solution is to starve the beast (big government). High tax
states make housing so expensive that too many people are forced to drop
out into the streets. California is a prime example of that. Try getting
a building permit out here, let alone pay for it. Socialism does not work..


Hmmm. Referring to my map, how do you explain Texas and Florida -- or even Pennsylvania?

You're not going to "tough love" a bunch of schizophrenics or drug addled or brain injured people into getting work. You just push them further into criminality or they do nothing and die off due to starvation or exposure. I mean those are options. https://www.theguardian.com/society/...ortland-oregon

But, for some reason, those options tend to turn people off. Bunch of snowflakes! What we need is a longer snow season!

-- Jay Beattie.



  #28  
Old March 13th 18, 09:09 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,206
Default New bike path

On 2018-03-13 13:41, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 12:58:11 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-13 12:23, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 7:36:16 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:


[...]



Scramento has a huge homeless problem and especially so along
the American River bike path. To the point where it isn't
always safe riding there anymore. It is largely a homemade
problem. The mayor they have now doesn't understand that with
all his throwing moeny and resources at this he is enticing
ever more homeless to move to Sacramento. Free stuff! When he
started this I could notice a substantial drop in the number of
homeless I see along the El Dorado Trail yet the guy does not
get it.

I've been buying bus tickets to Sacramento for the dudes camped
along our giant MUP, the Springwater Corridor. I'm glad to see
its paying off -- that and the periodic "sweeps."
http://pamplinmedia.com/go/42-news/3...ingwater-sweep



I was riding back from the Gorge on Sunday and cut over on the 205
bike path and hit a spot under an over-pass where I could barely
squeeze by all the tents -- and garbage and needles, etc., etc.
F****** incredible pigsty.

Let me know if you come up with a solution. I sure don't have
one -- at least one that doesn't sound like something out of the
Old Testament, or perhaps a modern book on recycling organic
matter.


The solution would be our country becoming more conservative. Work
requirements for welfare, less unconditional free stuff, and so on.
The difference in the rate of homelessness in liberal versus
conservative states is striking and Oregon looks worse than even
California (which I hadn't thought was possible).

http://nlihc.org/article/ten-highest...ess-state-2012



Nevada is kind of an exception, probably because a lot of hermits and
loners live there. They chose that lifestyle and the low amount of
regulations and little enforcement allows them to spend their days
baking in a dilapidated trailer out in the desert.


This map gives Oregon better numbers:
https://www.usich.gov/tools-for-action/map/#fn[]=1500&fn[]=2900&fn[]=6100&fn[]=10100&fn[]=14100&all_types=true&year=2017


It doesn't. Oregon has about 10% of inhabintants versus California so
its homeless rate is higher. But only slightly. California is quite bad
in that domain, as evidenced during most of my bike rides.



The other solution is to starve the beast (big government). High
tax states make housing so expensive that too many people are
forced to drop out into the streets. California is a prime example
of that. Try getting a building permit out here, let alone pay for
it. Socialism does not work.


Hmmm. Referring to my map, how do you explain Texas and Florida --
or even Pennsylvania?


Simple: You need to look at the total population and then divide the
number of homeless by that. Texas has almost the number of inhabitants
as California but only a fraction of our number of homeless.

Same with Florida. Half the number of people as in California but less
than a quarter of our homeless.


You're not going to "tough love" a bunch of schizophrenics or drug
addled or brain injured people into getting work. You just push them
further into criminality or they do nothing and die off due to
starvation or exposure.



We have to take a look at how states with a much lower homeless
percentage do it. They usually have a much less generous welfare system
and that is part of the reason. The other is smaller government, lower
taxes and thus more affordable housing. You can buy the same kind of
house for half in Texas versus California.

Not all homeless are druggies. The topper so far was a homeless man whom
I gave some money. It was in Washington D.C., he was well-mannered, a
bit dirty but wore an old suit, with tie!


I mean those are options.



Sure, but out-of-control welfare isn't. Neither is legalizing marijuana
which will backfire, big time.


https://www.theguardian.com/society/...ortland-oregon

But, for some reason, those options tend to turn people off. Bunch
of snowflakes! What we need is a longer snow season!


That's the problem, there are shelters but often homeless do not use
them. One thing shelters must do though is to also provide for their
animals. Nobody would go into a shelter and leave their dog to die
outside in a snow storm. I know you don't hold dogs in high regard but
other people do, just as I do.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #29  
Old March 14th 18, 01:08 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,967
Default New bike path

On Tue, 13 Mar 2018 13:26:50 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-03-13 13:21, AMuzi wrote:
On 3/13/2018 2:58 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-13 12:23, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 7:36:16 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:


[...]


Scramento has a huge homeless problem and especially so
along the
American River bike path. To the point where it isn't
always safe
riding there anymore. It is largely a homemade problem.
The mayor
they have now doesn't understand that with all his
throwing moeny
and resources at this he is enticing ever more homeless
to move to
Sacramento. Free stuff! When he started this I could
notice a
substantial drop in the number of homeless I see along
the El
Dorado Trail yet the guy does not get it.

I've been buying bus tickets to Sacramento for the dudes
camped along
our giant MUP, the Springwater Corridor. I'm glad to see
its paying
off -- that and the periodic "sweeps."
http://pamplinmedia.com/go/42-news/3...ingwater-sweep



I was riding back from the Gorge on Sunday and cut over
on the 205
bike path and hit a spot under an over-pass where I could
barely
squeeze by all the tents -- and garbage and needles, etc.,
etc.
F****** incredible pigsty.

Let me know if you come up with a solution. I sure don't
have one --
at least one that doesn't sound like something out of the Old
Testament, or perhaps a modern book on recycling organic
matter.


The solution would be our country becoming more
conservative. Work requirements for welfare, less
unconditional free stuff, and so on. The difference in the
rate of homelessness in liberal versus conservative states
is striking and Oregon looks worse than even California
(which I hadn't thought was possible).

http://nlihc.org/article/ten-highest...ess-state-2012



Nevada is kind of an exception, probably because a lot of
hermits and loners live there. They chose that lifestyle and
the low amount of regulations and little enforcement allows
them to spend their days baking in a dilapidated trailer out
in the desert.

The other solution is to starve the beast (big government).
High tax states make housing so expensive that too many
people are forced to drop out into the streets. California
is a prime example of that. Try getting a building permit
out here, let alone pay for it. Socialism does not work.



Who are you and what have you done with The Real Joerg, who likes high
taxes for expensive elaborate kiddy paths paid for by the long suffering
working man?


I never liked high taxes. All I want is that taxes are invested wisely.
Investment in bikes paths and bike lanes is wise, investment in a bullet
train to nowhere is not.


I see, you feel that building expensive bike paths for an almost
infinitesimal portion of the road users is wise investment?

After all, bicycles comprise about 2% of all road accidents and
studies I've seen state that nation wide bicycles make up about 1% of
the total traffic.

Doesn't spend substantial portions of the tax budget on a group that
comprises only 1% of the road users seem a bit one sided?
--
Cheers,

John B.

  #30  
Old March 14th 18, 01:24 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,489
Default New bike path

On 3/13/2018 4:09 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-13 13:41, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 12:58:11 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-03-13 12:23, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, March 13, 2018 at 7:36:16 AM UTC-7, Joerg
wrote:


[...]



Scramento has a huge homeless problem and especially so
along
the American River bike path. To the point where it isn't
always safe riding there anymore. It is largely a homemade
problem. The mayor they have now doesn't understand
that with
all his throwing moeny and resources at this he is
enticing
ever more homeless to move to Sacramento. Free stuff!
When he
started this I could notice a substantial drop in the
number of
homeless I see along the El Dorado Trail yet the guy
does not
get it.

I've been buying bus tickets to Sacramento for the dudes
camped
along our giant MUP, the Springwater Corridor. I'm glad
to see
its paying off -- that and the periodic "sweeps."
http://pamplinmedia.com/go/42-news/3...ingwater-sweep




I was riding back from the Gorge on Sunday and cut over on
the 205
bike path and hit a spot under an over-pass where I
could barely
squeeze by all the tents -- and garbage and needles,
etc., etc.
F****** incredible pigsty.

Let me know if you come up with a solution. I sure
don't have
one -- at least one that doesn't sound like something
out of the
Old Testament, or perhaps a modern book on recycling
organic
matter.


The solution would be our country becoming more
conservative. Work
requirements for welfare, less unconditional free stuff,
and so on.
The difference in the rate of homelessness in liberal versus
conservative states is striking and Oregon looks worse
than even
California (which I hadn't thought was possible).

http://nlihc.org/article/ten-highest...ess-state-2012




Nevada is kind of an exception, probably because a lot of
hermits and
loners live there. They chose that lifestyle and the low
amount of
regulations and little enforcement allows them to spend
their days
baking in a dilapidated trailer out in the desert.


This map gives Oregon better numbers:
https://www.usich.gov/tools-for-action/map/#fn[]=1500&fn[]=2900&fn[]=6100&fn[]=10100&fn[]=14100&all_types=true&year=2017



It doesn't. Oregon has about 10% of inhabintants versus
California so its homeless rate is higher. But only
slightly. California is quite bad in that domain, as
evidenced during most of my bike rides.



The other solution is to starve the beast (big
government). High
tax states make housing so expensive that too many people
are
forced to drop out into the streets. California is a
prime example
of that. Try getting a building permit out here, let
alone pay for
it. Socialism does not work.


Hmmm. Referring to my map, how do you explain Texas and
Florida --
or even Pennsylvania?


Simple: You need to look at the total population and then
divide the number of homeless by that. Texas has almost the
number of inhabitants as California but only a fraction of
our number of homeless.

Same with Florida. Half the number of people as in
California but less than a quarter of our homeless.


You're not going to "tough love" a bunch of schizophrenics
or drug
addled or brain injured people into getting work. You just
push them
further into criminality or they do nothing and die off
due to
starvation or exposure.



We have to take a look at how states with a much lower
homeless percentage do it. They usually have a much less
generous welfare system and that is part of the reason. The
other is smaller government, lower taxes and thus more
affordable housing. You can buy the same kind of house for
half in Texas versus California.

Not all homeless are druggies. The topper so far was a
homeless man whom I gave some money. It was in Washington
D.C., he was well-mannered, a bit dirty but wore an old
suit, with tie!


I mean those are options.



Sure, but out-of-control welfare isn't. Neither is
legalizing marijuana which will backfire, big time.


https://www.theguardian.com/society/...ortland-oregon


But, for some reason, those options tend to turn people
off. Bunch
of snowflakes! What we need is a longer snow season!


That's the problem, there are shelters but often homeless do
not use them. One thing shelters must do though is to also
provide for their animals. Nobody would go into a shelter
and leave their dog to die outside in a snow storm. I know
you don't hold dogs in high regard but other people do, just
as I do.



When you get your California temps down to minus 21F the
problem may resolve itself:

http://www.inforum.com/content/homel...aused-exposure

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


 




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