Is Symmetrics getting hosed by the UCI and the Tour of California?

"steephill" wrote in message
...
| There was a simmering discontent when Symmetrics wasn't invited to the
| Tour of California. Well, I think there is more to the story:
|
| http://www.steephill.tv/2008/is-symm...getting-hosed/
|
| Steve
| www.steephill.tv bike travelogue

OK, I need clarification on something. Are you saying that the Symmetrics
team couldn't get in, even if they paid the $10k or whatever? You mention
further down that, as an event sponsor of some sort, it's more likely that a
team would get in. But what level of $$$ does that entail?

Basically, the question is, can *any* decent non-Pro-Tour team get in if
they have the bucks, or is there more to it than that?

Also, why the surprise revelation about "LetLeviRide.com?" Did anybody
actually believe that it wasn't orchestrated by one of the team's sponsors?
I might have missed something somewhere that implied it was an entirely
grass-roots effort, but I assumed from the start that Trek was behind it.

I should add at this point that I believe having the Tour of California
nearby was definitely good for business. My theory is that, for those with
significant others, the heavy local news coverage makes it a lot easier to
justify a new bike purchase to the non-biker in the family. High-end bikes
suddenly appear legit. My guess is that this was industry-wide and not
limited just to companies that sponsored teams that did well.

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com

You are seriously missing the point of all this.

No, your the missing my point. As I said Medalist Sports explanation
was acceptable, but I posted the report for two reasons:
1) To highlight the UCI's ambiguous stance on how teams are selected
for events which implies unwritten rules.
2) To point out the UCI is lobbying for a Colombian team which doesn't
meet Medalist Sports stated criteria; a team that is less qualified
than Symmetrics, but that AEG seems quite willing to accept.


The UCI, the teams and the race itself are in the business of MAKING
MONEY.

Everyone accepts that, but the procees needs to be understood
otherwise it's not a sporting event:

- Symmetrics was willing to pay the entrance fee for the race. If that
wasn't good enough then what is the actual fee (entrance fee +
sponsorship) the organizer is looking for? I asked "What does
Symmetrics need to DO to get into the Tour of California?" Medalist
Sports says Symmetrics isn't eligible but I pointed out that's not
quite true. The process needs to be more transparent.

- Is the UCI getting paid to lobby for the Colombian team or is there
some quid pro quo? That's not a legitimate way for the UCI to MAKE
MONEY. The fact they don't support their own UCI America's winner
certainly implies some sort of illicit behind the scenes deal which no
administering body should be engaging in.

If we don't know the facts then cycling starts looking more like an
exclusive, underground party with a rigged outcome rather than a
sporting event.

Steve
www.steephill.tv

OK, I need clarification on something. Are you saying that the Symmetrics
team couldn't get in, even if they paid the $10k or whatever?

Yes.

You mention
further down that, as an event sponsor of some sort, it's more likely that a
team would get in. But what level of $$$ does that entail?

That's part of my point... it's negotiable when it should be more
transparent.


Basically, the question is, can *any* decent non-Pro-Tour team get in if
they have the bucks, or is there more to it than that?

I pointed out that Symmetrics is not eligible because they are neither
a ProTour team or a U.S. domestic squad. However, I've revealed a
similar Colombian squad is in good with the UCI and AEG and I'd like
to know why.


Also, why the surprise revelation about "LetLeviRide.com?" Did anybody
actually believe that it wasn't orchestrated by one of the team's sponsors?
I might have missed something somewhere that implied it was an entirely
grass-roots effort, but I assumed from the start that Trek was behind it.

Levi made it seem so at the pre-race press conference. "Hey, somebody
made up these t-shirts?" sort of thing.

Steve
www.steephill.tv

steephill wrote:
That's part of my point... it's negotiable when it should be more
transparent.

It doesn't need to be transparent to you and me. It looks
to be negotiated on a team by team basis. Negotiations
with Symmetrics didn't work out.

If you were negotiating a starting salary with an employer
would you expect them to tell you about other candidates
for the job and details about prior rounds of negotiations?
Would you tell the employer about other opportunities you
had going? You might, if it helped your case. Otherwise
you'd STFU, eh?

Bob Schwartz

Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
OK, I need clarification on something. Are you saying that the Symmetrics
team couldn't get in, even if they paid the $10k or whatever? You mention
further down that, as an event sponsor of some sort, it's more likely that
a
team would get in. But what level of $$$ does that entail?

Well, Ball states that Rock & Republic gave over $1,000,000 to the race.

How much money does it take to put on a race like the Tour of California? I
can't even imagine. Even the cities that host starts and finishes have to
pay a lot. If I remember correctly, hosting a start will cost you $15K and a
finish is $50K. Add that to a handful of $1M sponsors, and you're talking
about a pretty big budget.

I'm sure there are people reading this thread who know a lot more.

| Basically, the question is, can *any* decent non-Pro-Tour team get in if
| they have the bucks, or is there more to it than that?
|
| I pointed out that Symmetrics is not eligible because they are neither
| a ProTour team or a U.S. domestic squad. However, I've revealed a
| similar Colombian squad is in good with the UCI and AEG and I'd like
| to know why.

Right, that's why I asked the question. Is it just about the money? Are the
Colombians willing to pony up the $$$, or is the UCI offering to subsidize
their entry?

| Levi made it seem so at the pre-race press conference. "Hey, somebody
| made up these t-shirts?" sort of thing.

I figured he was joking around about it, especially since he knew a lot that
he wasn't letting on ("You'll be seeing something in a few days" sort of
thing). I mean, really, when have you seen successful "grass roots"
movements in competitive cycling???

--Mike-- Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReactionBicycles.com


"steephill" wrote in message
...
|
| OK, I need clarification on something. Are you saying that the
Symmetrics
| team couldn't get in, even if they paid the $10k or whatever?
|
| Yes.
|
| You mention
| further down that, as an event sponsor of some sort, it's more likely
that a
| team would get in. But what level of $$$ does that entail?
|
| That's part of my point... it's negotiable when it should be more
| transparent.
|
|
| Basically, the question is, can *any* decent non-Pro-Tour team get in if
| they have the bucks, or is there more to it than that?
|
| I pointed out that Symmetrics is not eligible because they are neither
| a ProTour team or a U.S. domestic squad. However, I've revealed a
| similar Colombian squad is in good with the UCI and AEG and I'd like
| to know why.
|
|
| Also, why the surprise revelation about "LetLeviRide.com?" Did anybody
| actually believe that it wasn't orchestrated by one of the team's
sponsors?
| I might have missed something somewhere that implied it was an entirely
| grass-roots effort, but I assumed from the start that Trek was behind
it.
|
| Levi made it seem so at the pre-race press conference. "Hey, somebody
| made up these t-shirts?" sort of thing.
|
| Steve
| www.steephill.tv
|

On Feb 29, 6:33*am, steephill wrote:

- Is the UCI getting paid to lobby for the Colombian team or is there
some quid pro quo? That's not a legitimate way for the UCI to MAKE
MONEY. The fact they don't support their own UCI America's winner
certainly implies some sort of illicit behind the scenes deal which no
administering body should be engaging in.




Pollyanna -


Behind the scenes deals are the way the world works.


thanks,

K. Gringioni.

Off The Back wrote:
Bob Schwartz wrote:
This is no different than going to Superweek. You pay high
entry fees and some of that goes to pay low level Euro pros to
come to Milwaukee and kick your ass.

That's so 1990's Bob. Now it's US guys like Kayle Leogrande, Adam
Bergman, and Dave Fuentes who get paid from our Superweek entry fees.

They do, but I was referring to the guys that get travel
expenses and appearance money. Like the Milram B team that
showed up a while back, teams where Otto has to pay airfare
from Europe.

Compromised US domestic pros are the Symmetrics of Superweek.
There are lots of them and no one notices if a specific one
isn't there.

Bob Schwartz

How much money does it take to put on a race like the Tour of California?
I can't even imagine. Even the cities that host starts and finishes have
to pay a lot. If I remember correctly, hosting a start will cost you $15K
and a finish is $50K. Add that to a handful of $1M sponsors, and you're
talking about a pretty big budget.

I was told that the Local Organizing Committee for the Prologue (in Palo
Alto) had to come up with $180k. We put in $1k ourselves, as did two other
shops, for a fund-raising event featuring the Astana team a couple days
ahead of the race. Overall there's quite a bit of money involved.

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA


"Off The Back" wrote in message
...
Mike Jacoubowsky wrote:
OK, I need clarification on something. Are you saying that the Symmetrics
team couldn't get in, even if they paid the $10k or whatever? You mention
further down that, as an event sponsor of some sort, it's more likely
that a
team would get in. But what level of $$$ does that entail?

Well, Ball states that Rock & Republic gave over $1,000,000 to the race.

How much money does it take to put on a race like the Tour of California?
I can't even imagine. Even the cities that host starts and finishes have
to pay a lot. If I remember correctly, hosting a start will cost you $15K
and a finish is $50K. Add that to a handful of $1M sponsors, and you're
talking about a pretty big budget.

I'm sure there are people reading this thread who know a lot more.

I was told that the Local Organizing Committee for the Prologue (in Palo
Alto) had to come up with $180k. We put in $1k ourselves, as did two other
shops, for a fund-raising event featuring the Astana team a couple days
ahead of the race. Overall there's quite a bit of money involved.


dumbass,

is the bike industry the stingiest there is ?

i realize bike shops aren't the most profitable business ever, but if
i owned a shop i would be embarrassed to post on a forum all i could
come up was $1000 to put towards an event like this.