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Is this the first full suspension bike ever? Anyway it's older than
http://patentpending.blogs.com/paten...rst_full_.html -- Cheers marcin |
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On Tue, 19 Feb 2008 18:15:17 +0000, Kinky Cowboy
wrote: On Tue, 19 Feb 2008 00:45:00 -0700, wrote: http://www.google.com/patents?id=apB..._pages&cad=0_1 I think this patent application comes from somebody who knew nothing of counter-steering :-) Kinky Cowboy* Dear Kinky, I'm so used to seeing remote-steering and, er, unusual designs in old patents that what really caught my eye was the dainty depiction of the crank arm. Judging by the inch-pitch teeth on the chain-ring, those are roughly 76 mm cranks. Cheers, Carl Fogel |
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On Tue, 19 Feb 2008 10:54:52 +0100, "Marcin J."
wrote: Is this the first full suspension bike ever? Anyway it's older than http://patentpending.blogs.com/paten...rst_full_.html Dear Marcin, The question of "first" can be tricky. First to be imagined? I wouldn't be surprised if the bike in my link existed only in the inventor's fevered imagination. That looks like a 75 mm crank, which is not exactly practical. First to be built, even as a commercial failure? Here's the first safety bicycle, the 1879 Lawson: http://www.scienceandsociety.co.uk/r...=2&imagepos=39 Commercially, it was a flop. So nephew John Starley's Rover gets the credit a few years later (1884/5)as the first _successful_ safety bicycle: http://tinyurl.com/2mct4m Anyway, some early suspension . . . Rear suspension, 1885 Whippet safety, same year as Rover: http://www.scienceandsociety.co.uk/r...2&imagepos=112 A better view of the same model, ~1887, in Pryor Dodge's "Bicycle," a Whippet spring-frame dwarf safety Linley & Biggs roadster with rear suspension: http://i25.tinypic.com/vn1her.jpg A Victor front-suspension patent application, filed in 1886--page down because the fork is more complicated than the first drawing suggests: http://www.google.com/patents?id=gTF..._pages&cad=0_1 Ad for the 1888 improved Victor front suspension, the famous half-heart spring: http://i32.tinypic.com/2q07mfs.jpg Full-suspension 1889 production bicycle, the Don No. 2 of 1889: http://www.localhistory.scit.wlv.ac....cycles/Don.gif "The Don Spring-Frame No.2 Dwarf Safety Roadster. We have here a practicable spring frame without complication in design or working. On the top of the rear forks there is a double link, connecting them with the top of the seat pillar, which receives the saddle-pin. The lower forks are horizontal, and are taken forward beyond the bracket; and between the end and lower frame tube there is a strong coil spring. The bracket, where the seat-pillar and front tube unite, is hinged, to permit of a downward motion which is checked by the action of the spring. This produces a very easy motion for the rider, and, so to speak, smoothes the road, reducing concussion and vibration to a low point. The front forks are double, and not continuous. The straight ones run to within 3in. of the axle, and are connected by a spring with the pilot wheel forks, to which they are pivoted in the centre; this also helps to take the strain off the forks when the brake is applied. The machine is a very good one, and with balls all parts, etc., the price is £18." http://www.localhistory.scit.wlv.ac....cles/Devey.htm Cheers, Carl Fogel |
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Thanks for the reply. This is what I was counting on.
Uzytkownik wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if the bike in my link existed only in the inventor's fevered imagination. That looks like a 75 mm crank, which is not exactly practical. The first thing I've noticed was compression. This suspension is totally compressed (bottomed) like it was pictured with heavy rider in the saddle. Even modern xc full-suspension bikes suffer from low BB (small clearance) but if you put "standard" length crank into this one it will plow field nicely. The same about chain ring - it seems to be smaller than usual. Thus maybe it wasn't a mistake just a set-up suggestion? Well exaggerated one. BTW compare these cranks: http://www.google.com/patents?id=uu1wAAAAEBAJ So nephew John Starley's Rover gets the credit a few years later (1884/5)as the first _successful_ safety bicycle: http://tinyurl.com/2mct4m I'm familiar with the concept of safety bicycle. Polish word "rower" (pronounced "rover") means bicycle. Anyway, some early suspension . . . Rear suspension, 1885 Whippet safety, same year as Rover: http://www.scienceandsociety.co.uk/r...2&imagepos=112 A better view of the same model, ~1887, in Pryor Dodge's "Bicycle," a Whippet spring-frame dwarf safety Linley & Biggs roadster with rear suspension: http://i25.tinypic.com/vn1her.jpg In case of this velocipede we should redefine the term "full suspension". Naming it rear suspended bike is a bit unfair in my opinion. Here is the patent: http://www.google.com/patents?id=FvBgAAAAEBAJ Notice that it has been patented in England September 8 _1885_. It takes the lead. However I'm unable to find the original patent. A Victor front-suspension patent application, filed in 1886--page down because the fork is more complicated than the first drawing suggests: http://www.google.com/patents?id=gTF..._pages&cad=0_1 Primitive - no telescoping or pivoting parts. It seems to be laterally stiff though. Ad for the 1888 improved Victor front suspension, the famous half-heart spring: http://i32.tinypic.com/2q07mfs.jpg + some rear suspension as well. Full-suspension 1889 production bicycle, the Don No. 2 of 1889: http://www.localhistory.scit.wlv.ac....cycles/Don.gif I can't find the patent. However I've found Don. Brazier as a witness in http://www.google.com/patents?id=TsxWAAAAEBAJ And now the dessert: fully (almost) suspended fourwheeler http://www.google.com/patents?id=_upWAAAAEBAJ and my favorite although (probably) not suspended - a new kind of velocipede http://v3.espacenet.com/textdoc?DB=E...B190202557&F=0 or whatever it is. I haven't been old bikes lover - rather a suspension geek. Now I see that suspension is as old as bicycle. My explanation is that they needed it more in 19th century that we need it today... It would be nice to gather all this knowledge in one place to compare side by side these very first ideas with highly engineered modern designs. Do you (anyone) know if it is legal to use patent drawings for non-commercial web site? -- Cheers marcin |
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On Feb 19, 2:54*am, "Marcin J." wrote:
Is this the first fullsuspensionbike ever? Anyway it's older thanhttp://patentpending.blogs.com/patent_pending_blog/2005/03/the_first_... -- Cheers marcin Dear Marcin, Full-suspension can be pushed back to 1869 with the Buell velocipede: http://www.google.com/patents?id=AAF..._pages&cad=0_1 http://i30.tinypic.com/2pttetj.jpg Cheers, Carl Fogel |
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Uzytkownik wrote:
Dear Marcin, Full-suspension can be pushed back to 1869 with the Buell velocipede: http://www.google.com/patents?id=AAF..._pages&cad=0_1 http://i30.tinypic.com/2pttetj.jpg Thanks Carl. It's a great picture. This bike is very close to the original Lallement design http://www.google.com/patents?id=emkAAAAAEBAJ Which is not strange considering they both lived in New Heaven CT in the same time (186x). Even if there is an earlier full-suspended bike it can't be much older. -- Cheers marcin |
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