Just ordered a hub dynamo online

On 10/12/2013 1:23 AM, James wrote:

snip

1.09kg including Mavic QR skewer and cloth rim tape, but no tyre or tube.

What?! You used real rim tape instead of medical adhesive tape?! You
could have saved like $2!

John B. writes:

On Sun, 13 Oct 2013 10:37:08 -0700, Dan
wrote:


snip


(Let me clarify the "pedantic Germans" a little better: I was
referring to the *laws*, not the headlight makers. It's pretty
apparent that Germany *is* relatively pedantic about having
everything pinned down to a precise specification. It has its
merits, but they are sort of the extreme example in the world,
and it's also good to have so room to hang loose. Anyway this
was a reference to your suggestion that we should adopt the
German legal requirements - requirements that apparently even
the Germans have seen fit to relax since then.)

That's all.

Dan, most standards ARE pedantic. Including the U.S. standards :-)

After all a non-pedantic "standard" would be standard in what manner?


Absolutely right. In my *original* remark, I was going to
say, "those zany Germans"... but in the context, they're
more serious and demanding of precision than anyone else,
so I went looking for another adjective.

Don't get me wrong, I love my Thorens turntable and Tubus
rack and stuff like that - just don't feel the need for
more uptight restrictions on bicycling.

On Sun, 13 Oct 2013 19:41:33 -0700, Dan
wrote:

John B. writes:

On Sun, 13 Oct 2013 10:37:08 -0700, Dan
wrote:


snip


(Let me clarify the "pedantic Germans" a little better: I was
referring to the *laws*, not the headlight makers. It's pretty
apparent that Germany *is* relatively pedantic about having
everything pinned down to a precise specification. It has its
merits, but they are sort of the extreme example in the world,
and it's also good to have so room to hang loose. Anyway this
was a reference to your suggestion that we should adopt the
German legal requirements - requirements that apparently even
the Germans have seen fit to relax since then.)

That's all.

Dan, most standards ARE pedantic. Including the U.S. standards :-)

After all a non-pedantic "standard" would be standard in what manner?


Absolutely right. In my *original* remark, I was going to
say, "those zany Germans"... but in the context, they're
more serious and demanding of precision than anyone else,
so I went looking for another adjective.

Don't get me wrong, I love my Thorens turntable and Tubus
rack and stuff like that - just don't feel the need for
more uptight restrictions on bicycling.

With all the discussion of bike paths, bike lanes, bikes this and
that, I wonder when some bright young spark in the G'ment will hit on
the idea of controlling" these people who are using the bike paths,
etc After all they aren't trained, aren't counted, aren't controlled
in any way. Perhaps a Bicycle Tsar would be appointed and standards
established for manufacture and design of these two wheel machines.
Courses could be established in Universities for Bi-Cycle engineering,
and a training syllabus established and certified courses organized
together with a national certification and licensing department.

Or we could continue to go quietly about our business and "live free"
as the saying goes.

--
Cheers,

John B.

On Monday, September 16, 2013 6:58:16 AM UTC+1, James wrote:
My poor ol' Sanyo Dynapower is getting a bit long in the tooth. The

bearings and bushes are wearing out. It makes a bit more noise than it

used to, despite me lubricating the moving parts. I suspect it's days

are numbered.



So I ordered a PV-8 http://www.sp-dynamo.com/8seriesdynamo%20hub.html

from the UK. Don't expect an Australian supplier to have something like

this, or if it is available locally it's sure to be double the price!

90 GBP, minus VAT, plus shipping made it 86 GBP = 146 AUD.

[snip]

--

JS

Starting to look like a smart decision. There's suddenly a spate of reports on another group I'm on about SON bearing failures, some as low as 12k. Since the only justification for buying a SON, besides snobbery, is that it is supposedly sturdier and longer-lasting, that's a bit disturbing. Fortunately, I have only one SON; maybe I should sell it on!

Andre Jute

On Sunday, October 13, 2013 7:46:57 PM UTC-4, sms wrote:
On 10/13/2013 11:01 AM, Andre Jute wrote:

On Sunday, October 13, 2013 6:37:08 PM UTC+1, Dan wrote to Frank Krygowski

your suggestion that we should adopt the



German legal requirements - requirements that apparently even



the Germans have seen fit to relax since then.



Krygowski and associated idiots have been running around here for years claiming the German legislation was the end-all and be-all of bicycle lighting, and abusing everyone who tried to explain that the legislation led to lights entirely unsuitable for large swathes of the bicycling population.



There are people that think that everything in Europe is automatically

the best despite the fact that this is often not the case.



I do like the fact that lighting is required on bicycles (with certain

exceptions) on bicycles sold in Germany. But that doesn't mean that the

lighting standards that they've instituted are necessarily suitable for

every other country.



Some Europhiles tend to pick and choose the things that they think are

great about Europe without taking things into context. They love the

fact that few Dutch cyclists wear helmets but they really don't want to

ride that slow or have to use crowded bicycle facilities. They love the

engineering and build quality of a German light versus a mass-market

Chinese light, but they don't want to understand that the German laws

require these lights to be sub-optimal in terms of functionality.

I was right with you until your last sentence - the German laws do NOT require the lights to be sub-optimal. The German StVZO mandates a beam pattern that is *good* for seeing, and yet not blinding or dazzling oncoming traffic. This makes the lights *better* than 99% of the non-StVZO lights on the market. Where StVZO does limit lights is in the 6V/2.4W limitation - to my knowledge there is no limitation on total light output; that limit is imposed by the current limitation and the efficacy of available LED emitters. As efficacy improves, we will see better and better lights available that still meet the StVZO requirements.

It is theoretically possible to take a light with a good beam pattern and disregard the StVZO maximum current limits and produce a superior light. However, I am not aware of a single light that does this, so unless/until that occurs, the StVZO compliant lights will still be the best lights available for riding on road/in traffic.

nate

On 10/14/2013 11:25 AM, Andre Jute wrote:
On Monday, September 16, 2013 6:58:16 AM UTC+1, James wrote:
My poor ol' Sanyo Dynapower is getting a bit long in the tooth. The

bearings and bushes are wearing out. It makes a bit more noise than it

used to, despite me lubricating the moving parts. I suspect it's days

are numbered.



So I ordered a PV-8 http://www.sp-dynamo.com/8seriesdynamo%20hub.html

from the UK. Don't expect an Australian supplier to have something like

this, or if it is available locally it's sure to be double the price!

90 GBP, minus VAT, plus shipping made it 86 GBP = 146 AUD.

[snip]

--

JS

Starting to look like a smart decision. There's suddenly a spate of reports on another group I'm on about SON bearing failures, some as low as 12k. Since the only justification for buying a SON, besides snobbery, is that it is supposedly sturdier and longer-lasting, that's a bit disturbing. Fortunately, I have only one SON; maybe I should sell it on!

Andre Jute


In the U.S. check out http://stores.ebay.com/intelligentdesigncycles
for SP dynamo hubs.

On 15/10/13 05:25, Andre Jute wrote:
On Monday, September 16, 2013 6:58:16 AM UTC+1, James wrote:
My poor ol' Sanyo Dynapower is getting a bit long in the tooth.
The

bearings and bushes are wearing out. It makes a bit more noise
than it

used to, despite me lubricating the moving parts. I suspect it's
days

are numbered.



So I ordered a PV-8
http://www.sp-dynamo.com/8seriesdynamo%20hub.html

from the UK. Don't expect an Australian supplier to have something
like

this, or if it is available locally it's sure to be double the
price!

90 GBP, minus VAT, plus shipping made it 86 GBP = 146 AUD.

[snip]

--

JS

Starting to look like a smart decision. There's suddenly a spate of
reports on another group I'm on about SON bearing failures, some as
low as 12k. Since the only justification for buying a SON, besides
snobbery, is that it is supposedly sturdier and longer-lasting,
that's a bit disturbing. Fortunately, I have only one SON; maybe I
should sell it on!


Are they a cartridge bearing? Easy to replace? 12k miles (or even
worse if kilometres!) is not a long bearing life for a front hub. I
should hope they'd last 3-4 times as long at least. Are these heavily
loaded bikes?

I did read that some people had broken the axle on the SP dynamo, but I
can only assume they are carrying loads, and not just themselves. I
don't expect such a failure given my use of the bike.

--
JS

On Monday, October 14, 2013 5:45:48 PM UTC-4, James wrote:
On 15/10/13 05:25, Andre Jute wrote:


Starting to look like a smart decision. There's suddenly a spate of
reports on another group I'm on about SON bearing failures, some as
low as 12k. ...

Are they a cartridge bearing? Easy to replace? 12k miles (or even
worse if kilometres!) is not a long bearing life for a front hub. I
should hope they'd last 3-4 times as long at least. Are these heavily
loaded bikes?

Since it's Jute posting, remember that there's a strong possibility that the reports are entirely imaginary. We'll see as time passes.

- Frank Krygowski

On Monday, October 14, 2013 5:45:48 PM UTC-4, James wrote:
On 15/10/13 05:25, Andre Jute wrote:

On Monday, September 16, 2013 6:58:16 AM UTC+1, James wrote:

My poor ol' Sanyo Dynapower is getting a bit long in the tooth.

The



bearings and bushes are wearing out. It makes a bit more noise

than it



used to, despite me lubricating the moving parts. I suspect it's

days



are numbered.







So I ordered a PV-8

http://www.sp-dynamo.com/8seriesdynamo%20hub.html



from the UK. Don't expect an Australian supplier to have something

like



this, or if it is available locally it's sure to be double the

price!



90 GBP, minus VAT, plus shipping made it 86 GBP = 146 AUD.



[snip]



--



JS



Starting to look like a smart decision. There's suddenly a spate of

reports on another group I'm on about SON bearing failures, some as

low as 12k. Since the only justification for buying a SON, besides

snobbery, is that it is supposedly sturdier and longer-lasting,

that's a bit disturbing. Fortunately, I have only one SON; maybe I

should sell it on!





Are they a cartridge bearing? Easy to replace? 12k miles (or even

worse if kilometres!) is not a long bearing life for a front hub. I

should hope they'd last 3-4 times as long at least. Are these heavily

loaded bikes?



I did read that some people had broken the axle on the SP dynamo, but I

can only assume they are carrying loads, and not just themselves. I

don't expect such a failure given my use of the bike.



--

JS

I believe that the SON hubs do in fact use cartridge bearings, whereas the Shimano are loose-ball just like their non-dyno hubs. The Shimano dynos are theoretically non-serviceable but it can and has been done. As for the SON, they apparently are serviceable, but SON don't intend them to be field-serviceable.

http://www.nabendynamo.de/service/pdf/Service_SON_e.pdf

nate

On Monday, October 14, 2013 10:45:48 PM UTC+1, James wrote:
On 15/10/13 05:25, Andre Jute wrote:

On Monday, September 16, 2013 6:58:16 AM UTC+1, James wrote:

My poor ol' Sanyo Dynapower is getting a bit long in the tooth.

The



bearings and bushes are wearing out. It makes a bit more noise

than it



used to, despite me lubricating the moving parts. I suspect it's

days



are numbered.







So I ordered a PV-8

http://www.sp-dynamo.com/8seriesdynamo%20hub.html



from the UK. Don't expect an Australian supplier to have something

like



this, or if it is available locally it's sure to be double the

price!



90 GBP, minus VAT, plus shipping made it 86 GBP = 146 AUD.



[snip]



--



JS



Starting to look like a smart decision. There's suddenly a spate of

reports on another group I'm on about SON bearing failures, some as

low as 12k. Since the only justification for buying a SON, besides

snobbery, is that it is supposedly sturdier and longer-lasting,

that's a bit disturbing. Fortunately, I have only one SON; maybe I

should sell it on!





Are they a cartridge bearing? Easy to replace?

SON hubs are not user-serviceable. They give a five-year guarantee, but the cyclist has to pay for carriage to and from the SON factory in Germany, which is pricey for a whole wheel, and a nuisance for stripping the hub out and rebuilding the wheel if you send only the hub. Compare this to Rohloff, which effectively gives you a lifetime guarantee if you change the oil annually, including carriage to anywhere in the world.

12k miles (or even

worse if kilometres!) is not a long bearing life for a front hub. I

should hope they'd last 3-4 times as long at least. Are these heavily

loaded bikes?

12000 miles/ 20,000km according to one report from a fellow who had two fail and now has switched back to battery lamps. (Scharfie will be his pal for life!)

I did read that some people had broken the axle on the SP dynamo, but I

can only assume they are carrying loads, and not just themselves. I

don't expect such a failure given my use of the bike.

These SON failures are from a conference of heavy users, guys who do big miles, loaded tourers, fast tourers, 10k miles pa four-seasons commuters. Sometimes it seems I'm the only credit-card, home-on-the-third-day rider on that conference. I'm there among other reasons because that designer's bikes are perpetually on my shortlist, and his bikes, besides the thoughtfully designed frames, are on my shortlist because he knows the best components, and his clientele really gives them a thorough test, and again and again. (It also helps that they are well-mannered, because I am bored with constant nastiness of the trash on RBT.)

If I can find an email for you, I'll send you the URL of the relevant thread so you can go look for yourself.

Andre Jute