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Damned Central Heating!



 
 
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  #21  
Old March 24th 19, 12:20 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 356
Default Damned Central Heating!

On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 16:06:42 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-23 15:56, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 09:34:21 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-20 11:09, sms wrote:


[...]


There's a big move now to all-electric since the electricity can be
generated without the use of fossil fuels.


Electric? With PG&E as the supplier? I won't touch that with a 10ft pole
for anything where electric power isn't absolutely needed.Yve cooling. No tax
incentives there either because politicians are generally not smart
enough to understand the benefits of that.


You bought a house in a gated community, and you own two cars, and
can't afford electricity?


Please pay closer attention to what was written and, even more so, what
was not written. Premature conclusions are also not wise.

a. We do not live in a gated community. Never did.


Strange that as it has been said more than once that you do live in a
gated community and you have never before refuted it?

b. Our cars are both well over 20 years old and we drive less than
1200mi/year with each of them.


I see, there are no additional costs for using a car if you don't
drive it? Like insurance, etc? Just don't drive them and they are
free?

c. Of course we can afford electricity. However, it is foolish to use a
resource with sky-high prices when there is another much more economical
resource.


How are prices "sky high", assuming that you pay the same rate as
everyone else? They don't have inflation in California? Their minimum
salary isn't "sky high" compared to other states? After all California
has the highest minimum rate of any state in the union. Why shouldn't
their electricity be high also?
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  #22  
Old March 24th 19, 04:23 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,016
Default Damned Central Heating!

On 2019-03-23 16:20, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 16:06:42 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-23 15:56, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 09:34:21 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-20 11:09, sms wrote:


[...]


There's a big move now to all-electric since the electricity can be
generated without the use of fossil fuels.


Electric? With PG&E as the supplier? I won't touch that with a 10ft pole
for anything where electric power isn't absolutely needed.Yve cooling. No tax
incentives there either because politicians are generally not smart
enough to understand the benefits of that.

You bought a house in a gated community, and you own two cars, and
can't afford electricity?


Please pay closer attention to what was written and, even more so, what
was not written. Premature conclusions are also not wise.

a. We do not live in a gated community. Never did.


Strange that as it has been said more than once that you do live in a
gated community and you have never before refuted it?



I have. You should read more carefully.


b. Our cars are both well over 20 years old and we drive less than
1200mi/year with each of them.


I see, there are no additional costs for using a car if you don't
drive it? Like insurance, etc? Just don't drive them and they are
free?


Insurance is cheap and it is also necessary for cycling, which is
covered with the car insurance. The cost pales in comparison to other items.


c. Of course we can afford electricity. However, it is foolish to use a
resource with sky-high prices when there is another much more economical
resource.


How are prices "sky high", assuming that you pay the same rate as
everyone else? They don't have inflation in California? Their minimum
salary isn't "sky high" compared to other states? After all California
has the highest minimum rate of any state in the union. Why shouldn't
their electricity be high also?


See? That's what I mean with high. We pay the highest in the nation or
close to highest for almost everything while often receiving shoddy
service in return, thanks to politically endorsed union strangleholds.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #23  
Old March 24th 19, 11:28 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 547
Default Damned Central Heating!

On Sun, 24 Mar 2019 08:23:11 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-23 16:20, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 16:06:42 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-23 15:56, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 09:34:21 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-20 11:09, sms wrote:

[...]


There's a big move now to all-electric since the electricity can be
generated without the use of fossil fuels.


Electric? With PG&E as the supplier? I won't touch that with a 10ft pole
for anything where electric power isn't absolutely needed.Yve cooling. No tax
incentives there either because politicians are generally not smart
enough to understand the benefits of that.

You bought a house in a gated community, and you own two cars, and
can't afford electricity?


Please pay closer attention to what was written and, even more so, what
was not written. Premature conclusions are also not wise.

a. We do not live in a gated community. Never did.


Strange that as it has been said more than once that you do live in a
gated community and you have never before refuted it?



I have. You should read more carefully.


Well perhaps I missed your reply to one or more of J's messages
mentioning your establishment.

b. Our cars are both well over 20 years old and we drive less than
1200mi/year with each of them.


I see, there are no additional costs for using a car if you don't
drive it? Like insurance, etc? Just don't drive them and they are
free?


Insurance is cheap and it is also necessary for cycling, which is
covered with the car insurance. The cost pales in comparison to other items.



I see. You have insurance for your bicycle? What sort? collision
insurance to pay for all the cars you smash up with your bicycle?

c. Of course we can afford electricity. However, it is foolish to use a
resource with sky-high prices when there is another much more economical
resource.


How are prices "sky high", assuming that you pay the same rate as
everyone else? They don't have inflation in California? Their minimum
salary isn't "sky high" compared to other states? After all California
has the highest minimum rate of any state in the union. Why shouldn't
their electricity be high also?


See? That's what I mean with high. We pay the highest in the nation or
close to highest for almost everything while often receiving shoddy
service in return, thanks to politically endorsed union strangleholds.


I find you very strange. You are an immigrant to the U.S. so one
assumes that you could have lived in any state in the union but you
elected to live in what may well be the most expensive place to live
of any of the 50 states and now you complain about it. Have you ever
heard to old U.S. adage about shooting yourself in the foot?

Someone recently advised you that if you didn't like it in California
just move.

I might point out that during the 20 years I was in the military that
counting the state I was born in, I lived in 8 states and three
foreign countries. Granted it was at "my Uncle's" request but the
point is that moving can be done safely and is not really a traumatic
experience.
--

Cheers,

John B.
  #24  
Old March 24th 19, 11:43 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,870
Default Damned Central Heating!

On Sunday, March 24, 2019 at 8:23:15 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2019-03-23 16:20, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 16:06:42 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-23 15:56, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 09:34:21 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-20 11:09, sms wrote:

[...]


There's a big move now to all-electric since the electricity can be
generated without the use of fossil fuels.


Electric? With PG&E as the supplier? I won't touch that with a 10ft pole
for anything where electric power isn't absolutely needed.Yve cooling. No tax
incentives there either because politicians are generally not smart
enough to understand the benefits of that.

You bought a house in a gated community, and you own two cars, and
can't afford electricity?


Please pay closer attention to what was written and, even more so, what
was not written. Premature conclusions are also not wise.

a. We do not live in a gated community. Never did.


Strange that as it has been said more than once that you do live in a
gated community and you have never before refuted it?



I have. You should read more carefully.


b. Our cars are both well over 20 years old and we drive less than
1200mi/year with each of them.


I see, there are no additional costs for using a car if you don't
drive it? Like insurance, etc? Just don't drive them and they are
free?


Insurance is cheap and it is also necessary for cycling, which is
covered with the car insurance. The cost pales in comparison to other items.


c. Of course we can afford electricity. However, it is foolish to use a
resource with sky-high prices when there is another much more economical
resource.


How are prices "sky high", assuming that you pay the same rate as
everyone else? They don't have inflation in California? Their minimum
salary isn't "sky high" compared to other states? After all California
has the highest minimum rate of any state in the union. Why shouldn't
their electricity be high also?


See? That's what I mean with high. We pay the highest in the nation or
close to highest for almost everything while often receiving shoddy
service in return, thanks to politically endorsed union strangleholds.

--
Regards, Joerg


Move. You can take TK with you. Leave California. Get out of that hell-hole golf-course community! Maybe the Villages in Florida.

-- Jay Beattie.
  #25  
Old March 25th 19, 01:04 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 547
Default Damned Central Heating!

On Sun, 24 Mar 2019 15:43:34 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

On Sunday, March 24, 2019 at 8:23:15 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2019-03-23 16:20, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 16:06:42 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-23 15:56, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 09:34:21 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-20 11:09, sms wrote:

[...]


There's a big move now to all-electric since the electricity can be
generated without the use of fossil fuels.


Electric? With PG&E as the supplier? I won't touch that with a 10ft pole
for anything where electric power isn't absolutely needed.Yve cooling. No tax
incentives there either because politicians are generally not smart
enough to understand the benefits of that.

You bought a house in a gated community, and you own two cars, and
can't afford electricity?


Please pay closer attention to what was written and, even more so, what
was not written. Premature conclusions are also not wise.

a. We do not live in a gated community. Never did.

Strange that as it has been said more than once that you do live in a
gated community and you have never before refuted it?



I have. You should read more carefully.


b. Our cars are both well over 20 years old and we drive less than
1200mi/year with each of them.

I see, there are no additional costs for using a car if you don't
drive it? Like insurance, etc? Just don't drive them and they are
free?


Insurance is cheap and it is also necessary for cycling, which is
covered with the car insurance. The cost pales in comparison to other items.


c. Of course we can afford electricity. However, it is foolish to use a
resource with sky-high prices when there is another much more economical
resource.

How are prices "sky high", assuming that you pay the same rate as
everyone else? They don't have inflation in California? Their minimum
salary isn't "sky high" compared to other states? After all California
has the highest minimum rate of any state in the union. Why shouldn't
their electricity be high also?


See? That's what I mean with high. We pay the highest in the nation or
close to highest for almost everything while often receiving shoddy
service in return, thanks to politically endorsed union strangleholds.

--
Regards, Joerg


Move. You can take TK with you. Leave California. Get out of that hell-hole golf-course community! Maybe the Villages in Florida.

-- Jay Beattie.



Disregarding Hawaii, California is the 4th most expensive state to
live in, electricity wise, while Arkansas and Louisiana are the
cheapest. Florida ranks about in the middle (26th).

--

Cheers,

John B.
  #26  
Old March 25th 19, 01:11 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 547
Default Damned Central Heating!

On Mon, 25 Mar 2019 07:04:40 +0700, John B. Slocomb
wrote:

On Sun, 24 Mar 2019 15:43:34 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

On Sunday, March 24, 2019 at 8:23:15 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2019-03-23 16:20, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 16:06:42 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-23 15:56, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 09:34:21 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-20 11:09, sms wrote:

[...]


There's a big move now to all-electric since the electricity can be
generated without the use of fossil fuels.


Electric? With PG&E as the supplier? I won't touch that with a 10ft pole
for anything where electric power isn't absolutely needed.Yve cooling. No tax
incentives there either because politicians are generally not smart
enough to understand the benefits of that.

You bought a house in a gated community, and you own two cars, and
can't afford electricity?


Please pay closer attention to what was written and, even more so, what
was not written. Premature conclusions are also not wise.

a. We do not live in a gated community. Never did.

Strange that as it has been said more than once that you do live in a
gated community and you have never before refuted it?


I have. You should read more carefully.


b. Our cars are both well over 20 years old and we drive less than
1200mi/year with each of them.

I see, there are no additional costs for using a car if you don't
drive it? Like insurance, etc? Just don't drive them and they are
free?


Insurance is cheap and it is also necessary for cycling, which is
covered with the car insurance. The cost pales in comparison to other items.


c. Of course we can afford electricity. However, it is foolish to use a
resource with sky-high prices when there is another much more economical
resource.

How are prices "sky high", assuming that you pay the same rate as
everyone else? They don't have inflation in California? Their minimum
salary isn't "sky high" compared to other states? After all California
has the highest minimum rate of any state in the union. Why shouldn't
their electricity be high also?


See? That's what I mean with high. We pay the highest in the nation or
close to highest for almost everything while often receiving shoddy
service in return, thanks to politically endorsed union strangleholds.

--
Regards, Joerg


Move. You can take TK with you. Leave California. Get out of that hell-hole golf-course community! Maybe the Villages in Florida.

-- Jay Beattie.



Disregarding Hawaii, California is the 4th most expensive state to
live in, electricity wise, while Arkansas and Louisiana are the
cheapest. Florida ranks about in the middle (26th).


Further research shows that of the 50 states, including Hawaii and
D.C., that California is the most expensive place to live based on the
cost of food, housing, transportation, utilities, health care and
miscellaneous costs.
--

Cheers,

John B.
  #27  
Old March 25th 19, 02:59 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,477
Default Damned Central Heating!

On 3/20/2019 3:44 PM, news18 wrote:

snip

Wood is a preferrable heating method to gas to electric. Since our wood
heater almost needs replacement, we did look at pellets, but limited
supply leading to cost gouging was a concern, plus modern heaters seem to
be tin plate these days.


In California, on "Spare the Air" days it is forbidden to use wood or
pellets for heating. "The rule prohibits burning any solid fuel,
including pellets and manufactured logs."

  #28  
Old March 25th 19, 07:33 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,261
Default Damned Central Heating!

On Saturday, March 23, 2019 at 4:09:26 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2019-03-20 09:42, wrote:
On Tuesday, March 19, 2019 at 1:28:01 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2019-03-19 11:17,
wrote:
A couple of months ago when it was coldest my central heating
stopped igniting. My impression from the sounds it was making was
that the thermocouple was bad or the pilot light that would be
ignited was dirty or some such so that the flame wasn't close
enough to the thermocouple of inform it that there was a real
flame there and turn the full flame on.

The repairman came out and said that the pilot and thermocouple
was OK and changed out the main gas valve. The heater appeared to
work for six weeks and then as the weather got cold again started
not lighting again.

The company sent another repairman out and he said that it was
the main control board and replaced that.

I am now $1,600 into "repairs" and sure enough - the heater
isn't lighting still.

It would appear to me at this time that there is nothing more to
replace but the pilot tube and the thermocouple. So I wonder how
to convince the repairman that there is something wrong with one
of those?


We had that happen a long time ago and the cause was the
electronic controller board. The central propane furnace would go
VROOOOP .. PHUTAH-PHUT ... RUMBLE ... VROOOOOOOOOP ... and never
stayed on anymore.

When the technician came out he exclaimed "Oh look, an old Fenwal
controller board!", saying he was amazed that it lasted this long.
He switched it out against one from another manufacturer and all
was well.

I asked him to leave the old board and when probing it I found that
the triac that controls the main burner valve had gone partially
bad so it wouldn't be able to send a full current through the valve
solenoid anymore. Could have kicked myself because instead of
paying a few hundred Dollars I could have gotten one of those triac
for a couple of Dollars and replaced it. If these triac are on a
separate driver board then check that.

There is also a suction sensor, for example a flap in the intake
stream that operates a signaling switch. If that got crudded up it
might at times falsely signal a failing air draft and that would
cut the main valve.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/





when the technician came out again the board was showing errors of
"too many tries". He pulled the connector off and spread the male
connector so that it would make better connection to the main gas
valve and it appears to work perfectly now. Though when the main gas
valve was replaced 3 months ago it all worked fine until recently.


The first technician could have diagnosed that easily by measuring how
many volts are actually arriving at the solenoid. This is the first
order of business for me when, for example, my wife says that a certain
zone in the yard doesn't get watered reliably.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/


He got the correct readings because the problem wasn't the board but the connection between the board and the gas solenoid not making proper contact. Since both the board and the valve were new there really wasn't any question about their working. It took him a little while to isolate the connection.. These connectors are the male and female pin types. So it is virtually impossible to measure them when connected.
  #29  
Old March 25th 19, 07:37 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,261
Default Damned Central Heating!

On Sunday, March 24, 2019 at 3:43:36 PM UTC-7, jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, March 24, 2019 at 8:23:15 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2019-03-23 16:20, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 16:06:42 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-23 15:56, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 09:34:21 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-20 11:09, sms wrote:

[...]


There's a big move now to all-electric since the electricity can be
generated without the use of fossil fuels.


Electric? With PG&E as the supplier? I won't touch that with a 10ft pole
for anything where electric power isn't absolutely needed.Yve cooling. No tax
incentives there either because politicians are generally not smart
enough to understand the benefits of that.

You bought a house in a gated community, and you own two cars, and
can't afford electricity?


Please pay closer attention to what was written and, even more so, what
was not written. Premature conclusions are also not wise.

a. We do not live in a gated community. Never did.

Strange that as it has been said more than once that you do live in a
gated community and you have never before refuted it?



I have. You should read more carefully.


b. Our cars are both well over 20 years old and we drive less than
1200mi/year with each of them.

I see, there are no additional costs for using a car if you don't
drive it? Like insurance, etc? Just don't drive them and they are
free?


Insurance is cheap and it is also necessary for cycling, which is
covered with the car insurance. The cost pales in comparison to other items.


c. Of course we can afford electricity. However, it is foolish to use a
resource with sky-high prices when there is another much more economical
resource.

How are prices "sky high", assuming that you pay the same rate as
everyone else? They don't have inflation in California? Their minimum
salary isn't "sky high" compared to other states? After all California
has the highest minimum rate of any state in the union. Why shouldn't
their electricity be high also?


See? That's what I mean with high. We pay the highest in the nation or
close to highest for almost everything while often receiving shoddy
service in return, thanks to politically endorsed union strangleholds.

--
Regards, Joerg


Move. You can take TK with you. Leave California. Get out of that hell-hole golf-course community! Maybe the Villages in Florida.

-- Jay Beattie.


Sun City, AZ, is hardly anything other than homes and golf courses. Every drives around on the streets with electric golf carts. In two weeks of riding all over Phoenix area I never saw one single homeless person. And they have more illegals per citizen than California. I drove up to the Grand Canyon and all of the cities and towns in between - no homeless.

It was sort of the way Portland used to be before they got a Democrat political structure.
  #30  
Old March 25th 19, 07:39 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,261
Default Damned Central Heating!

On Sunday, March 24, 2019 at 5:04:45 PM UTC-7, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Sun, 24 Mar 2019 15:43:34 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

On Sunday, March 24, 2019 at 8:23:15 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2019-03-23 16:20, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 16:06:42 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-23 15:56, John B Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 23 Mar 2019 09:34:21 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2019-03-20 11:09, sms wrote:

[...]


There's a big move now to all-electric since the electricity can be
generated without the use of fossil fuels.


Electric? With PG&E as the supplier? I won't touch that with a 10ft pole
for anything where electric power isn't absolutely needed.Yve cooling. No tax
incentives there either because politicians are generally not smart
enough to understand the benefits of that.

You bought a house in a gated community, and you own two cars, and
can't afford electricity?


Please pay closer attention to what was written and, even more so, what
was not written. Premature conclusions are also not wise.

a. We do not live in a gated community. Never did.

Strange that as it has been said more than once that you do live in a
gated community and you have never before refuted it?


I have. You should read more carefully.


b. Our cars are both well over 20 years old and we drive less than
1200mi/year with each of them.

I see, there are no additional costs for using a car if you don't
drive it? Like insurance, etc? Just don't drive them and they are
free?


Insurance is cheap and it is also necessary for cycling, which is
covered with the car insurance. The cost pales in comparison to other items.


c. Of course we can afford electricity. However, it is foolish to use a
resource with sky-high prices when there is another much more economical
resource.

How are prices "sky high", assuming that you pay the same rate as
everyone else? They don't have inflation in California? Their minimum
salary isn't "sky high" compared to other states? After all California
has the highest minimum rate of any state in the union. Why shouldn't
their electricity be high also?


See? That's what I mean with high. We pay the highest in the nation or
close to highest for almost everything while often receiving shoddy
service in return, thanks to politically endorsed union strangleholds.

--
Regards, Joerg


Move. You can take TK with you. Leave California. Get out of that hell-hole golf-course community! Maybe the Villages in Florida.

-- Jay Beattie.



Disregarding Hawaii, California is the 4th most expensive state to
live in, electricity wise, while Arkansas and Louisiana are the
cheapest. Florida ranks about in the middle (26th).

--

Cheers,

John B.


Last month I had a $20 electricity bill and a $265 gas bill. You know - that carbon tax.
 




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