#101
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So, for my ride for today, I decided to look for African Americans on their
bikes, since we were riding the popular Lake Washington Loop route. I probably saw two dozen, the most I think I've ever seen on any ride. Maybe they've always been there, and I just haven't noticed, who knows? -- Warm Regards, Claire Petersky Home of the meditative cyclist: http://home.earthlink.net/~cpetersky/Welcome.htm Personal page: http://www.geocities.com/cpetersky/ See the books I've set free at: http://bookcrossing.com/referral/Cpetersky |
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#102
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jt wrote:
It is more an issue of socioeconomic's than race. I know runners & cyclists of all races. However I have always lived in nice middle/upper class neighborhoods. People who live in working class neighborhoods who are adults generally don't exercise other than perhaps lifting weights, cardio is non-existent. People riding on bikes/running wearing spandex etc it can be safely assumed that their job does not involve manual labor but most likely sitting at a desk. I have had jobs when I was younger that involved manual labor and I was too tired to exercise. I know anyone can find anecdotal evidence to the contrary but the facts are what they are. I think this is generally true, but I found the exception in southern CA. While the usual crew are still dominant in cycling, there are plenty of people in the construction business, both management and labor, as well as a lot of police/fire/rescue folks. Then again, class differences and identities are not as apparent in CA as in the east. Oviously some people have way more money than others, but the usual class stereotypes hardly apply. Nor are class identities as strong. There are plenty of construction workers with yuppie tastes, and professionals with redneck tastes. Assumptions about income levels don't apply either -- skilled tradesmen often make healthy six figure incomes, while engineers, scientists, and educators with advanced degrees struggle to make half that much. About being too tired to work -- it happens, but smart laborers know staying in shape in makes their job a lot easier. If you can't maintain your pace all day, every day, week to week, month to month, you're doing something wrong. Working yourself into shape on the job only works when you're young -- sometimes. After 30 or so, it takes a concerted effort to stay in shape in order to keep working comfortably. If this isn't true at 30, it certainly is at 40. Just 50 years ago it was common for laborers to retire at 40, and drop dead by 45. Today we know a lot more about nutrition, exercise, overuse injuries, etc. Of course not everyone's up to speed with this. As with many other things it's a problem of education. Matt O. |
#103
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"Claire Petersky" wrote:
"RonSonic" wrote in message news On Sat, 5 Mar 2005 12:52:29 -0800, "Claire Petersky" wrote: FWIW, as a white woman, I feel safer riding in urban black neighborhoods than I do on many rural roads. Young black men apparently find very little percentage in harrassing me for the sake of harrassing me; somehow in the woods a young white guy in monster truck will think it's fun to run me off the road. Has the latter actually happened? I'm both fierce about keeping my lane position, and also seem to need less space to be comfortable between me and the motor vehicle than a lot of other cyclists, so, I'm pretty hard to run off the road. I've had people come pretty close, though. Yet you somehow created a stereotype image of the crazed rural truck drivers with homicidal tendencies toward bicycles,. But I'll bet had the unqualified negative stereotype been about the young black men, you'd be offended. Bottom line, there are jerks in every demographic, including in the suburban black woman demographic that you point out in the next post (which should tell you about all you really need to know about making stereotypical generalizations). From my experience, the percentage of jerks in any group is well above zero, but far under a significant percentage - I tend to leave it at that. Mark Hickey Habanero Cycles http://www.habcycles.com Home of the $695 ti frame |
#104
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Mark Hickey wrote: Yet you somehow created a stereotype image of the crazed rural truck drivers with homicidal tendencies toward bicycles,. But I'll bet had the unqualified negative stereotype been about the young black men, you'd be offended. Bottom line, there are jerks in every demographic, including in the suburban black woman demographic that you point out in the next post (which should tell you about all you really need to know about making stereotypical generalizations). From my experience, the percentage of jerks in any group is well above zero, but far under a significant percentage - I tend to leave it at that. You can leave it at that, but I think it's silly to pretend that all groups contain the same percentage of jerks. Maybe it's too un-PC for you, but after seven years of living in the rural South, I feel very strongly that among backwoods pickup drivers with rebel flags, the average is much higher than one a**hole per person. Details on request, I suppose - but I had those guys sic dogs on me, try to grab my sisters hair as she rode her bike, physically assault me, etc. When I taught in a school down there, I heard them talk about going hunting and taking "bush shots" (shooting at unseen animals - or people? - they heard in the bushes). I had them ride motorcycles on sidewalks outside classroom doors. I had them mercilessly make fun of black students because they were black... There were some fine folks in that demographic, to be sure. But based on my samples, there were a higher percentage of jerks than I've encountered in any other group. Let me be quick to apologize to the rebel-flagged, pickup driving cyclists who are reading this. I figure, if any one of those guys ever got on a bicycle, their IQ would instantaneously rise. OK, that's my personal prejudice, based on my personal experience. Have at it. |
#106
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Anybody have any theories? Maybe this varies in different parts of the country. In Philadelphia I have ridden with many Afro-American and Asian riders, and frequently see people of all colors both in club groups and riding individually. There seems to be a good mix whether it's road or mountain biking. Last summer I saw a large pack of fully kitted-out riders, both male and female, on very nice bikes - all African American. Since it's unusual to see a single-race group around here, I rode up and asked where they were from, and it turned out they were in town from Atlanta, taking part in one of the summertime fraternity picnics which the city hosts every year. Philadelphia in general seems to be quite relaxed when it comes to racial mixing - I can't say that no one notices race, but it doesn't seem nearly as segregated as Boston or Chicago. Mort |
#107
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Matt O'Toole wrote: jt wrote: About being too tired to work -- it happens, but smart laborers know staying in shape in makes their job a lot easier. If you can't maintain your pace all day, every day, week to week, month to month, you're doing something wrong. Working yourself into shape on the job only works when you're young -- sometimes. After 30 or so, it takes a concerted effort to stay in shape in order to keep working comfortably. If this isn't true at 30, it certainly is at 40. Just 50 years ago it was common for laborers to retire at 40, and drop dead by 45. Today we know a lot more about nutrition, exercise, overuse injuries, etc. Of course not everyone's up to speed with this. As with many other things it's a problem of education. Matt O. Tell my 86 year old construction working father (retired at 70) that he should have exercised when he arrived home from work each day. The look on his face would be priceless. ;-) Do you work construction? Are you an educated construction worker who works his ass off all day then comes home and exercises? Doesn't sound that smart to me. I should get all the construction guys around here up to speed. Some of them are still working in their 70's. Keeps them young. All Good Things, Maggie |
#108
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Claire Petersky wrote:
So, for my ride for today, I decided to look for African Americans on their bikes, since we were riding the popular Lake Washington Loop route. I probably saw two dozen, the most I think I've ever seen on any ride. Maybe they've always been there, and I just haven't noticed, who knows? I don't think I've seen that many at one go before [1]. When I have seen them, they were almost exclusively riding obviously nice bikes and kitted out fairly well. I stopped once to help one fellow and got to talking with him.[2] He was working for the local football team in some white collar fashion. I don't remember what it was precisely, it was either PR or recruiting, but some sort of desk job. So he does fit the profile fairly well that we've been talking about. [1] I'm talking about adult cyclists. My neighborhood and some of the other neighborhoods I travel and shop in are much more heavily Black than is typical for Seattle. So I see a *lot* of kids out on bikes, but very rarely any adults. [2] Two busted drive side spokes on an undertensioned wheel (some machine built thing that came with his bike). Releasing his rear brake didn't come close to spinning free, so I tweaked it some with my spoke wrench. He was a new rider, so he really hadn't a really good idea of what to do. -- Dane Jackson - z u v e m b i @ u n i x b i g o t s . o r g "We don't care. We don't have to. We're the Phone Company." |
#109
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mort wrote: Anybody have any theories? Maybe this varies in different parts of the country. In Philadelphia I have ridden with many Afro-American and Asian riders, and frequently see people of all colors both in club groups and riding individually. There seems to be a good mix whether it's road or mountain biking. Last summer I saw a large pack of fully kitted-out riders, both male and female, on very nice bikes - all African American. Since it's unusual to see a single-race group around here, I rode up and asked where they were from, and it turned out they were in town from Atlanta, taking part in one of the summertime fraternity picnics which the city hosts every year. Philadelphia in general seems to be quite relaxed when it comes to racial mixing - I can't say that no one notices race, but it doesn't seem nearly as segregated as Boston or Chicago. Mort For some reason this thread about which socio-economic or ethic group rides bikes rubs me the wrong way. I have not figured out why as of yet. Maybe it will come to me in a vision. Is this about "Lance Armstrong Riding" or just plain old get on a bike and go? There was a time when people only rode a bike because they could not afford a car. Anyone out there remember being forced into riding a bike because you had absolutely no money for a car? I do. Maybe thats why I can't relate to the bikes that cost thousands of dollars. It was only a year ago that I found out that there are bikes that expensive. When John Kerry's bicycle was a topic of conversation. I actually never knew a bike could cost that much. All good things, Maggie |
#110
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On 10 Mar 2005 05:26:43 -0800, "Maggie" wrote:
For some reason this thread about which socio-economic or ethic group rides bikes rubs me the wrong way. I have not figured out why as of yet. Maybe it will come to me in a vision. Is this about "Lance Armstrong Riding" or just plain old get on a bike and go? Let's call it sport riding, as a contrast to DUI riders, migrant workers who haven't gotten a down payment to the buy here pay here lot, kids selling crack from chrome BMX bike and people who just gotta get in shape and cycling is easier on the ankles even though they hate it as much as they do running. Some folks don't do sport riding. Sometimes it makes sense as a practical matter, other times it's just some cultural quirk. As for why it would rub you the wrong way, you know that you are a sport / fitness rider and you know the sort of attitude about that behavior common to your neighborhood. There was a time when people only rode a bike because they could not afford a car. Anyone out there remember being forced into riding a bike because you had absolutely no money for a car? I do. Maybe thats why I can't relate to the bikes that cost thousands of dollars. It was only a year ago that I found out that there are bikes that expensive. When John Kerry's bicycle was a topic of conversation. I actually never knew a bike could cost that much. I remember being broke and having a bike as my primary mode. But I am not aware that there was EVER a time when one rode a bike "only" because a car was out of the budget. That may have been the case in some neighborhoods in some overpopulated mid-Atlantic region. Then again, that region seems to hold other narrow, stupid and bigoted ideas and practices. As for bikes costing thousands, it is amusing when the bike is that much more capable than the rider. At the same time what's the point of expensive furniture. Basically the same, these are nice things we'd like to own and have surrounding us. Ron |
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