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Dry lube?



 
 
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  #21  
Old April 27th 18, 07:41 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
James[_8_]
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Posts: 5,740
Default Dry lube?

On 27/04/18 10:14, John B. wrote:


I would be a bit apprehensive about heating any hydrocarbon over an
open flame.... after all their most important property is that they
burn.


So does most cooking oil. The interesting bit is the flashpoint.

Motor oil seems fairly high. 420-485F = 215C.
Similar for paraffin wax at 250C.

Food oil is a bit higher at 315C

But keep in mind, you usually see smoke before fire. If the solution is
smoking hot, turn off the heat source.

Or use a thermometer to monitor the temperature and keep it at or below
150C to be safe.

--
JS
Ads
  #22  
Old April 27th 18, 09:57 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tanguy Ortolo
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Default Dry lube?

Frank Krygowski, 2018-04-26 17:50+0200:
The other common advice with this method: Don't heat the wax-oil mix
indoors over an open flame. Supposedly the vapors are flammable and any
resulting fire can be fierce and difficult to extinguish. So your gas
kitchen stove is out.


I already fought such a fire, due to the negligence of a friend that was
melting wax to make some torchs. It was on an electric kitchen stove,
but he left if unattended for so long that the was started to boil, and
the vapor autoignited! It made a flame of about one meter, which I
managed to shut off by simply covering it with a metal lid, and waiting
for the wax to cool down.

You clearly do not want that to happen in your kitchen, and it is useful
to know that it can happen even with no external flame.

--
Tanguy
  #23  
Old April 27th 18, 10:24 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tanguy Ortolo
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Default Dry lube?

Tanguy Ortolo, 2018-04-26 10:46+0200:
Great, I have to try this! With some adaptation to enhance the wife
acceptance factor, because I expect some trouble if I use a kitchen pot
for such a mechanic work. :-D


In fact, I think I will use a glass jar initially meant for jam, both as
a double boiler and to store afterwards. The glass will make the melting
slower of course, but it will resist the heat and it has a lid.

I am already using a jar full of white gas to clean the chain, so that
would just be another jar with a different label.

Now I wonder, after I have done my mixture and deep-waxed the chain, I
could add some solvent to keep that liquid, and use that later to
lubricate the chain without removing it, could I not? Once applied, can
I expect the solvent to evaporate, leaving only the paraffin wax and oil
mixture? I will try that on something else anyway, preparing a small
amount of that and leaving it on something metallic to see the result
after a couple of hours.

--
Tanguy
  #24  
Old April 27th 18, 11:29 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
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Posts: 8,281
Default Dry lube?

On 4/24/2018 2:06 AM, Tanguy Ortolo wrote:
Dear cyclists,

After years using wet lubes in all conditions (currently, a specific
chain oil with PTFE from 3in1
http://www.3-en-un.fr/produit/lubrifiant-chaines-et-cables-250ml/),
and being used to seing my chain getting very dirty, I have just learnt
that I may avoid this by using dry lube instead.

Actually, I have heard of one specific product, the Squirt dry lube
http://www.squirtlube.com/our-products/. It is about twice more
expensive than the lubricant I am currently using, but it is supposed to
reduce cleaning work, and if it does make the chain cleaner, it may as
well reduce its wear and extend its life.

So, have any of you tried that lubricant, or any other dry one? Would
you recommend it rather than wet lubes? My most important usage is a
daily commuting through suburb streets and forest paths (in all weather
conditions, therfore quite muddy when it rains, but now that summer is
coming, it is going to be rather dry).



I recall when I was in my teens and read somewhere about molybdenum
disulfide being a great dry lubricant for bicycle chains. But it had the
same issue as most dry lubricants, you can't get them inside the chain
where they're needed, it just makes a mess on the outside. It was
difficult to find at the time, but one distributor sold me a single can.

Hot wax at least can get inside the rollers and sleeves, but once it
cools and hardens it is quickly displaced. That's why all the experts
advise against hot wax. It causes all sorts of problems. Of course some
people mix the wax with some kind of oil to ensure that there is some
actual lubricant inside, but they could just leave out the wax and
they'd be just as well off. But for some people. recreational chain
cleaning and lubing is a hobby, so if it make them happy then there's no
harm in messing with pots, pans, double boilers, etc.

Whatever lubricant you use, be sure that it can penetrate inside.
Foaming chain lubes for non-O ring chains are the best at lubricating,
but of course you'll have to wipe the excess off the outside of the
chain after you apply it.
  #25  
Old April 28th 18, 02:18 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B.[_3_]
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Posts: 3,967
Default Dry lube?

On Fri, 27 Apr 2018 16:41:54 +1000, James
wrote:

On 27/04/18 10:14, John B. wrote:


I would be a bit apprehensive about heating any hydrocarbon over an
open flame.... after all their most important property is that they
burn.


So does most cooking oil. The interesting bit is the flashpoint.

Motor oil seems fairly high. 420-485F = 215C.
Similar for paraffin wax at 250C.

Food oil is a bit higher at 315C

But keep in mind, you usually see smoke before fire. If the solution is
smoking hot, turn off the heat source.

Or use a thermometer to monitor the temperature and keep it at or below
150C to be safe.


I use a Chinese made electric "Wok". I let the pot melt the wax and
cycle through at least one thermostat cycle and then drop in the chain
and leave it for two cycles. By this time the chain is at
approximately the same temperature as the liquid wax.

I then remove the chain from the wax and "hang it up to dry" until it
reaches ambient temperatures and then reinstall it.

When the chain is first handled after waxing it is slightly stiff
proving that the wax has penetrated into the inner regions of the
chain. As for those that assert that the wax is squeezed out of the
chain I can only comment that I took a couple of links apart on a
waxed chain after use and the wax was not squeezed out of the links.
It was still there.
--
Cheers,

John B.

  #26  
Old April 28th 18, 04:25 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
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Posts: 6,044
Default Dry lube?

On 4/27/2018 6:29 PM, sms wrote:


Hot wax at least can get inside the rollers and sleeves, but once it
cools and hardens it is quickly displaced. That's why all the experts
advise against hot wax. It causes all sorts of problems.


sigh Mr. Scharf AKA "sms" never tires of spreading misinformation.

See
https://www.bikeradar.com/us/road/ne...formula-36424/

http://www.velonews.com/2013/03/bike...ith-wax_279148

There are other sources I could quote or link. But anyone new to this
group should understand, Scharf's definition of "expert" is: "someone
who happens to agree with Scharf."


--
- Frank Krygowski
  #27  
Old April 28th 18, 06:15 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B.[_3_]
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Posts: 3,967
Default Dry lube?

On Fri, 27 Apr 2018 23:25:52 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 4/27/2018 6:29 PM, sms wrote:


Hot wax at least can get inside the rollers and sleeves, but once it
cools and hardens it is quickly displaced. That's why all the experts
advise against hot wax. It causes all sorts of problems.


sigh Mr. Scharf AKA "sms" never tires of spreading misinformation.

See
https://www.bikeradar.com/us/road/ne...formula-36424/

http://www.velonews.com/2013/03/bike...ith-wax_279148

There are other sources I could quote or link. But anyone new to this
group should understand, Scharf's definition of "expert" is: "someone
who happens to agree with Scharf."



Well he is a politician now and isn't that what politicians do? Make
loud, positive, comments with the assumption that if they talk loud
enough someone will listen.
--
Cheers,

John B.

  #28  
Old April 28th 18, 09:30 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 255
Default Dry lube?

On Saturday, April 28, 2018 at 5:25:55 AM UTC+2, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 4/27/2018 6:29 PM, sms wrote:


Hot wax at least can get inside the rollers and sleeves, but once it
cools and hardens it is quickly displaced. That's why all the experts
advise against hot wax. It causes all sorts of problems.


sigh Mr. Scharf AKA "sms" never tires of spreading misinformation.

See
https://www.bikeradar.com/us/road/ne...formula-36424/

http://www.velonews.com/2013/03/bike...ith-wax_279148

There are other sources I could quote or link. But anyone new to this
group should understand, Scharf's definition of "expert" is: "someone
who happens to agree with Scharf."


--
- Frank Krygowski


Stop, stop it is getting into a religion discussion already.

Lou
  #29  
Old April 28th 18, 03:21 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sepp Ruf
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Posts: 196
Default Dry lube?

wrote:
Frank Krygowski wrote:


See
https://www.bikeradar.com/us/road/ne...formula-36424/

[...] it is getting into a religion discussion already.


Oh, great!

You just can't get over the fact that using outdated Squirt instead of
switching to Danish Space Agency approved UFO Drip lube means wasting
precious power_!!!

Loud lube saving watts!
http://www.ceramicspeed.com/media/539856/UFO-Drip-Magazine.pdf
  #30  
Old April 28th 18, 05:45 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Ralph Barone[_4_]
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Posts: 154
Default Dry lube?

wrote:
On Saturday, April 28, 2018 at 5:25:55 AM UTC+2, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 4/27/2018 6:29 PM, sms wrote:


Hot wax at least can get inside the rollers and sleeves, but once it
cools and hardens it is quickly displaced. That's why all the experts
advise against hot wax. It causes all sorts of problems.


sigh Mr. Scharf AKA "sms" never tires of spreading misinformation.

See
https://www.bikeradar.com/us/road/ne...formula-36424/

http://www.velonews.com/2013/03/bike...ith-wax_279148

There are other sources I could quote or link. But anyone new to this
group should understand, Scharf's definition of "expert" is: "someone
who happens to agree with Scharf."


--
- Frank Krygowski


Stop, stop it is getting into a religion discussion already.

Lou


Oh yeah?! Well my God's chain lasts longer than your God's chain.

 




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