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Making America into Amsterdam



 
 
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  #341  
Old July 27th 18, 07:31 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
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Posts: 13,447
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 7/27/2018 9:25 AM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-26 18:43, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 16:27:45 -0700, Joerg
Joerg wrote
On 2018-07-25 16:41, John B. Slocomb wrote:
25 Jul Joerg wrote
On 2018-07-24 19:53, John B. Slocomb wrote:
Joerg wrote
On 2018-07-23 18:27, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Mon, 23 Jul 2018 15:13:21 -0700, Joerg
Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-22 21:44, John B. Slocomb wrote:


If the bicycles are for work, what are the cars for?


snip snip
I might point out that my father built two houses (2
bedroom and 3
bedroom) while working as a postal clerk by doing all of
the work
himself. Granted it does take a long time but it is both
possible and
economically feasible.


And how did the lumber, cladding and all that get there? On
a bicycle? On foot?



When rebuilding my girlfriend's sun porch this spring, we
uncovered the the former exterior house wall which was rough
sawn 15~18" planks on rough sawn studs with squarecut nails,
circa 1920 when milled lumber was plentiful if one had cash
and a means to move it, which they apparently did not. What
they had were axes, 2-man saws and draft horses with chains
to get the logs down off the ridge in snow.

The best way to get any job done will vary a lot depending
on who you are and where (physically and philosophically)
you are. Sometimes that means a bicycle where other guys
might choose a truck or just not to do the job at all.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


Ads
  #342  
Old July 27th 18, 07:39 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 13,447
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 7/27/2018 11:44 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/26/2018 9:43 PM, John B. Slocomb wrote:

If little Joey has adequate medical attention his
appendicitis will
never become acute.


Sorry, I disagree based on personal experience.

Has anyone besides me had the experience of riding their
bike home from work with acute appendicitis?

It didn't happen because of a lack of medical attention. I
felt fine in the morning, and not very bad in the afternoon.
I had a belly ache on the way home, but by about 7 PM I was
feverish and shaking. My doctor came into the office to
examine me, and by about 9 PM I was at the ER, based on his
evaluation.


Notoriously difficult to diagnose and the stakes are too
high to guess. My brother the Doc says he would demur and
defer to a specialist.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #343  
Old July 27th 18, 07:45 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 401
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 27/07/2018 11:49 AM, Radey Shouman wrote:
Duane writes:

John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 21:09:57 -0700 (PDT), Frank Krygowski
wrote:


[ ... ]

Most people driving at night are sensible and responsible. But there's a
significant number who just do not bother to turn their high beams
off. There's
also a significant number who either say "MFFY, I'm leaving my brights on"
or who might think "Wait, you mean there are two settings for my
headlights??"

Those latter ones are the ones I'm calling low IQ. And compared to totally
self-centered and abusive, low IQ is charitable.

- Frank Krygowski

I really wonder. I've driven with all sorts of folks from the so
called "red necks" to some pretty sophisticated people, school
teachers et al, and I can't remember single example of someone
running on high beams just to be a Horse's Ass.

I have seen vehicles with the head lights out of adjustment, running
on high, but in that (those) cases it still isn't an effort to be
obnoxious, rather an effort to see where one is going.

But maybe I've lived a sheltered life and they are out there. After
more then half of the first 20 years of my working career was spent
outside the U.S. and all of the next 20 or so, so maybe there places
that are choc ka-block full with people that the average person would
pay good money to avoid.... and I just haven't been there yet.

.... but I keep watching the antics of your latest President ...



No one was talking about high beams. They were talking about the LED or
whatever headlights that give off a bright bluish tinted light. Bright
enough to seem like they’re high beams.


Frank *is* talking about high beams:


Yes, well I should have said no one WAS talking about hi beams. We
certainly weren't when we originally hijacked this thread.

  #344  
Old July 27th 18, 07:52 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 401
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 27/07/2018 2:09 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Friday, July 27, 2018 at 9:44:15 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/26/2018 9:43 PM, John B. Slocomb wrote:

If little Joey has adequate medical attention his appendicitis will
never become acute.


Sorry, I disagree based on personal experience.

Has anyone besides me had the experience of riding their bike home from
work with acute appendicitis?

It didn't happen because of a lack of medical attention. I felt fine in
the morning, and not very bad in the afternoon. I had a belly ache on
the way home, but by about 7 PM I was feverish and shaking. My doctor
came into the office to examine me, and by about 9 PM I was at the ER,
based on his evaluation.


No, but I've ridden my bike with acute pulmonary embolism, broken hand, separated shoulder, broken ribs, broken legs (although with internal fixation and ortho boots), internal bleeding, concussion, facial, leg, arm lacerations, flu, head-cold, allergies, hang-over, sunburn, acne and indigestion. Not all at the same time. My hair is also thinning, and my joints hurt. I could do a century with acute appendicitis.

Let's face it, little Joey was a slacker. I don't miss him in the least. And the last time I checked, even people with no cars can call an ambulance or even Uber. No need to ride the bike to the hospital.

Don't they have ambulances in Cameron Park? Uber? Yellow cab? A spare golf cart? We can save little Joey!

-- Jay Beattie.


I don't often agree with Frank but he's right in that acute appendicitis
comes on pretty quickly. In my case I came back from dinner and felt a
bit queasy but went to bed. Woke up a couple of hours later and had to
go to the ER. Appendix burst while they were giving me tests.

John's comment about poor medical attention made no sense.
  #345  
Old July 27th 18, 08:25 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
SMS
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,477
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 7/27/2018 8:45 AM, Radey Shouman wrote:

Ohio must be different. I have experienced over-bright headlights, and
headlights that are poorly aimed, but have never been anywhere that
drivers commonly neglected to dim their brights for oncoming motor
traffic. In many locales behaving that way would be tempting homicidal
road rage, not to mention traffic citations.


Ditto, California drivers are very good about dimming their lights.But I
can say that within my own family, when driving and we see movement at
night, that could be an animal, pedestrian, or poorly lit or unlit
cyclist, we do put on the high beams in order to see them better. And
say something among ourselves, like "what an idiot," (if it's a person!).

We bike a lot and we are careful to use lights and other visibility aids
at night and we don't experience the issue of motorists blinding us with
high beams. It's a choice we make to ensure that motorists can easily
see us, and obviously not everyone makes the same choice. To insist
"motorists should be able to see us even when we are not conspicuous" is
not very smart, IMVAIO.

As a cyclists, it's a conscious decision to decide whether to use no
lighting, minimum legal lighting, or lighting that makes you
conspicuous. If using no lighting or poor lighting then you should be
grateful that motorists are paying sufficient attention to the road that
when they see movement they try to see you! Also remember that not every
driver has the best night vision.
  #346  
Old July 27th 18, 08:42 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,016
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On 2018-07-27 12:25, sms wrote:
On 7/27/2018 8:45 AM, Radey Shouman wrote:

Ohio must be different. I have experienced over-bright headlights, and
headlights that are poorly aimed, but have never been anywhere that
drivers commonly neglected to dim their brights for oncoming motor
traffic. In many locales behaving that way would be tempting homicidal
road rage, not to mention traffic citations.


Ditto, California drivers are very good about dimming their lights.But I
can say that within my own family, when driving and we see movement at
night, that could be an animal, pedestrian, or poorly lit or unlit
cyclist, we do put on the high beams in order to see them better. And
say something among ourselves, like "what an idiot," (if it's a person!).

We bike a lot and we are careful to use lights and other visibility aids
at night and we don't experience the issue of motorists blinding us with
high beams. It's a choice we make to ensure that motorists can easily
see us, and obviously not everyone makes the same choice. To insist
"motorists should be able to see us even when we are not conspicuous" is
not very smart, IMVAIO.

As a cyclists, it's a conscious decision to decide whether to use no
lighting, minimum legal lighting, or lighting that makes you
conspicuous. If using no lighting or poor lighting then you should be
grateful that motorists are paying sufficient attention to the road that
when they see movement they try to see you! Also remember that not every
driver has the best night vision.



Many cyclists are blissfully risk-ignorant. Not just in traffic where
they ride unlit or poorly lit at night. Yesterday I rode through a long
narrow bike path tunnel underneath Hwy 50. All others generally blow
through there at their full 15-25mph, in almost total darkness. Yet this
is a place where rattlesnakes often curl up to cool off.

I always go through there at 5mph with my headlight at full power.
Because of rattlers and because there is the occasional homeless person
sleeping off yesterday's hangover.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
  #347  
Old July 27th 18, 11:07 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 144
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On Fri, 27 Jul 2018 09:05:42 -0400, Duane
wrote:

On 27/07/2018 8:08 AM, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Fri, 27 Jul 2018 10:32:04 -0000 (UTC), Duane
wrote:

John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 21:09:57 -0700 (PDT), Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On Thursday, July 26, 2018 at 9:47:18 PM UTC-4, sms wrote:
On 7/26/2018 7:04 AM, Sepp Ruf wrote:

snip

More utter nonsense from you!

Wow, maybe you should think about formulating logical responses to facts,
rather than emulating our commander in chief.

Both sms and Aunt Joan are ignorant and beyond hope, so why bother?

LOL, well I'm pretty sure that everyone here can tell the difference
between a logical factual response and one-line, content-free, personal
attacks. It speaks volumes about each poster.

Here is one web site where you can begin to educate yourself:
https://www.dmv.org/how-to-guides/when-to-use-headlights.php

"In some instances, using the high beam setting on your headlights will
make it easier to see the road. If there are few or no streetlights on
the road, high beams will help you see farther down your path,
preventing you from hitting any animals or pedestrians crossing in front
of you."

This is why motorists use high beams. It isn't to be obnoxious, at least
not in most cases. It's to avoid hitting things that are difficult to
see at night

SMS, I believe everyone here knows how to use headlights. Those instructions
need to go to the dolts who my wife complained about on our drive home this
evening. It was about 30 miles entirely over rural highways. My wife complained
more than I did - "I wish those guys would dim their lights!" or "I hate those
bright lights! Why isn't that illegal?"

Most people driving at night are sensible and responsible. But there's a
significant number who just do not bother to turn their high beams off. There's
also a significant number who either say "MFFY, I'm leaving my brights on"
or who might think "Wait, you mean there are two settings for my headlights??"

Those latter ones are the ones I'm calling low IQ. And compared to totally
self-centered and abusive, low IQ is charitable.

- Frank Krygowski

I really wonder. I've driven with all sorts of folks from the so
called "red necks" to some pretty sophisticated people, school
teachers et al, and I can't remember single example of someone
running on high beams just to be a Horse's Ass.

I have seen vehicles with the head lights out of adjustment, running
on high, but in that (those) cases it still isn't an effort to be
obnoxious, rather an effort to see where one is going.

But maybe I've lived a sheltered life and they are out there. After
more then half of the first 20 years of my working career was spent
outside the U.S. and all of the next 20 or so, so maybe there places
that are choc ka-block full with people that the average person would
pay good money to avoid.... and I just haven't been there yet.

.... but I keep watching the antics of your latest President ...



No one was talking about high beams. They were talking about the LED or
whatever headlights that give off a bright bluish tinted light. Bright
enough to seem like they’re high beams.



The so called "driving lights"? New car here have LED lights front and
rear but I think the idea is for the car to be seen as they aren't
particularly bright. Probably about the same a driving with the
parking lights on.

Y'all have something brighter then we do.



Maybe they aren't LED but these Zenon HID lights:
https://www.powerbulbs.com/ca/blog/2...car-headlights


I can't swear to this but I don't think that these light are installed
as original equipment here, or perhaps only in the last year or so as
I've certainly not seen anything like that on the rod here although I
have seen "Zenon" advertised as replacement bulbs in car shops.
  #348  
Old July 27th 18, 11:20 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 144
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On Fri, 27 Jul 2018 07:25:05 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-07-26 18:43, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 16:27:45 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-07-25 16:41, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Wed, 25 Jul 2018 13:38:57 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-07-24 19:53, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Tue, 24 Jul 2018 07:41:08 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-07-23 18:27, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Mon, 23 Jul 2018 15:13:21 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-07-22 21:44, John B. Slocomb wrote:


[...]


If the bicycles are for work, what are the cars for?


Have you ever tried to haul half a ton of wood pellets, firewood,
construction lumber and whatnot on a bicycle, uphill? With uphill I mean
some serious hills.

Why ever not? Small loads and many trips, just as you would if you
were walking. The argument, "OH! It is too big for my bike", is just
that an argument for using the car.


Obviously you have never hauled four cords of firewood from a location
that is 1400ft lower than where you live. That's eight tons.


Quite the opposite. I spent much of my second career transporting
stuff through jungles, up and down hills and through swamps. I'm quite
aware of the effort of moving tons of machinery and equipment up and
down hills.


On a bicycle. Through the jungle. Right.

Well, not on a bicycle but certainly through the jungle. I might add
that in some places, usually swamps, we carried the cargo on our
heads, arms, back, any way we could get it there.

The sysmic crews, who admitedly didn't work for me, were strictly
human powered. Every thing that they did was powered by hand. Cut a
path through the jungle - by hand. Drill the shot holes - by hand.
Carry everything through the jungle - by hand. Build a camp - by hand.


When cost is not an issue or the government pays the tab that's
feasible. When cost is an issue and its for a house it is an issue. It
doesn't work.


I might point out that my father built two houses (2 bedroom and 3
bedroom) while working as a postal clerk by doing all of the work
himself. Granted it does take a long time but it is both possible and
economically feasible.


And how did the lumber, cladding and all that get there? On a bicycle?
On foot?


've got to qualify that by adding "with the building codes of the
period" as modern building codes have, in my opinion, gone far past
the reasonable and appear to have become simply job protection for
those in the trade.


To some extent yes. Electrical code, no, that is mostly there to prevent
fires and electrocution.


Really? In New Hampshire "Metal Clad" electrical cable is approved for
use in wiring houses. In California it is not approved. Do you think
that electrical shorts are different in one state or the other.

California, at least when I was there, would not allow an electrician
to work unless he had a California license. No electricity in the
other states?




Yeah, some dreamers can go back to the no-car world. Then when little
Joey gets acute appendicitis he can't be transported fast enough and
dies from it. Like in the "good old" days.

[...]


If little Joey has adequate medical attention his appendicitis will
never become acute.


Nope. Appendicitis happens out of the blue and it can go fast. A
neighbor was transported to a hospital, fast, and the doc said after the
surgery that the appendix literally exploded in his hand when he
operated. Without a motor vehicle available he would have very likely
died from something that is rather simple to fix these days. Same for
many other illnesses, including non-preventable ones such as rattlesnake
bites.



I think that you watch too much TV. Given that my brother had an
impending "acute appendix" and was simply driven to the hospital where
they operated and another bloke after I was in the A.F. that we took
to the hospital with a swollen stomach and pains, that was labeled
"acute" I doubt very much that acute is necessarily "ready to
explode".
  #349  
Old July 27th 18, 11:28 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 144
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On Fri, 27 Jul 2018 13:31:04 -0500, AMuzi wrote:

On 7/27/2018 9:25 AM, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-26 18:43, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 16:27:45 -0700, Joerg
Joerg wrote
On 2018-07-25 16:41, John B. Slocomb wrote:
25 Jul Joerg wrote
On 2018-07-24 19:53, John B. Slocomb wrote:
Joerg wrote
On 2018-07-23 18:27, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Mon, 23 Jul 2018 15:13:21 -0700, Joerg
Joerg wrote:
On 2018-07-22 21:44, John B. Slocomb wrote:


If the bicycles are for work, what are the cars for?


snip snip
I might point out that my father built two houses (2
bedroom and 3
bedroom) while working as a postal clerk by doing all of
the work
himself. Granted it does take a long time but it is both
possible and
economically feasible.


And how did the lumber, cladding and all that get there? On
a bicycle? On foot?



When rebuilding my girlfriend's sun porch this spring, we
uncovered the the former exterior house wall which was rough
sawn 15~18" planks on rough sawn studs with squarecut nails,
circa 1920 when milled lumber was plentiful if one had cash
and a means to move it, which they apparently did not. What
they had were axes, 2-man saws and draft horses with chains
to get the logs down off the ridge in snow.


Depending on what sort of wood, I would think that 15 ` 18" planks
would be worth some money.

I was at an auction where they were selling off a whole household and
a guy bid on the stable building. Later I asked him what he wanted
"that shack" for and he told me that the interior was finished off
with 1 inch rough sawn oak and the interior wood was at least a 100%
profit over what he paid :-)

The best way to get any job done will vary a lot depending
on who you are and where (physically and philosophically)
you are. Sometimes that means a bicycle where other guys
might choose a truck or just not to do the job at all.

  #350  
Old July 27th 18, 11:51 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,261
Default Making America into Amsterdam

On Friday, July 27, 2018 at 3:20:48 PM UTC-7, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Fri, 27 Jul 2018 07:25:05 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-07-26 18:43, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 16:27:45 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-07-25 16:41, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Wed, 25 Jul 2018 13:38:57 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-07-24 19:53, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Tue, 24 Jul 2018 07:41:08 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-07-23 18:27, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Mon, 23 Jul 2018 15:13:21 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2018-07-22 21:44, John B. Slocomb wrote:


[...]


If the bicycles are for work, what are the cars for?


Have you ever tried to haul half a ton of wood pellets, firewood,
construction lumber and whatnot on a bicycle, uphill? With uphill I mean
some serious hills.

Why ever not? Small loads and many trips, just as you would if you
were walking. The argument, "OH! It is too big for my bike", is just
that an argument for using the car.


Obviously you have never hauled four cords of firewood from a location
that is 1400ft lower than where you live. That's eight tons.


Quite the opposite. I spent much of my second career transporting
stuff through jungles, up and down hills and through swamps. I'm quite
aware of the effort of moving tons of machinery and equipment up and
down hills.


On a bicycle. Through the jungle. Right.

Well, not on a bicycle but certainly through the jungle. I might add
that in some places, usually swamps, we carried the cargo on our
heads, arms, back, any way we could get it there.

The sysmic crews, who admitedly didn't work for me, were strictly
human powered. Every thing that they did was powered by hand. Cut a
path through the jungle - by hand. Drill the shot holes - by hand.
Carry everything through the jungle - by hand. Build a camp - by hand.


When cost is not an issue or the government pays the tab that's
feasible. When cost is an issue and its for a house it is an issue. It
doesn't work.


I might point out that my father built two houses (2 bedroom and 3
bedroom) while working as a postal clerk by doing all of the work
himself. Granted it does take a long time but it is both possible and
economically feasible.


And how did the lumber, cladding and all that get there? On a bicycle?
On foot?


've got to qualify that by adding "with the building codes of the
period" as modern building codes have, in my opinion, gone far past
the reasonable and appear to have become simply job protection for
those in the trade.


To some extent yes. Electrical code, no, that is mostly there to prevent
fires and electrocution.


Really? In New Hampshire "Metal Clad" electrical cable is approved for
use in wiring houses. In California it is not approved. Do you think
that electrical shorts are different in one state or the other.

California, at least when I was there, would not allow an electrician
to work unless he had a California license. No electricity in the
other states?




Yeah, some dreamers can go back to the no-car world. Then when little
Joey gets acute appendicitis he can't be transported fast enough and
dies from it. Like in the "good old" days.

[...]

If little Joey has adequate medical attention his appendicitis will
never become acute.


Nope. Appendicitis happens out of the blue and it can go fast. A
neighbor was transported to a hospital, fast, and the doc said after the
surgery that the appendix literally exploded in his hand when he
operated. Without a motor vehicle available he would have very likely
died from something that is rather simple to fix these days. Same for
many other illnesses, including non-preventable ones such as rattlesnake
bites.



I think that you watch too much TV. Given that my brother had an
impending "acute appendix" and was simply driven to the hospital where
they operated and another bloke after I was in the A.F. that we took
to the hospital with a swollen stomach and pains, that was labeled
"acute" I doubt very much that acute is necessarily "ready to
explode".


California electrical codes are supposedly much different than other states inasmuch as what other states codes that are used for commercial buildings are to be now used in all new residential buildings here. So you have two wire plus ground plugs, wires run through conduit etc. You need shielded wire despite running it though conduit in commercial buildings now I think.

No buildings may use fuses but only circuit breakers but what difference that makes seems sort of fuzzy to me. Probably because people will put a penny behind a fuse if they don't have a replacement handy.

You can't get home insurance in California if you have so much as one fuse unless it's been under continuous coverage.

And yet they are careless with sewer runs and gas piping. If you avoid turns in sewer piping you usually can't get stoppages. And you should avoid turns in gas pipes because it causes reduced pressure and flow. but it is unusual for gas pipes not to have 360 degree or more of turns.

You have to see the mess much of the phone systems are though AT&T is changing over to video cables which takes the power off of the phone lines and you can tear them out and toss them.

I just put video Internet into my home and it cost a couple of bucks less for 10 times the speed.
 




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