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#41
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Sunscreen for bicycling
On 2018-08-21 01:31, Sepp Ruf wrote:
John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 13:53:02 -0700 (PDT), Frank Krygowski wrote: On Monday, August 20, 2018 at 3:00:57 PM UTC-4, Joerg wrote: Since moving to California in the 90's I also don't seem to get sun burns anymore. That's odd about your location. Joerg might be eating more wholesome ketchup than sauerkraut now ... No, pretzels, _with_ Obatzda. During my last ride here, along with a Kloster Andechs Hefeweizen Dunkel: http://beergardensacramento.com/ ... or he had previously paled during each of those UV-less Dutch winters. Maybe more odd was my experience touring Ireland by bike in the early 1990s. It was three weeks of the wettest experience in my life. But the tops of my ears were burned and peeling. And that's back when I wore a helmet, which I'd think would have shaded my ears. I still get paid millions by the Irish Tourism Board to casually mention that I had under 1/3rd of rainy days, less than 1/6th soakingly wet ones. Admittedly, that was during a statistically "arid" month. Before emigrating to the US we rented a house in Killaloe (Shannon River) for a couple of weeks, to see if this would be a country to retire to. It rained exactly one day out of 14. Now the Irish Tourism Board will pay me instead :-) It is called "windburn" see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windburn If the rain tastes metallic though, it's properly called "windscale." In the not so good old days in Germany the rain burned when some got into the eyes. Acid rain. The difference was felt most profoundly when one lived in Scotland for a while where this never happened. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
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#42
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Sunscreen for bicycling
On Tue, 21 Aug 2018 07:23:43 -0700, Joerg
wrote: On 2018-08-20 18:45, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 14:50:44 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 14:43, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 13:55:46 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 13:36, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 12:23:34 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 12:13, wrote: On Monday, August 20, 2018 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 11:26, wrote: On Saturday, August 11, 2018 at 7:29:00 PM UTC-7, Joy Beeson wrote: On Thu, 9 Aug 2018 00:05:16 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska wrote: Does anybody have suggestions for sunscreen to wear while bicycling? My cancer doctor said to use zinc sunblock on fresh scars. (My current scar is under my hatband, so all I use is E-oil and a white linen do-rag.) I'm currently using Kroger's knock-off of Neutrogena 70; when it runs out, I plan to start snitching my spouse's Neutrogena 100, so as to use it up faster. I used to use a cheaper sunblock on my arms and legs, but when it ran out, I began to put the same stuff everywhere. I usually coat only the outside of the calf muscle on my legs, because that is where I got a brown streak when I could ride that long. I rub my arms together like a cricket, and put an extra layer on what sticks out of my sleeves. (In hot weather, I wear long linen sleeves -- and on my last few rides they got soaking wet without spitting water on them.) I still have brown, speckled arms. And there's a patch on the back of my hand even though I put on another layer of 50-SPF sunscreen every time I take off my gloves. The stick sunscreen is running out and I haven't yet found another that fits into my pocket. I recently realized that I can put lotion into a lip-salve box -- if I can find one that isn't identical in every way to the box I carry A&D in. I used to carry hand cleaner in my tool kit. A&D cleans hands just fine, and has a lot of other uses. Also, nowadays, I fix flats with my cell phone, so I don't need a grease remover. -- Joy Beeson joy beeson at comcast dot net http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/ Well, I can recommend the Neutrogena 100+. Did a long hard ride mostly in direct sunlight yesterday and my tan didn't change at all. Once you have developed a good tan it won't change much any more. Sometimes when working in the yard for a few minutes I get carried away and cut bushes for a couple hours. No sun screen at that time but the tan doesn't change anymore. Since moving to California in the 90's I also don't seem to get sun burns anymore. My ride was out towards the Altemont Pass. If there is enough sun my arms will turn red as if I got a sunburn but they will be brown again the next day. But with that 100+ there was absolutely NO reaction. Turning red is critical even if it "heals" in a day. I had that as well years ago but somehow not anymore. It all just tans a bit more over the weeks. On of my riding buddies has very white skin, Irish/Scandinavian type. So he uses SPF100 like you do and no tan or burn ever develops. One thing to remember is that a tan does not prevent UV damage to the skin. Yeah, that's a problem. However, people in countries where the majority has naturally darker skin fare much better in terms of skin cancer rates despite a much higher UV exposu That is certainly true but on the other hand all of the Caucasians I know who have developed skin cancer in their later years were outdoors people that had a good tan for much of their life. The ones I know or knew :-( ... were mostly light-skinned Caucasians with a more Nordic ethnic background. They didn't easily develop a tan but red skin and then blisters. Some of them essentially remained red all summer. AFAIK that is how the term redneck developed. Nope :-) A Redneck was originally a term used for a farmer. He followed a mule around the field all day and the back of his neck got sunburned. Sunburned. That's exactly what I said. It got red because the farmer was of Northern European ancestry and, therefore, his skin burned easily. A farmer of Southern European, South Asian or African ethnicity could plow the field all day and not get sunburned. Not necessarily only Northern European ancestry. Nearly all races will react to hot sun. When I was at Eniwetok the guy in the next cot, in the tent we lived in, was a Negro and he got got suprisingly darker after a time on the island. Japanese, particularly women, will sunburn and Chinese, and, and, and. |
#43
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Sunscreen for bicycling
On 2018-08-21 11:22, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Tue, 21 Aug 2018 07:23:43 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 18:45, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 14:50:44 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 14:43, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 13:55:46 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 13:36, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 12:23:34 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 12:13, wrote: On Monday, August 20, 2018 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 11:26, wrote: On Saturday, August 11, 2018 at 7:29:00 PM UTC-7, Joy Beeson wrote: On Thu, 9 Aug 2018 00:05:16 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska wrote: Does anybody have suggestions for sunscreen to wear while bicycling? My cancer doctor said to use zinc sunblock on fresh scars. (My current scar is under my hatband, so all I use is E-oil and a white linen do-rag.) I'm currently using Kroger's knock-off of Neutrogena 70; when it runs out, I plan to start snitching my spouse's Neutrogena 100, so as to use it up faster. I used to use a cheaper sunblock on my arms and legs, but when it ran out, I began to put the same stuff everywhere. I usually coat only the outside of the calf muscle on my legs, because that is where I got a brown streak when I could ride that long. I rub my arms together like a cricket, and put an extra layer on what sticks out of my sleeves. (In hot weather, I wear long linen sleeves -- and on my last few rides they got soaking wet without spitting water on them.) I still have brown, speckled arms. And there's a patch on the back of my hand even though I put on another layer of 50-SPF sunscreen every time I take off my gloves. The stick sunscreen is running out and I haven't yet found another that fits into my pocket. I recently realized that I can put lotion into a lip-salve box -- if I can find one that isn't identical in every way to the box I carry A&D in. I used to carry hand cleaner in my tool kit. A&D cleans hands just fine, and has a lot of other uses. Also, nowadays, I fix flats with my cell phone, so I don't need a grease remover. -- Joy Beeson joy beeson at comcast dot net http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/ Well, I can recommend the Neutrogena 100+. Did a long hard ride mostly in direct sunlight yesterday and my tan didn't change at all. Once you have developed a good tan it won't change much any more. Sometimes when working in the yard for a few minutes I get carried away and cut bushes for a couple hours. No sun screen at that time but the tan doesn't change anymore. Since moving to California in the 90's I also don't seem to get sun burns anymore. My ride was out towards the Altemont Pass. If there is enough sun my arms will turn red as if I got a sunburn but they will be brown again the next day. But with that 100+ there was absolutely NO reaction. Turning red is critical even if it "heals" in a day. I had that as well years ago but somehow not anymore. It all just tans a bit more over the weeks. On of my riding buddies has very white skin, Irish/Scandinavian type. So he uses SPF100 like you do and no tan or burn ever develops. One thing to remember is that a tan does not prevent UV damage to the skin. Yeah, that's a problem. However, people in countries where the majority has naturally darker skin fare much better in terms of skin cancer rates despite a much higher UV exposu That is certainly true but on the other hand all of the Caucasians I know who have developed skin cancer in their later years were outdoors people that had a good tan for much of their life. The ones I know or knew :-( ... were mostly light-skinned Caucasians with a more Nordic ethnic background. They didn't easily develop a tan but red skin and then blisters. Some of them essentially remained red all summer. AFAIK that is how the term redneck developed. Nope :-) A Redneck was originally a term used for a farmer. He followed a mule around the field all day and the back of his neck got sunburned. Sunburned. That's exactly what I said. It got red because the farmer was of Northern European ancestry and, therefore, his skin burned easily. A farmer of Southern European, South Asian or African ethnicity could plow the field all day and not get sunburned. Not necessarily only Northern European ancestry. Nearly all races will react to hot sun. When I was at Eniwetok the guy in the next cot, in the tent we lived in, was a Negro and he got got suprisingly darker after a time on the island. Japanese, particularly women, will sunburn and Chinese, and, and, and. Sure, the tanning mechanism is the same. However, since they have an intense natural tan the prevalence of skin cancer in, for example, African Americans is hugely lower: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2757062/ -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#44
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Sunscreen for bicycling
On Wed, 22 Aug 2018 12:44:08 -0700, Joerg
wrote: On 2018-08-21 11:22, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Tue, 21 Aug 2018 07:23:43 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 18:45, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 14:50:44 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 14:43, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 13:55:46 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 13:36, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 12:23:34 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 12:13, wrote: On Monday, August 20, 2018 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 11:26, wrote: On Saturday, August 11, 2018 at 7:29:00 PM UTC-7, Joy Beeson wrote: On Thu, 9 Aug 2018 00:05:16 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska wrote: Does anybody have suggestions for sunscreen to wear while bicycling? My cancer doctor said to use zinc sunblock on fresh scars. (My current scar is under my hatband, so all I use is E-oil and a white linen do-rag.) I'm currently using Kroger's knock-off of Neutrogena 70; when it runs out, I plan to start snitching my spouse's Neutrogena 100, so as to use it up faster. I used to use a cheaper sunblock on my arms and legs, but when it ran out, I began to put the same stuff everywhere. I usually coat only the outside of the calf muscle on my legs, because that is where I got a brown streak when I could ride that long. I rub my arms together like a cricket, and put an extra layer on what sticks out of my sleeves. (In hot weather, I wear long linen sleeves -- and on my last few rides they got soaking wet without spitting water on them.) I still have brown, speckled arms. And there's a patch on the back of my hand even though I put on another layer of 50-SPF sunscreen every time I take off my gloves. The stick sunscreen is running out and I haven't yet found another that fits into my pocket. I recently realized that I can put lotion into a lip-salve box -- if I can find one that isn't identical in every way to the box I carry A&D in. I used to carry hand cleaner in my tool kit. A&D cleans hands just fine, and has a lot of other uses. Also, nowadays, I fix flats with my cell phone, so I don't need a grease remover. -- Joy Beeson joy beeson at comcast dot net http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/ Well, I can recommend the Neutrogena 100+. Did a long hard ride mostly in direct sunlight yesterday and my tan didn't change at all. Once you have developed a good tan it won't change much any more. Sometimes when working in the yard for a few minutes I get carried away and cut bushes for a couple hours. No sun screen at that time but the tan doesn't change anymore. Since moving to California in the 90's I also don't seem to get sun burns anymore. My ride was out towards the Altemont Pass. If there is enough sun my arms will turn red as if I got a sunburn but they will be brown again the next day. But with that 100+ there was absolutely NO reaction. Turning red is critical even if it "heals" in a day. I had that as well years ago but somehow not anymore. It all just tans a bit more over the weeks. On of my riding buddies has very white skin, Irish/Scandinavian type. So he uses SPF100 like you do and no tan or burn ever develops. One thing to remember is that a tan does not prevent UV damage to the skin. Yeah, that's a problem. However, people in countries where the majority has naturally darker skin fare much better in terms of skin cancer rates despite a much higher UV exposu That is certainly true but on the other hand all of the Caucasians I know who have developed skin cancer in their later years were outdoors people that had a good tan for much of their life. The ones I know or knew :-( ... were mostly light-skinned Caucasians with a more Nordic ethnic background. They didn't easily develop a tan but red skin and then blisters. Some of them essentially remained red all summer. AFAIK that is how the term redneck developed. Nope :-) A Redneck was originally a term used for a farmer. He followed a mule around the field all day and the back of his neck got sunburned. Sunburned. That's exactly what I said. It got red because the farmer was of Northern European ancestry and, therefore, his skin burned easily. A farmer of Southern European, South Asian or African ethnicity could plow the field all day and not get sunburned. Not necessarily only Northern European ancestry. Nearly all races will react to hot sun. When I was at Eniwetok the guy in the next cot, in the tent we lived in, was a Negro and he got got suprisingly darker after a time on the island. Japanese, particularly women, will sunburn and Chinese, and, and, and. Sure, the tanning mechanism is the same. However, since they have an intense natural tan the prevalence of skin cancer in, for example, African Americans is hugely lower: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2757062/ True, "but as I said, not necessarily only Northern European ancestry. Nearly all races will react to hot sun." You are correct that Negroes get less UV caused cancer, but they do get it. Just as do other "dusky" races. |
#45
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Sunscreen for bicycling
On Wednesday, August 22, 2018 at 12:44:06 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-08-21 11:22, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Tue, 21 Aug 2018 07:23:43 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 18:45, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 14:50:44 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 14:43, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 13:55:46 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 13:36, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 12:23:34 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 12:13, wrote: On Monday, August 20, 2018 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 11:26, wrote: On Saturday, August 11, 2018 at 7:29:00 PM UTC-7, Joy Beeson wrote: On Thu, 9 Aug 2018 00:05:16 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska wrote: Does anybody have suggestions for sunscreen to wear while bicycling? My cancer doctor said to use zinc sunblock on fresh scars. (My current scar is under my hatband, so all I use is E-oil and a white linen do-rag.) I'm currently using Kroger's knock-off of Neutrogena 70; when it runs out, I plan to start snitching my spouse's Neutrogena 100, so as to use it up faster. I used to use a cheaper sunblock on my arms and legs, but when it ran out, I began to put the same stuff everywhere. I usually coat only the outside of the calf muscle on my legs, because that is where I got a brown streak when I could ride that long. I rub my arms together like a cricket, and put an extra layer on what sticks out of my sleeves. (In hot weather, I wear long linen sleeves -- and on my last few rides they got soaking wet without spitting water on them.) I still have brown, speckled arms. And there's a patch on the back of my hand even though I put on another layer of 50-SPF sunscreen every time I take off my gloves. The stick sunscreen is running out and I haven't yet found another that fits into my pocket. I recently realized that I can put lotion into a lip-salve box -- if I can find one that isn't identical in every way to the box I carry A&D in. I used to carry hand cleaner in my tool kit. A&D cleans hands just fine, and has a lot of other uses. Also, nowadays, I fix flats with my cell phone, so I don't need a grease remover. -- Joy Beeson joy beeson at comcast dot net http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/ Well, I can recommend the Neutrogena 100+. Did a long hard ride mostly in direct sunlight yesterday and my tan didn't change at all. Once you have developed a good tan it won't change much any more. Sometimes when working in the yard for a few minutes I get carried away and cut bushes for a couple hours. No sun screen at that time but the tan doesn't change anymore. Since moving to California in the 90's I also don't seem to get sun burns anymore. My ride was out towards the Altemont Pass. If there is enough sun my arms will turn red as if I got a sunburn but they will be brown again the next day. But with that 100+ there was absolutely NO reaction. Turning red is critical even if it "heals" in a day. I had that as well years ago but somehow not anymore. It all just tans a bit more over the weeks. On of my riding buddies has very white skin, Irish/Scandinavian type. So he uses SPF100 like you do and no tan or burn ever develops. One thing to remember is that a tan does not prevent UV damage to the skin. Yeah, that's a problem. However, people in countries where the majority has naturally darker skin fare much better in terms of skin cancer rates despite a much higher UV exposu That is certainly true but on the other hand all of the Caucasians I know who have developed skin cancer in their later years were outdoors people that had a good tan for much of their life. The ones I know or knew :-( ... were mostly light-skinned Caucasians with a more Nordic ethnic background. They didn't easily develop a tan but red skin and then blisters. Some of them essentially remained red all summer. AFAIK that is how the term redneck developed. Nope :-) A Redneck was originally a term used for a farmer. He followed a mule around the field all day and the back of his neck got sunburned. Sunburned. That's exactly what I said. It got red because the farmer was of Northern European ancestry and, therefore, his skin burned easily. A farmer of Southern European, South Asian or African ethnicity could plow the field all day and not get sunburned. Not necessarily only Northern European ancestry. Nearly all races will react to hot sun. When I was at Eniwetok the guy in the next cot, in the tent we lived in, was a Negro and he got got suprisingly darker after a time on the island. Japanese, particularly women, will sunburn and Chinese, and, and, and. Sure, the tanning mechanism is the same. However, since they have an intense natural tan the prevalence of skin cancer in, for example, African Americans is hugely lower: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2757062/ -- Regards, Joerg Not so Joerg, EVERYONE gets sunburned. Just because a black man's skin doesn't show red doesn't mean that he doesn't sunburn. Remember that Homosapiens came from Northern Africa so precisely the same mechanism is at work on everyone. Just because a Chinese farmer is out in the sun all the time to the extent that he has enough melanin to block most of the UVA that he is exposed to in his area doesn't mean that he wouldn't burn to a crisp elsewhere.. This is why Arabs are always totally covered. |
#47
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Sunscreen for bicycling
On Friday, August 24, 2018 at 11:44:57 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-08-24 11:04, wrote: On Wednesday, August 22, 2018 at 12:44:06 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-21 11:22, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Tue, 21 Aug 2018 07:23:43 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 18:45, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 14:50:44 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 14:43, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 13:55:46 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 13:36, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 12:23:34 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 12:13, wrote: On Monday, August 20, 2018 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 11:26, wrote: On Saturday, August 11, 2018 at 7:29:00 PM UTC-7, Joy Beeson wrote: On Thu, 9 Aug 2018 00:05:16 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska wrote: Does anybody have suggestions for sunscreen to wear while bicycling? My cancer doctor said to use zinc sunblock on fresh scars. (My current scar is under my hatband, so all I use is E-oil and a white linen do-rag.) I'm currently using Kroger's knock-off of Neutrogena 70; when it runs out, I plan to start snitching my spouse's Neutrogena 100, so as to use it up faster. I used to use a cheaper sunblock on my arms and legs, but when it ran out, I began to put the same stuff everywhere. I usually coat only the outside of the calf muscle on my legs, because that is where I got a brown streak when I could ride that long. I rub my arms together like a cricket, and put an extra layer on what sticks out of my sleeves. (In hot weather, I wear long linen sleeves -- and on my last few rides they got soaking wet without spitting water on them.) I still have brown, speckled arms. And there's a patch on the back of my hand even though I put on another layer of 50-SPF sunscreen every time I take off my gloves. The stick sunscreen is running out and I haven't yet found another that fits into my pocket. I recently realized that I can put lotion into a lip-salve box -- if I can find one that isn't identical in every way to the box I carry A&D in. I used to carry hand cleaner in my tool kit. A&D cleans hands just fine, and has a lot of other uses. Also, nowadays, I fix flats with my cell phone, so I don't need a grease remover. -- Joy Beeson joy beeson at comcast dot net http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/ Well, I can recommend the Neutrogena 100+. Did a long hard ride mostly in direct sunlight yesterday and my tan didn't change at all. Once you have developed a good tan it won't change much any more. Sometimes when working in the yard for a few minutes I get carried away and cut bushes for a couple hours. No sun screen at that time but the tan doesn't change anymore. Since moving to California in the 90's I also don't seem to get sun burns anymore. My ride was out towards the Altemont Pass. If there is enough sun my arms will turn red as if I got a sunburn but they will be brown again the next day. But with that 100+ there was absolutely NO reaction. Turning red is critical even if it "heals" in a day. I had that as well years ago but somehow not anymore. It all just tans a bit more over the weeks. On of my riding buddies has very white skin, Irish/Scandinavian type. So he uses SPF100 like you do and no tan or burn ever develops. One thing to remember is that a tan does not prevent UV damage to the skin. Yeah, that's a problem. However, people in countries where the majority has naturally darker skin fare much better in terms of skin cancer rates despite a much higher UV exposu That is certainly true but on the other hand all of the Caucasians I know who have developed skin cancer in their later years were outdoors people that had a good tan for much of their life. The ones I know or knew :-( ... were mostly light-skinned Caucasians with a more Nordic ethnic background. They didn't easily develop a tan but red skin and then blisters. Some of them essentially remained red all summer. AFAIK that is how the term redneck developed. Nope :-) A Redneck was originally a term used for a farmer. He followed a mule around the field all day and the back of his neck got sunburned. Sunburned. That's exactly what I said. It got red because the farmer was of Northern European ancestry and, therefore, his skin burned easily. A farmer of Southern European, South Asian or African ethnicity could plow the field all day and not get sunburned. Not necessarily only Northern European ancestry. Nearly all races will react to hot sun. When I was at Eniwetok the guy in the next cot, in the tent we lived in, was a Negro and he got got suprisingly darker after a time on the island. Japanese, particularly women, will sunburn and Chinese, and, and, and. Sure, the tanning mechanism is the same. However, since they have an intense natural tan the prevalence of skin cancer in, for example, African Americans is hugely lower: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2757062/ -- Regards, Joerg Not so Joerg, EVERYONE gets sunburned. Just because a black man's skin doesn't show red doesn't mean that he doesn't sunburn. Remember that Homosapiens came from Northern Africa so precisely the same mechanism is at work on everyone. Just because a Chinese farmer is out in the sun all the time to the extent that he has enough melanin to block most of the UVA that he is exposed to in his area doesn't mean that he wouldn't burn to a crisp elsewhere. This is why Arabs are always totally covered. Then why is the propensity to develop skin cancer about an order of magnitude higher in Caucasians versus African-Americans? -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ I don't follow you. We were talking about sunburn and skin cancer has to do with UVA rays effect on the skin and not particularly sunburn. I suppose someone that gets sunburn all the time may be more likely to get skin cancer but that doesn't mean that blacks and Morros don't get sunburned. It isn't sunburn in and of itself that causes cancer. |
#48
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Sunscreen for bicycling
On 2018-08-27 08:23, wrote:
On Friday, August 24, 2018 at 11:44:57 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-24 11:04, wrote: On Wednesday, August 22, 2018 at 12:44:06 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-21 11:22, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Tue, 21 Aug 2018 07:23:43 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 18:45, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 14:50:44 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 14:43, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 13:55:46 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 13:36, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 12:23:34 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 12:13, wrote: On Monday, August 20, 2018 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 11:26, wrote: On Saturday, August 11, 2018 at 7:29:00 PM UTC-7, Joy Beeson wrote: On Thu, 9 Aug 2018 00:05:16 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska wrote: Does anybody have suggestions for sunscreen to wear while bicycling? My cancer doctor said to use zinc sunblock on fresh scars. (My current scar is under my hatband, so all I use is E-oil and a white linen do-rag.) I'm currently using Kroger's knock-off of Neutrogena 70; when it runs out, I plan to start snitching my spouse's Neutrogena 100, so as to use it up faster. I used to use a cheaper sunblock on my arms and legs, but when it ran out, I began to put the same stuff everywhere. I usually coat only the outside of the calf muscle on my legs, because that is where I got a brown streak when I could ride that long. I rub my arms together like a cricket, and put an extra layer on what sticks out of my sleeves. (In hot weather, I wear long linen sleeves -- and on my last few rides they got soaking wet without spitting water on them.) I still have brown, speckled arms. And there's a patch on the back of my hand even though I put on another layer of 50-SPF sunscreen every time I take off my gloves. The stick sunscreen is running out and I haven't yet found another that fits into my pocket. I recently realized that I can put lotion into a lip-salve box -- if I can find one that isn't identical in every way to the box I carry A&D in. I used to carry hand cleaner in my tool kit. A&D cleans hands just fine, and has a lot of other uses. Also, nowadays, I fix flats with my cell phone, so I don't need a grease remover. -- Joy Beeson joy beeson at comcast dot net http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/ Well, I can recommend the Neutrogena 100+. Did a long hard ride mostly in direct sunlight yesterday and my tan didn't change at all. Once you have developed a good tan it won't change much any more. Sometimes when working in the yard for a few minutes I get carried away and cut bushes for a couple hours. No sun screen at that time but the tan doesn't change anymore. Since moving to California in the 90's I also don't seem to get sun burns anymore. My ride was out towards the Altemont Pass. If there is enough sun my arms will turn red as if I got a sunburn but they will be brown again the next day. But with that 100+ there was absolutely NO reaction. Turning red is critical even if it "heals" in a day. I had that as well years ago but somehow not anymore. It all just tans a bit more over the weeks. On of my riding buddies has very white skin, Irish/Scandinavian type. So he uses SPF100 like you do and no tan or burn ever develops. One thing to remember is that a tan does not prevent UV damage to the skin. Yeah, that's a problem. However, people in countries where the majority has naturally darker skin fare much better in terms of skin cancer rates despite a much higher UV exposu That is certainly true but on the other hand all of the Caucasians I know who have developed skin cancer in their later years were outdoors people that had a good tan for much of their life. The ones I know or knew :-( ... were mostly light-skinned Caucasians with a more Nordic ethnic background. They didn't easily develop a tan but red skin and then blisters. Some of them essentially remained red all summer. AFAIK that is how the term redneck developed. Nope :-) A Redneck was originally a term used for a farmer. He followed a mule around the field all day and the back of his neck got sunburned. Sunburned. That's exactly what I said. It got red because the farmer was of Northern European ancestry and, therefore, his skin burned easily. A farmer of Southern European, South Asian or African ethnicity could plow the field all day and not get sunburned. Not necessarily only Northern European ancestry. Nearly all races will react to hot sun. When I was at Eniwetok the guy in the next cot, in the tent we lived in, was a Negro and he got got suprisingly darker after a time on the island. Japanese, particularly women, will sunburn and Chinese, and, and, and. Sure, the tanning mechanism is the same. However, since they have an intense natural tan the prevalence of skin cancer in, for example, African Americans is hugely lower: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2757062/ -- Regards, Joerg Not so Joerg, EVERYONE gets sunburned. Just because a black man's skin doesn't show red doesn't mean that he doesn't sunburn. Remember that Homosapiens came from Northern Africa so precisely the same mechanism is at work on everyone. Just because a Chinese farmer is out in the sun all the time to the extent that he has enough melanin to block most of the UVA that he is exposed to in his area doesn't mean that he wouldn't burn to a crisp elsewhere. This is why Arabs are always totally covered. Then why is the propensity to develop skin cancer about an order of magnitude higher in Caucasians versus African-Americans? -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ I don't follow you. We were talking about sunburn and skin cancer has to do with UVA rays effect on the skin and not particularly sunburn. I suppose someone that gets sunburn all the time may be more likely to get skin cancer but that doesn't mean that blacks and Morros don't get sunburned. It isn't sunburn in and of itself that causes cancer. Dark-skinned people get sunburned much less than people with very pale skin. I met many people from South America who work outdoors all day long and never use sun screen yet don't get sunburns. Because as you said this doesn't mean they won't run a risk of skin cancer, medical people still recommend they use sun screen. Despite all this their prevalence of skin cancer is way lower than that of white folks. So it seems the darker skin is a good protection against both skin cancer and sunburns. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#49
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Sunscreen for bicycling
On Monday, August 27, 2018 at 10:27:03 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-08-27 08:23, wrote: On Friday, August 24, 2018 at 11:44:57 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-24 11:04, wrote: On Wednesday, August 22, 2018 at 12:44:06 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-21 11:22, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Tue, 21 Aug 2018 07:23:43 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 18:45, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 14:50:44 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 14:43, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 13:55:46 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 13:36, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 12:23:34 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 12:13, wrote: On Monday, August 20, 2018 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 11:26, wrote: On Saturday, August 11, 2018 at 7:29:00 PM UTC-7, Joy Beeson wrote: On Thu, 9 Aug 2018 00:05:16 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska wrote: Does anybody have suggestions for sunscreen to wear while bicycling? My cancer doctor said to use zinc sunblock on fresh scars. (My current scar is under my hatband, so all I use is E-oil and a white linen do-rag.) I'm currently using Kroger's knock-off of Neutrogena 70; when it runs out, I plan to start snitching my spouse's Neutrogena 100, so as to use it up faster. I used to use a cheaper sunblock on my arms and legs, but when it ran out, I began to put the same stuff everywhere. I usually coat only the outside of the calf muscle on my legs, because that is where I got a brown streak when I could ride that long. I rub my arms together like a cricket, and put an extra layer on what sticks out of my sleeves. (In hot weather, I wear long linen sleeves -- and on my last few rides they got soaking wet without spitting water on them.) I still have brown, speckled arms. And there's a patch on the back of my hand even though I put on another layer of 50-SPF sunscreen every time I take off my gloves. The stick sunscreen is running out and I haven't yet found another that fits into my pocket. I recently realized that I can put lotion into a lip-salve box -- if I can find one that isn't identical in every way to the box I carry A&D in. I used to carry hand cleaner in my tool kit. A&D cleans hands just fine, and has a lot of other uses. Also, nowadays, I fix flats with my cell phone, so I don't need a grease remover. -- Joy Beeson joy beeson at comcast dot net http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/ Well, I can recommend the Neutrogena 100+. Did a long hard ride mostly in direct sunlight yesterday and my tan didn't change at all. Once you have developed a good tan it won't change much any more. Sometimes when working in the yard for a few minutes I get carried away and cut bushes for a couple hours. No sun screen at that time but the tan doesn't change anymore. Since moving to California in the 90's I also don't seem to get sun burns anymore. My ride was out towards the Altemont Pass. If there is enough sun my arms will turn red as if I got a sunburn but they will be brown again the next day. But with that 100+ there was absolutely NO reaction. Turning red is critical even if it "heals" in a day. I had that as well years ago but somehow not anymore. It all just tans a bit more over the weeks. On of my riding buddies has very white skin, Irish/Scandinavian type. So he uses SPF100 like you do and no tan or burn ever develops. One thing to remember is that a tan does not prevent UV damage to the skin. Yeah, that's a problem. However, people in countries where the majority has naturally darker skin fare much better in terms of skin cancer rates despite a much higher UV exposu That is certainly true but on the other hand all of the Caucasians I know who have developed skin cancer in their later years were outdoors people that had a good tan for much of their life. The ones I know or knew :-( ... were mostly light-skinned Caucasians with a more Nordic ethnic background. They didn't easily develop a tan but red skin and then blisters. Some of them essentially remained red all summer. AFAIK that is how the term redneck developed. Nope :-) A Redneck was originally a term used for a farmer. He followed a mule around the field all day and the back of his neck got sunburned. Sunburned. That's exactly what I said. It got red because the farmer was of Northern European ancestry and, therefore, his skin burned easily. A farmer of Southern European, South Asian or African ethnicity could plow the field all day and not get sunburned. Not necessarily only Northern European ancestry. Nearly all races will react to hot sun. When I was at Eniwetok the guy in the next cot, in the tent we lived in, was a Negro and he got got suprisingly darker after a time on the island. Japanese, particularly women, will sunburn and Chinese, and, and, and. Sure, the tanning mechanism is the same. However, since they have an intense natural tan the prevalence of skin cancer in, for example, African Americans is hugely lower: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2757062/ -- Regards, Joerg Not so Joerg, EVERYONE gets sunburned. Just because a black man's skin doesn't show red doesn't mean that he doesn't sunburn. Remember that Homosapiens came from Northern Africa so precisely the same mechanism is at work on everyone. Just because a Chinese farmer is out in the sun all the time to the extent that he has enough melanin to block most of the UVA that he is exposed to in his area doesn't mean that he wouldn't burn to a crisp elsewhere. This is why Arabs are always totally covered. Then why is the propensity to develop skin cancer about an order of magnitude higher in Caucasians versus African-Americans? -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ I don't follow you. We were talking about sunburn and skin cancer has to do with UVA rays effect on the skin and not particularly sunburn. I suppose someone that gets sunburn all the time may be more likely to get skin cancer but that doesn't mean that blacks and Morros don't get sunburned. It isn't sunburn in and of itself that causes cancer. Dark-skinned people get sunburned much less than people with very pale skin. I met many people from South America who work outdoors all day long and never use sun screen yet don't get sunburns. Because as you said this doesn't mean they won't run a risk of skin cancer, medical people still recommend they use sun screen. Despite all this their prevalence of skin cancer is way lower than that of white folks. So it seems the darker skin is a good protection against both skin cancer and sunburns. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Ahh, now we are in total agreement. I was just pointing out that black and other dark skinned people can get sunburned. Here at 37 degrees north latitude we have a very large number of black people. In the cold winters and little sunshine under the marine layer, in the spring just like the rest of us they get sunburned if they are careless. |
#50
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Sunscreen for bicycling
On 2018-08-27 12:52, wrote:
On Monday, August 27, 2018 at 10:27:03 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-27 08:23, wrote: On Friday, August 24, 2018 at 11:44:57 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-24 11:04, wrote: On Wednesday, August 22, 2018 at 12:44:06 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-21 11:22, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Tue, 21 Aug 2018 07:23:43 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 18:45, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 14:50:44 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 14:43, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 13:55:46 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 13:36, John B. Slocomb wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 12:23:34 -0700, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 12:13, wrote: On Monday, August 20, 2018 at 12:00:57 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote: On 2018-08-20 11:26, wrote: On Saturday, August 11, 2018 at 7:29:00 PM UTC-7, Joy Beeson wrote: On Thu, 9 Aug 2018 00:05:16 -0000 (UTC), bob prohaska wrote: Does anybody have suggestions for sunscreen to wear while bicycling? My cancer doctor said to use zinc sunblock on fresh scars. (My current scar is under my hatband, so all I use is E-oil and a white linen do-rag.) I'm currently using Kroger's knock-off of Neutrogena 70; when it runs out, I plan to start snitching my spouse's Neutrogena 100, so as to use it up faster. I used to use a cheaper sunblock on my arms and legs, but when it ran out, I began to put the same stuff everywhere. I usually coat only the outside of the calf muscle on my legs, because that is where I got a brown streak when I could ride that long. I rub my arms together like a cricket, and put an extra layer on what sticks out of my sleeves. (In hot weather, I wear long linen sleeves -- and on my last few rides they got soaking wet without spitting water on them.) I still have brown, speckled arms. And there's a patch on the back of my hand even though I put on another layer of 50-SPF sunscreen every time I take off my gloves. The stick sunscreen is running out and I haven't yet found another that fits into my pocket. I recently realized that I can put lotion into a lip-salve box -- if I can find one that isn't identical in every way to the box I carry A&D in. I used to carry hand cleaner in my tool kit. A&D cleans hands just fine, and has a lot of other uses. Also, nowadays, I fix flats with my cell phone, so I don't need a grease remover. -- Joy Beeson joy beeson at comcast dot net http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/ Well, I can recommend the Neutrogena 100+. Did a long hard ride mostly in direct sunlight yesterday and my tan didn't change at all. Once you have developed a good tan it won't change much any more. Sometimes when working in the yard for a few minutes I get carried away and cut bushes for a couple hours. No sun screen at that time but the tan doesn't change anymore. Since moving to California in the 90's I also don't seem to get sun burns anymore. My ride was out towards the Altemont Pass. If there is enough sun my arms will turn red as if I got a sunburn but they will be brown again the next day. But with that 100+ there was absolutely NO reaction. Turning red is critical even if it "heals" in a day. I had that as well years ago but somehow not anymore. It all just tans a bit more over the weeks. On of my riding buddies has very white skin, Irish/Scandinavian type. So he uses SPF100 like you do and no tan or burn ever develops. One thing to remember is that a tan does not prevent UV damage to the skin. Yeah, that's a problem. However, people in countries where the majority has naturally darker skin fare much better in terms of skin cancer rates despite a much higher UV exposu That is certainly true but on the other hand all of the Caucasians I know who have developed skin cancer in their later years were outdoors people that had a good tan for much of their life. The ones I know or knew :-( ... were mostly light-skinned Caucasians with a more Nordic ethnic background. They didn't easily develop a tan but red skin and then blisters. Some of them essentially remained red all summer. AFAIK that is how the term redneck developed. Nope :-) A Redneck was originally a term used for a farmer. He followed a mule around the field all day and the back of his neck got sunburned. Sunburned. That's exactly what I said. It got red because the farmer was of Northern European ancestry and, therefore, his skin burned easily. A farmer of Southern European, South Asian or African ethnicity could plow the field all day and not get sunburned. Not necessarily only Northern European ancestry. Nearly all races will react to hot sun. When I was at Eniwetok the guy in the next cot, in the tent we lived in, was a Negro and he got got suprisingly darker after a time on the island. Japanese, particularly women, will sunburn and Chinese, and, and, and. Sure, the tanning mechanism is the same. However, since they have an intense natural tan the prevalence of skin cancer in, for example, African Americans is hugely lower: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2757062/ -- Regards, Joerg Not so Joerg, EVERYONE gets sunburned. Just because a black man's skin doesn't show red doesn't mean that he doesn't sunburn. Remember that Homosapiens came from Northern Africa so precisely the same mechanism is at work on everyone. Just because a Chinese farmer is out in the sun all the time to the extent that he has enough melanin to block most of the UVA that he is exposed to in his area doesn't mean that he wouldn't burn to a crisp elsewhere. This is why Arabs are always totally covered. Then why is the propensity to develop skin cancer about an order of magnitude higher in Caucasians versus African-Americans? -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ I don't follow you. We were talking about sunburn and skin cancer has to do with UVA rays effect on the skin and not particularly sunburn. I suppose someone that gets sunburn all the time may be more likely to get skin cancer but that doesn't mean that blacks and Morros don't get sunburned. It isn't sunburn in and of itself that causes cancer. Dark-skinned people get sunburned much less than people with very pale skin. I met many people from South America who work outdoors all day long and never use sun screen yet don't get sunburns. Because as you said this doesn't mean they won't run a risk of skin cancer, medical people still recommend they use sun screen. Despite all this their prevalence of skin cancer is way lower than that of white folks. So it seems the darker skin is a good protection against both skin cancer and sunburns. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ Ahh, now we are in total agreement. I was just pointing out that black and other dark skinned people can get sunburned. Here at 37 degrees north latitude we have a very large number of black people. In the cold winters and little sunshine under the marine layer, in the spring just like the rest of us they get sunburned if they are careless. They can but it takes a whole lot more of exposure to the sun. The difference can be an order of magnitude. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
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