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hex entry at the back of pedal



 
 
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  #11  
Old September 29th 18, 10:04 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Emanuel Berg[_2_]
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Posts: 1,035
Default hex entry at the back of pedal

AMuzi wrote:

http://i.ebayimg.com/00/$%28KGrHqZ,!lIE2EP64yPuBNhl+JMIDw~~_35.JPG?set_id= 8800005007


I love Knipex tools! Especially the Cobra and
the combination pliers, tho they aren't used
that frequently on bikes. The wire cutters are
cool as well.

--
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
Ads
  #12  
Old September 29th 18, 10:29 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
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Posts: 9,767
Default hex entry at the back of pedal

On 9/29/2018 2:26 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, September 29, 2018 at 11:11:58 AM UTC-7, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/29/2018 12:59 PM, Emanuel Berg wrote:
Today I replaced the pedals on a modern bike
with regular ones, which are just commodity
items from the hardware store. The modern
pedals are too short and, without using such
shoes, the interface to fixate them becomes an
uncomfortable blob under the foot.

Anyway first thing I noticed was an entry for
a hex key at the back of the pedal "screw
block" (?)

I removed the pedals just like a would with the
single speed, old steel bikes, i.e. a long
pipe, a 15mm wrench, a string to hold the crank
to the chainstay, CRC 5-56 (probably not needed
even), left pedal LT, right pedal regular, and
so very little force needed for the pedal to
come loose.

So what is the reason for the hex entry and
when do you use it?

BTW does anyone have an image with pedal parts
and terminology? I image googled but didn't
find anything to that end.


Pedal spindle (or axle - people use both terms) with allen
broach:
https://outdoorgearlab-mvnab3pwrvp3t...46_3693_XL.jpg

offers faster assembly:
http://i.ebayimg.com/00/$%28KGrHqZ,!lIE2EP64yPuBNhl+JMIDw~~_35.JPG?set_id= 8800005007

Fully tighten, or break free to remove, with 15mm pedal wrench.

Some pedals omit the wrench flats and have an 8mm allen
broach only on the inside.


Which I consider to be a huge step backwards. It's like putting the zipper pull for your fly on the inside -- or putting shoe laces under the tongue.

-- Jay Beattie.


Yeah, I was going to make unkind comments but riders who own
them have suffered enough (or will).

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #13  
Old September 30th 18, 12:11 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B. Slocomb
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Posts: 177
Default hex entry at the back of pedal

On Sat, 29 Sep 2018 23:01:46 +0200, Emanuel Berg
wrote:

David Scheidt wrote:

Typical torque spec for a 12.9 grade 10mm
socket head screw, which is what has an 8mm
hex socket, is 80 NM (~60 foot pounds).
Shimano pedals are 35 or 40 NM (25 to 29 ft
pounds), as I recall. If you can't do that
with a hex bit, you are not competent to work
on anything.


40nm, isn't that the typical casette torque?
You are supposed to do that with an 8mm allen
wrench? Not that I ever saw this situation
first hand!

BTW I don't think I put the pedals in that
hard. I have a torque wrench but for sockets,
not an open spanner - unless you can buy that
as a separate part and plug it in?

But I doubt they (the pedals) will get much
deeper anyhow...?


See https://www.tonetool.co.jp/english/p.../flyer_015.pdf
--
Cheers

John B.
  #14  
Old September 30th 18, 12:49 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
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Posts: 6,329
Default hex entry at the back of pedal

On 9/29/2018 5:01 PM, Emanuel Berg wrote:
David Scheidt wrote:

Typical torque spec for a 12.9 grade 10mm
socket head screw, which is what has an 8mm
hex socket, is 80 NM (~60 foot pounds).
Shimano pedals are 35 or 40 NM (25 to 29 ft
pounds), as I recall. If you can't do that
with a hex bit, you are not competent to work
on anything.


40nm, isn't that the typical casette torque?
You are supposed to do that with an 8mm allen
wrench? Not that I ever saw this situation
first hand!


As I mentioned in another thread: Our folding bikes (Bikes Friday) must
have the pedals removed to pack them in their travel suitcase, for
airline trips. The company supplies the tool kit, which includes a pedal
wrench that seems to be laser burned out of a piece of flat steel. It's
about 1/8" thick and 5" long.

I was skeptical about its adequacy when we first got the bikes, but I've
used it many times without problems. Pedal spindles tend to self-tighten
into the crank arms anyway. Getting them out is more of a problem than
tightening them sufficiently.


--
- Frank Krygowski
  #15  
Old September 30th 18, 01:02 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
news18
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Posts: 111
Default hex entry at the back of pedal

On Sat, 29 Sep 2018 19:49:42 -0400, Frank Krygowski wrote:

was skeptical about its adequacy when we first got the bikes, but I've
used it many times without problems. Pedal spindles tend to self-tighten
into the crank arms anyway. Getting them out is more of a problem than
tightening them sufficiently.


IME, I found a touch of grease on the thread makes it easier to remove
them when required without resaorting to major toolage. It is part of my
regular bearing maintenance.

  #16  
Old September 30th 18, 03:05 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
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Posts: 3,428
Default hex entry at the back of pedal

On Saturday, September 29, 2018 at 2:01:49 PM UTC-7, Emanuel Berg wrote:
David Scheidt wrote:

Typical torque spec for a 12.9 grade 10mm
socket head screw, which is what has an 8mm
hex socket, is 80 NM (~60 foot pounds).
Shimano pedals are 35 or 40 NM (25 to 29 ft
pounds), as I recall. If you can't do that
with a hex bit, you are not competent to work
on anything.


40nm, isn't that the typical casette torque?
You are supposed to do that with an 8mm allen
wrench? Not that I ever saw this situation
first hand!

BTW I don't think I put the pedals in that
hard. I have a torque wrench but for sockets,
not an open spanner - unless you can buy that
as a separate part and plug it in?

But I doubt they (the pedals) will get much
deeper anyhow...?


I'm not sure if I'm following, but all you do is put an 8mm hex socket on your torque wrench. https://images.homedepot-static.com/...77-64_1000.jpg Or buy an el-cheapo 8mm pedal wrench and just give it a good hard push. https://tinyurl.com/yc4n8z28

As for standard 15mm open-end pedal wrench, I never once saw a mechanic use an open end torque wrench, and historically, I just reefed on it a bit and called it good. Maybe others have a more scientific approach. I had one pedal come loose, but as Frank mentions, with bearing precession, the pedal should tighten. My pedal bearings were probably munged, or there was some other issue that caused the pedal to loosen besides low tightening torque. I bent the spindle on one of those pedals, too.

-- Jay Beattie.

  #17  
Old September 30th 18, 04:19 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
David Scheidt
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Posts: 1,268
Default hex entry at the back of pedal

Emanuel Berg wrote:
avid Scheidt wrote:

: Typical torque spec for a 12.9 grade 10mm
: socket head screw, which is what has an 8mm
: hex socket, is 80 NM (~60 foot pounds).
: Shimano pedals are 35 or 40 NM (25 to 29 ft
: pounds), as I recall. If you can't do that
: with a hex bit, you are not competent to work
: on anything.

:40nm, isn't that the typical casette torque?
:You are supposed to do that with an 8mm allen
:wrench? Not that I ever saw this situation
:first hand!

I can do 40 NM with a t-handle wrench. I admit I'm a big guy, with
good hand strength, and have tightened lots of fasteners. with an L
handled key, it's pretty easy. My long one is 15 cm long, so you need
to put a force of 266 N on the end of it. so put a bit less than 30
kilos into it. assuming no muscle, that's a bit of a grunt, not that
hard. Put a socket on a ratchet, and you can have a big lever, no
problem.

:BTW I don't think I put the pedals in that
:hard. I have a torque wrench but for sockets,
:not an open spanner - unless you can buy that
:as a separate part and plug it in?

What you'd want is called a 'crows foot wrench', a socket with an open
end wrench on it.

:But I doubt they (the pedals) will get much
:deeper anyhow...?

Tight pedals dont' move, which means they don't make noise.


--
sig 88
  #18  
Old September 30th 18, 04:53 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
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Posts: 6,329
Default hex entry at the back of pedal

On 9/29/2018 10:05 PM, jbeattie wrote:

As for standard 15mm open-end pedal wrench, I never once saw a mechanic use an open end torque wrench, and historically, I just reefed on it a bit and called it good. Maybe others have a more scientific approach. I had one pedal come loose, but as Frank mentions, with bearing precession, the pedal should tighten. My pedal bearings were probably munged, or there was some other issue that caused the pedal to loosen besides low tightening torque.


One of the weirdest failures I remember: During a ride, a good friend of
mine complained that his left pedal was giving him trouble. Eventually,
it stopped rotating entirely. We couldn't get it to spin at all.

So we pulled off the outside dust cap. One of his bearing balls was
split perfectly in two. The two halves had jammed in the race and locked
things up. I don't know why it split; the guy was certainly not a
powerful rider.

And BTW, the incident disproved one of the mythical reasons for left
hand threads on the left pedal. The pedal did not unscrew from the crank.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #19  
Old September 30th 18, 11:36 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tosspot[_3_]
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Posts: 1,202
Default hex entry at the back of pedal

On 2018-09-29 21:12, jbeattie wrote:
On Saturday, September 29, 2018 at 12:36:21 PM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2018-09-29 11:12, AMuzi wrote:
On 9/29/2018 12:59 PM, Emanuel Berg wrote:
Today I replaced the pedals on a modern bike with regular ones,
which are just commodity items from the hardware store. The
modern pedals are too short and, without using such shoes, the
interface to fixate them becomes an uncomfortable blob under
the foot.



You aren't supposed to ride click pedals with regular shoes :-)


Anyway first thing I noticed was an entry for a hex key at the
back of the pedal "screw block" (?)

I removed the pedals just like a would with the single speed,
old steel bikes, i.e. a long pipe, a 15mm wrench, a string to
hold the crank to the chainstay, CRC 5-56 (probably not needed
even), left pedal LT, right pedal regular, and so very little
force needed for the pedal to come loose.

So what is the reason for the hex entry and when do you use
it?

BTW does anyone have an image with pedal parts and terminology?
I image googled but didn't find anything to that end.


Pedal spindle (or axle - people use both terms) with allen
broach:
https://outdoorgearlab-mvnab3pwrvp3t...46_3693_XL.jpg




offers faster assembly:
http://i.ebayimg.com/00/$%28KGrHqZ,!lIE2EP64yPuBNhl+JMIDw~~_35.JPG?set_id= 8800005007




Or use a power drill with an allen bit in there, faster. We even use a
power drill to make bread dough.


Fully tighten, or break free to remove, with 15mm pedal wrench.

Some pedals omit the wrench flats and have an 8mm allen broach
only on the inside.


That sounds scary, I'd never buy those. 8mm ist too wimpy for a
nice tight fit.


Virtually every rider in the pro peleton has pedals tightened with an
8mm hex wrench.
https://www.excelsports.com/assets/z...y/112594-5.jpg It's
not a problem. It's just inconvenient as compared to the old days of
wrench flats.


Right up until the ******* spawn of Stan has ultrasonically vacuum ion
fused itself to the crank. *Then* and only then, the Park Pedal wrench
is brandished at it, just to let it know who is top of the evolutionary
tree!
  #20  
Old September 30th 18, 11:39 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tosspot[_3_]
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Posts: 1,202
Default hex entry at the back of pedal

On 2018-09-30 00:11, John B. Slocomb wrote:
On Sat, 29 Sep 2018 23:01:46 +0200, Emanuel Berg
wrote:

David Scheidt wrote:

Typical torque spec for a 12.9 grade 10mm socket head screw,
which is what has an 8mm hex socket, is 80 NM (~60 foot pounds).
Shimano pedals are 35 or 40 NM (25 to 29 ft pounds), as I recall.
If you can't do that with a hex bit, you are not competent to
work on anything.


40nm, isn't that the typical casette torque? You are supposed to do
that with an 8mm allen wrench? Not that I ever saw this situation
first hand!

BTW I don't think I put the pedals in that hard. I have a torque
wrench but for sockets, not an open spanner - unless you can buy
that as a separate part and plug it in?

But I doubt they (the pedals) will get much deeper anyhow...?


See https://www.tonetool.co.jp/english/p.../flyer_015.pdf


*******.
 




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