Lake Oroville State Recreation Area Hiking/Equestrian Trails Once Again Closed to Bikes!

Mikey says:

snippage

In spite of ORAC's concerns and user group complaints, DPR went forward,
modifying the 50-year-old single-track trails, mechanically widening the
pathway, removing trees along with other natural obstacles, to combine
mountain biking, equestrian and pedestrian hiking uses.

Which actually means that they ruined the trails for mountain-biking anyway, so
doubtless very few folks did bike the trails, and as usual, Mikey is barking up
the wrong tree years after the coon climbed down and ran away .

Apologies to coon hound lovers everywhere for likening MV to such a fine beast,
but I was analogy-challenged...

Steve

Mikey says:

snippage

In spite of ORAC's concerns and user group complaints, DPR went
forward,
modifying the 50-year-old single-track trails, mechanically widening
the
pathway, removing trees along with other natural obstacles, to
combine
mountain biking, equestrian and pedestrian hiking uses.

Which actually means that they ruined the trails for mountain-biking
anyway, so
doubtless very few folks did bike the trails, and as usual, Mikey is
barking up
the wrong tree years after the coon climbed down and ran away .

Apologies to coon hound lovers everywhere for likening MV to such a
fine beast,
but I was analogy-challenged...

Steve


That doesn't sound like great riding: "...widened...removing trees...
other natural obstacles..." it sounds like riding along some semi-paved
dip**** walking path old people and "newlyweds" frequent.

No offense meant to old folks or people newly in love; I too am suffering
from an analogy shortage.

Odd that folks "saving the environment" need to "...mechanically..."
widen trails into paths to enjoy the "saved" environment.

You have to love a good 'coon hound though. I wonder, since he has a bay
similar to one, does he have that funky (term used marginally) odor as
well?

K.


--
ireman_1

All this tends to prove is in grand American fashion the group with the
most people win, to simply put I doubt there was much mountian biking
taking place as was stated so there was probably little or no effort to
fight it and without resistance of course it passed, ok you can thump
you chest here, But also in the great nation of ours you can speak your
voice and carry on like the old man of the moutian that everyone seems
to have stopped listening to anyway, have fun keep on typing.


--
Aurawolf

Mikey-baby says:

.Which actually means that they ruined the trails for mountain-biking anyway,

Sour grapes, huh?

No - just means no big loss if they did close it to mtbs. ;-)

Steve

On 22 Aug 2004 12:44:06 GMT, ospam (Stephen Baker) wrote:

..Mikey-baby says:
..
...Which actually means that they ruined the trails for mountain-biking anyway,
..
..Sour grapes, huh?
..
..No - just means no big loss if they did close it to mtbs. ;-)

That's not what Paul Nam (president of ROMP) and Michael Kelley (founder of
IMBA) said:

To: ROMP
From: Paul Nam
Subject: [ROMP] Pt Reyes and Lake Oroville Access Alerts
Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2004 23:05:32 -0800 (PST)

ROMP,

We have posted detailed information on these two time sensitive action items,
Lake Oroville and Point Reyes National Seashore, at romp.org.

http://romp.org/

You'll find information there to form an opinion and compose a letter. Please
respond to Point Reyes by the 20th; only 2 days left! And the Lake Oroville
comments should go by mail before the 29th. These news items are listed on the
romp home page.

Chances are that the Point Reyes Stewart Beach ride should be included in the
IMBA Wild Rides program for 04'. This is a beautiful ride, and demonstrates the
potential of Point Reyes for cycling.

Save the trails not just for yourself, but for future generations of cyclists.
Make a difference. Please write.

Sincerely,
Paul


To: ROMP
From: Michael Kelley
Subject: [ROMP] Issues at a distance
Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:27:56 -0800

Pals,

This and related emails raise issues that I would like to comment upon.

At the outset, let me say that I couldn't have more respect for ROMP and the
work it is doing, and in particular, for the efforts of Paul Nam. He is doing an
extraordinary job, and we are all lucky to have him

In recent posts, some folks have suggested that we are a trail group, not an
environmental group, and that we should leave environmental issues to others. I
couldn't disagree more. It's always been my impression that we mountain bike
because of the diverse environments that we are able to experience. Often, it's
not about the trail; it's where the trail takes us. We are part of the community
that uses, and is inspired by these places. We must help act as stewards for
them; without them, we might as well work out in a gym.

When my pals and I ride, we thrive off the open spaces we pass through, and know
that we must be partners with those who want to preserve them. We are blissed
out at the sight of birds of prey, hovering above cliffs overlooking the ocean,
and become partners with those concerned about habitat and endangered species.

I'm reminded of a ride I took with some pals. We had spent an entire day in
paradise, with views to die for. We were all thankful for that. Then one of the
riders began complaining about the environmental community's treatment of bikes,
and about his belief that we had no business involving ourselves in
environmental issues. I was a bit dumbstuck, for here we were in a place that
would be protected for the rest of his and my lives combined, yet he couldn't
see the connection between us and the environmental groups that made our ride
possible..

The characteristics of the trail alone don't begin to tell the story. As another
example, about 15 years ago, a developer came to the East Bay Area Trails
Council, and asked for its endorsement of a housing development, on the theory
that a trail was included. In fact, the group went for it at first, because it
was a damn nice trail. But a bit of study revealed that this was a crummy
development in all other respects, and in fact that the "trail" was surrounded
by tall buildings and roads. We learned, nearly the hard way, that just having a
trail was not enough. We had to also be concerned about the land around the
trail.

Finally, let me speak a bit about advocating for trail, environmental and open
space issues outside our local area. While it is true that "think globally, act
locally," is a fine approach to many things, it is by no means the complete
answer. We live and work in the Bay Area, and probably do most of our riding
here. But we all need to visit other areas. Downieville, Forest City, Annadel,
Boggs Mountain, Fort Ord, Henry Coe, Moab, Fruita, and other areas too numerous
to mention are like magnets to us. We know them, and would do anything we could
to preserve them as mountain bike destinations. The fact that they are not local
means nothing.

When IMBA called, we leapt in and wrote letters to the BLM, successfully urging
them to reconsider a poorly conceived plan, even though there is almost no BLM
land in our area. In doing so, we recognized a duty to mountain bikers
throughout the country, who would have suffered greatly under the proposal. For
similar reasons, many of us are participating in the current wilderness
discussions. Again, most of us agree that the "fact" that these are not local
issues is immaterial.

Keep in mind that many of the lands we are concerned about are owned by the
state or federal government. In that sense, they are treasures that belong to
the citizens as a whole. We all have a responsibility to take care of them. In
most cases they are located in remote areas. That's why we like them. But such
areas often don't have local advocacy groups, either for trails or the
environment. If we don't pay attention, who will? It's groups like ROMP that
have the expertise to help out. We can often make the difference.

Keep it up Paul! And keep it up ROMP! You are doing a fantastic job.

Happy trails,

Michael Kelley

===
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

Mike Vandeman Wrote:
On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 16:15:39 +1000, Aurawolf
wrote:



Nope, there was a big effort to stop this from happening (see below).
This has
nothing to do with numbers. There was no voting. A federal agency
(FERC) made
the decision, based on all available information.




Hmm, went to the ROMP website and can't see how "big" and effort they
made oh well don't have the time this morning to read every detail
about it so maybe they did make this huge effort, as far as this
reflecting a numbers game yes it does, just cause there was no voting
doesn't mean a federal agency can't be swayed by a larger group happens
all the time right or wrong it does happen. Now here is the major
question and I ask in all honesty here cause I am curious why is FERC
even involved they aren't the goverment agency to handle land
management at all, I did double check things and the FERC closing a
park trail is kinda like the DEA closing a McDonalds for food
poisoning. Sure I am sure the DEA could close a McDonalds for food
poisoning but that doesn't mean it is the goverment agency with the
most credentials to investigate it properly and make the best choice
for doing such. Does this lake happen to have an oil field or natural
gas deposit around it?


--
Aurawolf

Pete Bargewell says:

Hi Mike

Im interested being a fellow hiker

And top-poster and non-snipper ;-)

any ideas about horses on trails?

They don't belong on any shared-use trail. Biker OR hiker. Unless you want to
go off-trail when they pass by.

Steve

And the last two paragraphs of M. Vandeman's article read......

The federal agency continued: "[C]onverting the trail to multiple use
(with
bicycles sharing the trail) would adversely change the recreational
experience for equestrian users primarily because it would increase the
potential user conflicts and necessitate more trail maintenance and
modifications to accommodate the multiple uses."

Fortunately for all the public, as FERC itself notes, Lake Oroville's "25
or
so miles of equestrian and hiker-only trails and more than 47 miles of
mountain bicycle trails in and adjacent to the project area offer a
balance
of recreational opportunities for the trail users."


Oooh, did I read "more than 47 miles of mountain bicycle trails
in and adjacent to the project area"?

I ran trails for over 20 years until the knee went.
Bikers can be a pain in the ass on a trail.
But nothing destroys a trail like a horse.


And I honestly never met a runner or biker
who wanted to share a trail with a horse.
(I doubt the hikers do either)


I would take the 47 miles of bike trails and give the horses 25.

IMO

JP

And I honestly never met a runner or biker
who wanted to share a trail with a horse.
(I doubt the hikers do either)

Once while hiking I came upon a group of horses stopped on the trail. I
paused, until someone told me to "go right ahead". Problem was, the only way
through meant walking behind the horses. Horses can spook if they know that
there is someone behind them that they can't see, and sometimes they kick. I
made it past alright, but the ignorance of those people was worrying.

--
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/ _|/ _/ |_ _|_ _|
\_ ( (( o | | | |
|__/\__\_/|_| |_|

On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 17:04:46 GMT, "Scott Burley"
wrote:

And I honestly never met a runner or biker
who wanted to share a trail with a horse.
(I doubt the hikers do either)

Once while hiking I came upon a group of horses stopped on the trail. I
paused, until someone told me to "go right ahead". Problem was, the only way
through meant walking behind the horses. Horses can spook if they know that
there is someone behind them that they can't see, and sometimes they kick. I
made it past alright, but the ignorance of those people was worrying.

Some horse people have a rather long list of things that others using
the trail are supposed to do, and not to do. They only want to share
the trail with people who are willing to step off the trail for them
instantly.

Happy trails,
Gary (net.yogi.bear)
------------------------------------------------
at the 51st percentile of ursine intelligence

Gary D. Schwartz, Needham, MA, USA
Please reply to: garyDOTschwartzATpoboxDOTcom