A Cycling & bikes forum. CycleBanter.com

Go Back   Home » CycleBanter.com forum » rec.bicycles » Techniques
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Bicyclist Fatalities in AZ 2009



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1251  
Old December 11th 10, 09:06 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,511
Default Bicyclist Fatalities in AZ 2009

On Dec 11, 1:38*pm, "Duane Hebert" wrote:


Apparently you're either in the middle of the lane or hugging the curb.
Boolean logic. *You know, black/white, true/false no gray.


I tried mightily to get a non-Boolean answer out of several of you.
The question was: ten foot lane, 8.5 foot truck behind, where would
you ride?

It would have been quite easy to say "Roughly six feet from the curb,"
or "Four feet" or "One foot" or whatever. I don't recall getting that
from anyone.

I got lots of "It depends," or "I'd get out of there" or (from DR)
"**** you." Neither Duane nor Dan nor DR nor Robert wanted to discuss
specifics. Barry did, and the conversation was amicable.

Seems to me the Boolean logic you're using is this: Whatever I say
must be totally condemned, despite my data, citations or
corroboration. Whatever the four of you say must never be disagreed
with, whether or not you have facts to back it up.

- Frank Krygowski
Ads
  #1252  
Old December 11th 10, 09:33 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,rec.bicycles.soc
Kristian M Zoerhoff
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 472
Default Kill-filing

On 2010-12-11, T?m Sherm?n? ?_? "" wrote:
On 12/11/2010 2:32 AM, Jym Dyer wrote:
I'm aware of how MIME works. It doesn't change the underlying
foundation of Usenet, it just makes it possible to piggyback
non-ASCII content onto an ASCII medium of transport.


=v= There aren't so many NNTP servers as there used to be.
Are any of them really so old that they still choke on 8 bits?
_Jym_


Ask the people over on alt.shut.the.hell.up.geek.


I resemble that remark.

--

Kristian Zoerhoff

  #1253  
Old December 11th 10, 09:34 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech,rec.bicycles.soc
Kristian M Zoerhoff
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 472
Default Kill-filing

On 2010-12-10, Michael Press wrote:
In article . org,
Kristian M Zoerhoff wrote:

On 2010-12-09, Michael Press wrote:
In article . org,
Kristian M Zoerhoff wrote:

On 2010-12-09, T?m Sherm?n? ?_? "" wrote:
On 12/8/2010 8:22 AM, Duane H?bert wrote:
On 12/7/2010 8:13 PM, T?m Sherm?n? ?_? wrote:
On 12/7/2010 8:22 AM, Duane H?bert wrote:
On 12/6/2010 9:21 PM, T?m Sherm?n? ?_? wrote:
On 12/6/2010 10:08 AM, Duane H?bert wrote:

At home I use Outlook Express for a news reader.[...]

Bill Gates holding a gun to your head?


Huh?

Why would anyone use a Micro$oft product when better, free alternatives
are available? (Assuming that they are given a choice.)


I haven't got around to installing TBird at home. Last year when I
tried it, it sucked too much. The current version seems ok - I'm using
it at work.

The "Huh?" was more about you telling me to use a newsreader that will
let me respond to your posts in lieu of you not doing funny things to
your header.

So huh?

My header is UTF-8 compliant.

Alas, usenet is not. It's a 7-bit medium.

All headers must be ASCII. Header titles
must be exactly as prescribed. HOWEVER... there are
means to communicate and render glyphs outside
ASCII. You have some reading to do, but I
promise it is rewarding reading.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIME
http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2047


I'm aware of how MIME works. It doesn't change the underlying foundation of
Usenet, it just makes it possible to piggyback non-ASCII content onto an
ASCII medium of transport.


Not a 7-bit medium as you assert.
Network News Transfer Protocol, rfc 3977, 3.1.1 reads

Note that texts using an encoding (such as UTF-16 or UTF-32) that may
contain the octets NUL, LF, or CR other than a CRLF pair cannot be
reliably conveyed in the above format (that is, they violate the MUST
requirement above). However, except when stated otherwise, this
specification does not require the content to be UTF-8, and therefore
(subject to that same requirement) it MAY include octets above and
below 128 mixed arbitrarily.


I stand corrected. Mea culpa.

--

Kristian Zoerhoff

  #1254  
Old December 11th 10, 10:23 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tºm Shermªn™ °_°[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,270
Default Bicyclist Fatalities in AZ 2009

On 12/11/2010 12:29 PM, Duane Hebert wrote:
"T�m Sherm�nT " wrote in
message ...
On 12/11/2010 8:29 AM, Duane Hebert wrote:
"T?m Sherm?n? " wrote in
message ...
On 12/10/2010 11:28 PM, DirtRoadie WHO? ANONYMOUSLY SNIPES:

Hmm. Given your fears, I suppose Quebec must have special Ground
Meat
Crews to scrape away all the dead cyclists!

- Frank Krygowski

**** you.

+1
DR

Good to see the maturity and civility of the group being preserved.

/sarcasm

Calling me a coward is bad enough but making light
of the dead cyclists here, some of which were friends
and all of which were persons, was a bit much.

And lying/libel is not a bit much?


Are you talking to me?


No, it is a different Frank-Basherâ„¢ who hides behind a pseudonym while
lying and committing libel by falsifying quotations. However, for some
reason, this immoral behavior draws much less ire than Frank Krygowski's
above board argumentation.

--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731,-83.985007
I am a vehicular cyclist.
  #1255  
Old December 11th 10, 11:18 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
RobertH
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 342
Default Bicyclist Fatalities in AZ 2009

On Dec 11, 7:36 am, "Duane Hebert" wrote:
"RobertH" wrote in message

...

On Dec 10, 7:55 pm, "Duane Hebert" wrote:


Your response was much more polite than mine. You must be new dealing
with
this
guy.


Truthfully I first experienced the whole ordeal maybe 10 or more years
ago. The ordeal loses its effect after you've experienced it 30 or 40
times.


So you can eventually ignore him?


His verbal, what you might call tactics lost any power to personally
annoy once I realized that he's been responding the exact same way
(using the exact same words in many cases) to everyone, without fail,
for many many years.

It's kind of like arguing with a recorded message.

It's particularly fun when he starts making **** up, out of whole
cloth, and gets called on it. More often than not he just sticks to
the script.
  #1256  
Old December 12th 10, 12:19 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tºm Shermªn™ °_°[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,339
Default Bicyclist Fatalities in AZ 2009

On 12/11/2010 4:18 PM, RobertH Who?:
[...]
It's particularly fun when he [Frank Krygowski] starts making
**** up, out of whole cloth, and gets called on it. [...]


Citation?

--
Tºm Shermªn - 42.435731,-83.985007
I am a vehicular cyclist.
  #1257  
Old December 12th 10, 12:47 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane Hebert
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 628
Default Bicyclist Fatalities in AZ 2009


"Frank Krygowski" wrote in message
...
On Dec 11, 1:38 pm, "Duane Hebert" wrote:


Apparently you're either in the middle of the lane or hugging the curb.
Boolean logic. You know, black/white, true/false no gray.


I tried mightily to get a non-Boolean answer out of several of you.
The question was: ten foot lane, 8.5 foot truck behind, where would
you ride?


It would have been quite easy to say "Roughly six feet from the curb,"
or "Four feet" or "One foot" or whatever. I don't recall getting that
from anyone.


I got lots of "It depends," or "I'd get out of there" or (from DR)
"**** you." Neither Duane nor Dan nor DR nor Robert wanted to discuss
specifics. Barry did, and the conversation was amicable.


Seems to me the Boolean logic you're using is this: Whatever I say
must be totally condemned, despite my data, citations or
corroboration. Whatever the four of you say must never be disagreed
with, whether or not you have facts to back it up.


That's rich. After telling me that I'm ignorant in more ways that I can
remember, calling me a coward, implying that I'm illiterate, telling me
that I have no idea about logic, math, statistics, proofs, analyses and
any number of other topics you are now claiming that you've been
slandered in some way.

Is it possible that you don't know what you're saying when you offend
people?
I doubt it. I imagine this is just the next step in your methodology.

In all of the time that I've been on Usenet with all of the trolls and
flames that I've dealt with,
I've NEVER lost my temper enough to use profanity like that.
Referring to dead cyclists as ground meat? And you're a cycling advocate?
That's rich.


  #1258  
Old December 12th 10, 12:48 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane Hebert
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 628
Default Bicyclist Fatalities in AZ 2009


"RobertH" wrote in message
...
On Dec 11, 7:36 am, "Duane Hebert" wrote:
"RobertH" wrote in message

...

On Dec 10, 7:55 pm, "Duane Hebert" wrote:


Your response was much more polite than mine. You must be new dealing
with
this
guy.


Truthfully I first experienced the whole ordeal maybe 10 or more years
ago. The ordeal loses its effect after you've experienced it 30 or 40
times.


So you can eventually ignore him?


His verbal, what you might call tactics lost any power to personally
annoy once I realized that he's been responding the exact same way
(using the exact same words in many cases) to everyone, without fail,
for many many years.

It's kind of like arguing with a recorded message.

It's particularly fun when he starts making **** up, out of whole
cloth, and gets called on it. More often than not he just sticks to
the script.


Apparently the next step is the downtrodden, much maligned
innocent attempting to save the world. Sort of the Harry Seldon
of current times.


  #1259  
Old December 12th 10, 12:52 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Duane Hebert
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 628
Default Bicyclist Fatalities in AZ 2009


"Tºm Shermªn™ °_°" " wrote in
message ...
On 12/11/2010 4:18 PM, RobertH Who?:
[...]
It's particularly fun when he [Frank Krygowski] starts making
**** up, out of whole cloth, and gets called on it. [...]


Citation?


At least twice in a thread about helmets (you were prominent in
that discussion with your foam hat repertoire), he accused
me of verbally attacking him. This was more annoying before
I actually did but still. I called him on it and he admitted
that he was "mistaken"


  #1260  
Old December 12th 10, 01:13 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
DirtRoadie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,915
Default Bicyclist Fatalities in AZ 2009

On Dec 11, 4:50*pm, Phil W Lee wrote:
DirtRoadie considered Sat, 11 Dec 2010 09:17:20
-0800 (PST) the perfect time to write:





On Dec 11, 9:39*am, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On Dec 11, 2:14*am, Phil W Lee wrote:


But there IS a clear distinction between the use of "vehicles" which
is all encompassing, and "motor vehicles" which is not.
The statute you quote says you must conform to the requirements for
vehicles, but does not say that you must conform to those requirements
for motor vehicles.
Sadly, (and maybe not surprisingly) English is a foreign language to
Americans, so maybe that's why their lawyers have difficulties in
understanding it.


It is amazing that such a simple point causes confusion, isn't it?


Only for those who have no grasp of how law is written and
interpreted. You would do well to do some reading about statutory
interpretation and how the result of an appellate decision
interpreting a term forecloses rehashing arguments about what the term
means.


Simple example:
Older laws are often referred to as "motor vehicle codes" and
contained references to "motor vehicles." As those evolved typically
they dropped the title "motor vehicle code" in favor of the more
complete and/or accurate "vehicle code" or "traffic code."


But sometimes the older term "motor vehicle" still lingers in sections
of law that were not completely revised or rewritten. But, as we have
seen, the newer laws typically provide that *bicycles are subject to
the same rights and responsibilities as any other vehicle. So that,
and an appellate court saying "yes, the term 'motor vehicle' in that
section means bicycles, too," that's the end of it. "Motor vehicle"
means bicycles too.


You can legislate that horses are dogs, but it still doesn't make it
correct.


One does not find typically legislation that dictates the equivalent
of "horses are dogs." But much legislation says the equivalent of
"wherever the term 'dog' appears it shall be understood to include all
four legged animals, including horses."

Wrong is wrong, no matter what seniority of judge said it.


Yes, wrong is wrong and you are wrong.
YANAL. And have proven it.

DR
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Reduce fatalities or danger rates instead? Doug[_3_] UK 3 September 19th 10 08:05 AM
Three cycling fatalities in London last month. Daniel Barlow UK 4 July 7th 09 12:58 PM
Child cyclist fatalities in London Tom Crispin UK 13 October 11th 08 05:12 PM
Car washes for cyclist fatalities Bobby Social Issues 4 October 11th 04 07:13 PM
web-site on road fatalities cfsmtb Australia 4 April 23rd 04 09:21 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 01:02 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 CycleBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.