I guess that makes three things the guy's done right.

"G.T." wrote in message
...

"JD" wrote in message
ups.com...

If our armed forces are a purely volunteer force, why did Casey
volunteer for what some may deem a terribe cause?

Many volunteer because of economics and because they believe in our
country
in general, not because they believe in this war.

Exactly. Without a draft, our army is for the most part an army of the poor.
That is not meant as a disrespect. I've seen some interesting programs on
their recruiting tactics in poor areas.

Does that make those
who have volunteered to serve in our armed forces supporters of what
you see as a terrible cause?

I don't know; that's tricky. One might say that a true patriot would follow
orders with faith in their country in its leadership. I can see that. But
there is a line that must be drawn when the orders conflict with personal
ethics or convictions. I'm sure you don't have to think too hard to imagine
a case where you were ordered to do something you simply could not do.
Somewhere in between is a place where it is our duty to conscienciously
object.


Not at all.

Greg

G.T. wrote:
"JD" wrote in message
ups.com...

If our armed forces are a purely volunteer force, why did Casey
volunteer for what some may deem a terrible cause?

Many volunteer because of economics and because they believe in our country
in general, not because they believe in this war.


I enlisted for economic and patriotic reasons, fully knowing I may have
to lay my life on the line for something I may or may not fully believe
in. Whether or not it was something I truly believed in, I made a
commitment built on trust and knew I was dedicated enough to trust the
decisions being made. The UCMJ gives an individual the right to not
carry out an order in the case of what the civilized world may deem an
atrocity, so I never worried about being ordered to mindlessly
slaughter innocent civilians.

War sucks, but can be an unfortunate neccesity in the eyes of some.
I'm also set to wondering how the majority of the Iraqui people really
feel about their cost of freedom, not by just what the media is feeding
us.

Does that make those
who have volunteered to serve in our armed forces supporters of what
you see as a terrible cause?


Not at all.


Which is my point to gree-c, who is obviously blinded by his own brand
of hate.

JD hates heavy traffic

"JD" wrote in message
oups.com...

G.T. wrote:
"JD" wrote in message
ups.com...

If our armed forces are a purely volunteer force, why did Casey
volunteer for what some may deem a terrible cause?

Many volunteer because of economics and because they believe in our
country
in general, not because they believe in this war.


I enlisted for economic and patriotic reasons, fully knowing I may have
to lay my life on the line for something I may or may not fully believe
in. Whether or not it was something I truly believed in, I made a
commitment built on trust and knew I was dedicated enough to trust the
decisions being made. The UCMJ gives an individual the right to not
carry out an order in the case of what the civilized world may deem an
atrocity, so I never worried about being ordered to mindlessly
slaughter innocent civilians.

War sucks, but can be an unfortunate neccesity in the eyes of some.
I'm also set to wondering how the majority of the Iraqui people really
feel about their cost of freedom, not by just what the media is feeding
us.

Does that make those
who have volunteered to serve in our armed forces supporters of what
you see as a terrible cause?


Not at all.


Which is my point to gree-c, who is obviously blinded by his own brand
of hate.


My hate for the loss of human life sacrificed to our imperialistic
imperatives?

cc wrote:
Exactly. Without a draft, our army is for the most part an army of the poor.
That is not meant as a disrespect. I've seen some interesting programs on
their recruiting tactics in poor areas.


Tell us all how your firsthand experience in the US military has shown
you all of this. I had no money and no prospects when I enlisted, but
don't remember any "recruiting tactics". I walked the five miles to
the recruiter's office and volunteered. The most interesting programs
I witnessed in the military were geared towards giving me a career path
once my enlistment was up. Shame on them!

JD

"JD" wrote in message
oups.com...

cc wrote:
Exactly. Without a draft, our army is for the most part an army of the
poor.
That is not meant as a disrespect. I've seen some interesting programs on
their recruiting tactics in poor areas.


Tell us all how your firsthand experience in the US military has shown
you all of this. I had no money and no prospects when I enlisted, but
don't remember any "recruiting tactics". I walked the five miles to
the recruiter's office and volunteered. The most interesting programs
I witnessed in the military were geared towards giving me a career path
once my enlistment was up.

I READ, JD. One firsthand experience does not trump research involving
thousands. Sorry.

Look at the statistics on how many coming out get their benefits as
promised. Read about how many have been left by the wayside when they
returned from Iraq.

http://www.afsc.org/pwork/0506/050607.htm

Shame on them!

JD

Bill Sornson wrote:

But that wouldn't get a rise out of you! Duh! (Read some Mikey if you need
help with this.)

You got me.

E.P.

Per JD:
If our armed forces are a purely volunteer force, why did Casey
volunteer for what some may deem a terribe cause?

Can't speak to Casey's case, but I recall writing a two-page, single-spaced,
typewritten letter to some Colonel somewhere explaining why my particular MOS
was being wasted where I was stationed and would be much better used in a war
zone: namely Vietnam.

Luckily for me, the letter was ignored.

Why did I volunteer?

Patriotism? Don't think so...

Dedication to duty? Are you kidding?


I think it was just a combination of poor judgment and most any young man's
desire to be where the action is.
--
PeteCresswell

"cc" wrote in message
...

"MTBlood" wrote in message
...

" nope...can't stand hippies...

you can stop proving you're ignorant now. go back to watching
television.

Wow...what a great comeback! I'm disappointed...I thought my ignorant ass
would be awed with your infinite wisdom...

There's no point in arguing with you. You have too much at stake to change
your views and are clearly thoroughly washed.


This is a mountain bike newsgroup..take your anti-war, anti-American ****
where it belongs. I made great sacrifices for this country and I did so
with my head high and with honor that can only be bestowed upon a U.S.
service member. Your statements are a disrespect to every man and women
in uniform.

I'm not disrespecting you, but your leaders.

I take this comment back. I am not disrespecting. I am disagreeing. Funny
that dissent is so easily interpreted as being anti-American.

wrote in message
oups.com...

Bill Sornson wrote:
wrote:
Bill Sornson wrote:
cc wrote:

He sees no difference between "the SS" and US soldiers, so whatever
he writes has zero credibility or weight.

You bias is hanging out; don't trip on it!

Same for you - he didn't say they were the same.

He was drawing a parallel. And the parallel he drew (and not the one
you are assigning) is apt.

Just because someone thinks they are doing the right thing doesn't
mean they actually are doing the right thing.

OK. So gassing jews in chambers if you /think/ it's the right thing to
do
is equivalent to serving in the armed forces in Iraq right now. Wow.

Boy, you're not too clear on the concept of *logic*, are you? The only
one *equating* those things is *you*, Bill. Drawing a parallel on a
line of thinking is not making a equation on actions.

Engage your brain for a second.

In Salem, MA, in the 17th century, some town leaders thought they were
doing God's will when they executed some young women who were likely
the victims of grain fungus poisoning. *Thinking* you are doing the
right thing is not the same thing as *doing* the right thing.

Don't let your bias make you lose sight of the real argument.

You mean like far-lefties who actively root against the US now because
they're still ****ed about the 2000 election. Gotcha. I won't.

Disagreeing != rooting against. If I was anti-American, I'd say "go for it!"
and "let's get Iran next!" so the middle east could collapse at our feet,
with us holding the bag.

"cc" wrote:


"Bill Sornson" wrote in message
...
Mark Hickey wrote:

Why do you suppose some are searching so dilligently for any misstep
by the US, and shouting anything they find from the highest rooftop -
all while giving a pass to those who kill innocents by the dozen?

Are you kidding me ?!!!

How about when WE kill innocents - e.g. Iraqi civilians - by the dozen?
Covered? No.

It got lots of coverage. Where do you get your news?

The groundless detention and mistreatment of foreign nationals (who are
quite often free to go when they are *finally* returned to their homeland)
at Guantanamo? Hardly.

"Groundless detention"??? Hoo boy. You know of course that the
majority have been released - and many of THOSE have been killed or
recaptured trying to kill more US servicemen and women, right?

The displacement of millions of Palestinians with the use of US funds? Funny
how in the media the Israelis are the poor displaced ones, isn't it? Not
really. Israel is the biggest recipient of foreign aid in the world, thanks
to us.

So? Why wouldn't we prop up the one real democracy in the middle
east?

The list really goes on and on. If you think the media is biased left, you
should look again. Or try reading.

Funny - I read through the above, and don't see any mention of
terrorists killing hundreds of innocents, of PLO and other groups
blowing up hundreds of innocents. But you're not gonna miss a few
prisoners being photographed nude by a few renegade US guards, are
you?

Two words: media bias.

Bill "left out 'blatant'" S.

Are you living on some other planet?

Than you? Probably.

Mark Hickey
Habanero Cycles
http://www.habcycles.com
Home of the $695 ti frame