Chain lube intervals 7-speed versus 10-speed

No, not a new helmet thread :-)

Just curious. I had to use my MTB for a while even on roads because my
road bike was indisposed. After a fresh clean and lube with White
Lightning Epic Ride (it's a thin oil plus wax) it started squealing
after only 100 miles of pure asphalt riding, no trails or dirt. The road
bike delivers in excess of 200mi per lube. The difference is that the
MTB uses a KMC X10.93 10-speed chain and the road bike uses wider 7/8
speed chains of various brands (Wippermann, Sachs-Sedis, KMC).

Why is that? Are 10-speed chains more like the princess on the pea?

--
Regards, Joerg (who still wants O-ring chains ...)

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On Fri, 09 Jun 2017 16:15:45 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

No, not a new helmet thread :-)

Just curious. I had to use my MTB for a while even on roads because my
road bike was indisposed. After a fresh clean and lube with White
Lightning Epic Ride (it's a thin oil plus wax) it started squealing
after only 100 miles of pure asphalt riding, no trails or dirt. The road
bike delivers in excess of 200mi per lube. The difference is that the
MTB uses a KMC X10.93 10-speed chain and the road bike uses wider 7/8
speed chains of various brands (Wippermann, Sachs-Sedis, KMC).

Why is that? Are 10-speed chains more like the princess on the pea?

I don't know about the lube but
7 speed is 7.3 mm wide, an 8 speed 7.1 mm, a 9 speed 6.6 to 6.8 mm, a
10 speed 6.2 mm (Shimano, Campagnolo), or maybe 10 speed (Narrow) 5.88
mm (Campagnolo, KMC) so a 10 speed chain is about 17% wider then a 7
speed.

I can't say for White lightening lube but I usually lube my chains
with either my wax mix or the corrosion preventative I used to use,
monthly and that is normally more then 200 miles on pavement.
--
Cheers,

John B.

On 10/06/17 14:53, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 09 Jun 2017 16:15:45 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

No, not a new helmet thread :-)

Just curious. I had to use my MTB for a while even on roads because my
road bike was indisposed. After a fresh clean and lube with White
Lightning Epic Ride (it's a thin oil plus wax) it started squealing
after only 100 miles of pure asphalt riding, no trails or dirt. The road
bike delivers in excess of 200mi per lube. The difference is that the
MTB uses a KMC X10.93 10-speed chain and the road bike uses wider 7/8
speed chains of various brands (Wippermann, Sachs-Sedis, KMC).

Why is that? Are 10-speed chains more like the princess on the pea?

I don't know about the lube but
7 speed is 7.3 mm wide, an 8 speed 7.1 mm, a 9 speed 6.6 to 6.8 mm, a
10 speed 6.2 mm (Shimano, Campagnolo), or maybe 10 speed (Narrow) 5.88
mm (Campagnolo, KMC) so a 10 speed chain is about 17% wider then a 7
speed.

I can't say for White lightening lube but I usually lube my chains
with either my wax mix or the corrosion preventative I used to use,
monthly and that is normally more then 200 miles on pavement.

Recently, about 1000km for my 10s chain having been "cooked" in my
wax/oil mix, and that includes some wet weather!

I use a Connex quick link that requires no tools for me to undo.

--
JS

On Friday, June 9, 2017 at 11:14:36 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 10/06/17 14:53, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 09 Jun 2017 16:15:45 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

No, not a new helmet thread :-)

Just curious. I had to use my MTB for a while even on roads because my
road bike was indisposed. After a fresh clean and lube with White
Lightning Epic Ride (it's a thin oil plus wax) it started squealing
after only 100 miles of pure asphalt riding, no trails or dirt. The road
bike delivers in excess of 200mi per lube. The difference is that the
MTB uses a KMC X10.93 10-speed chain and the road bike uses wider 7/8
speed chains of various brands (Wippermann, Sachs-Sedis, KMC).

Why is that? Are 10-speed chains more like the princess on the pea?

I don't know about the lube but
7 speed is 7.3 mm wide, an 8 speed 7.1 mm, a 9 speed 6.6 to 6.8 mm, a
10 speed 6.2 mm (Shimano, Campagnolo), or maybe 10 speed (Narrow) 5.88
mm (Campagnolo, KMC) so a 10 speed chain is about 17% wider then a 7
speed.

I can't say for White lightening lube but I usually lube my chains
with either my wax mix or the corrosion preventative I used to use,
monthly and that is normally more then 200 miles on pavement.

Recently, about 1000km for my 10s chain having been "cooked" in my
wax/oil mix, and that includes some wet weather!

I use a Connex quick link that requires no tools for me to undo.

I was unaware that they had more than one method of quick releases. I have a packet of four that has "YBN" on it. They work fine and I can release them easily though it requires a pair of pliers.

On 2017-06-10 06:41, wrote:
On Friday, June 9, 2017 at 11:14:36 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 10/06/17 14:53, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 09 Jun 2017 16:15:45 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

No, not a new helmet thread :-)

Just curious. I had to use my MTB for a while even on roads
because my road bike was indisposed. After a fresh clean and
lube with White Lightning Epic Ride (it's a thin oil plus wax)
it started squealing after only 100 miles of pure asphalt
riding, no trails or dirt. The road bike delivers in excess of
200mi per lube. The difference is that the MTB uses a KMC
X10.93 10-speed chain and the road bike uses wider 7/8 speed
chains of various brands (Wippermann, Sachs-Sedis, KMC).

Why is that? Are 10-speed chains more like the princess on the
pea?

I don't know about the lube but 7 speed is 7.3 mm wide, an 8
speed 7.1 mm, a 9 speed 6.6 to 6.8 mm, a 10 speed 6.2 mm
(Shimano, Campagnolo), or maybe 10 speed (Narrow) 5.88 mm
(Campagnolo, KMC) so a 10 speed chain is about 17% wider then a
7 speed.



I guess you meant narrower :-)

What surprised me was that this makes such a difference in lube
intervals. Or maybe it's the construction of the chains?


I can't say for White lightening lube but I usually lube my
chains with either my wax mix or the corrosion preventative I
used to use, monthly and that is normally more then 200 miles on
pavement.


It probably depends on the climate, dust and route. The road bike has to
endure about 5-10% offroad or dirt roads. I often get 250mi but without
those dusty dirt roads I might get more. With the MTB as a substitute I
didn't ride dirt at all.


Recently, about 1000km for my 10s chain having been "cooked" in my
wax/oil mix, and that includes some wet weather!


A friend does the wax cooking thing. He gets slightly more miles per
lube but not a whole lot. His chains last longer though.


I use a Connex quick link that requires no tools for me to undo.

I was unaware that they had more than one method of quick releases. I
have a packet of four that has "YBN" on it. They work fine and I can
release them easily though it requires a pair of pliers.


I use the KMC missing link that comes with the chains. It requires
"tenting" the link, a piece of wood and a mallet (or small rock when on
the trail). I don't carry suitable pliers for that on rides since it
takes less than a minte to do the job without those.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On Sat, 10 Jun 2017 07:13:06 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-06-10 06:41, wrote:
On Friday, June 9, 2017 at 11:14:36 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 10/06/17 14:53, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 09 Jun 2017 16:15:45 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

No, not a new helmet thread :-)

Just curious. I had to use my MTB for a while even on roads
because my road bike was indisposed. After a fresh clean and
lube with White Lightning Epic Ride (it's a thin oil plus wax)
it started squealing after only 100 miles of pure asphalt
riding, no trails or dirt. The road bike delivers in excess of
200mi per lube. The difference is that the MTB uses a KMC
X10.93 10-speed chain and the road bike uses wider 7/8 speed
chains of various brands (Wippermann, Sachs-Sedis, KMC).

Why is that? Are 10-speed chains more like the princess on the
pea?

I don't know about the lube but 7 speed is 7.3 mm wide, an 8
speed 7.1 mm, a 9 speed 6.6 to 6.8 mm, a 10 speed 6.2 mm
(Shimano, Campagnolo), or maybe 10 speed (Narrow) 5.88 mm
(Campagnolo, KMC) so a 10 speed chain is about 17% wider then a
7 speed.



I guess you meant narrower :-)

What surprised me was that this makes such a difference in lube
intervals. Or maybe it's the construction of the chains?


I can't say for White lightening lube but I usually lube my
chains with either my wax mix or the corrosion preventative I
used to use, monthly and that is normally more then 200 miles on
pavement.


It probably depends on the climate, dust and route. The road bike has to
endure about 5-10% offroad or dirt roads. I often get 250mi but without
those dusty dirt roads I might get more. With the MTB as a substitute I
didn't ride dirt at all.


Recently, about 1000km for my 10s chain having been "cooked" in my
wax/oil mix, and that includes some wet weather!


A friend does the wax cooking thing. He gets slightly more miles per
lube but not a whole lot. His chains last longer though.


I use a Connex quick link that requires no tools for me to undo.

I was unaware that they had more than one method of quick releases. I
have a packet of four that has "YBN" on it. They work fine and I can
release them easily though it requires a pair of pliers.


I use the KMC missing link that comes with the chains. It requires
"tenting" the link, a piece of wood and a mallet (or small rock when on
the trail). I don't carry suitable pliers for that on rides since it
takes less than a minte to do the job without those.

The construction of bicycle chain did change some time ago but I don't
know if that was all chains or only some chains. I've got a 7 speed
chain and I'll pop a link off and look at it.

Or maybe Andrew knows.
--
Cheers,

John B.

On Sun, 11 Jun 2017 21:05:47 +0700, John B.
wrote:

On Sat, 10 Jun 2017 07:13:06 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-06-10 06:41, wrote:
On Friday, June 9, 2017 at 11:14:36 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 10/06/17 14:53, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 09 Jun 2017 16:15:45 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

No, not a new helmet thread :-)

Just curious. I had to use my MTB for a while even on roads
because my road bike was indisposed. After a fresh clean and
lube with White Lightning Epic Ride (it's a thin oil plus wax)
it started squealing after only 100 miles of pure asphalt
riding, no trails or dirt. The road bike delivers in excess of
200mi per lube. The difference is that the MTB uses a KMC
X10.93 10-speed chain and the road bike uses wider 7/8 speed
chains of various brands (Wippermann, Sachs-Sedis, KMC).

Why is that? Are 10-speed chains more like the princess on the
pea?

I don't know about the lube but 7 speed is 7.3 mm wide, an 8
speed 7.1 mm, a 9 speed 6.6 to 6.8 mm, a 10 speed 6.2 mm
(Shimano, Campagnolo), or maybe 10 speed (Narrow) 5.88 mm
(Campagnolo, KMC) so a 10 speed chain is about 17% wider then a
7 speed.



I guess you meant narrower :-)

What surprised me was that this makes such a difference in lube
intervals. Or maybe it's the construction of the chains?


I can't say for White lightening lube but I usually lube my
chains with either my wax mix or the corrosion preventative I
used to use, monthly and that is normally more then 200 miles on
pavement.


It probably depends on the climate, dust and route. The road bike has to
endure about 5-10% offroad or dirt roads. I often get 250mi but without
those dusty dirt roads I might get more. With the MTB as a substitute I
didn't ride dirt at all.


Recently, about 1000km for my 10s chain having been "cooked" in my
wax/oil mix, and that includes some wet weather!


A friend does the wax cooking thing. He gets slightly more miles per
lube but not a whole lot. His chains last longer though.


I use a Connex quick link that requires no tools for me to undo.

I was unaware that they had more than one method of quick releases. I
have a packet of four that has "YBN" on it. They work fine and I can
release them easily though it requires a pair of pliers.


I use the KMC missing link that comes with the chains. It requires
"tenting" the link, a piece of wood and a mallet (or small rock when on
the trail). I don't carry suitable pliers for that on rides since it
takes less than a minte to do the job without those.

The construction of bicycle chain did change some time ago but I don't
know if that was all chains or only some chains. I've got a 7 speed
chain and I'll pop a link off and look at it.

Or maybe Andrew knows.

I busted up the old 7 speed chain I have, or rather the chain I took
off the old seven speed bike. It is marked FSC-F50 which I believe
indicates that it is a 7 speed chain. It is made exactly like my 9
speed chains with the rollers supported by the "dimpled" side plates.
--
Cheers,

John B.

On 2017-06-11 17:28, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 11 Jun 2017 21:05:47 +0700, John B.
wrote:

On Sat, 10 Jun 2017 07:13:06 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-06-10 06:41, wrote:
On Friday, June 9, 2017 at 11:14:36 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 10/06/17 14:53, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 09 Jun 2017 16:15:45 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

No, not a new helmet thread :-)

Just curious. I had to use my MTB for a while even on roads
because my road bike was indisposed. After a fresh clean and
lube with White Lightning Epic Ride (it's a thin oil plus wax)
it started squealing after only 100 miles of pure asphalt
riding, no trails or dirt. The road bike delivers in excess of
200mi per lube. The difference is that the MTB uses a KMC
X10.93 10-speed chain and the road bike uses wider 7/8 speed
chains of various brands (Wippermann, Sachs-Sedis, KMC).

Why is that? Are 10-speed chains more like the princess on the
pea?

I don't know about the lube but 7 speed is 7.3 mm wide, an 8
speed 7.1 mm, a 9 speed 6.6 to 6.8 mm, a 10 speed 6.2 mm
(Shimano, Campagnolo), or maybe 10 speed (Narrow) 5.88 mm
(Campagnolo, KMC) so a 10 speed chain is about 17% wider then a
7 speed.



I guess you meant narrower :-)

What surprised me was that this makes such a difference in lube
intervals. Or maybe it's the construction of the chains?


I can't say for White lightening lube but I usually lube my
chains with either my wax mix or the corrosion preventative I
used to use, monthly and that is normally more then 200 miles on
pavement.


It probably depends on the climate, dust and route. The road bike has to
endure about 5-10% offroad or dirt roads. I often get 250mi but without
those dusty dirt roads I might get more. With the MTB as a substitute I
didn't ride dirt at all.


Recently, about 1000km for my 10s chain having been "cooked" in my
wax/oil mix, and that includes some wet weather!


A friend does the wax cooking thing. He gets slightly more miles per
lube but not a whole lot. His chains last longer though.


I use a Connex quick link that requires no tools for me to undo.

I was unaware that they had more than one method of quick releases. I
have a packet of four that has "YBN" on it. They work fine and I can
release them easily though it requires a pair of pliers.


I use the KMC missing link that comes with the chains. It requires
"tenting" the link, a piece of wood and a mallet (or small rock when on
the trail). I don't carry suitable pliers for that on rides since it
takes less than a minte to do the job without those.

The construction of bicycle chain did change some time ago but I don't
know if that was all chains or only some chains. I've got a 7 speed
chain and I'll pop a link off and look at it.

Or maybe Andrew knows.

I busted up the old 7 speed chain I have, or rather the chain I took
off the old seven speed bike. It is marked FSC-F50 which I believe
indicates that it is a 7 speed chain. It is made exactly like my 9
speed chains with the rollers supported by the "dimpled" side plates.


Maybe the 10-speed ones squeal earlier because the load-bearing surfaces
are narrower? The squealing is most pronounced under load. I can feel it
coming up when going uphill and the chain lets off a faint "wrrrt ...
wrrrt" noise with slight vibration. Later it begins to squeal. Same for
7/8-speed except their lube remains much longer.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On Saturday, June 10, 2017 at 7:12:57 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-06-10 06:41, wrote:
On Friday, June 9, 2017 at 11:14:36 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 10/06/17 14:53, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 09 Jun 2017 16:15:45 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

No, not a new helmet thread :-)

Just curious. I had to use my MTB for a while even on roads
because my road bike was indisposed. After a fresh clean and
lube with White Lightning Epic Ride (it's a thin oil plus wax)
it started squealing after only 100 miles of pure asphalt
riding, no trails or dirt. The road bike delivers in excess of
200mi per lube. The difference is that the MTB uses a KMC
X10.93 10-speed chain and the road bike uses wider 7/8 speed
chains of various brands (Wippermann, Sachs-Sedis, KMC).

Why is that? Are 10-speed chains more like the princess on the
pea?

I don't know about the lube but 7 speed is 7.3 mm wide, an 8
speed 7.1 mm, a 9 speed 6.6 to 6.8 mm, a 10 speed 6.2 mm
(Shimano, Campagnolo), or maybe 10 speed (Narrow) 5.88 mm
(Campagnolo, KMC) so a 10 speed chain is about 17% wider then a
7 speed.



I guess you meant narrower :-)

We used to run Henry Weinhards down around Sarasota. Back then they was longhorns.

On Mon, 12 Jun 2017 07:39:43 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-06-11 17:28, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 11 Jun 2017 21:05:47 +0700, John B.
wrote:

On Sat, 10 Jun 2017 07:13:06 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-06-10 06:41, wrote:
On Friday, June 9, 2017 at 11:14:36 PM UTC-7, James wrote:
On 10/06/17 14:53, John B. wrote:
On Fri, 09 Jun 2017 16:15:45 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

No, not a new helmet thread :-)

Just curious. I had to use my MTB for a while even on roads
because my road bike was indisposed. After a fresh clean and
lube with White Lightning Epic Ride (it's a thin oil plus wax)
it started squealing after only 100 miles of pure asphalt
riding, no trails or dirt. The road bike delivers in excess of
200mi per lube. The difference is that the MTB uses a KMC
X10.93 10-speed chain and the road bike uses wider 7/8 speed
chains of various brands (Wippermann, Sachs-Sedis, KMC).

Why is that? Are 10-speed chains more like the princess on the
pea?

I don't know about the lube but 7 speed is 7.3 mm wide, an 8
speed 7.1 mm, a 9 speed 6.6 to 6.8 mm, a 10 speed 6.2 mm
(Shimano, Campagnolo), or maybe 10 speed (Narrow) 5.88 mm
(Campagnolo, KMC) so a 10 speed chain is about 17% wider then a
7 speed.



I guess you meant narrower :-)

What surprised me was that this makes such a difference in lube
intervals. Or maybe it's the construction of the chains?


I can't say for White lightening lube but I usually lube my
chains with either my wax mix or the corrosion preventative I
used to use, monthly and that is normally more then 200 miles on
pavement.


It probably depends on the climate, dust and route. The road bike has to
endure about 5-10% offroad or dirt roads. I often get 250mi but without
those dusty dirt roads I might get more. With the MTB as a substitute I
didn't ride dirt at all.


Recently, about 1000km for my 10s chain having been "cooked" in my
wax/oil mix, and that includes some wet weather!


A friend does the wax cooking thing. He gets slightly more miles per
lube but not a whole lot. His chains last longer though.


I use a Connex quick link that requires no tools for me to undo.

I was unaware that they had more than one method of quick releases. I
have a packet of four that has "YBN" on it. They work fine and I can
release them easily though it requires a pair of pliers.


I use the KMC missing link that comes with the chains. It requires
"tenting" the link, a piece of wood and a mallet (or small rock when on
the trail). I don't carry suitable pliers for that on rides since it
takes less than a minte to do the job without those.

The construction of bicycle chain did change some time ago but I don't
know if that was all chains or only some chains. I've got a 7 speed
chain and I'll pop a link off and look at it.

Or maybe Andrew knows.

I busted up the old 7 speed chain I have, or rather the chain I took
off the old seven speed bike. It is marked FSC-F50 which I believe
indicates that it is a 7 speed chain. It is made exactly like my 9
speed chains with the rollers supported by the "dimpled" side plates.


Maybe the 10-speed ones squeal earlier because the load-bearing surfaces
are narrower? The squealing is most pronounced under load. I can feel it
coming up when going uphill and the chain lets off a faint "wrrrt ...
wrrrt" noise with slight vibration. Later it begins to squeal. Same for
7/8-speed except their lube remains much longer.


I don't know. I can't remember any chain that I've had that made any
noises. Even back in the days when the chain on a very old one speed
schwinn would get all rusty in the winter and I'd oil it with my Mom's
sewing machine oil.

But maybe I spend too much time on bicycle preventative maintenance
--
Cheers,

John B.