ok, hands up

enough!

i love the middle age male concept!

i particularly like the houses of bricks, sticks & straw analogy. on
the east coast of course, bricks are fine. here on the west, bricks are
a no-no because of seismic activity, so we build from sticks. and in
the europe, there are houses with straw roofs, so that is an excellent
illustration of something being unacceptable to one person but the only
way forward for another. just as long as the opinions of each group are
respected and relevant facts observed.

thanks again folks.

jb

We have plenty
of folks here who do not BS, qualify their comments and show evidence
to substantiate their claims.

jobst, i got to hand it to you - you have the biggest brass gonads i've
ever seen. how you can make a statement like that, suggesting by
implication of course that /you/ just happen to be a shining example of
this exemplary behavior, just amazes me. how do you do it?

* you are the guy that can't differentiate between materials that
exhibit strain aging from those that don't, yet holds himself up to be a
materials expert, complete with new fatigue analysis theories.

* you are the guy that doesn't know enough to show the appropriate
stress/strain graphs when discussing the properties of materials in his
own publication. [see point above.]

* you are the guy that hits on one of many possible explanations for
cracking failures in rims but can't be bothered to check whether the one
you've thrown your weight behind is indeed the real cause.

* you are the guy that states that all silver ma2 rims are unanodized,
regardless of contrary facts presented in the manufacturers own catalogs.

[there's more, but i've made my point]

please, give us a break!

as bill has very astutely observed earlier in this thread, _you_ are the
guy that has that has the remarkable ability to twist one argument into
another as though the facts of one support the supposition of the other.
and here you are doing it again!

look, we're all entitled to opinions and this is an open forum, but
please quit this "fact supports supposition" and "opinion = fact" stuff.
particularly when you're out of your own personal experience or
knowledge boundries! you have a valid contribution to make - your book
is quite handy in some respects, but it's not all technically correct,
and some of the stuff you write here is just plain fantasy. just enough
fact thrown in of course to make it sound credible, but fantasy nonetheless.

please, try to look beyond any "personal" element of someone's
disagreement and understand that as experienced and expert in some
issues as you may be, it is possible that there are others where you are
not. particularly if it's new materials outside your expertise! making
a general statement about carbon fork failure for example does not have
any relevance to its vibration damping properties. sure, particularly
early on, carbon forks did fail!! and if you don't want to ride one
because of that risk, that's absolutely fine. but don't extend that one
fact into _supposition_ about there not being any difference in ride
quality because it's simply not true!

looking back through the archives, man, you've had some real doozies of
arguments with people who've apparently had valuable contributions to
make, yet because you've stuck your neck out in defense of whatever
position you've taken, you just keep savaging them till they go away -
regardless of their worth. and a lot of them don't return. this forum
is sadly impoverished by that in my opinion. unfortunately, you seem to
take their departure as vindication and confirmation of your
"correctness" and you therefore continue to fling odure at whoever comes
along next and simply repeat the whole ghastly business all over again.

suggestion: let's just get along. not every innovation is a personal
affront. manufacturers are not /all/ out to rip us off. someone
pointing out a contrary argument is not necessarily a /personal/ attack
requiring a "death or glory" defense. just take it easy. share the
wisdom [& facts] you /do/ have and enjoy the learning of what you don't.

jb

Jim Beam- suggestion: let's just get along. not every innovation is a
personal
affront. manufacturers are not /all/ out to rip us off. BRBR

Lots snipped. Another suggestion, let's try to remember this is about bicycles,
after-all. Just fun, nothing more. Not heart lung machines or fire fighting
equipment or something...

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

(Art Harris) wrote in message . com...
jim beam wrote:
why do people do it?

I don't know. Why do you use different names in every ng you post to?

Are you basing that on his email address, ? That's the
Federal Trade Commission's address for unsolicited commercial email. I
suspect that "jim beam" is trying to punish spammers who harvest
addresses from newsgroups. He's probably not the only one to use that
tactic. So it may be unfair to accuse him of using aliases.

"Qui si parla Campagnolo" wrote in message
...
Jim Beam- suggestion: let's just get along. not every innovation is a
personal
affront. manufacturers are not /all/ out to rip us off. BRBR

Lots snipped. Another suggestion, let's try to remember this is about
bicycles,
after-all. Just fun, nothing more. Not heart lung machines or fire
fighting
equipment or something...

That's it -- you're out of the group!

Bill "just fun our asses" S.

Never been pregnant, don't want to be....

Peter Chisholm

This is a Good Thing - we'd have a heck of a job finding a volunteer
to get you that way...

Peter "never miss a cheap shot" Headland

In article ,
(Jeff Wills) wrote:

"swamprun" wrote in message
. ..
I have noticed the same thing. The recumbent riders seem to have
an almost religious zeal for their machines, but few facts about
riding them.


Well, yes... in many cases, switching to recumbent bike allows a
dedicated rider to continue riding a bicycle for many years after
the pain of upright riding precludes further cycling. Whether that
pain is caused by maladjustment of the bicycle or improper
equipment choices is a subject worthy of a college course, not a
usenet posting.

You write this as though "the pain" is an inevitable consequence of
riding s standard bicycle. Frankly, for rides under about 100 miles,
I think that if you have pain there is something wrong. It may be
something wrong with equipment selection, adjustment, fit or it may be
something wrong with the rider (fitness, preparedness, medical
problem, etc). In almost all cases, "the pain" is likely to be a
correctible problem.

In my observations, one of the greatest causes of "the pain" in riding
a standard bike is 50 year old potbellied men trying to ride in Chris
Boardman's position on a bike 4 sizes too small, sold to them by the
22 year old Cat 1 racer working part-time at the bike shop so he can
buy parts cheap.

I know one person who switched to a recumbent because of neck problems
(herniated disk). His neck only hurts and his hands only go numb when
he hyperextends his neck, so he switched to a recumbent and has had
not further problems. However, he noted that there's still butt
discomfort- it's just different than the discomfort sometimes
associated with traditional bike saddles.

In article ,
jim beam wrote:

i particularly like the houses of bricks, sticks & straw analogy.
on the east coast of course, bricks are fine. here on the west,
bricks are a no-no because of seismic activity, so we build from
sticks. and in the europe, there are houses with straw roofs, so
that is an excellent illustration of something being unacceptable
to one person but the only way forward for another.

Check out straw bale houses, an increasingly popular building
technique.

In article ,
jim beam wrote:

We have plenty of folks here who do not BS, qualify their
comments and show evidence to substantiate their claims.

jobst, i got to hand it to you - you have the biggest brass gonads
i've ever seen. how you can make a statement like that, suggesting
by implication of course that /you/ just happen to be a shining
example of this exemplary behavior, just amazes me. how do you do
it?

snip

Nice call, David.

On Fri, 05 Sep 2003 08:15:32 -0400, swamprun wrote:
Alas, recumbent zealots don't seem to understand how to discuss the topic
of velocity in objective terms. Perhaps they have something to hide.

It seems to me that they sometimes have more fun.

That's as valid as increased speed, though they
ought to just say it that way...

--
Rick Onanian