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#21
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Zefal Deluxe LED Light, 180 Lumens, Spot/Flood Zoom, Two-Axis Mount. $21.96, includes tail light.
Joerg wrote:
On 2015-03-09 11:31 AM, sms wrote: On 3/9/2015 11:26 AM, Joerg wrote: With the chains I am rather religious in caring and cleaning. On the road bike it gets cleaned and lubed every 150mi. On the MTB every 30-50mi, depending on turf and weather conditions. I am using White Lightning Epic Ride as lube. A friend just sprays motorcycle chain lube on his chains and says it's great stuff but I don't know about that. The best lubricant I've found is the motorcycle chain lube. It's not the lube as much as it is the mechanics of how it goes on. Ok, you are the 2nd person saying that. Maybe I should switch when my 8oz bottle of Epic Ride is gone. The chain of my friend who uses motorcycle lube is kind of noisy though. As Sheldon wrote: "The problem with lubricating conventional chains is that thick lubricants can't penetrate into the inaccessible crannies where they are really needed, but thin lubricants don't last long enough. There is a family of popular chain lubricants that deal with this by mixing a thick oil-type lubricant with a volatile solvent. The resulting mix is thin enough to get some penetration by capillary action, then the solvent evaporates and leaves the thick oil behind. This type of lube is easy to apply, and is very popular for that reason." A great many people do a really good job of lubricating the outside of their chain but not the pins and rollers. Similarly, the hot wax method gets into the pins and rollers but lasts only an extremely short time because it isn't mobile. You also have people cleaning their chain with water-based solutions. This is okay as long as you're certain to get all the water out from between the pins and rollers which is difficult to do unless you heat the chain or wait a long time. You really want to use a petroleum based solvent like kerosene. I don't use any solvent but clean it mechanically. Knife, watchmaker screwdriver's blade, toothbrush and cloth. A good cleaning can take 20-30 minutes but then the chain is really shiny. The Epic Ride oil is a combination of a very thin oil and wax. You have to shake it to make the wax dissolve evenly. The oil runs into everything and then the wax coats the outside. It's almost like the chain drinks the oil part. I apply it using a Q-tip which avoids run-off and results in an equal lube along the whole chain. Many MTB riders out here told me they never even get close to 1000mi on a chain. Wow, I get that kind of a mileage without doing all that. Just hose the chain down, get it dry and relube. Only after a wet muddy ride of coarse but that is almost every ride on my ATB. -- Lou |
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#22
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Zefal Deluxe LED Light, 180 Lumens, Spot/Flood Zoom, Two-AxisMount. $21.96, includes tail light.
Nuts to "religious chain cleaning". My current KMC X8.93 has 3500km on it and has never been cleaned. Not once. Nor has it ever been oiled or greased or sprayed or whatever. It has had zero nil nada maintenance. After 3500km it still runs on the factory lube. It shows no visible evidence of wear. I expect it, perhaps, to start showing signs of wear at around 4500km (the previous KMC X8 made 4506km before being replaced when I fitted a new crankset). See http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/...p?topic=6813.0 for how I managed this extraordinary feat.
Andre Jute On Monday, March 9, 2015 at 6:58:51 PM UTC, Joerg wrote: On 2015-03-09 11:31 AM, sms wrote: On 3/9/2015 11:26 AM, Joerg wrote: With the chains I am rather religious in caring and cleaning. On the road bike it gets cleaned and lubed every 150mi. On the MTB every 30-50mi, depending on turf and weather conditions. I am using White Lightning Epic Ride as lube. A friend just sprays motorcycle chain lube on his chains and says it's great stuff but I don't know about that. The best lubricant I've found is the motorcycle chain lube. It's not the lube as much as it is the mechanics of how it goes on. Ok, you are the 2nd person saying that. Maybe I should switch when my 8oz bottle of Epic Ride is gone. The chain of my friend who uses motorcycle lube is kind of noisy though. As Sheldon wrote: "The problem with lubricating conventional chains is that thick lubricants can't penetrate into the inaccessible crannies where they are really needed, but thin lubricants don't last long enough. There is a family of popular chain lubricants that deal with this by mixing a thick oil-type lubricant with a volatile solvent. The resulting mix is thin enough to get some penetration by capillary action, then the solvent evaporates and leaves the thick oil behind. This type of lube is easy to apply, and is very popular for that reason." A great many people do a really good job of lubricating the outside of their chain but not the pins and rollers. Similarly, the hot wax method gets into the pins and rollers but lasts only an extremely short time because it isn't mobile. You also have people cleaning their chain with water-based solutions. This is okay as long as you're certain to get all the water out from between the pins and rollers which is difficult to do unless you heat the chain or wait a long time. You really want to use a petroleum based solvent like kerosene. I don't use any solvent but clean it mechanically. Knife, watchmaker screwdriver's blade, toothbrush and cloth. A good cleaning can take 20-30 minutes but then the chain is really shiny. The Epic Ride oil is a combination of a very thin oil and wax. You have to shake it to make the wax dissolve evenly. The oil runs into everything and then the wax coats the outside. It's almost like the chain drinks the oil part. I apply it using a Q-tip which avoids run-off and results in an equal lube along the whole chain. Many MTB riders out here told me they never even get close to 1000mi on a chain. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#23
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Zefal Deluxe LED Light, 180 Lumens, Spot/Flood Zoom, Two-AxisMount. $21.96, includes tail light.
On Monday, March 9, 2015 at 7:42:20 PM UTC, jbeattie wrote:
I'm also suing Lance Armstrong because I thought he was clean. I can just see it: ATTORNEY: Such dishonesty should not be allowed. JUDGE: Shhh! You're in a courtroom, counsellor, a meeting place for attorneys. We do not discuss honesty. Andre Jute |
#24
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Zefal Deluxe LED Light, 180 Lumens, Spot/Flood Zoom, Two-AxisMount. $21.96, includes tail light.
On 2015-03-09 12:55 PM, Lou Holtman wrote:
Joerg wrote: On 2015-03-09 11:31 AM, sms wrote: On 3/9/2015 11:26 AM, Joerg wrote: With the chains I am rather religious in caring and cleaning. On the road bike it gets cleaned and lubed every 150mi. On the MTB every 30-50mi, depending on turf and weather conditions. I am using White Lightning Epic Ride as lube. A friend just sprays motorcycle chain lube on his chains and says it's great stuff but I don't know about that. The best lubricant I've found is the motorcycle chain lube. It's not the lube as much as it is the mechanics of how it goes on. Ok, you are the 2nd person saying that. Maybe I should switch when my 8oz bottle of Epic Ride is gone. The chain of my friend who uses motorcycle lube is kind of noisy though. As Sheldon wrote: "The problem with lubricating conventional chains is that thick lubricants can't penetrate into the inaccessible crannies where they are really needed, but thin lubricants don't last long enough. There is a family of popular chain lubricants that deal with this by mixing a thick oil-type lubricant with a volatile solvent. The resulting mix is thin enough to get some penetration by capillary action, then the solvent evaporates and leaves the thick oil behind. This type of lube is easy to apply, and is very popular for that reason." A great many people do a really good job of lubricating the outside of their chain but not the pins and rollers. Similarly, the hot wax method gets into the pins and rollers but lasts only an extremely short time because it isn't mobile. You also have people cleaning their chain with water-based solutions. This is okay as long as you're certain to get all the water out from between the pins and rollers which is difficult to do unless you heat the chain or wait a long time. You really want to use a petroleum based solvent like kerosene. I don't use any solvent but clean it mechanically. Knife, watchmaker screwdriver's blade, toothbrush and cloth. A good cleaning can take 20-30 minutes but then the chain is really shiny. The Epic Ride oil is a combination of a very thin oil and wax. You have to shake it to make the wax dissolve evenly. The oil runs into everything and then the wax coats the outside. It's almost like the chain drinks the oil part. I apply it using a Q-tip which avoids run-off and results in an equal lube along the whole chain. Many MTB riders out here told me they never even get close to 1000mi on a chain. Wow, I get that kind of a mileage without doing all that. Just hose the chain down, get it dry and relube. Only after a wet muddy ride of coarse but that is almost every ride on my ATB. What gets us here is the summer. Then all the trail dirt morphs into a dust cone of fine powder, courtesy of the front wheel. A freshly oiled chain is brown within less than a mile. It's so bad that you have to keep 100-200ft distance from the next rider to avoid his dust plume. Also, hosing and compressor-blowing with all the spattering this causes would not find favor with my missus. And not with the authorities since we aren't allowed to hose off anything on account of the drought. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#25
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Zefal Deluxe LED Light, 180 Lumens, Spot/Flood Zoom, Two-AxisMount. $21.96, includes tail light.
On 2015-03-09 1:20 PM, Andre Jute wrote:
Nuts to "religious chain cleaning". My current KMC X8.93 has 3500km on it and has never been cleaned. Not once. Nor has it ever been oiled or greased or sprayed or whatever. It has had zero nil nada maintenance. After 3500km it still runs on the factory lube. It shows no visible evidence of wear. I expect it, perhaps, to start showing signs of wear at around 4500km (the previous KMC X8 made 4506km before being replaced when I fitted a new crankset). See http://www.thorncycles.co.uk/forums/...p?topic=6813.0 for how I managed this extraordinary feat. Ya well, not everyone has a Rohloff gear box. With the classic derailers this does not work. At least not out he http://www.analogconsultants.com/ng/bike/CoachLane1.JPG "Hey, where's Johnny?" ... "See that plume over yonder? He's about half a mile behind us". The KMC factory lube lasts about 200 miles, then the chain begins to scream for maintenance. Regards, Joerg -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#26
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Zefal Deluxe LED Light, 180 Lumens, Spot/Flood Zoom, Two-Axis Mount. $21.96, includes tail light.
Lou Holtman wrote:
jbeattie wrote: On Monday, March 9, 2015 at 10:42:23 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote: On 2015-03-09 16:43:59 +0000, jbeattie said: On Monday, March 9, 2015 at 9:09:34 AM UTC-7, sms wrote: On 3/9/2015 7:57 AM, Joerg wrote: Don't know about lights but when it comes to hydration packs Zefal makes good stuff. I've got one and it's been through a lot. The worst was when a Manzanita branch caught a loop in the pack and yanked my clear off the MTB. I was pretty banged up but the Zefal pack didn't suffer at all, despite rolling a few times with me attached to it. And let's not forget the legendary Zefal pumps. I still have two, and have a good story about Zefal pumps. Decades ago, my friend was on a century ride in the east Bay (Pleasanton) and was going through the top of a T intersection, on the shoulder. Yeah, she should have stopped for the red light, but there no cross traffic possible on the top of the T. She got a ticket and was not very cooperative. She said nothing when the cop asked her for the make and model of her bicycle. He inspected the bicycle and wrote down "10 speed Zefal." Prima Vera? I rode my first one 38 years ago. God, I'm old. So, I have a question: why is the run time at full output so long on the Zefal. It's 20/40/60 (high, low, flash). The Planet Bike light, which has about the same output but is USB rechargeable is 2 hours on high, 4 hours on low and up to 25 hours on flashing. Is it because the Zefal is spec'd with throw-away batteries. What would be the run-time with rechargeable batteries? -- Jay Beattie. Because they probably don't tell the truth. Never trust runtimes mentioned. I'm going to buy one of those lights, turn it on, let it run out in four or five hours and then sue. I'll bring a huge class-action on behalf of purchasers who thought they could ride for 20 hours on high beam. Think of all the deceived people stuck in the dark. I'm also suing Lance Armstrong because I thought he was clean. -- Jay Beattie. You don't have to do that, just use common sense. I think Jay is being sarcastic. Being a lawyer though I don't know, maybe he's channeling Conan Doyle's Frankland from HOTB. Though I hear I can get some bucks from a class action suit for buying price fixed dram -2002. Unfortunately I didn't buy any because the prices were outrageous. Lol. -- duane |
#27
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Zefal Deluxe LED Light, 180 Lumens, Spot/Flood Zoom, Two-AxisMount. $21.96, includes tail light.
On Monday, March 9, 2015 at 3:07:46 PM UTC-7, Duane wrote:
Lou Holtman wrote: jbeattie wrote: On Monday, March 9, 2015 at 10:42:23 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote: On 2015-03-09 16:43:59 +0000, jbeattie said: On Monday, March 9, 2015 at 9:09:34 AM UTC-7, sms wrote: On 3/9/2015 7:57 AM, Joerg wrote: Don't know about lights but when it comes to hydration packs Zefal makes good stuff. I've got one and it's been through a lot. The worst was when a Manzanita branch caught a loop in the pack and yanked my clear off the MTB. I was pretty banged up but the Zefal pack didn't suffer at all, despite rolling a few times with me attached to it. And let's not forget the legendary Zefal pumps. I still have two, and have a good story about Zefal pumps. Decades ago, my friend was on a century ride in the east Bay (Pleasanton) and was going through the top of a T intersection, on the shoulder. Yeah, she should have stopped for the red light, but there no cross traffic possible on the top of the T. She got a ticket and was not very cooperative. She said nothing when the cop asked her for the make and model of her bicycle. He inspected the bicycle and wrote down "10 speed Zefal." Prima Vera? I rode my first one 38 years ago. God, I'm old. So, I have a question: why is the run time at full output so long on the Zefal. It's 20/40/60 (high, low, flash). The Planet Bike light, which has about the same output but is USB rechargeable is 2 hours on high, 4 hours on low and up to 25 hours on flashing. Is it because the Zefal is spec'd with throw-away batteries. What would be the run-time with rechargeable batteries? -- Jay Beattie. Because they probably don't tell the truth. Never trust runtimes mentioned. I'm going to buy one of those lights, turn it on, let it run out in four or five hours and then sue. I'll bring a huge class-action on behalf of purchasers who thought they could ride for 20 hours on high beam. Think of all the deceived people stuck in the dark. I'm also suing Lance Armstrong because I thought he was clean. -- Jay Beattie. You don't have to do that, just use common sense. I think Jay is being sarcastic. Being a lawyer though I don't know, maybe he's channeling Conan Doyle's Frankland from HOTB. Though I hear I can get some bucks from a class action suit for buying price fixed dram -2002. Unfortunately I didn't buy any because the prices were outrageous. Lol. Yes, I was kidding. Class action humor often escapes the continentals. It's not that funny over here, either, except for the endless, tiny checks and coupons that I receive in settlement of class actions. I got a check for something like $.49 once. I don't even remember what the case was about. Maybe my Rice Krispies snapped, crackled, but didn't pop, or I bought 87 octane gas that was really 86.5. Who knows. -- Jay Beattie. |
#28
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Zefal Deluxe LED Light, 180 Lumens, Spot/Flood Zoom, Two-AxisMount. $21.96, includes tail light.
On 2015-03-09 3:24 PM, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, March 9, 2015 at 3:07:46 PM UTC-7, Duane wrote: Lou Holtman wrote: jbeattie wrote: On Monday, March 9, 2015 at 10:42:23 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote: On 2015-03-09 16:43:59 +0000, jbeattie said: On Monday, March 9, 2015 at 9:09:34 AM UTC-7, sms wrote: On 3/9/2015 7:57 AM, Joerg wrote: Don't know about lights but when it comes to hydration packs Zefal makes good stuff. I've got one and it's been through a lot. The worst was when a Manzanita branch caught a loop in the pack and yanked my clear off the MTB. I was pretty banged up but the Zefal pack didn't suffer at all, despite rolling a few times with me attached to it. And let's not forget the legendary Zefal pumps. I still have two, and have a good story about Zefal pumps. Decades ago, my friend was on a century ride in the east Bay (Pleasanton) and was going through the top of a T intersection, on the shoulder. Yeah, she should have stopped for the red light, but there no cross traffic possible on the top of the T. She got a ticket and was not very cooperative. She said nothing when the cop asked her for the make and model of her bicycle. He inspected the bicycle and wrote down "10 speed Zefal." Prima Vera? I rode my first one 38 years ago. God, I'm old. So, I have a question: why is the run time at full output so long on the Zefal. It's 20/40/60 (high, low, flash). The Planet Bike light, which has about the same output but is USB rechargeable is 2 hours on high, 4 hours on low and up to 25 hours on flashing. Is it because the Zefal is spec'd with throw-away batteries. What would be the run-time with rechargeable batteries? -- Jay Beattie. Because they probably don't tell the truth. Never trust runtimes mentioned. I'm going to buy one of those lights, turn it on, let it run out in four or five hours and then sue. I'll bring a huge class-action on behalf of purchasers who thought they could ride for 20 hours on high beam. Think of all the deceived people stuck in the dark. I'm also suing Lance Armstrong because I thought he was clean. -- Jay Beattie. You don't have to do that, just use common sense. I think Jay is being sarcastic. Being a lawyer though I don't know, maybe he's channeling Conan Doyle's Frankland from HOTB. Though I hear I can get some bucks from a class action suit for buying price fixed dram -2002. Unfortunately I didn't buy any because the prices were outrageous. Lol. Yes, I was kidding. Class action humor often escapes the continentals. It's not that funny over here, either, except for the endless, tiny checks and coupons that I receive in settlement of class actions. I got a check for something like $.49 once. I don't even remember what the case was about. Maybe my Rice Krispies snapped, crackled, but didn't pop, or I bought 87 octane gas that was really 86.5. Who knows. Or worse: I received a few measly Dollars class action refund because the promised Internet speed was far from true for a long time. Promptly the ISP raised the price by $3 or so, per month! A little research showed that the lawyers made a huge amount of dough and now we all pay for that. Great. It's the same when a utility gets "punished" for whatever. In the end the ratepayers get socked because of that. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
#29
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Zefal Deluxe LED Light, 180 Lumens, Spot/Flood Zoom, Two-AxisMount. $21.96, includes tail light.
I thought he was clean.
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#30
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Zefal Deluxe LED Light, 180 Lumens, Spot/Flood Zoom, Two-AxisMount. $21.96, includes tail light.
On 3/9/2015 6:24 PM, jbeattie wrote:
Yes, I was kidding. Class action humor often escapes the continentals. It's not that funny over here, either, except for the endless, tiny checks and coupons that I receive in settlement of class actions. I got a check for something like $.49 once. I don't even remember what the case was about. Maybe my Rice Krispies snapped, crackled, but didn't pop, or I bought 87 octane gas that was really 86.5. Who knows. I was once told the explanation for that is that the lawyers get their 30+% fee out of the total; but since there are sometimes hundreds of thousands on the "class" that's making the "action suit," each beneficiary gets very little. IOW, the lawyers do very well and so justice is served - sort of. Is that true? -- - Frank Krygowski |
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