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Stronger rubber cement?



 
 
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  #181  
Old January 18th 17, 08:51 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
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Posts: 10,538
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On 1/17/2017 8:54 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Wed, 18 Jan 2017 07:55:12 +1100, James
wrote:

Why not put some of Stans goop in the inner tubes and seal them from the
inside?


http://www.notubes.com
http://www.notubes.com/Sealant-C14.aspx
http://www.notubes.com/help/tubelessexplainedanddemystified.aspx
Kinda looks like it's made to allow mountain bikes to run without any
tubes by filling the tires with I suspect is expanding urethane foam.


I don't think so. I think the tires are still filled with air, but that
the sealant is a sort of clotting liquid that automatically plugs any
small holes, much like blood clots.

My question: If a person is running tubeless and gets a flat far from
home - say, if a large piece of glass produces a 1/4" slash - what's the
technique for getting home? Do you install a standard tube, perhaps
with a tire boot?

--
- Frank Krygowski
Ads
  #182  
Old January 18th 17, 09:01 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
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Posts: 10,538
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On 1/18/2017 1:29 PM, wrote:
On Tuesday, January 17, 2017 at 8:10:41 PM UTC-6, John B. wrote:
I have a set of wheels with sew ups somewhere. I last used them maybe
40 years ago. I've never raced, so sew ups offer no benefits to me. I
wonder if they still will hold air?


When you have a flat they are much faster to fix. Just rip the flat
off the rim and stick on another from the collection you have strapped
under the seat :-)

John B.


Have you ever fixed a tubular on the side of the road? Or even in the shop at home? No one just rips off the flat tubular and quickly sticks the new one on the rim. Does not happen that way in the real world. Maybe in fantasy land. Tubulars are glued on very well. It takes a lot of pulling and prying to get a little bit of the tire off the rim. Then a lot of strength to slowly pull the rest of the tire off the rim. Several minutes of work or more. Then to put the new one on, you better pray it is well stretched on an old rim. You start at one side and slowly work it onto the rim with old glue. Slowly pulling it on. Then the last few inches you strain and stress until maybe hopefully you get it on. Then you spend several more minutes trying to get the tire somewhat straight on the rim. The old glue does not allow the tire to be moved very easily. Keep living in your fantasy world.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYwfMlEGWlA

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #183  
Old January 18th 17, 09:09 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
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Posts: 10,538
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On 1/17/2017 9:07 PM, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 17 Jan 2017 06:48:12 -0800 (PST), jbeattie
wrote:


Tubulars are still the last word in bicycle tires and what the pros ride, but they have

professional support staff who are physically fit and skilled in the
complex operation of floor pumps and other precision machinery. Most
of us do not have the intelligence or fitness necessary to operate a
floor pump -- and certainly not on a daily basis. My wife and I have
more robust tires on our bike that we have professionally pumped once
a year.
http://www.loupiote.com/photos_m/796...re-bicycle.jpg

-- Jay Beattie.


Gee, the U.S. must be a real "Alice" country. Professional tire
pumpers :-)


Of course! See 0:47 in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vn29DvMITu4

You don't have these ladies where you live? Sad!

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #184  
Old January 18th 17, 09:11 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
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Posts: 13,447
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On 1/18/2017 11:33 AM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-18 09:18, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, January 18, 2017 at 7:36:44 AM UTC-8, Joerg
wrote:
On 2017-01-17 15:26, DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH wrote:
analog,

I will not explain tire mounting again. Retard at your
own speed


I have explained to you that these are _flat_ rims. Hard to
understand?


The Argent rim is just a Mod E2. Right?



Mine are Mavic Module “3” Argent “D”. Almost flat
inside.


http://equusbicycle.com/bike/mavic/images/11and12.jpg Pretty
standard rim of the era. Get VAR lever. It lifts the bead
over the
rim. Your problems will be solved. Getting another tire
or rim will
also solve your problems. Most people will not wrestle
with a tire
for a half-an-hour, at least not more than once.


I have broken many high quality levers on those and bike
shop owners have confirmed that issue. When they say "Good
luck getting them on" you know what you are up to.

The thick tubes I have do not exactly help in keeping the
bead towards the center but I made myself Delrin pieces to
do that. The relief that this provides is very limited
though, as evidenced by the fact that even with thin tubes
Gatorskins are really hard to mount onto these rims.

Fact is, the Vredestein tires always went on with ease and
the Gatorskin tires do not. Huge difference. However, the
Vredesteins had too many flats. So, I am looking for a tire
that is very puncture-resistant, has sturdy side walls _and_
is easy to mount. Eventually I will find one and then buy a
stack of them. Just like I did for the MTB where I found
three brands that work well.


That's a known deficient design with hardly any drop between
the bead seats and the center well. Not only those Mavic,
but Trek copied it for some all-time-lousy rims under their
Bontrager brand. Very hard to mount/remove tires; Joerg is
not making that up.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #185  
Old January 18th 17, 09:47 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 3,345
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On Wednesday, January 18, 2017 at 11:31:55 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 1/17/2017 1:56 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-17 10:36, jbeattie wrote:


So what your saying is that I pay nothing extra insurance-wise for
owning a bike. It is covered by insurance that I already own. (:
OTOH, there are whole other things called "auto insurance policies"
-- specially for autos! And they cost a lot! ):


That is the same as saying that welfare costs us nothing. _Everyone_ is
paying for the risk of cycling including home owners who never ride. Is
that fair? I don't think so but that's the way it is.


Oh, quit the bull**** about the "risks of cycling." There have been at
least five different studies on the risks vs. benefits of cycling,
measured in different ways - for example, health care dollars spent vs.
saved, years of life lost vs. gained, etc. EVERY study found that
cycling is by FAR a net benefit.

So in insurance terms, you've got things backwards. _Everyone_ is
getting reduced insurance premiums and reduced health care costs from
cycling, even the people who never ride.

IOW, quit the "Danger! Danger!" implications. You may ride like an
idiot, but even you don't tip the scales in the direction you claim.


--
- Frank Krygowski


Aren't you the one telling us that the study that showed Hillary 14 points in the lead was accurate and my reference to a site that broke down these polls and said that they were so biased that they were useless was nothing more than BS?

Like those polls ANY "study" of US bicycle use is less than worthless since the numbers of serious cyclists are so low that you cannot make competent statistical analysis of them. And a real engineer would know that.
  #186  
Old January 18th 17, 09:53 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 3,345
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On Wednesday, January 18, 2017 at 7:51:06 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-17 20:21, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 17 Jan 2017 07:43:37 -0800, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-01-16 18:04, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 17:11:50 -0800, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-01-16 16:50, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 10:16:51 -0800, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-01-05 02:04, Tosspot wrote:
On 04/01/17 20:05, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-03 17:04, Joerg wrote:
Gentlemen,

Is there something stronger than the usual rubber cement in the patch
kits? Ideally something that won't dry out so fast or where multiple
cheap small tubes are available.

The reason is that I sometimes have larger holes from side wall
blow-outs. Not inch-long gashes but one or two tenths of an inch long.
The tubes I use are super thick and, therefore, expensive. $15-20 each
and that's not something to be thrown out lightly. Instead of the li'l
REMA patches I need to use thicker rubber from an older sacrified tube
but this has to be vulcanized/cemented really well.


Thanks to all responders (also Barry and Doug). I'll order Slime Rubber
Cement with my next Amazon shipment because that's what David uses, he
says it works well and it isn't expensive:

https://www.amazon.com/Slime-1050-Ru.../dp/B003V9UU66

Whatwhat!! Are you *seriously* claiming r.b.t has been useful!? What
ever is the world coming to?


Usenet is very useful, I guess that's where the name comes from. A lot
of hints here go into my bicycle files, in the sense of "If ... ever
breaks consider replacing it with ..." or "If it breaks don't ever use ...".

When I mentioned in a post in a newsgroup that I had bonked, want to
avoid it but can't stand the cyclist astronaut food or any sweet stuff
someone responded with a link to a recipe for homemade non-sweet power
bars. My wife bakes them to this day. Yesterday I shared these bars with
another rider who really likes them as well. Can't buy them anywhere.


Out of curiosity, is your wife's recipe actually free of sugar, in any
form, or it just doesn't taste sweet?


It has a pinch of sugar for some reason, not sure if that can be left
out or replaced with something else. You can't taste it though. While
they also mention just a pinch of salt we add several pinches because in
summer one sweats out a lot of salt here.

Got it only in German but if really interested I could translate it:

http://www.chefkoch.de/rezepte/14555...liriegel..html

It's a little more work than it looks like, with the bacon and all that,
and cutting into bars at the end so they can be packed on a bicycle. My
wife puts all of them into the freezer and then moves as many as needed
to the fridge a couple days before rides.

That looks like a recipe for some sort of Oatmeal cookies with bacon,
rather than the usual "power Bar" concept, which is usually something
that your body can get a quick bunch of energy from to replace what
you have lost.


I make sure I eat them during a scheduled break at some nice and scenic
area, not after I begin to feel a hard bonk coming up. The latter is a
mistake I only made once and don't want to experience that again. These
bar get me through the rides quite nicely. Usually 40-45 miles,
partially under a lot of power.


The difference is usually in how fast your body converts carbohydrates
to energy. Simple carbohydrates, essentially sugars, are converted
rapidly and complex carbohydrates like starches are converted much
slower. Which is, of course, why all the energy drinks contain
dextrose or sucrose or some other simple carbs.


This is why I carry dextrose tablets in my first aid kit. So far I never
needed one of those myself but others did.


Back when I was running I "bonked" or may better, "crashed and
burned". I reached the point where even after sitting down and resting
for a while I physically could not run any longer. I would sit down
and rest until I felt better and set off again and within 100 yards,
or less, wouldn't be able to run any more.



That is exactly how one MTB ride ended for me. I still had to ride about
10 miles home and did. Unfortunately mostly uphill. Those 10 miles took
me about two hours and several times I had the urge to just plop myself
into the grass and sleep. Luckily I was riding with a friend who made
sure I didn't do that. Early on he gave me a liquid energy pack but it
didn't help at all. I guess once you are in the bonk it's too late.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/


Jeorg, perhaps you like your present road bike or cannot afford another but otherwise I do not see why you don't get a cyclocross bike. I have two and enough room between the stays and fork to mount 32 mm tires. Since these are little more than standard road bikes with more room between the stays you can set them up for anything from hard off-road to street.

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/5960735902.html
  #187  
Old January 18th 17, 10:04 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sir Ridesalot
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Posts: 5,270
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On Wednesday, January 18, 2017 at 12:18:18 PM UTC-5, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, January 18, 2017 at 7:36:44 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-17 15:26, DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH wrote:
analog,

I will not explain tire mounting again. Retard at your own speed


I have explained to you that these are _flat_ rims. Hard to understand?


The Argent rim is just a Mod E2. Right? http://equusbicycle.com/bike/mavic/images/11and12.jpg Pretty standard rim of the era. Get VAR lever. It lifts the bead over the rim. Your problems will be solved. Getting another tire or rim will also solve your problems. Most people will not wrestle with a tire for a half-an-hour, at least not more than once.

-- Jay Beattie.


Especially if they ride where stopping for long could cause them to become dinner for a mountain lion.

Cheers
  #188  
Old January 18th 17, 10:15 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Sir Ridesalot
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Posts: 5,270
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On Wednesday, January 18, 2017 at 3:01:46 PM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 1/18/2017 1:29 PM, wrote:
On Tuesday, January 17, 2017 at 8:10:41 PM UTC-6, John B. wrote:
I have a set of wheels with sew ups somewhere. I last used them maybe
40 years ago. I've never raced, so sew ups offer no benefits to me. I
wonder if they still will hold air?


When you have a flat they are much faster to fix. Just rip the flat
off the rim and stick on another from the collection you have strapped
under the seat :-)

John B.


Have you ever fixed a tubular on the side of the road? Or even in the shop at home? No one just rips off the flat tubular and quickly sticks the new one on the rim. Does not happen that way in the real world. Maybe in fantasy land. Tubulars are glued on very well. It takes a lot of pulling and prying to get a little bit of the tire off the rim. Then a lot of strength to slowly pull the rest of the tire off the rim. Several minutes of work or more. Then to put the new one on, you better pray it is well stretched on an old rim. You start at one side and slowly work it onto the rim with old glue. Slowly pulling it on. Then the last few inches you strain and stress until maybe hopefully you get it on. Then you spend several more minutes trying to get the tire somewhat straight on the rim. The old glue does not allow the tire to be moved very easily. Keep living in your fantasy world.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYwfMlEGWlA

--
- Frank Krygowski


I can change the tube in my clincher tire in less time than he changed the tire on that rim (not counting the time he stopped to explain) and when pumped up I don't have to worry aboutthe tire rolling off the rim in a hard turn like you do with an unglued tubular.

The great thing about being able to change a tube on a clincher tire is that when it's done you have the SAME ability to ride the bike as you did when you left for the ride.

Cheers
  #189  
Old January 18th 17, 10:19 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Doug Landau
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Posts: 1,424
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On Wednesday, January 18, 2017 at 1:04:40 PM UTC-8, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Wednesday, January 18, 2017 at 12:18:18 PM UTC-5, jbeattie wrote:
On Wednesday, January 18, 2017 at 7:36:44 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-17 15:26, DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH wrote:
analog,

I will not explain tire mounting again. Retard at your own speed


I have explained to you that these are _flat_ rims. Hard to understand?


The Argent rim is just a Mod E2. Right? http://equusbicycle.com/bike/mavic/images/11and12.jpg Pretty standard rim of the era. Get VAR lever. It lifts the bead over the rim. Your problems will be solved. Getting another tire or rim will also solve your problems. Most people will not wrestle with a tire for a half-an-hour, at least not more than once.

-- Jay Beattie.


Especially if they ride where stopping for long could cause them to become dinner for a mountain lion.

Cheers


I was stalked by a mountain lion in fort ord, monterey bay, ca, while riding my recumbent at dusk. He walked circles around me and glared at me. I say ride a wedgie in lion country.
  #190  
Old January 18th 17, 10:37 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Doug Landau
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Posts: 1,424
Default Stronger rubber cement?

On Wednesday, January 18, 2017 at 7:36:08 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-17 11:36, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, January 17, 2017 at 10:56:13 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-17 10:36, jbeattie wrote:
On Tuesday, January 17, 2017 at 9:47:32 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-17 08:21, jbeattie wrote:


[...]


What I pay in car insurance annually would buy me an all new
bike every year. Skip cleaning the chain -- just put last
year's bike out with the garbage. Plus, my bikes are
reliable. I reliably change the chain when the wear
indicator indicates and change the tires when they are worn
out. I fix a flat now and then and do other routine
maintenance. It's not like some monumental inconvenience, and
if flats were epidemic, then I would switch to a hard-case
tire. I would not agonize over the fact that the 20lb tire
on my Subaru goes flat less often.


My point is that when I say I am going to be there for an
important meeting at 11:30am I don't want to leave half an
hour earlier just in case I get a flat. And good luck getting
that Gatorksin tire back onto one of my rims.

If it takes you half an hour to fix a flat, you have other
problems that need to be addressed.


Yeah, I could get new rims and/or different tires. That is why
finding a suitable tire isn't easy. You are welcome to come over
and try getting a Gatorskin onto my rims.


Dude, I was mounting first generation Turbos on E2s rims using my
bare thumbs, but when I could no longer stand the pain, I got a VAR
tool and packed that. http://tinyurl.com/j9ul39s



I've got various sets of really good tire levers. They are of no use
when wrestling the bead over the rim. Try Gatorskins on a flat Mavic
Argent rim. I am by far not the only one and people have used all sorts
of tricks. Problem is, there are no trick, just raw force.


Sounds like you haven't tried motionpros

https://www.motionpro.com/motorcycle...FRKRfgodycsNdw
 




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