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what would you choose?



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 30th 05, 03:13 PM
lowkey
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Default what would you choose?


One route I frequent takes me out Stone Rd. It is a multi-lane east/west
city street that abruptly narrows to a single lane east of Gordon St. as you
pass through, first the university proper, and then the arboretum on the
north side and residential followed by undeveloped land to the south.

At the next major intersection - Victoria Rd. - the street has recently
been rebuilt into a luxurious multi-lane intersection with incredibly wide
bike lanes with nary a storm grate. Those have been built integral to the
curb so that the bike lane is a smooth strip of pristine asphalt almost a
car width wide.

The narrow single lane stretch in-between the multi-lane intersections is
the problem. the lanes are very narrow and quite busy. the should is unpaved
and very broad - easily a kar lane wide. but while the surface is broadly
smooth it has the herringbone texture of heavy equipment tires and treads
making for a vibrating ride. For residential stretch the shoulder abuts on
to a very broad grass strip, followed by a usually deserted sidewalk
followed by more lawn before the residential part begins. They could easily
have 3 more lanes with the space they have.

[The reason it has not been so widened involves a lot of municipal
politics. I don't doubt the entire stretch will eventually be widened but
for now that is the nature of the street.]

Now here is the problem: Driving on the single lane is dicey. I am quite
experience and comfortable riding in traffic but this narrow and busy single
lane makes me nervous. Kars do not give you much space. The shoulder is
ridable on a mtb or sturdy hybrid/utility but I wouldn't want to ride it on
a skinny tire road racer. Even on a full suspension mtb the ride is
unpleasant given the surface texture.

The lawn strip is similarly ridable on an mtb but soft and mushy. It isn't
part of the residential properties so riding it would not be a trespass.

Then there is the sidewalk. As I said it is pretty much deserted since
decent people drive kars to go 100 meters. A good surface, no pedestrians,
no kars....

What would kona do?

-busy dicey narrow single lane asphalt?

-rough broad shoulder

-broad grass strip

-the rarely used sidewalk?




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  #2  
Old September 30th 05, 03:45 PM
Rich
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Default what would you choose?

lowkey wrote:

What would kona do?

-busy dicey narrow single lane asphalt?

-rough broad shoulder

-broad grass strip

-the rarely used sidewalk?


Sidewalk.

Although some will say "take the lane" (which at times I agree with and
do), that would be option 2 in my book, since another empty 3' wide
paved "lane" is available that impeeds noone. Of course, if there were
people on the walk then I'd probably forgo it that day.

Rich

P.S. My "road" bike is an old MTB so I have no experience with going on
and off sidewalks on a real road bike. Maybe it's a bad idea.
  #3  
Old September 30th 05, 04:15 PM
andy gee
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Default what would you choose?

"lowkey" wrote in
:

What would kona do?

-busy dicey narrow single lane asphalt?

-rough broad shoulder

-broad grass strip

-the rarely used sidewalk?


If your bike is physically uncomfortable in the rough, the choice is
between the sidewalk and the narrow road. I face such a choice on the
way between Atlantic Beach and Long Beach; I take the road and everyone
else can pass me, wait for me, or get a bike. I only hop the sidewalk
if a road (not this one, it never gets that jammed) is so crowded that
not even a bike can get through. NYS law allows sidewalk riding except
where prohibited, for example, all of NYC. If you think riding the
sidewalk makes life easier for everyone, do it. If you get nabbed, go
to court with a bunch of 8x10 color glossies with circles and arrows and
a paragraph on the back explaining what each one is. You could get a
precedent allowing the practice.

--ag
  #4  
Old September 30th 05, 05:07 PM
Dave Vandervies
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Default what would you choose?

In article ,
lowkey wrote:

The narrow single lane stretch in-between the multi-lane intersections is
the problem. the lanes are very narrow and quite busy. the should is unpaved
and very broad - easily a kar lane wide. but while the surface is broadly
smooth it has the herringbone texture of heavy equipment tires and treads
making for a vibrating ride. For residential stretch the shoulder abuts on
to a very broad grass strip, followed by a usually deserted sidewalk
followed by more lawn before the residential part begins. They could easily
have 3 more lanes with the space they have.


[...]

Now here is the problem: Driving on the single lane is dicey. I am quite
experience and comfortable riding in traffic but this narrow and busy single
lane makes me nervous. Kars do not give you much space. The shoulder is
ridable on a mtb or sturdy hybrid/utility but I wouldn't want to ride it on
a skinny tire road racer. Even on a full suspension mtb the ride is
unpleasant given the surface texture.



What would kona do?

-busy dicey narrow single lane asphalt?


No idea who/what kona is, but this is the one I'd pick. Take the lane,
if there's no oncoming traffic for a bit move over to let cars behind
you pass, otherwise they can wait.
How long a stretch is it? If it's only from one major intersection to
the next, I'd guess not long. If somebody has a problem with slowing
down to half the normal traffic speed for two or three minutes because
it's not safe to pass a bike, they can take an alternate route. If two
minutes is going to make the difference between being on time and being
late, well, their lack of planning ahead isn't your problem.


dave

--
Dave Vandervies
[i]f I really did not possess a sense of humour at all, then I would not get
*any* jokes on comp.lang.c, would I? I have a distinct memory of getting some
jokes in the last few months. --Joona I Palaste in comp.lang.c
  #5  
Old September 30th 05, 05:18 PM
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Default what would you choose?

lowkey wrote:
snip

What would kona do?

-busy dicey narrow single lane asphalt?

-rough broad shoulder

-broad grass strip

-the rarely used sidewalk?


Depends on the law where you live, and your attitude to it.

Most places, riding on the sidewalk is illegal. It may be safe, it may
be deserted, you may be unlikely to be stopped/fined etc., but it's
probably illegal. I'd guess that the grass strip probably counts as
part of the sidewalk. Do you care about doing somthing illegal (albeit
illegal at a very minor level)? That's up to you.

Likewise, there may or may not be a compulsion on cyclists to use a
cycle lane if one exists. If there is, and you care about such things
(as above), ya gotta use it - unless you can reasonably make a case
that the surface is so bad that it's unsafe, and you're forced to use
the road.

If there's no such compulsion, you are entitled to use the road
regardless of whether the bike lane exists or not. Most places, you
have to ride as close to the kerb as is resonably consistent with
safety. That includes positioning yourself to prevent someone from
overtaking you dangerously. If that means in the middle of the road
lane then that's where you need to be. If others are held up by you
for a few seconds, tough. It's a short stretch, your safety comes
before their inconvenience.

The worst place to be is trapped on the road surface between the kerb
and the passing traffic. Be part of the traffic flow, not an
obstruction to it.
If you need to use the road lane, and you're not legally obliged to be
in bike lane, then take posession of the traffic lane.
Be awake and concious of your surroundings, clear about your
intentions, firm and polite. Look back well in advance, spot your gap,
indicate before you pull out, keep your speed reasonable, indicate back
in, then give a wave of thanks as you pull back in.

I'm not being a zealot. I'm not suggesting that you hold people up
just beacause you can, or that you flick in and out of the traffic flow
on a whim and put yourself in danger. It's not always possible to get
out, or maybe the next guy in the traffic is an a**h**e and accelerates
to block you, or is asleep. There's a million exceptions, but it's
common sense that'll keep you safe. It's also easy for me to preach at
you about what you should be doing, especially from out here in
usenet...

Cyclists who bumble along semi-concious, ride on kerbs, or worse,
against the traffic, break lights etc. give us all a bad name, and
reinforce the idea among cagers that we're not entitled to fair use of
the road, and are just an obstruction to be bypassed as quickly as
possible.

Just my 2c. worth...

bookieb.

  #6  
Old September 30th 05, 05:37 PM
Leo Lichtman
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Default what would you choose?


"andy gee" wrote: (clip) a bunch of 8x10 color glossies with circles and
arrows and a paragraph on the back explaining what each one is. (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
"Thanks for the memory."


  #7  
Old September 30th 05, 05:44 PM
Art Harris
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Default what would you choose?

lowkey wrote:

What would kona do?
-busy dicey narrow single lane asphalt?
-rough broad shoulder
-broad grass strip
-the rarely used sidewalk?


I don't know. I don't live around here.

Art Harris

  #8  
Old September 30th 05, 05:47 PM
Matt O'Toole
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Default what would you choose?

lowkey wrote:

One route I frequent takes me out Stone Rd. It is a multi-lane
east/west city street that abruptly narrows to a single lane east of
Gordon St. as you pass through, first the university proper, and then
the arboretum on the north side and residential followed by
undeveloped land to the south.

At the next major intersection - Victoria Rd. - the street has
recently been rebuilt into a luxurious multi-lane intersection with
incredibly wide bike lanes with nary a storm grate. Those have been
built integral to the curb so that the bike lane is a smooth strip of
pristine asphalt almost a car width wide.

The narrow single lane stretch in-between the multi-lane
intersections is the problem. the lanes are very narrow and quite
busy. the should is unpaved and very broad - easily a kar lane wide.
but while the surface is broadly smooth it has the herringbone
texture of heavy equipment tires and treads making for a vibrating
ride. For residential stretch the shoulder abuts on to a very broad
grass strip, followed by a usually deserted sidewalk followed by more
lawn before the residential part begins. They could easily have 3
more lanes with the space they have.

[The reason it has not been so widened involves a lot of municipal
politics. I don't doubt the entire stretch will eventually be widened
but for now that is the nature of the street.]

Now here is the problem: Driving on the single lane is dicey. I am
quite experience and comfortable riding in traffic but this narrow
and busy single lane makes me nervous. Kars do not give you much
space. The shoulder is ridable on a mtb or sturdy hybrid/utility but
I wouldn't want to ride it on a skinny tire road racer. Even on a
full suspension mtb the ride is unpleasant given the surface texture.

The lawn strip is similarly ridable on an mtb but soft and mushy. It
isn't part of the residential properties so riding it would not be a
trespass.

Then there is the sidewalk. As I said it is pretty much deserted
since decent people drive kars to go 100 meters. A good surface, no
pedestrians, no kars....

What would kona do?

-busy dicey narrow single lane asphalt?

-rough broad shoulder

-broad grass strip

-the rarely used sidewalk?


Take the lane. Pretend you're a farm tractor, garbage truck, street sweeper, or
other slow moving vehicle, because in the eyes of the law, *that's what you
are.* Being hit from behind is extremely rare, but you can further minimize
your risk by being as visible as possible -- don't hug the curb, wear bright
colored clothing, use reflectors, etc.

Matt O.


  #9  
Old September 30th 05, 06:21 PM
DrLith
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Default !

lowkey wrote:

I'd try it out both ways and see which made me happiest. I'll generally
take the lane if the terrain is such that I can expect maintain a good
clip (few stops, flat or downhill), and I'll take an unoccupied sidewalk
if it's a good sidewalk and conditions are such that I would be
travelling slower than my usual slower-than-traffic pace (uphill, lots
of lights or stop signs, etc).

I don't know if riding on the sidewalk is technically legal around here
or not, but I think I see as many bikes on the sidewalks as I do on the
street. I'm still not used to this dense suburban lifestyle, and I miss
my midwestern wide open spaces!
  #10  
Old October 1st 05, 05:31 AM
Claire Petersky
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Default what would you choose?

"lowkey" wrote in message
...

What would kona do?



Got a google map or something?

Thanks.

--
Warm Regards,

Claire Petersky
Personal page: http://www.geocities.com/cpetersky/
See the books I've set free at:
http://bookcrossing.com/referral/Cpetersky


 




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