chainstay gouge

I've had my Specialized Tarmac Pro for about two months now - I was
cleaning it the other day and noticed the chainstay protector (a
carbon fiber plate) was skewed sitting about 75-deg up from the
chainstay. And right there where the plate used to be was a nice deep
gouge in the carbon. There is some grease on the plate but no damage
to it. The LBS guys say the damage is deep enough to cause structural
problems (it didn't look too deep to me, but it *is* into the carbon).

Jeez.

I took the frame back to the LBS who tried to get Specialized to
replace it based on the fact the plate came off, but Specialized said,
"Dude, takka hike!"

Everyone who has seen it sez some type of chain suck caused this but I
can't remember, for the life of me any such an episode, let alone one
that would cause a serious gouge.

In the past Specialized has warranty replaced frames that I thought
were in much better shape (a couple of the old glued carbon tube
frames that were oxiding at the joints)

My questions for the group:
Has anyone seen this problem with carbon fiber frames? Sounds like a
little chainsuck protector would be a good insurance item for owners.

Is there any appeal route from Specialized? The LBS is sending in the
frame to see if they change their mind.

Do you think the warranty should cover chain suck if the problem was
the chainstay protector came off?

I guess I gotta go back to steel

Thanks,
Steve

It's unfortunate that Specialized doesn't wan't to support their
customer when their product has such an obvious flaw.

Since they are going through the trouble to make the guard out of
carbon fiber they could improve the design by including some tabs on
the ends that wrap around the stay to keep it in place. I liew of this
design improvement, some zipties will serve the same function.

SC wrote:
I've had my Specialized Tarmac Pro for about two months now - I was
cleaning it the other day and noticed the chainstay protector (a
carbon fiber plate) was skewed sitting about 75-deg up from the
chainstay. And right there where the plate used to be was a nice deep
gouge in the carbon. There is some grease on the plate but no damage
to it. The LBS guys say the damage is deep enough to cause structural
problems (it didn't look too deep to me, but it *is* into the carbon).

Jeez.

I took the frame back to the LBS who tried to get Specialized to
replace it based on the fact the plate came off, but Specialized said,
"Dude, takka hike!"

Everyone who has seen it sez some type of chain suck caused this but I
can't remember, for the life of me any such an episode, let alone one
that would cause a serious gouge.

In the past Specialized has warranty replaced frames that I thought
were in much better shape (a couple of the old glued carbon tube
frames that were oxiding at the joints)

My questions for the group:
Has anyone seen this problem with carbon fiber frames? Sounds like a
little chainsuck protector would be a good insurance item for owners.

Is there any appeal route from Specialized? The LBS is sending in the
frame to see if they change their mind.

Do you think the warranty should cover chain suck if the problem was
the chainstay protector came off?

I guess I gotta go back to steel

Thanks,
Steve


1. if you post pics, it'll be easier to give an opinion on the problem.

2. chain suck is not a frame manufacturer's fault.

3. a gouged steel frame will fatigue most impressively.

Steve C. who? wrote:
I've had my Specialized Tarmac Pro for about two months now - I was
cleaning it the other day and noticed the chainstay protector (a
carbon fiber plate) was skewed sitting about 75-deg up from the
chainstay. And right there where the plate used to be was a nice deep
gouge in the carbon. There is some grease on the plate but no damage
to it. The LBS guys say the damage is deep enough to cause structural
problems (it didn't look too deep to me, but it *is* into the carbon)....

Could a repair be made by wrapping a piece of appropriate carbon fiber
cloth around the stay and bonding it with an appropriate epoxy?

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

jim beam wrote:
SC wrote:
snip

stay protector came off?

I guess I gotta go back to steel

Thanks,
Steve

Snip
3. a gouged steel frame will fatigue most impressively.

As indeed did my Fausto Coppi. I had the chain off in the first race I
did on it and dinged the stay. It lasted another 3 years till one day I
started to hear a pinging noise. On investigation the stay had a crack
80% of the way around it. The only difference with steel was that Chas
Roberts did a fine job of replacing the stay and the frame is still in
use today as my winter hack.

Stan Cox

On Aug 2, 11:07 pm, Stan Cox wrote:
jim beam wrote:
SC wrote:

snip

stay protector came off?



I guess I gotta go back to steel

Thanks,
Steve

Snip
3. a gouged steel frame will fatigue most impressively.

As indeed did my Fausto Coppi. I had the chain off in the first race I
did on it and dinged the stay. It lasted another 3 years till one day I
started to hear a pinging noise. On investigation the stay had a crack
80% of the way around it. The only difference with steel was that Chas
Roberts did a fine job of replacing the stay and the frame is still in
use today as my winter hack.

Stan Cox

This is why I don't trust carbon on bikes. It may be strong when
treated correctly, but, the scenes in Formula One auto racing of it
shattering when impacted makes me nervous. Yes, other materials can be
compromised as well, but, carbon doesn't seem to have much of a slowly-
fading curve. It's just good, or it's broke.

Tom \Johnny Sunset\ Sherman Wrote:

Could a repair be made by wrapping a piece of appropriate carbon fiber
cloth around the stay and bonding it with an appropriate epoxy?

Sure, as long as:
A) the damage is a sufficient distance from the ends to allow a decent
overlap, 30 mm or so in both directions
B) the owner is ready to accept the weight increase of perhaps 15-30
grams for the added material
C) the owner is ready to accept the aestethic blemish of the slight
swelling and less-than-perfect surface match of the repair.


--
dabac

On Fri, 03 Aug 2007 00:42:55 -0700, Joe Bernard
wrote:

This is why I don't trust carbon on bikes. It may be strong when
treated correctly, but, the scenes in Formula One auto racing of it
shattering when impacted makes me nervous. Yes, other materials can be
compromised as well, but, carbon doesn't seem to have much of a slowly-
fading curve. It's just good, or it's broke.

Good for you.
--
JT
****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************

On Fri, 3 Aug 2007 19:09:01 +1000, dabac
wrote:


Tom \Johnny Sunset\ Sherman Wrote:

Could a repair be made by wrapping a piece of appropriate carbon fiber
cloth around the stay and bonding it with an appropriate epoxy?

Sure, as long as:
A) the damage is a sufficient distance from the ends to allow a decent
overlap, 30 mm or so in both directions
B) the owner is ready to accept the weight increase of perhaps 15-30
grams for the added material
C) the owner is ready to accept the aestethic blemish of the slight
swelling and less-than-perfect surface match of the repair.

And this sort of fix is only possible if there is enough room for it.

--
JT
****************************
Remove "remove" to reply
Visit http://www.jt10000.com
****************************

On Aug 3, 2:42 am, Joe Bernard wrote:
On Aug 2, 11:07 pm, Stan Cox wrote:



jim beam wrote:
SC wrote:

snip

stay protector came off?

I guess I gotta go back to steel

Thanks,
Steve

Snip
3. a gouged steel frame will fatigue most impressively.

As indeed did my Fausto Coppi. I had the chain off in the first race I
did on it and dinged the stay. It lasted another 3 years till one day I
started to hear a pinging noise. On investigation the stay had a crack
80% of the way around it. The only difference with steel was that Chas
Roberts did a fine job of replacing the stay and the frame is still in
use today as my winter hack.

Stan Cox

This is why I don't trust carbon on bikes. It may be strong when
treated correctly, but, the scenes in Formula One auto racing of it
shattering when impacted makes me nervous. Yes, other materials can be
compromised as well, but, carbon doesn't seem to have much of a slowly-
fading curve. It's just good, or it's broke.


Lance Armstrong rode his CARBON-framed bike up Luz Ardiden with a
cracked chainstay during the TdF. As I recall, he won the stage
too.

Sounds like it ain't 'just good, or it's broke'.

D'ohBoy