#1
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BAH!
http://www.eveningnews24.co.uk/conte...A23%3A53%3A250
"A road safety charity today slammed a decision not to ban a teenage driver who hit a young cyclist while distracted by the mobile phone he was holding." He also had a worn tyre... ""The child accepted that he had ridden out in front of Mr Bradford." But Bradford had been holding his mobile phone which probably contributed to him being unable to stop in time. Mrs Tucker told the court: "He (Bradford) later said there was another child in the road and he was between the devil and the deep blue sea as to which child he hit."" Perhaps if he had maintained his vehicle properly and paid attention to what was going on, he may well have been able to stop in time, thus not hitting anyone?? Cheers, helen s |
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#2
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BAH!
wafflycat wrote:
Perhaps if he had maintained his vehicle properly and paid attention to what was going on, he may well have been able to stop in time, thus not hitting anyone?? Perhaps, perhaps not. Whilst I abhor the use of mobile phones in cars, and poor maintenance, there comes a point whereby even the most attentive driver won't avoid a crash if a pedestrian or cyclist does something stupid. That may have been the case here - the youth should be fined the usual amount for the phone and tyre, but unless it can be shown that he truly could have avoided the accident, this is the correct verdict. -- Mark. http://tranchant.plus.com/ |
#3
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BAH!
On Thu, 21 Jul 2005, Mark Tranchant wrote:
That may have been the case here - the youth should be fined the usual amount for the phone and tyre, but unless it can be shown that he truly could have avoided the accident, this is the correct verdict. No, everyone driving illegal vehicles or using a phone when driving should be punished as if they hit someone. regards, Ian SMith -- |\ /| no .sig |o o| |/ \| |
#4
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BAH!
Ian Smith wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jul 2005, Mark Tranchant wrote: That may have been the case here - the youth should be fined the usual amount for the phone and tyre, but unless it can be shown that he truly could have avoided the accident, this is the correct verdict. No, everyone driving illegal vehicles or using a phone when driving should be punished as if they hit someone. regards, Ian SMith We live in a society that punishes people for the crimes that did happen, not what might have happened. It would be a dangerous day should we start punishing people for what could have happened. I think we'd all be locked up at some stage in our lives... |
#5
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BAH!
On Thu, 21 Jul 2005 15:57:57 +0000 (UTC) someone who may be "Mick"
wrote this:- We live in a society that punishes people for the crimes that did happen, not what might have happened. It would be a dangerous day should we start punishing people for what could have happened. That day is already here. Sajid Badat did not blow up an aeroplane but was sentenced to 13 years. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article...4770_1,00.html has the background. -- David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E I will always explain revoked keys, unless the UK government prevents me by using the RIP Act 2000. |
#6
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BAH!
On Thu, 21 Jul 2005, Mick wrote:
Ian Smith wrote: On Thu, 21 Jul 2005, Mark Tranchant wrote: That may have been the case here - the youth should be fined the usual amount for the phone and tyre, but unless it can be shown that he truly could have avoided the accident, this is the correct verdict. No, everyone driving illegal vehicles or using a phone when driving should be punished as if they hit someone. We live in a society that punishes people for the crimes that did happen, You're saying that breaking the law isn't a crime unless someone is injured? Is that something you would propose for all law, or do you think it should only aplly to motoring law? regards, Ian SMith -- |\ /| no .sig |o o| |/ \| |
#7
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BAH!
in message , Ian Smith
') wrote: On Thu, 21 Jul 2005, Mark Tranchant wrote: That may have been the case here - the youth should be fined the usual amount for the phone and tyre, but unless it can be shown that he truly could have avoided the accident, this is the correct verdict. No, everyone driving illegal vehicles or using a phone when driving should be punished as if they hit someone. Correction: if they hit someone, that's enough for jail time. Oh, and _permanent_ license revocation. The phone and the tyre aggravate it, but it is not acceptable to drive so you're at risk of hitting people. -- (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/ Iraq war: it's time for regime change... ... go now, Tony, while you can still go with dignity. [update 18 months after this .sig was written: it's still relevant] |
#8
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BAH!
Ian Smith wrote:
On Thu, 21 Jul 2005, Mick wrote: Ian Smith wrote: On Thu, 21 Jul 2005, Mark Tranchant wrote: That may have been the case here - the youth should be fined the usual amount for the phone and tyre, but unless it can be shown that he truly could have avoided the accident, this is the correct verdict. No, everyone driving illegal vehicles or using a phone when driving should be punished as if they hit someone. We live in a society that punishes people for the crimes that did happen, You're saying that breaking the law isn't a crime unless someone is injured? Absolutely not, but they should be punished for what they did. In this case, the misdemeanour is using a phone whilst driving with a dodgy tyre, and appropriate fines/points should be levied. *Only* if it can be shown that this contributed to the accident should tougher sentencing arise. Innocent until proven guilty *must* prevail. Is that something you would propose for all law, or do you think it should only aplly to motoring law? All law. If I fail to maintain a tree on my property despite warnings and a heavy branch blows down, I shouldn't get done for manslaughter unless the branch actually does kill someone. -- Mark. http://tranchant.plus.com/ |
#9
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BAH!
On Fri, 22 Jul, Mark Tranchant wrote:
Ian Smith wrote: On Thu, 21 Jul 2005, Mick wrote: Ian Smith wrote: On Thu, 21 Jul 2005, Mark Tranchant wrote: That may have been the case here - the youth should be fined the usual amount for the phone and tyre, but unless it can be shown that he truly could have avoided the accident, this is the correct verdict. No, everyone driving illegal vehicles or using a phone when driving should be punished as if they hit someone. We live in a society that punishes people for the crimes that did happen, You're saying that breaking the law isn't a crime unless someone is injured? Absolutely not, but they should be punished for what they did. In this case, the misdemeanour is using a phone whilst driving with a dodgy tyre, and appropriate fines/points should be levied. *Only* if it can be shown that this contributed to the accident should tougher sentencing arise. Innocent until proven guilty *must* prevail. Indeed. I have proposed nothing remotely contrary to that. You are arguing with a straw man - it's not really very clever. (Incidently, innocent until proven guilty is not a universal precept of UK law.) Anyone guilty of driving a dangerously illegal vehicle, having been proven guilty, should be punished to a degree comensurate with having, through delibverate negligence, hit someone with that vehicle. Is that something you would propose for all law, or do you think it should only aplly to motoring law? All law. If I fail to maintain a tree on my property despite warnings and a heavy branch blows down, I shouldn't get done for manslaughter unless the branch actually does kill someone. Right. So burglary is not an offence in your proposed legal system? Fraud? Vandalism? All perfectly OK, as long as no-one is actually physically injured. regards, Ian SMith -- |\ /| no .sig |o o| |/ \| |
#10
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BAH!
On Thu, 21 Jul, Simon Brooke wrote:
in message , Ian Smith ') wrote: No, everyone driving illegal vehicles or using a phone when driving should be punished as if they hit someone. Correction: if they hit someone, that's enough for jail time. Oh, and _permanent_ license revocation. The phone and the tyre aggravate it, but it is not acceptable to drive so you're at risk of hitting people. No, that simply makes it a lottery. The legal system should not tolerate deliberate wilful negligence that unnecessarily increases the risk of killing people. Driving with a bald tyre should be treated similarly to (say) discharging a rifle down the high street. If someone did that and somehow didn't kill anyone there'd be uproar if the system prosecuted them only for (say) disturbing the peace. regards, Ian SMith -- |\ /| no .sig |o o| |/ \| |
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