USPS TREK bikes really just "stock" frames????

JFT- Men of anywhere near average height and proportions don't need custom
frames for bike fit. BRBR

This is a great point. Maybe 5% of the framesets we sell are custom. Bike shops
that spout that custom is needed for most are mostly Serotta, cuz they make $
on custom framesets.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"

On Fri, 09 Jul 2004 18:43:08 -0400, John Forrest Tomlinson
wrote:

Men of anywhere near average height and proportions don't need custom
frames for bike fit.

True.

I've seen a number of OCLV Treks from the old Saturn team, and while
the basic tubes, lugs and proportins may have been stock, there were
small differerences. Some or all had steel forks.

That might have been in the days when Trek sold the "Classic" fork,
pretty flexible fork. I wonder if Trek developed the "Air Rail" in
response to some riders using steel forks?

Most or all had
numner plate tabs under the top tube.

The Treks for sale at my LBS don't have those. ;-)

On Fri, 09 Jul 2004 18:43:08 -0400, John Forrest Tomlinson
wrote:

Men of anywhere near average height and proportions don't need custom
frames for bike fit.

True.

I've seen a number of OCLV Treks from the old Saturn team, and while
the basic tubes, lugs and proportins may have been stock, there were
small differerences. Some or all had steel forks.

That might have been in the days when Trek sold the "Classic" fork,
pretty flexible fork. I wonder if Trek developed the "Air Rail" in
response to some riders using steel forks?

Most or all had
numner plate tabs under the top tube.

The Treks for sale at my LBS don't have those. ;-)

On Fri, 9 Jul 2004 22:42:04 -0400, (Jesse
Thompson) wrote:

They are stock frames because Trek can't make "non-stock" frames with
the lug system they have.

Could be; but it's hard to imagine there's not at least a little
wiggle room. After all, the tubes have to be assembled onto the lugs.

Also, a smart engineer could consider mixing and matching tubes and
lugs from different frame sizes to achieve custom geometry. And now
that OCLV is available in WSD, there are even more to choose from.

I don't see why it should be too hard to have made a slightly shorter
top tube for, say, Roberto Heras as an example.

So they have managed to turn a problem into a
marketing opportunity...

That's for sure. Just as I would have done! ;-)

What I really want to know is, since Colnago and Trek both use lugs to
make their carbon frames, how can Colnago make custom C40s for their
racers, but Trek can't?

Good question. Could it be a different problem besides technical that
keeps Trek from offering custom geometry? I'm thinking logistics, but
that seems unlikely given that Project One has so many different color
combinations available.

What is the difference in their lug
construction?

Looks like Trek is internal and Colnago external, but I don't know
enough to guess what other differences might come into it.

On Fri, 9 Jul 2004 22:42:04 -0400, (Jesse
Thompson) wrote:

They are stock frames because Trek can't make "non-stock" frames with
the lug system they have.

Could be; but it's hard to imagine there's not at least a little
wiggle room. After all, the tubes have to be assembled onto the lugs.

Also, a smart engineer could consider mixing and matching tubes and
lugs from different frame sizes to achieve custom geometry. And now
that OCLV is available in WSD, there are even more to choose from.

I don't see why it should be too hard to have made a slightly shorter
top tube for, say, Roberto Heras as an example.

So they have managed to turn a problem into a
marketing opportunity...

That's for sure. Just as I would have done! ;-)

What I really want to know is, since Colnago and Trek both use lugs to
make their carbon frames, how can Colnago make custom C40s for their
racers, but Trek can't?

Good question. Could it be a different problem besides technical that
keeps Trek from offering custom geometry? I'm thinking logistics, but
that seems unlikely given that Project One has so many different color
combinations available.

What is the difference in their lug
construction?

Looks like Trek is internal and Colnago external, but I don't know
enough to guess what other differences might come into it.

On Sat, 10 Jul 2004 13:39:58 -0500, dianne_1234
wrote:


I don't see why it should be too hard
to have made a slightly shorter
top tube for, say, Roberto Heras as
an example.


What makes you think he requires a short toptube for a man his height?

JT

On Sat, 10 Jul 2004 13:39:58 -0500, dianne_1234
wrote:


I don't see why it should be too hard
to have made a slightly shorter
top tube for, say, Roberto Heras as
an example.


What makes you think he requires a short toptube for a man his height?

JT

"Qui si parla Campagnolo " wrote in message
...
jack- Are the USPS TREK bikes really just "stock" frames??? And if
that's
true,
being completely objective, doesn't it blow a huge hole in the custom
frame
lobby? I guess it begs the question: If stock frames are good enough to
win the Tour De France, are they not good enough for average joe?
BRBR


Lance's framesets are not 'stock'.

I have to disagree with this statement in part. I believe Trek makes its
58cm bike to "fit" Lance and that anybody else who rides a 58cm will have to
adjust to that specific frame!

"Qui si parla Campagnolo " wrote in message
...
jack- Are the USPS TREK bikes really just "stock" frames??? And if
that's
true,
being completely objective, doesn't it blow a huge hole in the custom
frame
lobby? I guess it begs the question: If stock frames are good enough to
win the Tour De France, are they not good enough for average joe?
BRBR


Lance's framesets are not 'stock'.

I have to disagree with this statement in part. I believe Trek makes its
58cm bike to "fit" Lance and that anybody else who rides a 58cm will have to
adjust to that specific frame!

Lance's framesets are not 'stock'.

Peter: Could you elaborate on that one? I've seen the production lines;
there's nothing whatsoever special about what Lance rides, aside from the
fact that he'll sometimes be on a production bike that the public doesn't
get for a couple of months. The Madone SL will very shortly be available
(end of this month perhaps), and the Madone SSL a bit later. The bike he's
using for many of the flat sections is a standard Madone, but being the
weight-weenie that he is, anything with the slightest grade and he goes to
the 50 gram lighter "SL" without the flared (aero) seat tube & downtube. As
mentioned, that will shortly be available at your local dealer.

OK, because Lance's bike has a glued-on number plate hanger, I suppose that
could qualify it as non-stock? That might be stretching things just a bit.

Frame geometry? Absolutely untouched. Truth? If Lance demanded a 1cm
longer top tube, he'd have it.. and so would the rest of us. Fortunately,
Lance just happens to fit very nicely on a stock 58cm geometry. No
customization whatsoever. More truth? For some of the mountain bike
riders, they *did* tweak the frames a bit, with slightly-longer top tubes, a
couple of years ago. But not for any of the bikes Lance rides.

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
IMBA, BikesBelong, NBDA member

"Qui si parla Campagnolo " wrote in message
...
jack- Are the USPS TREK bikes really just "stock" frames??? And if
that's
true,
being completely objective, doesn't it blow a huge hole in the custom
frame
lobby? I guess it begs the question: If stock frames are good enough to
win the Tour De France, are they not good enough for average joe?
BRBR

Well, being good enough to win, doesn't really take into account the huge
van
riding along with the riders full of spares, including framesets.

And they may be a size that fits a rider, and that becomes the 'stock
size',
for Trek.

Lance's framesets are not 'stock'.

Peter Chisholm
Vecchio's Bicicletteria
1833 Pearl St.
Boulder, CO, 80302
(303)440-3535
http://www.vecchios.com
"Ruote convenzionali costruite eccezionalmente bene"