Asian Women Drivers

On Thursday, December 8, 2016 at 9:52:07 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Wednesday, December 7, 2016 at 5:48:47 PM UTC-8, Doug Landau wrote:
Did you mention Wes there because you assume him to be of your own age group and to think of older people as racist and discriminatory? After all - there was no comment by Wes on the string you commented upon.

My brother was a snip

He continues to tell me snip

I ask him if he thinks that snip

snip

snip

Time to ask your masters what to say to that.

Well, Tom, I would like to take this opportunity to say this: When I got to my desk yesterday morning and opened RBT and blasted your latest reply, in my contempt I went a bit overboard. One of my retorts was as follows:

Christianity always seems to be horrifying to atheists. Apparently the constant paganism and war that existed before Christian conversion was far superior in their minds.
Christianity is for idiots

I regret having said that, and apologize to all whom I have offended. This statement was not only rude and offensive and juvenile, but incorrect. Altho I do not believe, since my first LSD trip I can see why people do. More importantly, as we all know religion fills a great many human needs, and has many benefits including moral guidance, community, and so on, and so there are plenty of good reasons to participate in religion, and those who choose to do so enjoy those benefits while I do not, and they are absolutely not idiots. But in this way I am.

Namaste

I think that you should travel to Africa and see your wonderful lack of religion up close and personal. There are entire areas in Ghana and South Sudan, Chad and Nigeria where you can discover the differences between the atheistic beliefs virtual identity to paganism and the sharp differences between it and Christianity. My wife taught at religious schools most of her life and saw many of her students going off on charitable pilgrimages to help these less fortunates. The stories they tell make "Out Of America: A Black Man Confronts Africa" read like a dime store novel. And most of these pilgrims were Asians.

I missed saying that words that we converse with in these groups are ALWAYS bound to get out of hand. This means only that your passions are showing and not your intellect.

Save Datakoll and Monkeyman. They're not even worth bothering with. They remind me of my brother that knows that the media is all lies and then uses the media to support insanity like "there once were men 37 feet tall with six fingers and six toes." or "Building 7 of the World Trade Towers were blown up by the CIA". But he won't respond to the fact that that 37 foot skeleton came from a carnival side show in the 1800's or answer why the CIA would want to blow up the trade towers.

On 12/8/2016 12:00 PM, wrote:
On Thursday, December 8, 2016 at 9:52:07 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Wednesday, December 7, 2016 at 5:48:47 PM UTC-8, Doug Landau wrote:
-snip snip snip-
answer why the CIA would want to blow up the trade towers.


Apply the logical test known as Capt. Bryan Suits' Razor:
Why wouldn't they?

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Per :
I think that you should travel to Africa and see your wonderful lack of religion up close and personal.

I kind of liked "The VICE Guide to Liberia"...... -)

Until recently I've been sort of negative about/dismissive of
too-strongly held religious beliefs.

But then I started hearing how devout Gwen Ifill was and I have to say I
have changed my outlook. If somebody that smart and that good at what
they did can be so devoutly-religious, religion must have some upsides
that I do not know about.
--
Pete Cresswell

On Thursday, December 8, 2016 at 1:00:10 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thursday, December 8, 2016 at 9:52:07 AM UTC-8, wrote:
On Wednesday, December 7, 2016 at 5:48:47 PM UTC-8, Doug Landau wrote:
Did you mention Wes there because you assume him to be of your own age group and to think of older people as racist and discriminatory? After all - there was no comment by Wes on the string you commented upon.

My brother was a snip

He continues to tell me snip

I ask him if he thinks that snip

snip

snip

Time to ask your masters what to say to that.

Well, Tom, I would like to take this opportunity to say this: When I got to my desk yesterday morning and opened RBT and blasted your latest reply, in my contempt I went a bit overboard. One of my retorts was as follows:

Christianity always seems to be horrifying to atheists. Apparently the constant paganism and war that existed before Christian conversion was far superior in their minds.
Christianity is for idiots

I regret having said that, and apologize to all whom I have offended. This statement was not only rude and offensive and juvenile, but incorrect. Altho I do not believe, since my first LSD trip I can see why people do.. More importantly, as we all know religion fills a great many human needs, and has many benefits including moral guidance, community, and so on, and so there are plenty of good reasons to participate in religion, and those who choose to do so enjoy those benefits while I do not, and they are absolutely not idiots. But in this way I am.

Namaste

I think that you should travel to Africa and see your wonderful lack of religion up close and personal. There are entire areas in Ghana and South Sudan, Chad and Nigeria where you can discover the differences between the atheistic beliefs virtual identity to paganism and the sharp differences between it and Christianity. My wife taught at religious schools most of her life and saw many of her students going off on charitable pilgrimages to help these less fortunates. The stories they tell make "Out Of America: A Black Man Confronts Africa" read like a dime store novel. And most of these pilgrims were Asians.

I missed saying that words that we converse with in these groups are ALWAYS bound to get out of hand. This means only that your passions are showing and not your intellect.

Save Datakoll and Monkeyman. They're not even worth bothering with. They remind me of my brother that knows that the media is all lies and then uses the media to support insanity like "there once were men 37 feet tall with six fingers and six toes." or "Building 7 of the World Trade Towers were blown up by the CIA". But he won't respond to the fact that that 37 foot skeleton came from a carnival side show in the 1800's or answer why the CIA would want to blow up the trade towers.

? you missed my blurp in the NYT ? Cecil ?

where are you based with these crits of Asian drivers ? SF ?

On 12/8/2016 2:22 PM, (PeteCresswell) wrote:
Per :
I think that you should travel to Africa and see your wonderful lack of religion up close and personal.

I kind of liked "The VICE Guide to Liberia"...... -)

Until recently I've been sort of negative about/dismissive of
too-strongly held religious beliefs.

But then I started hearing how devout Gwen Ifill was and I have to say I
have changed my outlook. If somebody that smart and that good at what
they did can be so devoutly-religious, religion must have some upsides
that I do not know about.

Lately I've begun to wonder if spirituality may be something similar to
music. There are people for whom music is nothing but random noise, or
perhaps nothing more than frequencies in mathematically justified
patterns. There are people who kind of like it in a "whatever's popular"
way, for whom little matters but a loud bass line. And there are people
who can perceive and appreciate complexities that the former groups will
never know. They get benefits the others miss.

A person in that latter group will never convince a person in the second
group that Beethoven is any better than Beyonce. He'll never convince
the first group that there's any more to music than what can be seen on
an oscilloscope. But the fault isn't with the guy with superior perception.

Maybe spiritual people can perceive and appreciate things that others
can't. Maybe they get benefits the others miss.

But maybe, like many atheists, I'm guilty of assuming those who disagree
aren't as perceptive.


--
- Frank Krygowski

On Thursday, December 8, 2016 at 12:45:56 PM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 12/8/2016 2:22 PM, (PeteCresswell) wrote:
Per :
I think that you should travel to Africa and see your wonderful lack of religion up close and personal.

I kind of liked "The VICE Guide to Liberia"...... -)

Until recently I've been sort of negative about/dismissive of
too-strongly held religious beliefs.

But then I started hearing how devout Gwen Ifill was and I have to say I
have changed my outlook. If somebody that smart and that good at what
they did can be so devoutly-religious, religion must have some upsides
that I do not know about.

Lately I've begun to wonder if spirituality may be something similar to
music. There are people for whom music is nothing but random noise, or
perhaps nothing more than frequencies in mathematically justified
patterns. There are people who kind of like it in a "whatever's popular"
way, for whom little matters but a loud bass line. And there are people
who can perceive and appreciate complexities that the former groups will
never know. They get benefits the others miss.

A person in that latter group will never convince a person in the second
group that Beethoven is any better than Beyonce. He'll never convince
the first group that there's any more to music than what can be seen on
an oscilloscope. But the fault isn't with the guy with superior perception.

Maybe spiritual people can perceive and appreciate things that others
can't. Maybe they get benefits the others miss.

But maybe, like many atheists, I'm guilty of assuming those who disagree
aren't as perceptive.


--
- Frank Krygowski

I am heavily into Stan Grof these days. Stan, while in or shortly after med school, was a volunteer subject in early LSD experiments in the 50's and became convinced that psychedelics offer a window into the soul. He conducted 10's of thousands of LSD psychotherapy sessions in the 60's before it became illegal and when it did he replaced the acid with breathwork. To put you in a non-ordinary state of consciousness.
Stan concluded, from what people talk about and draw while in non-ordinary states of consciousness, that who we are is pretty much determined by the time we spent in the womb. He divides the time into four parts: before contractions, characterized by bliss, start of contractions, characterized by ominous warnings of things to come, the birth canal, characterized by extreme pressure, and birth. Once you start thinking in these terms you see references to these perinatal periods/themes all over music, literature, art, especially in movies. For example in Fantasia they are especially obvious.
Stan is at the top of the field of psychology and listening to him talk is absolutely unreal.

On Thursday, December 8, 2016 at 3:45:56 PM UTC-5, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 12/8/2016 2:22 PM, (PeteCresswell) wrote:
Per :
I think that you should travel to Africa and see your wonderful lack of religion up close and personal.

I kind of liked "The VICE Guide to Liberia"...... -)

Until recently I've been sort of negative about/dismissive of
too-strongly held religious beliefs.

But then I started hearing how devout Gwen Ifill was and I have to say I
have changed my outlook. If somebody that smart and that good at what
they did can be so devoutly-religious, religion must have some upsides
that I do not know about.

Lately I've begun to wonder if spirituality may be something similar to
music. There are people for whom music is nothing but random noise, or
perhaps nothing more than frequencies in mathematically justified
patterns. There are people who kind of like it in a "whatever's popular"
way, for whom little matters but a loud bass line. And there are people
who can perceive and appreciate complexities that the former groups will
never know. They get benefits the others miss.

A person in that latter group will never convince a person in the second
group that Beethoven is any better than Beyonce. He'll never convince
the first group that there's any more to music than what can be seen on
an oscilloscope. But the fault isn't with the guy with superior perception.

Maybe spiritual people can perceive and appreciate things that others
can't. Maybe they get benefits the others miss.

But maybe, like many atheists, I'm guilty of assuming those who disagree
aren't as perceptive.


--
- Frank Krygowski

uh I doahn have statistics. Frank would testify to bicyclings experience as positive in widening one's perspective n understanding ...if touring ...

yet possibley in a temporary mode lessening a mathematical analysis pof the same...


or that rigor of engineering study would temporarily maybe permanently forsome mask a greater environmental view....if ura mechanical in cubical drawing calculating type say a EE..

so why deny the primal cloud a logical structure for being ?

urnot gonna tellus it blundered in randomly ?

On Thu, 8 Dec 2016 15:45:54 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 12/8/2016 2:22 PM, (PeteCresswell) wrote:
Per :
I think that you should travel to Africa and see your wonderful lack of religion up close and personal.

I kind of liked "The VICE Guide to Liberia"...... -)

Until recently I've been sort of negative about/dismissive of
too-strongly held religious beliefs.

But then I started hearing how devout Gwen Ifill was and I have to say I
have changed my outlook. If somebody that smart and that good at what
they did can be so devoutly-religious, religion must have some upsides
that I do not know about.

Lately I've begun to wonder if spirituality may be something similar to
music. There are people for whom music is nothing but random noise, or
perhaps nothing more than frequencies in mathematically justified
patterns. There are people who kind of like it in a "whatever's popular"
way, for whom little matters but a loud bass line. And there are people
who can perceive and appreciate complexities that the former groups will
never know. They get benefits the others miss.

A person in that latter group will never convince a person in the second
group that Beethoven is any better than Beyonce. He'll never convince
the first group that there's any more to music than what can be seen on
an oscilloscope. But the fault isn't with the guy with superior perception.

Maybe spiritual people can perceive and appreciate things that others
can't. Maybe they get benefits the others miss.

But maybe, like many atheists, I'm guilty of assuming those who disagree
aren't as perceptive.

I remember reading a statement that while many people changed their
politics at some point in life relatively few changed their religions
belief. I believe the statement was written in support of St. Francis
Xavier's statement that "Give me a child until he is seven and I will
give you the man".

I suspect that this is largely true as any logical individual would
dispute many of the tenets in any of the world's organized religions.
--
cheers,

John B.

On Thu, 08 Dec 2016 14:22:51 -0500, (PeteCresswell) wrote:

Until recently I've been sort of negative about/dismissive of
too-strongly held religious beliefs.

But then I started hearing how devout Gwen Ifill was and I have to say
I have changed my outlook. If somebody that smart and that good at
what they did can be so devoutly-religious, religion must have some
upsides that I do not know about.

Confirmation bias is a powerful thing. Many people look for an "-ism"
primarily to have their prejudices validated. This happens across the
social spectrum in terms of wealth, gender, race, faith, intelligence,
politics, etc. Everyone falls into this sometimes, maybe most of the
time.

Of course, one of the aspects of this is that it's easiest to see bias
in those who disagree with us. This is the primary danger of the echo
chamber effect so easily obtained on the Internet; and indeed,
confirmation bias is a huge part of how the American political system
got into the situation it's in.

I know many devoutly religious people. Focusing on the Christians, some
are deeply conservative, some are deeply liberal, most are somewhere in
between and they all find support for their viewpoint in the exact same
scriptures. That's confirmation bias in action.

One of the things I notice is that for all the polarization there are
more similarities than differences between these folks. They want to
live decent lives, raise their kids and have their kids have better
lives than they have.

But the similarities get overlooked these days, to our detriment. And
ditto the similarities between people of different faiths or of no
particular faith. One of my best friends is a Hindu pandit, another is
a devout Baptist, another is a lapsed Catholic, yet another is an
atheist... and they all get along just fine and find many things in
common.

On Thu, 8 Dec 2016 14:11:46 -0800 (PST), Doug Landau
wrote:

I am heavily into Stan Grof these days.

snip

Stan is at the top of the field of psychology and listening to him
talk is absolutely unreal.

Speaking as a licensed psychologist, Stan is not at the top of the
field. He's a fringe character to most. His name is vaguely familiar
to most psychologists as that guy who did LSD psychotherapy back in the
60s and few of us have heard anything about his work since then.

Which is unfortunate because Grof is willing to step back and ask if the
status quo should really be so quo. More so than most of us hidebound
psychologists. He's done some very interesting rethinking about
psychosis, for example. Stan isn't necessarily correct but he's thought
provoking and far more entertaining than the cognitive behavioral
therapists. Shaking things up sometimes lets in some air and light.