Rual America coming to save our cities

On Monday, January 30, 2017 at 9:15:38 AM UTC-8, (PeteCresswell) wrote:
Per Tim McNamara:
http://www.twincities.com/2017/01/27...ke-lane-users/

"...while riders under 15 years old would be banned from using bike
lanes."

What? Is this guy on drugs?
--
Pete Cresswell

No Pete if he was on drugs he'd be sayin hey man **** the permits everybody get off his back let 'im have a good time in fact as long as the city's gonna provide bike paths they should provide bikes too

On 1/30/2017 11:46 AM, wrote:
On Sunday, January 29, 2017 at 10:57:45 PM UTC-8, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 21:43:07 -0600, Tim McNamara
wrote:

http://www.twincities.com/2017/01/27...ke-lane-users/

It's not all of rural America. Just one idiot lawmaker.

Did you catch his logic for taxing bike lane users?
"Rep. Duane Quam, a Republican from Byron, said he wasn’t
out to make life difficult for bikers. Quam said he was
simply worried that a lack of education about biking laws
was making riders unsafe."

Besides his rather odd logic, he also doesn't know the correct term
for a bicycle rider (cyclist) and instead uses the term for a
motorcycle rider (biker).
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Is it just me or isn't the vast majority of bicycle accidents due to wrong way riding and running traffic control obstacles? In other words - a lack of either education or respect for why these regulations are in place?


Well, some of that. Then there are carbon forks...

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 09:46:25 -0800 (PST), wrote:
Is it just me or isn't the vast majority of bicycle accidents
due to wrong way riding and running traffic control obstacles?

Since I don't keep score, I can only confess to my own contribution to
the bicycle accident statistics. I was driving on the wrong side of
the road when I was clobbered by a dentist and his Pontiac running a
stop sign. The CHP delivered my wrong way ticket while I was still
strapped to a backboard in the emergency room. I forgot to ask if the
dentist had been cited for running the stop sign. To maximize the
damage, my medical insurance carrier refused to pay my ER bill without
offering a reason. No re-education required. The ticket was
sufficient.

Of the near missed involving bicycles where I was driving the car,
it's almost always an unlit bicycle, with the rider wearing dark
clothes, and riding in a part of the road where I would not expect to
see a bicycle. About 2 weeks ago, it was a rider weaving his way down
the center divider. Most of these riders are homeless riding stolen
bicycles. They can't afford proper lighting and their clothes reflect
their desire to remain invisible.

Of the 3 people I knew that have died while riding their bicycles, all
were hit by drunk drivers.

In other words - a lack of either education or respect for why
these regulations are in place?

I don't see how a lack of education or respect for the law is somehow
related to getting injured on a bicycle. I'm overly careful while
riding, possibly to the point of paranoia. Yet, almost every ride in
traffic involves close calls and near misses, where the fault would be
difficult to determine, and where no amount of education would prevent
an accident. I don't think any of these close calls and near misses
were the result of either the driver or bicycle rider educational
deficiencies or lack of respect for the law. Most commonly, it's not
paying attention, distracted driving, really awful reaction time,
overly aggressive behavior, or falling asleep at the wheel. Todays
winner was a lady making a right turn directly into my path while
looking every direction except the direction her vehicle was
traveling. To her credit, she was able to stop before rear-ending me.


--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Monday, January 30, 2017 at 1:02:00 PM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
On 1/30/2017 11:46 AM, wrote:
On Sunday, January 29, 2017 at 10:57:45 PM UTC-8, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 21:43:07 -0600, Tim McNamara
wrote:

http://www.twincities.com/2017/01/27...ke-lane-users/

It's not all of rural America. Just one idiot lawmaker.

Did you catch his logic for taxing bike lane users?
"Rep. Duane Quam, a Republican from Byron, said he wasn’t
out to make life difficult for bikers. Quam said he was
simply worried that a lack of education about biking laws
was making riders unsafe."

Besides his rather odd logic, he also doesn't know the correct term
for a bicycle rider (cyclist) and instead uses the term for a
motorcycle rider (biker).
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Is it just me or isn't the vast majority of bicycle accidents due to wrong way riding and running traffic control obstacles? In other words - a lack of either education or respect for why these regulations are in place?


Well, some of that. Then there are carbon forks...

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

The average age of bicyclists killed in crashes with motor vehicles continues to increase, climbing to 45 years old in 2014, up from 39 in 2004, 32 in 1998, and 24 in 1988.
88 percent of those killed were male.
71 percent of bicyclist fatalities occurred in urban areas.
20 percent of bicyclist fatalities occurred between 6 and 8:59 p.m.
19 percent of bicyclists killed had blood alcohol concentrations of 0.08 g/dL or higher.
In 35 percent of the crashes, either the driver or the bicyclist had blood alcohol concentrations of 0.08 g/dL or higher.
California (128), Florida (139), and Texas (50) lead the nation in the number of bicyclist fatalities.
Just two states, Rhode Island and Vermont, reported no fatalities in 2014.

Percentages of reasons for fatality reported as:

Hit by car 29
Fell 17
Roadway/walkway not in good repair 13
Rider error/not paying attention 13
Crashed/collision 7
Dog ran out 4

On 1/30/2017 5:10 PM, wrote:
On Monday, January 30, 2017 at 1:02:00 PM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
On 1/30/2017 11:46 AM, wrote:
On Sunday, January 29, 2017 at 10:57:45 PM UTC-8, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 21:43:07 -0600, Tim McNamara
wrote:

http://www.twincities.com/2017/01/27...ke-lane-users/

It's not all of rural America. Just one idiot lawmaker.

Did you catch his logic for taxing bike lane users?
"Rep. Duane Quam, a Republican from Byron, said he wasn’t
out to make life difficult for bikers. Quam said he was
simply worried that a lack of education about biking laws
was making riders unsafe."

Besides his rather odd logic, he also doesn't know the correct term
for a bicycle rider (cyclist) and instead uses the term for a
motorcycle rider (biker).
--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Is it just me or isn't the vast majority of bicycle accidents due to wrong way riding and running traffic control obstacles? In other words - a lack of either education or respect for why these regulations are in place?


Well, some of that. Then there are carbon forks...

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

The average age of bicyclists killed in crashes with motor vehicles continues to increase, climbing to 45 years old in 2014, up from 39 in 2004, 32 in 1998, and 24 in 1988.
88 percent of those killed were male.
71 percent of bicyclist fatalities occurred in urban areas.
20 percent of bicyclist fatalities occurred between 6 and 8:59 p.m.
19 percent of bicyclists killed had blood alcohol concentrations of 0.08 g/dL or higher.
In 35 percent of the crashes, either the driver or the bicyclist had blood alcohol concentrations of 0.08 g/dL or higher.
California (128), Florida (139), and Texas (50) lead the nation in the number of bicyclist fatalities.
Just two states, Rhode Island and Vermont, reported no fatalities in 2014.

Percentages of reasons for fatality reported as:

Hit by car 29
Fell 17
Roadway/walkway not in good repair 13
Rider error/not paying attention 13
Crashed/collision 7
Dog ran out 4


kidding aside. you are right. The industry recognizes that
our customer base is aging out fast. Not being replaced by
enough of the new generation, Portland notwithstanding.
Traffic deaths don't help an already gloomy long term outlook.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 1/30/17 11:48 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
I don't see how a lack of education or respect for the law is somehow
related to getting injured on a bicycle. I'm overly careful while
riding, possibly to the point of paranoia. Yet, almost every ride in
traffic involves close calls and near misses, where the fault would be
difficult to determine, and where no amount of education would prevent
an accident. I don't think any of these close calls and near misses
were the result of either the driver or bicycle rider educational
deficiencies or lack of respect for the law. Most commonly, it's not
paying attention, distracted driving, really awful reaction time,
overly aggressive behavior, or falling asleep at the wheel. Todays
winner was a lady making a right turn directly into my path while
looking every direction except the direction her vehicle was

All of my accidents except one were due to road hazards. The exception
was when I was distracted by something across the street when a parked
vehicle was sticking out too far from the curb.

But all of my three or more close calls were due to motorists who should
not be allowed to drive.

--
Wes Groleau

On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 22:57:40 -0800, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:
On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 21:43:07 -0600, Tim McNamara
wrote:

http://www.twincities.com/2017/01/27...ke-lane-users/

It's not all of rural America. Just one idiot lawmaker.

True. I just couldn't resist.

Did you catch his logic for taxing bike lane users?
"Rep. Duane Quam, a Republican from Byron, said he wasnÂ’t out to
make life difficult for bikers. Quam said he was simply worried that
a lack of education about biking laws was making riders unsafe."

Besides his rather odd logic, he also doesn't know the correct term
for a bicycle rider (cyclist) and instead uses the term for a
motorcycle rider (biker).

That's a Minnesotanism- I get called a "biker" regularly when I am out
on my bicycle (maybe he thinks it's an acoustic motorcycle).

Like everywhere else, Minnesota has its share of doofus politicians.
They just happen to be Republicans this year. There are a few laws
brought up every single session by someone or other, just like
clockwork, which are doomed to failure. Some of them have been brought
up every legislative session for 20-30 years without success.

Although this year one of these perennial laws may succeed- making
off-sale of liquor on Sundays legal. That one has been defeated by an
odd coalition of bleeding heart liberals wanting to protect alcoholics
from themselves and temperance-minded conservatives who view demon rum
with suspicion, mixed with a liquor lobbying firm that opposes Sunday
sales on the grounds that being open 7 days a week would be a hardship
for mom-and-pop stores (liquor sales are banned in grocery stores here,
unlike WI, IL, etc.).

On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 14:40:55 +0700, John B wrote:
On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 22:57:40 -0800, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 21:43:07 -0600, Tim McNamara
wrote:

http://www.twincities.com/2017/01/27...ke-lane-users/

It's not all of rural America. Just one idiot lawmaker.

Did you catch his logic for taxing bike lane users?
"Rep. Duane Quam, a Republican from Byron, said he wasnÂ’t out to
make life difficult for bikers. Quam said he was simply worried that
a lack of education about biking laws was making riders unsafe."

Besides his rather odd logic, he also doesn't know the correct term
for a bicycle rider (cyclist) and instead uses the term for a
motorcycle rider (biker).

Well, given that many reports indicate that numbers in the range of 40
- 50 percent of bicycle automobile collisions are the fault of the
cyclist perhaps he had a point.

Except that one could ride a bike on Minnesota roadways and streets
which *don't* have a bike lane without said permit. The law as proposed
only covers riding bikes in bike lanes!

On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 07:16:35 -0500, Frank Krygowski
wrote:
On 1/29/2017 10:43 PM, Tim McNamara wrote:
Rural America to the rescue! First they elect Trump for us, so that
we can be protected from terrorists and taco trucks. Now they are
figuring out how to fix our bike lanes for us!

http://www.twincities.com/2017/01/27...ke-lane-users/

I can hadly wait to be able to find something to fix for them, so as
to return the favor.

Concerning one statement in rebuttal: I don't know of many "robust
biker education programs taking place in schools and driver’s
education classes." Do those really exist in Minnesota?

Nope. Minnesota killed funding for this kind of stuff decades ago,
despite Congress's biggest proponent of cycling ever (Jim Oberstar)
being from here. Basically, just like everywhere else, Minnesotans
resent paying to educate other people's kids.

However, this is not the way to solve the lack of cyclist education.

No, it is not.

On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 12:15:32 -0500, (PeteCresswell) wrote:
Per Tim McNamara:
http://www.twincities.com/2017/01/27...ke-lane-users/

"...while riders under 15 years old would be banned from using bike
lanes."

What? Is this guy on drugs?

Well, I don't know one way or the other. But note that his proposed law
only applies to bike lanes. Riders under 15 could ride on streets and
roadways without bike lanes.

I think the hidden agenda here is to eliminate bike lanes. We have a
number of really badly designed lanes that don't work all that well for
bikes and make the roads really bad for cars (e.g., reducing high volume
through streets from 4 lanes to 2, with bike lanes sandwiched between
thousands of rolling cars per day and on-street business parking- while
a perfectly nice quiet parallel street is just one block away. It's
nice riding down your bike lane dodging coffee shop customers and
sucking down carbon monoxide and PM2.5 particulates, with resentful
drivers getting hostile because they can remember the good old days
(last year) when they weren't stuck in a 40 block long traffic backup.