Cyclist visibility

My wife decreed, this morning, that if I wanted to eat I would have to
take her shopping.

Shopping here in Phuket involves an 80 Km. trip and visiting a large
number of stores. Luckily some of them have interesting things for me
to look at while my "better half" replenishes the pantry.

But to make a long story short when returning home we overtook a group
of 7 cyclists. All Thai's they were correctly riding down the L.H.
side of the road as the law requires and they were flying flags.

Six of the seven were riding "road bikes" and one was riding (whatever
you call them) a road bike with straight handlebars. All seven were
wearing the usual black cycling shorts and what appeared to be
bicycling shoes and clipless pedals but instead of colorful jerseys
they were wearing sloppy white tee-shirts.

But what made them distinctive was that they each had a small "flag
pole" attached to the top of their helmets with a flag attached.

The "flag poles" appeared to be approximately 12 - 16 inches tall and
while I couldn't see how the "flag poles" were attached to what seemed
to be normal cycling helmets they were flying small flags. Perhaps 8 x
10 inches in size, six were flying the Thai National Flag and one was
flying "The King's Flag" - a banner which represents the king.

The interesting thing was that while the flags didn't make the riders
more visible from directly behind them but as they were overtaken they
became very noticeable (Guys with flags on their heads!)

Perhaps this innovation could be implemented as a bicycle safety
feature.

I can also see a real marketing potential here. Whippy little flag
poles with a method of attaching them to a helmet. One could fly all
manner of innovative "flags". One could advertise one's candidate for
president or a notice that "my bike shop is better then your bike
shop" or even a notice that "this cyclist has a right to the road!"

As a safety device they certainly do make the cyclist more noticeable
and in addition that can be used as advertisement for almost anything.
Imagine a thousand people cycling down the road, each with a flag on
their head announcing "100 miles for Bellyaches" or whatever the cause
of the month happens to be.

Perhaps instead of paying for the privilege of riding 100 miles one
could convince the Organizer to pay the riders for advertising their
cause :-) (or at least free water)
--

Cheers,

John B.

On Saturday, April 23, 2016 at 8:20:06 AM UTC-4, John B. wrote:
My wife decreed, this morning, that if I wanted to eat I would have to
take her shopping.

Shopping here in Phuket involves an 80 Km. trip and visiting a large
number of stores. Luckily some of them have interesting things for me
to look at while my "better half" replenishes the pantry.

But to make a long story short when returning home we overtook a group
of 7 cyclists. All Thai's they were correctly riding down the L.H.
side of the road as the law requires and they were flying flags.

Six of the seven were riding "road bikes" and one was riding (whatever
you call them) a road bike with straight handlebars. All seven were
wearing the usual black cycling shorts and what appeared to be
bicycling shoes and clipless pedals but instead of colorful jerseys
they were wearing sloppy white tee-shirts.

But what made them distinctive was that they each had a small "flag
pole" attached to the top of their helmets with a flag attached.

The "flag poles" appeared to be approximately 12 - 16 inches tall and
while I couldn't see how the "flag poles" were attached to what seemed
to be normal cycling helmets they were flying small flags. Perhaps 8 x
10 inches in size, six were flying the Thai National Flag and one was
flying "The King's Flag" - a banner which represents the king.

The interesting thing was that while the flags didn't make the riders
more visible from directly behind them but as they were overtaken they
became very noticeable (Guys with flags on their heads!)

Perhaps this innovation could be implemented as a bicycle safety
feature.

I can also see a real marketing potential here. Whippy little flag
poles with a method of attaching them to a helmet. One could fly all
manner of innovative "flags". One could advertise one's candidate for
president or a notice that "my bike shop is better then your bike
shop" or even a notice that "this cyclist has a right to the road!"

As a safety device they certainly do make the cyclist more noticeable
and in addition that can be used as advertisement for almost anything.
Imagine a thousand people cycling down the road, each with a flag on
their head announcing "100 miles for Bellyaches" or whatever the cause
of the month happens to be.

Perhaps instead of paying for the privilege of riding 100 miles one
could convince the Organizer to pay the riders for advertising their
cause :-) (or at least free water)
--

Cheers,

John B.

what foods did you buy ? costs ?

https://goo.gl/4HKvuB

https://goo.gl/mYuaMx

riders ride head down...so the pole goes over the occipital...there's a liability problem here.

On 4/23/2016 8:19 AM, John B. wrote:

My wife decreed, this morning, that if I wanted to eat I would have to
take her shopping.

Shopping here in Phuket involves an 80 Km. trip and visiting a large
number of stores. Luckily some of them have interesting things for me
to look at while my "better half" replenishes the pantry.

But to make a long story short when returning home we overtook a group
of 7 cyclists. All Thai's they were correctly riding down the L.H.
side of the road as the law requires and they were flying flags.

Six of the seven were riding "road bikes" and one was riding (whatever
you call them) a road bike with straight handlebars. All seven were
wearing the usual black cycling shorts and what appeared to be
bicycling shoes and clipless pedals but instead of colorful jerseys
they were wearing sloppy white tee-shirts.

But what made them distinctive was that they each had a small "flag
pole" attached to the top of their helmets with a flag attached.

The "flag poles" appeared to be approximately 12 - 16 inches tall and
while I couldn't see how the "flag poles" were attached to what seemed
to be normal cycling helmets they were flying small flags. Perhaps 8 x
10 inches in size, six were flying the Thai National Flag and one was
flying "The King's Flag" - a banner which represents the king.

The interesting thing was that while the flags didn't make the riders
more visible from directly behind them but as they were overtaken they
became very noticeable (Guys with flags on their heads!)

Perhaps this innovation could be implemented as a bicycle safety
feature.

I can also see a real marketing potential here. Whippy little flag
poles with a method of attaching them to a helmet. One could fly all
manner of innovative "flags". One could advertise one's candidate for
president or a notice that "my bike shop is better then your bike
shop" or even a notice that "this cyclist has a right to the road!"

As a safety device they certainly do make the cyclist more noticeable
and in addition that can be used as advertisement for almost anything.
Imagine a thousand people cycling down the road, each with a flag on
their head announcing "100 miles for Bellyaches" or whatever the cause
of the month happens to be.

Perhaps instead of paying for the privilege of riding 100 miles one
could convince the Organizer to pay the riders for advertising their
cause :-) (or at least free water)

If Scharf can get a commission on them, we'll see them touted here very
soon.

After all, if it makes a cyclist more visible, then any cyclist would be
foolish not to use one, right?

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Saturday, April 23, 2016 at 8:34:13 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 4/23/2016 8:19 AM, John B. wrote:

My wife decreed, this morning, that if I wanted to eat I would have to
take her shopping.

Shopping here in Phuket involves an 80 Km. trip and visiting a large
number of stores. Luckily some of them have interesting things for me
to look at while my "better half" replenishes the pantry.

But to make a long story short when returning home we overtook a group
of 7 cyclists. All Thai's they were correctly riding down the L.H.
side of the road as the law requires and they were flying flags.

Six of the seven were riding "road bikes" and one was riding (whatever
you call them) a road bike with straight handlebars. All seven were
wearing the usual black cycling shorts and what appeared to be
bicycling shoes and clipless pedals but instead of colorful jerseys
they were wearing sloppy white tee-shirts.

But what made them distinctive was that they each had a small "flag
pole" attached to the top of their helmets with a flag attached.

The "flag poles" appeared to be approximately 12 - 16 inches tall and
while I couldn't see how the "flag poles" were attached to what seemed
to be normal cycling helmets they were flying small flags. Perhaps 8 x
10 inches in size, six were flying the Thai National Flag and one was
flying "The King's Flag" - a banner which represents the king.

The interesting thing was that while the flags didn't make the riders
more visible from directly behind them but as they were overtaken they
became very noticeable (Guys with flags on their heads!)

Perhaps this innovation could be implemented as a bicycle safety
feature.

I can also see a real marketing potential here. Whippy little flag
poles with a method of attaching them to a helmet. One could fly all
manner of innovative "flags". One could advertise one's candidate for
president or a notice that "my bike shop is better then your bike
shop" or even a notice that "this cyclist has a right to the road!"

As a safety device they certainly do make the cyclist more noticeable
and in addition that can be used as advertisement for almost anything.
Imagine a thousand people cycling down the road, each with a flag on
their head announcing "100 miles for Bellyaches" or whatever the cause
of the month happens to be.

Perhaps instead of paying for the privilege of riding 100 miles one
could convince the Organizer to pay the riders for advertising their
cause :-) (or at least free water)

If Scharf can get a commission on them, we'll see them touted here very
soon.

After all, if it makes a cyclist more visible, then any cyclist would be
foolish not to use one, right?

Hey Frank, the apocalypse is near: http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/i...sues_port.html

Here's the spot in a ratty part of NoPo.

Now Andre is going to go nuts on the American justice system -- Go Andre, go! The driver probably had a $25/50K policy -- or no insurance -- and the only option is to find someone with deep pockets.

I'm always amazed at the comments when these stories come out. Its the usual "how could bikes possibly ride on that road!" Well, it's a wide road with a pretty continuous shoulder and its a direct route and flat -- and it's probably where the cyclist needed to be. It's legal to be on that road, and motorists are required to pass with adequate room, etc., etc.

-- Jay Beattie.

On Saturday, April 23, 2016 at 7:20:06 AM UTC-5, John B. wrote:

But to make a long story short when returning home we overtook a group
of 7 cyclists. All Thai's they were correctly riding down the L.H.
side of the road as the law requires and they were flying flags.

Six of the seven were riding "road bikes" and one was riding (whatever
you call them) a road bike with straight handlebars. All seven were
wearing the usual black cycling shorts and what appeared to be
bicycling shoes and clipless pedals but instead of colorful jerseys
they were wearing sloppy white tee-shirts.

But what made them distinctive was that they each had a small "flag
pole" attached to the top of their helmets with a flag attached.

The interesting thing was that while the flags didn't make the riders
more visible from directly behind them but as they were overtaken they
became very noticeable (Guys with flags on their heads!)


As you said the flags on the helmet did not make them visible from behind. Just from the side when you already knew they were there. Not sure that counts as making them more visible. Visibility is yes-no, on-off, live-dead.. There is not really any degree of visibility. If you see the cyclist, you see him. You cannot see him, visible, and then say I did not see him. You see him or you do not see him. So the flags on the helmet did not make the cyclist visible. You saw the cyclists from behind, knew they were there, drove beside them, and saw the flags on the helmet. The flags did not make the cyclist more visible from behind.

Sloppy white t-shirts. I suppose white shirts in a green landscape are visible. Assume jungle Thailand is green in mid spring or mid fall, whichever side of the equator you happen to be on. Better than black shirts.

I did not know Thailand followed the British system of driving on the wrong side of the road.

On Saturday, April 23, 2016 at 2:41:02 PM UTC-4, wrote:
Snipped
I did not know Thailand followed the British system of driving on the wrong side of the road.

Unfortunatel a LOT of bicyclists in North America also follow the British system of riding on the wrong side of the road. I guess they're like this guy.

As a senior citizen was driving down the freeway, his car phone rang. Answering, he heard his wife's voice urgently warning him, "Herman, I just heard on the news that there's a car going the wrong way on Highway 401. Please be careful!"

"Darn!," said Herman, "It's not just one car. It's hundreds of them!"

Cheers

On 4/23/2016 1:41 PM, wrote:
On Saturday, April 23, 2016 at 7:20:06 AM UTC-5, John B. wrote:

But to make a long story short when returning home we overtook a group
of 7 cyclists. All Thai's they were correctly riding down the L.H.
side of the road as the law requires and they were flying flags.

Six of the seven were riding "road bikes" and one was riding (whatever
you call them) a road bike with straight handlebars. All seven were
wearing the usual black cycling shorts and what appeared to be
bicycling shoes and clipless pedals but instead of colorful jerseys
they were wearing sloppy white tee-shirts.

But what made them distinctive was that they each had a small "flag
pole" attached to the top of their helmets with a flag attached.

The interesting thing was that while the flags didn't make the riders
more visible from directly behind them but as they were overtaken they
became very noticeable (Guys with flags on their heads!)


As you said the flags on the helmet did not make them visible from behind. Just from the side when you already knew they were there. Not sure that counts as making them more visible. Visibility is yes-no, on-off, live-dead. There is not really any degree of visibility. If you see the cyclist, you see him. You cannot see him, visible, and then say I did not see him. You see him or you do not see him. So the flags on the helmet did not make the cyclist visible. You saw the cyclists from behind, knew they were there, drove beside them, and saw the flags on the helmet. The flags did not make the cyclist more visible from behind.

Sloppy white t-shirts. I suppose white shirts in a green landscape are visible. Assume jungle Thailand is green in mid spring or mid fall, whichever side of the equator you happen to be on. Better than black shirts.

I did not know Thailand followed the British system of driving on the wrong side of the road.


Roman Empire= left side
Britain Thailand Japan etc= left side.
Revisionist traffic theory= right side.
You're welcome.

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Frank,

is your concern with opioids related to the musician's overdose ?

1 April, 1971

Florida Tourists both sides

South Americans unknown

Oregonians right mostly with occasional swerves into your lane

New Yorkers your lane is my lane

On Sat, 23 Apr 2016 11:34:09 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 4/23/2016 8:19 AM, John B. wrote:

My wife decreed, this morning, that if I wanted to eat I would have to
take her shopping.

Shopping here in Phuket involves an 80 Km. trip and visiting a large
number of stores. Luckily some of them have interesting things for me
to look at while my "better half" replenishes the pantry.

But to make a long story short when returning home we overtook a group
of 7 cyclists. All Thai's they were correctly riding down the L.H.
side of the road as the law requires and they were flying flags.

Six of the seven were riding "road bikes" and one was riding (whatever
you call them) a road bike with straight handlebars. All seven were
wearing the usual black cycling shorts and what appeared to be
bicycling shoes and clipless pedals but instead of colorful jerseys
they were wearing sloppy white tee-shirts.

But what made them distinctive was that they each had a small "flag
pole" attached to the top of their helmets with a flag attached.

The "flag poles" appeared to be approximately 12 - 16 inches tall and
while I couldn't see how the "flag poles" were attached to what seemed
to be normal cycling helmets they were flying small flags. Perhaps 8 x
10 inches in size, six were flying the Thai National Flag and one was
flying "The King's Flag" - a banner which represents the king.

The interesting thing was that while the flags didn't make the riders
more visible from directly behind them but as they were overtaken they
became very noticeable (Guys with flags on their heads!)

Perhaps this innovation could be implemented as a bicycle safety
feature.

I can also see a real marketing potential here. Whippy little flag
poles with a method of attaching them to a helmet. One could fly all
manner of innovative "flags". One could advertise one's candidate for
president or a notice that "my bike shop is better then your bike
shop" or even a notice that "this cyclist has a right to the road!"

As a safety device they certainly do make the cyclist more noticeable
and in addition that can be used as advertisement for almost anything.
Imagine a thousand people cycling down the road, each with a flag on
their head announcing "100 miles for Bellyaches" or whatever the cause
of the month happens to be.

Perhaps instead of paying for the privilege of riding 100 miles one
could convince the Organizer to pay the riders for advertising their
cause :-) (or at least free water)

If Scharf can get a commission on them, we'll see them touted here very
soon.

After all, if it makes a cyclist more visible, then any cyclist would be
foolish not to use one, right?

The sales possibilities are manifold. Initially a small "flag pole"
with, perhaps a three legged "glue on" base for existing helmets.
Next, the NEW helmet incorporating a mount for a (available at added
cost) flag pole.

And then the overwhelming favorite: The NEW bicycle helmet
incorporating the speed sensitive flag pole (at no additional cost).
The faster you go the more the flag pole bends. At a sedate 7 MPH the
pole will be vertical and as speed increase the air resistance causes
the pole to incline further and further from the vertical.

And, of course, there would also be a market for flags with catchy
messages :-)
--

Cheers,

John B.