Cervélo SA Recalls Bicycle Forks Due to Fall Hazard

wrote:
On Aug 22, 5:59 am, jim beam wrote:
Bret Wade wrote:

I've also broken a Time fork at the dropout while in a race, attacking
up a short climb. Time wouldn't even warranty the fork. The fact that I
had transported my bike on a car roof rack was considered sufficient to
void the warranty.
i'm with time on that one. think about the loading mode - magnitude is
much higher and /not/ that encountered for bike use. and to design it
to accommodate alien application negates the point of designing it for
bike racing.

Right, because nobody ever goes to a bike race
with their bike on the roof, and no professional bike
race ever has team cars following with bikes on
the roof.

Most types of bicycle have been carried on roof
racks without dropout separation - it is a rare event.
This suggests that it is possible to design a dropout
such that it can be carried on a rack, without
hindering its use in everyday cycling or racing.

For rare events, IMO, it would be better for manufacturers
to honor the warranty rather than looking for some
lame excuse to deny it. It's a small expense and the
word-of-mouth-PR value is high (either positive or
negative). However, maybe some manufacturers
attempt to deny all "JRA" claims as a matter of course
and that's what they lumped Bret in with.

Ben


Bianchi USA was the Time distributer at the time and we know how good
their customer service is.

I mispoke in my original post. The fork was out of warranty and I was
just trying to get them to give me a reduced price on a replacement
fork. They could have just said no, pointing the blame at me for using a
roof rack was gratuitous.

Bret

-snip fork blades right off-
Bret Wade wrote:
Bianchi USA was the Time distributer at the time and we know how good
their customer service is.

You had service issues with Binky USA? They treat us very well and are
quite responsive about returns which are relatively small by % of
product. No beef here after many many years with them.
--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

On Aug 22, 11:48*am, A Muzi wrote:
-snip fork blades right off-

Bret Wade wrote:
Bianchi USA was the Time distributer at the time and we know how good
their customer service is.

You had service issues with Binky USA? *They treat us very well and are
quite responsive about returns which are relatively small by % of
product. No beef here after many many years with them.

I think Bret was alluding to a famous "Bianchi are appaling"
thread in rbr, but the generator of that thread was actually
in Europe and we can't blame Binky USA for it.

Ben

wrote:
On Aug 22, 11:48 am, A Muzi wrote:
-snip fork blades right off-

Bret Wade wrote:
Bianchi USA was the Time distributer at the time and we know how good
their customer service is.
You had service issues with Binky USA? They treat us very well and are
quite responsive about returns which are relatively small by % of
product. No beef here after many many years with them.

I think Bret was alluding to a famous "Bianchi are appaling"
thread in rbr, but the generator of that thread was actually
in Europe and we can't blame Binky USA for it.

Ben

Yes I was. We can't blame but we can associate.

Bret

On Aug 22, 7:42 am, "Tom Kunich" cyclintom@yahoo. com wrote:
wrote in message

...



I met a guy last month who crashed on that fork and broke his ankle
quite badly. That was not reported in the official Cervelo statement
which said the worst injury was a broken wrist. He told me this
because I have the exact same fork.

Ilan, I'm still recovering from that crash I had when I broke my fork. It's
been 3 months now and the small bones in my face still haven't knit in
places.

I'm hoping that you will IMMEDIATELY get a replacement fork.

I'm making an appointment for this Sunday. My wife is more worried
than I am, especially since she witnessed my descending style, I
dropped her as she was driving behind me going down Smuggler's Notch
in Vermont and I was doing 50mph at one point which was probably
close to 60 on her speedometer. The descent of Le Revard near Aix-les-
Bains where we have been going is quite bumpy, so the fork issue might
slow me down, actually, probably not.....

I hope your recovery will go smoothly.

-ilan

Eric Vey wrote:
...
If you were George W. Bush, what would you do?

Choke on a pretzel while watching football.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
“Mary had a little lamb / And when she saw it sicken /
She shipped it off to Packingtown / And now it’s labeled chicken.”

On Aug 23, 12:40*am, "
wrote:

I think Bret was alluding to a famous "Bianchi are appaling"
thread

Guppekop:

Very fine thread. I refer to it often for the excellent list found
therein.

wrote:
On Aug 22, 5:59�am, jim beam wrote:
Bret Wade wrote:

I've also broken a Time fork at the dropout while in a race, attacking
up a short climb. Time wouldn't even warranty the fork. The fact that I
had transported my bike on a car roof rack was considered sufficient to
void the warranty.
i'm with time on that one. �think about the loading mode - magnitude is
much higher and /not/ that encountered for bike use. �and to design it
to accommodate alien application negates the point of designing it for
bike racing.

Right, because nobody ever goes to a bike race
with their bike on the roof, and no professional bike
race ever has team cars following with bikes on
the roof.

Most types of bicycle have been carried on roof
racks without dropout separation - it is a rare event.
This suggests that it is possible to design a dropout
such that it can be carried on a rack, without
hindering its use in everyday cycling or racing.

of course you can design a fork for riding on a roof rack! but then
it's not optimized for bicycle racing. have you ever seen a [steel]
bike on a roof rack bent by the cross-winds of the golden gate bridge?
i have. i do not think it reasonable to design a bike to withstand
stresses like that which are /entirely/ outside the scope of intended
operations.




For rare events, IMO, it would be better for manufacturers
to honor the warranty rather than looking for some
lame excuse to deny it. It's a small expense and the
word-of-mouth-PR value is high (either positive or
negative). However, maybe some manufacturers
attempt to deny all "JRA" claims as a matter of course
and that's what they lumped Bret in with.

i don't - that leaves the door wide open to all kinds of misapplication.

jim beam wrote:
wrote:
On Aug 22, 5:59�am, jim beam wrote:
Bret Wade wrote:

I've also broken a Time fork at the dropout while in a race, attacking
up a short climb. Time wouldn't even warranty the fork. The fact that I
had transported my bike on a car roof rack was considered sufficient to
void the warranty.
i'm with time on that one. �think about the loading mode - magnitude is
much higher and /not/ that encountered for bike use. �and to design it
to accommodate alien application negates the point of designing it for
bike racing.

Right, because nobody ever goes to a bike race
with their bike on the roof, and no professional bike
race ever has team cars following with bikes on
the roof.

Most types of bicycle have been carried on roof
racks without dropout separation - it is a rare event.
This suggests that it is possible to design a dropout
such that it can be carried on a rack, without
hindering its use in everyday cycling or racing.

of course you can design a fork for riding on a roof rack! but then
it's not optimized for bicycle racing. have you ever seen a [steel]
bike on a roof rack bent by the cross-winds of the golden gate bridge? i
have. i do not think it reasonable to design a bike to withstand
stresses like that which are /entirely/ outside the scope of intended
operations.




For rare events, IMO, it would be better for manufacturers
to honor the warranty rather than looking for some
lame excuse to deny it. It's a small expense and the
word-of-mouth-PR value is high (either positive or
negative). However, maybe some manufacturers
attempt to deny all "JRA" claims as a matter of course
and that's what they lumped Bret in with.

i don't - that leaves the door wide open to all kinds of misapplication.


i forgot to say - i practice what i preach - i never put a bike on a
rack with a fork fixing. the only ones i'll ever use are those with
independent support bracing. that's if i car pool to a ride. as for my
own vehicle, i only drive hatchbacks or station wagons where the bike
goes in the back - no external carry.

On Aug 23, 10:20*am, jim beam wrote:
wrote:
On Aug 22, 5:59 am, jim beam wrote:
Bret Wade wrote:

I've also broken a Time fork at the dropout while in a race, attacking
up a short climb. Time wouldn't even warranty the fork. The fact that I
had transported my bike on a car roof rack was considered sufficient to
void the warranty.
i'm with time on that one. think about the loading mode - magnitude is
much higher and /not/ that encountered for bike use. and to design it
to accommodate alien application negates the point of designing it for
bike racing.

Right, because nobody ever goes to a bike race
with their bike on the roof, and no professional bike
race ever has team cars following with bikes on
the roof.

Most types of bicycle have been carried on roof
racks without dropout separation - it is a rare event.
This suggests that it is possible to design a dropout
such that it can be carried on a rack, without
hindering its use in everyday cycling or racing.

of course you can design a fork for riding on a roof rack! *but then
it's not optimized for bicycle racing. *have you ever seen a [steel]
bike on a roof rack bent by the cross-winds of the golden gate bridge?
i have. *i do not think it reasonable to design a bike to withstand
stresses like that which are /entirely/ outside the scope of intended
operations.

Beamer,

You didn't say that dropouts should not be designed
to withstand gale force winds on the Golden Gate.
You said carrying a bike on a roof rack _at all_ should
void the fork's warranty. As Jay Beattie said, if you
think that, put a big sticker saying so on the fork when
you sell it.

I think a house roof should withstand a storm, but
not necessarily a hurricane. If my house's roof blew
off in an ordinary Norcal rainstorm and I went to the
builder and he said "I don't guarantee against storms.
Didn't you see the footage from Hurricane Andrew?"
I'd be pretty ****ed off.

For rare events, IMO, it would be better for manufacturers
to honor the warranty rather than looking for some
lame excuse to deny it. *It's a small expense and the
word-of-mouth-PR value is high (either positive or
negative). *However, maybe some manufacturers
attempt to deny all "JRA" claims as a matter of course
and that's what they lumped Bret in with.

i don't - that leaves the door wide open to all kinds of misapplication.

When you have a rare event like a dropout
falling out, there's usually two explanations -
manufacturing fault or user abuse. Sometimes
it's obvious which is which. Sometimes it's not.
A manufacturer can choose to deny all the non-
obvious claims, at the cost of building bad PR.
Sometimes they just give the user the benefit of
the doubt and do the warranty replacement
for the good PR, because the marginal cost
of warranty replacement is small. (Ask Mike J
what percentage of Trek frames ever get
warrantied.)

In any case, dropouts should not fall out of bikes
under ordinary usage. I don't like roof racks myself,
but they are so widespread as to constitute ordinary
usage.

Ben