A Cycling & bikes forum. CycleBanter.com

Go Back   Home » CycleBanter.com forum » rec.bicycles » General
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

NHTSA publishes 2007 bike fatality data



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old December 10th 08, 05:31 PM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Frank Krygowski[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,511
Default NHTSA publishes 2007 bike fatality data

NHTSA's report on 2007 bicyclist (or "pedalcyclist") fatalities is
just out. It shows that cyclist (and pedestrian) fatalities dropped
about 10% from 2006 to 2007. Pedestrian fatalities were also down a
couple percent.

See http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/Pubs/810986.PDF

At first glance, this is good news. But I think the main force
driving the fatality count may be exposure. IOW, there's a chance
that 2007 simply had fewer people riding bikes (or fewer miles ridden)
than in 2006. If anyone knows of data confirming or denying this, I'd
like to see it.

I'm concerned about this because 2008, with its $4/gallon gas prices
in America, was noted for a sharp increase in cycling. With lots of
inexperienced cyclists hitting the roads, I'm betting the news a year
from now will be less pleasant. And I'm betting it will trigger a
rise in "Bicycling is Dangerous" nonsense, with calls for more
discriminatory laws.

(BTW, last I checked, the annual fatality count for cycling was
roughly the same as the fatality count for accidentally inhaling
poisonous gases.)

- Frank Krygowski
Ads
  #2  
Old December 11th 08, 12:31 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Leo Lichtman[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 255
Default NHTSA publishes 2007 bike fatality data


"Frank Krygowski" (clip) I'm concerned about this because 2008, with its
$4/gallon gas prices
in America, was noted for a sharp increase in cycling. With lots of
inexperienced cyclists hitting the roads, I'm betting the news a year
from now will be less pleasant. And I'm betting it will trigger a
rise in "Bicycling is Dangerous" nonsense, with calls for more
discriminatory laws. (clip)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
OTOH, one could argue that each new cyclist, fleeing high gas prices, is one
less driver threatening cyclist's safety. I don't think anyone knows which
way that would push the statistics. Who switches from driving to riding is
certainly not randomly distributed. The people sho leave their cars at home
are going to be predominantly the younger, healthier, more alert. This
means that the older, slower reacting, drivers will still be out there. I'm
80 years old, and I'm trying to be unbiased.


  #3  
Old December 11th 08, 12:56 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Mike Jacoubowsky
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,972
Default NHTSA publishes 2007 bike fatality data

"Leo Lichtman" wrote in message
...

"Frank Krygowski" (clip) I'm concerned about this because 2008, with
its $4/gallon gas prices
in America, was noted for a sharp increase in cycling. With lots of
inexperienced cyclists hitting the roads, I'm betting the news a year
from now will be less pleasant. And I'm betting it will trigger a
rise in "Bicycling is Dangerous" nonsense, with calls for more
discriminatory laws. (clip)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
OTOH, one could argue that each new cyclist, fleeing high gas prices,
is one less driver threatening cyclist's safety. I don't think anyone
knows which way that would push the statistics. Who switches from
driving to riding is certainly not randomly distributed. The people
sho leave their cars at home are going to be predominantly the
younger, healthier, more alert. This means that the older, slower
reacting, drivers will still be out there. I'm 80 years old, and I'm
trying to be unbiased.


There's also a "safety in numbers" thing that happens when more people
ride bicycles. As bicyclists become the norm rather than the exception,
drivers are more likely to drive in a manner that's safer for all.

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA


  #4  
Old December 11th 08, 03:08 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Tom Keats
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,193
Default NHTSA publishes 2007 bike fatality data

In article ,
Frank Krygowski writes:

I'm concerned about this because 2008, with its $4/gallon gas prices
in America, was noted for a sharp increase in cycling. With lots of
inexperienced cyclists hitting the roads, I'm betting the news a year
from now will be less pleasant. And I'm betting it will trigger a
rise in "Bicycling is Dangerous" nonsense, with calls for more
discriminatory laws.


I've come to the admittedly opinionated conclusion that those
who will ride, will. And those who won't, won't. And for the
most part, bicyclists are off the law-makers' radar. I'm not
worried.

(BTW, last I checked, the annual fatality count for cycling was
roughly the same as the fatality count for accidentally inhaling
poisonous gases.)


It seems a fair number of people have carbon monoxided themselves
to death. They didn't realize indoor barbeques are not such a
very good idea. Neither is running a gas-powered generator
indoors when the power goes out during an ice storm.

The reduction in bicyclist & pedestrian fatalities seems to
be contemporaneous with larger Personally-Owned Vehicles
(i.e: SUVs and suchlike) falling out of favour. I haven't
yet looked at the document to which you refer, so I don't
know if non-fatal injuries are up while the number of
incidents remains roughly the same.

As for the numbers regarding numbers of cyclists or miles ridden,
I know you realize that has to be highly subjective. To the
statisticians, a bicycle is a bicycle, whether it's ridden by a
gonzo BMXer doing street-style, a hell-bent-for-leather downhill
mountain biker, a 5-y.o. kid bursting out of a driveway that's
obscured by parked cars, a DUI doing yet another non-recommendable
beer run, a newbie messenger out to prove himself, or whomever.

Maybe people are just becoming more savvy.
That would be nice.


cheers,
Tom

--
Nothing is safe from me.
I'm really at:
tkeats curlicue vcn dot bc dot ca
  #5  
Old December 11th 08, 03:30 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Ryan Cousineau
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,044
Default NHTSA publishes 2007 bike fatality data

In article ,
"Leo Lichtman" wrote:

"Frank Krygowski" (clip) I'm concerned about this because 2008, with its
$4/gallon gas prices
in America, was noted for a sharp increase in cycling. With lots of
inexperienced cyclists hitting the roads, I'm betting the news a year
from now will be less pleasant. And I'm betting it will trigger a
rise in "Bicycling is Dangerous" nonsense, with calls for more
discriminatory laws. (clip)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
OTOH, one could argue that each new cyclist, fleeing high gas prices, is one
less driver threatening cyclist's safety. I don't think anyone knows which
way that would push the statistics.


Yes we do. The fall in the car-driving population from increased cycling
is not substantial, even if there's a dramatic increase in the number of
cyclists.

It's akin to what would happen if 6 million Americans moved to Canada.
The roughly-20% increase in Canada's population would be a dramatic
change. The roughly-2% decrease in the US population would be a
discernable blip.

--
Ryan Cousineau http://www.wiredcola.com/
"In other newsgroups, they killfile trolls."
"In rec.bicycles.racing, we coach them."
  #6  
Old December 11th 08, 02:01 PM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Bruce Gilbert[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 23
Default NHTSA publishes 2007 bike fatality data


"Mike Jacoubowsky" wrote in message
...
"Leo Lichtman" wrote in message
...

"Frank Krygowski" (clip) I'm concerned about this because 2008, with its
$4/gallon gas prices
in America, was noted for a sharp increase in cycling. With lots of
inexperienced cyclists hitting the roads, I'm betting the news a year
from now will be less pleasant. And I'm betting it will trigger a
rise in "Bicycling is Dangerous" nonsense, with calls for more
discriminatory laws. (clip)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
OTOH, one could argue that each new cyclist, fleeing high gas prices, is
one less driver threatening cyclist's safety. I don't think anyone knows
which way that would push the statistics. Who switches from driving to
riding is certainly not randomly distributed. The people sho leave their
cars at home are going to be predominantly the younger, healthier, more
alert. This means that the older, slower reacting, drivers will still be
out there. I'm 80 years old, and I'm trying to be unbiased.


There's also a "safety in numbers" thing that happens when more people
ride bicycles. As bicyclists become the norm rather than the exception,
drivers are more likely to drive in a manner that's safer for all.

--Mike Jacoubowsky
Chain Reaction Bicycles
www.ChainReaction.com
Redwood City & Los Altos, CA USA

Or, they may see a "target-rich environment"

Never underestimate the power of a drunken redneck (or yuppie) in a pickup
truck...

Bruce


  #7  
Old December 15th 08, 01:06 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Stephen Harding
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 386
Default NHTSA publishes 2007 bike fatality data

Frank Krygowski wrote:

I'm concerned about this because 2008, with its $4/gallon gas prices
in America, was noted for a sharp increase in cycling. With lots of
inexperienced cyclists hitting the roads, I'm betting the news a year
from now will be less pleasant. And I'm betting it will trigger a
rise in "Bicycling is Dangerous" nonsense, with calls for more
discriminatory laws.


I had read in WSJ article a month ago that most major cities
had already surpassed bike fatalities for the previous year,
so it seems likely fatalities will be up.

Combined with car fatalities likely lowest since mid-60's we
have bikes being *very* dangerous indeed!!!

Of course now that gas here is back down to $1.60s, the
traveling world will self adjust to its natural order of
cars everywhere and bikes back on their hooks in the garage.

(BTW, last I checked, the annual fatality count for cycling was
roughly the same as the fatality count for accidentally inhaling
poisonous gases.)


Better keep your helmet on!


SMH
  #8  
Old December 15th 08, 01:58 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Frank Krygowski[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,511
Default NHTSA publishes 2007 bike fatality data

On Dec 14, 7:06*pm, Stephen Harding wrote:
Frank Krygowski wrote:


(BTW, last I checked, the annual fatality count for cycling was
roughly the same as the fatality count for accidentally inhaling
poisonous gases.)


Better keep your helmet on!


I was thinking more of mandatory gas masks. Always! Why, if only
_one_ life can be saved ....!

- Frank Krygowski
  #9  
Old December 15th 08, 04:13 AM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,751
Default NHTSA publishes 2007 bike fatality data

Frank Krygowski wrote:

http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/Pubs/810986.PDF

(BTW, last I checked, the annual fatality count for cycling was
roughly the same as the fatality count for accidentally inhaling
poisonous gases.)


Better keep your helmet on!


I was thinking more of mandatory gas masks. Always! Why, if only
_one_ life can be saved ....!


There was no listing of causes of death nor whether the listed deaths
resulted from collisions of motor vehicles with bicycles.

Nowhere in the article did I find what the population of bicyclists
was for the listed fatalities. From this article, any number of
claims could be supported, especially things that are not part of most
state vehicle codes. Typically the following piece in that report
rings of emotional thinking:

# IMPORTANT SAFETY REMINDERS

# All bicyclists should wear properly fitted bicycle helmets every
# time they ride. A helmet is the single most effective way to
# prevent head injury resulting from a bicycle crash. Bicyclists are
# considered vehicle operators; they are required to obey the same
# rules of the road as other vehicle operators, including obeying
# traffic signs, signals, and lane markings.

# When cycling in the street, cyclists must ride in the same direction
# as traffic. Drivers of motor vehicles need to share the road with
# bicyclists. Be courteous – allow at least three feet clearance
# when passing a bicyclist on the road, look for cyclists before
# opening a car door or pulling out from a parking space, and yield to
# cyclists at intersections and as directed by signs and signals. Be
# especially watchful for cyclists when making turns, either left or
# right.

# Bicyclists should increase their visibility to drivers by wearing
# fluorescent or brightly colored clothing during the day, dawn, and
# dusk. To be noticed when riding at night, use a front light and a
# red reflector or flashing rear light, and use retro-reflective tape
# or markings on equipment or clothing.

Nice pablum at best. I don't understand how such a vapid report gets
published.

Jobst Brandt
  #10  
Old December 15th 08, 05:48 PM posted to rec.bicycles.misc
Frank Krygowski[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7,511
Default NHTSA publishes 2007 bike fatality data

On Dec 14, 10:13*pm, wrote:
Frank Krygowski wrote:

*http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/Pubs/810986.PDF

(BTW, last I checked, the annual fatality count for cycling was
roughly the same as the fatality count for accidentally inhaling
poisonous gases.)
Better keep your helmet on!

I was thinking more of mandatory gas masks. *Always! *Why, if only
_one_ life can be saved ....!


There was no listing of causes of death nor whether the listed deaths
resulted from collisions of motor vehicles with bicycles.

Nowhere in the article did I find what the population of bicyclists
was for the listed fatalities. *From this article, any number of
claims could be supported, especially things that are not part of most
state vehicle codes. *Typically the following piece in that report
rings of emotional thinking:

# IMPORTANT SAFETY REMINDERS

# All bicyclists should wear properly fitted bicycle helmets every
# time they ride. *A helmet is the single most effective way to
# prevent head injury resulting from a bicycle crash. *Bicyclists are
# considered vehicle operators; they are required to obey the same
# rules of the road as other vehicle operators, including obeying
# traffic signs, signals, and lane markings.

# When cycling in the street, cyclists must ride in the same direction
# as traffic. *Drivers of motor vehicles need to share the road with
# bicyclists. *Be courteous – allow at least three feet clearance
# when passing a bicyclist on the road, look for cyclists before
# opening a car door or pulling out from a parking space, and yield to
# cyclists at intersections and as directed by signs and signals. *Be
# especially watchful for cyclists when making turns, either left or
# right.

# Bicyclists should increase their visibility to drivers by wearing
# fluorescent or brightly colored clothing during the day, dawn, and
# dusk. *To be noticed when riding at night, use a front light and a
# red reflector or flashing rear light, and use retro-reflective tape
# or markings on equipment or clothing.

Nice pablum at best. *I don't understand how such a vapid report gets
published.


It's been published for decades. The format - including the pablum at
the end - has been consistent for a long time. It's what that agency
(the NHTSA) does.

It's quite normal to have agencies keeping track of fatalities,
accidents, illnesses, etc. in lots of circumstances. For example, the
number of cardiovascular disease fatalities can be found within
minutes. Ditto the number of motorists killed per year.

My interest is driven by a paradox: Bicycling is not only quite safe,
but those who cycle are safer, overall, than those who are sedentary.
Yet cycling is portrayed as uniquely dangerous, and that image tends
to drive people away from a beneficial - and beautiful - activity.

- Frank Krygowski
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
WA - The Great Bike Ride 2007 - November 25, 2007 Andrew Priest Australia 0 August 10th 07 02:55 AM
NHTSA bicycle safety video mark General 34 March 2nd 07 01:02 AM
NYC fatality data Zebee Johnstone Australia 2 September 18th 06 03:35 AM
Fairfax publishes cyclists view (at last) Mc Australia 5 April 25th 05 03:19 PM
Atlanta bike fatality Rivermist General 109 September 13th 04 06:23 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:32 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 CycleBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.