Stronger rubber cement?

caws ura goin' too slow to get flats

but yaknow goin' slow helps find those chain nails in the barbed wire posts

On 2017-01-16 13:39, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Monday, January 16, 2017 at 2:39:18 PM UTC-5, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, January 16, 2017 at 11:03:05 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-16 10:43, David Scheidt wrote:
Joerg wrote:

:Yup. Standard bicycle tubes are usually junk. Would you accept
it if you :had to pump up the tires of your car every two
weeks? Yet most cyclists :think this is "normal".

Automotive tires have a much lower ratio of surface area to
volume than bike tires. They're also run a lower pressure, for
the most part.


Truck tires are often operated around 50psi or higher. Like my
MTB tires are.

A truck tire weights as a much as TWO UCI minimum race bikes -- or
one DH bike. Now throw in the rim. You have peculiar expectations
for bicycles. You're theoretically perfect bike would weigh about
250lbs.

-- Jay Beattie.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. What Joerg's wants in a
bicycle are would be met by a 250cc dirt-motorcycle converted to
pedal power and the engine removed.

I find it astounding that so many others who ride in very harsh
conditions do NOT have the breakages or other problems that Joerg
does.


According to several bicycle shop owners they do. Many said that two
factors allowed them to survive as a business:

1. Mountain bikers breaking stuff all the time.

2. Department store bike buyers who needed help and found that the store
that sold their bikes was less than helpful.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-16 15:05, Duane wrote:
James wrote:
On 17/01/17 04:49, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-04 22:55, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 11:59:28 -0800, Joerg
wrote:

Try these:

https://www.amazon.com/Sunlite-Thorn.../dp/B000BMT2TM


I never looked back. Reviews are mixed and sometimes they do have poor
valve attachment. Also, some are thick only towards the running surface
and that is less protecting than thick all around.

Thanks. I should probably get something like that instead of the
cheap tubes that I've been buying. Note that the cheap tubes seem to
leak without any riding. I've built wheels, applied pressure, and
watched the pressure drop slowly over a period of several days. The
leaks are small, difficult to find, tricky to plug without a patch,
and very irritating.


Yup. Standard bicycle tubes are usually junk. Would you accept it if you
had to pump up the tires of your car every two weeks? Yet most cyclists
think this is "normal".



I prefer pumping up tyres on my road bike every couple of weeks to
riding a slug.


I don't mind topping off my tire pressure daily just to be sure.
Admittedly a bit anal but part of my usual get ready for my ride routine.
The idea of two pounds worth of tubes to avoid putting air in my tires
doesn't parse at all.


That's only a very pleasant side effect for me, not the core reason. The
main reason is that I never get flats with thick tubes despite several
required offroad stretches on my road bike. Unless a side wall blows but
I hope it's just a matter of time until I find road bike tires with
better side walls and correct size (not undersized like Gatorskins).
Took me almost two years for the MTB but now I am pretty happy there.
Especially since those also happen to be the less expsnive tires (from
Asia).

What good does it do to be 2% faster on a ride when you are 20 miles
from home and ... PHSEEEOOOOUUU ...?

[...]


I think I rarely get more than a flat per year if that and when I do we're
talking 10 minutes to replace a tube. It's not the idea of 2% faster,
it's carrying all this extra weight and suffering this poor performance to
prevent something that rarely occurs.

--
duane

On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 10:16:51 -0800, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-01-05 02:04, Tosspot wrote:
On 04/01/17 20:05, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-03 17:04, Joerg wrote:
Gentlemen,

Is there something stronger than the usual rubber cement in the patch
kits? Ideally something that won't dry out so fast or where multiple
cheap small tubes are available.

The reason is that I sometimes have larger holes from side wall
blow-outs. Not inch-long gashes but one or two tenths of an inch long.
The tubes I use are super thick and, therefore, expensive. $15-20 each
and that's not something to be thrown out lightly. Instead of the li'l
REMA patches I need to use thicker rubber from an older sacrified tube
but this has to be vulcanized/cemented really well.


Thanks to all responders (also Barry and Doug). I'll order Slime Rubber
Cement with my next Amazon shipment because that's what David uses, he
says it works well and it isn't expensive:

https://www.amazon.com/Slime-1050-Ru.../dp/B003V9UU66

Whatwhat!! Are you *seriously* claiming r.b.t has been useful!? What
ever is the world coming to?


Usenet is very useful, I guess that's where the name comes from. A lot
of hints here go into my bicycle files, in the sense of "If ... ever
breaks consider replacing it with ..." or "If it breaks don't ever use ...".

When I mentioned in a post in a newsgroup that I had bonked, want to
avoid it but can't stand the cyclist astronaut food or any sweet stuff
someone responded with a link to a recipe for homemade non-sweet power
bars. My wife bakes them to this day. Yesterday I shared these bars with
another rider who really likes them as well. Can't buy them anywhere.


Out of curiosity, is your wife's recipe actually free of sugar, in any
form, or it just doesn't taste sweet?

--
cheers,

John B.

On Monday, January 16, 2017 at 4:46:17 PM UTC-8, Duane wrote:
Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-16 15:05, Duane wrote:
James wrote:
On 17/01/17 04:49, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-04 22:55, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 11:59:28 -0800, Joerg
wrote:

Try these:

https://www.amazon.com/Sunlite-Thorn.../dp/B000BMT2TM


I never looked back. Reviews are mixed and sometimes they do have poor
valve attachment. Also, some are thick only towards the running surface
and that is less protecting than thick all around.

Thanks. I should probably get something like that instead of the
cheap tubes that I've been buying. Note that the cheap tubes seem to
leak without any riding. I've built wheels, applied pressure, and
watched the pressure drop slowly over a period of several days. The
leaks are small, difficult to find, tricky to plug without a patch,
and very irritating.


Yup. Standard bicycle tubes are usually junk. Would you accept it if you
had to pump up the tires of your car every two weeks? Yet most cyclists
think this is "normal".



I prefer pumping up tyres on my road bike every couple of weeks to
riding a slug.


I don't mind topping off my tire pressure daily just to be sure.
Admittedly a bit anal but part of my usual get ready for my ride routine.
The idea of two pounds worth of tubes to avoid putting air in my tires
doesn't parse at all.


That's only a very pleasant side effect for me, not the core reason. The
main reason is that I never get flats with thick tubes despite several
required offroad stretches on my road bike. Unless a side wall blows but
I hope it's just a matter of time until I find road bike tires with
better side walls and correct size (not undersized like Gatorskins).
Took me almost two years for the MTB but now I am pretty happy there.
Especially since those also happen to be the less expsnive tires (from
Asia).

What good does it do to be 2% faster on a ride when you are 20 miles
from home and ... PHSEEEOOOOUUU ...?

[...]


I think I rarely get more than a flat per year if that and when I do we're
talking 10 minutes to replace a tube. It's not the idea of 2% faster,
it's carrying all this extra weight and suffering this poor performance to
prevent something that rarely occurs.

Joerg is content riding heavy, dead tires, even on the road. Some people are like that. I used to ride with a guy who would always carry a back-pack filled with tools. It was penance for some undisclosed sin -- or original sin. Who knows. http://tinyurl.com/zmcjfcl I don't recall him every using one of the tools, nor did I ever see inside the backpack. Judging by its size, I think he had a torch and granite surface plate, just in case he needed quick frame repair.

-- Jay Beattie.

On 2017-01-16 16:44, Duane wrote:
Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-16 15:05, Duane wrote:
James wrote:
On 17/01/17 04:49, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-04 22:55, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 11:59:28 -0800, Joerg
wrote:

Try these:

https://www.amazon.com/Sunlite-Thorn.../dp/B000BMT2TM


I never looked back. Reviews are mixed and sometimes they do have poor
valve attachment. Also, some are thick only towards the running surface
and that is less protecting than thick all around.

Thanks. I should probably get something like that instead of the
cheap tubes that I've been buying. Note that the cheap tubes seem to
leak without any riding. I've built wheels, applied pressure, and
watched the pressure drop slowly over a period of several days. The
leaks are small, difficult to find, tricky to plug without a patch,
and very irritating.


Yup. Standard bicycle tubes are usually junk. Would you accept it if you
had to pump up the tires of your car every two weeks? Yet most cyclists
think this is "normal".



I prefer pumping up tyres on my road bike every couple of weeks to
riding a slug.


I don't mind topping off my tire pressure daily just to be sure.
Admittedly a bit anal but part of my usual get ready for my ride routine.
The idea of two pounds worth of tubes to avoid putting air in my tires
doesn't parse at all.


That's only a very pleasant side effect for me, not the core reason. The
main reason is that I never get flats with thick tubes despite several
required offroad stretches on my road bike. Unless a side wall blows but
I hope it's just a matter of time until I find road bike tires with
better side walls and correct size (not undersized like Gatorskins).
Took me almost two years for the MTB but now I am pretty happy there.
Especially since those also happen to be the less expsnive tires (from
Asia).

What good does it do to be 2% faster on a ride when you are 20 miles
from home and ... PHSEEEOOOOUUU ...?

[...]


I think I rarely get more than a flat per year if that and when I do we're
talking 10 minutes to replace a tube. It's not the idea of 2% faster,
it's carrying all this extra weight and suffering this poor performance to
prevent something that rarely occurs.


Depends on where you ride. Out here people (other than myself) have
flats all the time. Mostly because of goat's head thorn from a plant
that cyclists in this area call "puncture vine". The thorns are hard and
can be 0.300" or longer.

As for weight I schlepp a lot of stuff around and often use my rides for
errands. Road as well as MTB which is why both bikes have sturdy racks
and panniers. So a pound more or less hardly registers. The MTB is
currently in the process of being ruggedized some more so it can haul
more. But first I need to build up a brew fridge. Priorities :-)

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On 2017-01-16 16:50, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 10:16:51 -0800, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-01-05 02:04, Tosspot wrote:
On 04/01/17 20:05, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-03 17:04, Joerg wrote:
Gentlemen,

Is there something stronger than the usual rubber cement in the patch
kits? Ideally something that won't dry out so fast or where multiple
cheap small tubes are available.

The reason is that I sometimes have larger holes from side wall
blow-outs. Not inch-long gashes but one or two tenths of an inch long.
The tubes I use are super thick and, therefore, expensive. $15-20 each
and that's not something to be thrown out lightly. Instead of the li'l
REMA patches I need to use thicker rubber from an older sacrified tube
but this has to be vulcanized/cemented really well.


Thanks to all responders (also Barry and Doug). I'll order Slime Rubber
Cement with my next Amazon shipment because that's what David uses, he
says it works well and it isn't expensive:

https://www.amazon.com/Slime-1050-Ru.../dp/B003V9UU66

Whatwhat!! Are you *seriously* claiming r.b.t has been useful!? What
ever is the world coming to?


Usenet is very useful, I guess that's where the name comes from. A lot
of hints here go into my bicycle files, in the sense of "If ... ever
breaks consider replacing it with ..." or "If it breaks don't ever use ...".

When I mentioned in a post in a newsgroup that I had bonked, want to
avoid it but can't stand the cyclist astronaut food or any sweet stuff
someone responded with a link to a recipe for homemade non-sweet power
bars. My wife bakes them to this day. Yesterday I shared these bars with
another rider who really likes them as well. Can't buy them anywhere.


Out of curiosity, is your wife's recipe actually free of sugar, in any
form, or it just doesn't taste sweet?


It has a pinch of sugar for some reason, not sure if that can be left
out or replaced with something else. You can't taste it though. While
they also mention just a pinch of salt we add several pinches because in
summer one sweats out a lot of salt here.

Got it only in German but if really interested I could translate it:

http://www.chefkoch.de/rezepte/14555...sliriegel.html

It's a little more work than it looks like, with the bacon and all that,
and cutting into bars at the end so they can be packed on a bicycle. My
wife puts all of them into the freezer and then moves as many as needed
to the fridge a couple days before rides.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 11:03:04 -0800, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-01-16 10:43, David Scheidt wrote:
Joerg wrote:

:Yup. Standard bicycle tubes are usually junk. Would you accept it if you
:had to pump up the tires of your car every two weeks? Yet most cyclists
:think this is "normal".

Automotive tires have a much lower ratio of surface area to volume
than bike tires. They're also run a lower pressure, for the most
part.


Truck tires are often operated around 50psi or higher. Like my MTB tires
are.

Have you ever tried to pick up a
truck tire"?

A typical 45" truck tire, say a B.F. Goodrich 445/65R-22.5, weighs,
according to the manufacturer some 215 lbs. Standard operating
pressure is in the neighborhood of 120 psi.

Comparing bicycle tires with tires for other vehicles is, to say the
least, a bit silly.

Unless, of course you plan on a 600 lb. bicycle :-)





... So even if the permiability of the two tires were the same,
car tires would lose pressure slower.


It's the same on motorcycles which have tires similar in shape to what
we ride, just larger.


... Of course, automotive tires are
much more impermiable, because they're heavier and thicker (the
inner liner of a typical car tire weighs as much as a bike tire does,
all by itself.)


Heavier & thicker = better. That why the first line item I look at in
search of a better tire is the weight. Any weight weenie offerings need
not apply.
--
cheers,

John B.

On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 16:23:53 -0800, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-01-16 13:39, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
On Monday, January 16, 2017 at 2:39:18 PM UTC-5, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, January 16, 2017 at 11:03:05 AM UTC-8, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-16 10:43, David Scheidt wrote:
Joerg wrote:

:Yup. Standard bicycle tubes are usually junk. Would you accept
it if you :had to pump up the tires of your car every two
weeks? Yet most cyclists :think this is "normal".

Automotive tires have a much lower ratio of surface area to
volume than bike tires. They're also run a lower pressure, for
the most part.


Truck tires are often operated around 50psi or higher. Like my
MTB tires are.

A truck tire weights as a much as TWO UCI minimum race bikes -- or
one DH bike. Now throw in the rim. You have peculiar expectations
for bicycles. You're theoretically perfect bike would weigh about
250lbs.

-- Jay Beattie.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. What Joerg's wants in a
bicycle are would be met by a 250cc dirt-motorcycle converted to
pedal power and the engine removed.

I find it astounding that so many others who ride in very harsh
conditions do NOT have the breakages or other problems that Joerg
does.


According to several bicycle shop owners they do. Many said that two
factors allowed them to survive as a business:

1. Mountain bikers breaking stuff all the time.

2. Department store bike buyers who needed help and found that the store
that sold their bikes was less than helpful.

Strange. My LBS is a chain of two large shops in Bangkok, and a large
number of agents scattered all over the country, and is the largest
bicycle business in Thailand. They sell predominantly road bikes and
the sales manager tells me that a very large portion of the bikes that
they sell are Carbon. In fact she said that it was much easier to sell
a carbon bike than an aluminum bike.

Do you live in some poor, improvised, area where people can't afford
decent equipment :-?

I wonder whether Andrew's business depends on broken mountain bikes
and cheap walmart stuff?
--
cheers,

John B.

On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 17:11:50 -0800, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-01-16 16:50, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 16 Jan 2017 10:16:51 -0800, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-01-05 02:04, Tosspot wrote:
On 04/01/17 20:05, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-01-03 17:04, Joerg wrote:
Gentlemen,

Is there something stronger than the usual rubber cement in the patch
kits? Ideally something that won't dry out so fast or where multiple
cheap small tubes are available.

The reason is that I sometimes have larger holes from side wall
blow-outs. Not inch-long gashes but one or two tenths of an inch long.
The tubes I use are super thick and, therefore, expensive. $15-20 each
and that's not something to be thrown out lightly. Instead of the li'l
REMA patches I need to use thicker rubber from an older sacrified tube
but this has to be vulcanized/cemented really well.


Thanks to all responders (also Barry and Doug). I'll order Slime Rubber
Cement with my next Amazon shipment because that's what David uses, he
says it works well and it isn't expensive:

https://www.amazon.com/Slime-1050-Ru.../dp/B003V9UU66

Whatwhat!! Are you *seriously* claiming r.b.t has been useful!? What
ever is the world coming to?


Usenet is very useful, I guess that's where the name comes from. A lot
of hints here go into my bicycle files, in the sense of "If ... ever
breaks consider replacing it with ..." or "If it breaks don't ever use ...".

When I mentioned in a post in a newsgroup that I had bonked, want to
avoid it but can't stand the cyclist astronaut food or any sweet stuff
someone responded with a link to a recipe for homemade non-sweet power
bars. My wife bakes them to this day. Yesterday I shared these bars with
another rider who really likes them as well. Can't buy them anywhere.


Out of curiosity, is your wife's recipe actually free of sugar, in any
form, or it just doesn't taste sweet?


It has a pinch of sugar for some reason, not sure if that can be left
out or replaced with something else. You can't taste it though. While
they also mention just a pinch of salt we add several pinches because in
summer one sweats out a lot of salt here.

Got it only in German but if really interested I could translate it:

http://www.chefkoch.de/rezepte/14555...sliriegel.html

It's a little more work than it looks like, with the bacon and all that,
and cutting into bars at the end so they can be packed on a bicycle. My
wife puts all of them into the freezer and then moves as many as needed
to the fridge a couple days before rides.

That looks like a recipe for some sort of Oatmeal cookies with bacon,
rather than the usual "power Bar" concept, which is usually something
that your body can get a quick bunch of energy from to replace what
you have lost.
--
cheers,

John B.