Mountain Bikers Are Unanimous: "There's Nothing Wrong with Riding Trails when Wet"

So much for IMBA's rule against riding wet trails....

Mike


Wed, 17 Oct 2007:
From:
Subject: mud = bad?

In a message dated 10/17/2007 10:48:35 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
writes:

So I recently bought a new bike. I picked up a 08 Specialized
Stumpjumper Expert which I totally love by the way. Lately I have
heard
a lot of talk about winter bikes. A few people have mentioned picking
up a clunker for winter use so as not to ruin the new fancy bike. I
like to ride year round and I really like my new bike but don't want
to
destroy it. So my question is what the heck do I do? Is it really that
bad to ride my bike in the mud? Are there things I can do to minimize
or eliminate the extra wear and tear? Should I just hang out and get
fat all winter?

Thoughts

Steve Atchison

Ride the crap out of it all winter long.

Good mud tires, a front down tube fender and a rear seat mounted
fender will
help. Pedals that work in mud also help like eggbeater or time.

I ride my bikes more in the winter than in the summer. Too many other
things to do in the summer. I clean my bikes after every ride with a
soft car
brush (blue fiber available at Shucks) and a hose. Never shoot water
directly
in areas of bearings. make sure the bike is left to dry inside a
heated
garage or better. I use DAWN dishwashing soap because it does not have
any skin
moisturizers that might contaminate disk break pads.

Lube the chain the night before the next ride with T-9. Wipe off as
much as
you can. Stuff is dynamite. Lube the pivot points on the derailers
every
couple of rides. Use a tube or just about anything that has a long
metal tub
spout, (looks like the needle on a syringe) Only one drop on each
pivot and
then wife off all the extra.

Store your bike upside down the night before the ride. This helps
lubricate
the upper bushing on most forks.

In the spring, if shifting is a problem of a correctly adjusted
derailer,
have the cables replaced. they don't last forever.

Care about your bike and it will care about you. Bike looks great
after
years of use.

Ride that bike!

Sherman Knight
Knight Mediation and The Law Offices of Sherman L. Knight
5400 Carillon Point
Kirkland WA 98033
425-576-4028 wk
425-822-9305 hm
425-576-4029 fax
email

Wed, 17 Oct 2007:
From:
Subject: mud = bad?

get an old bike and make it a singlespeed.

www.soulcraftbikes.com and other companies offer chain tensioners to
aid in the process.

singlespeeds rule in the slop!

Wed, 17 Oct 2007:
From: KevinA
Subject: mud = bad?
--- wrote:

singlespeeds rule in the slop!

And here's the reason WHY they rule in the slop. Its not so much
that the mud and gunk is hard on the *bike* but it IS hard on the
components and the bearings.

A FS bike will have bearings or bushings at the pivot points in
the frame. Mud and slop is going to wrech havoc at those pivot
points. Drivetrains are going to wear down. Same thing goes for
suspension components.

A singlespeed has a straight chainline which deals w/ mud much
better than a derailleur. The derailleur system puts side loads
on the chain to achieve the different gear combinations. I'm not
saying that a singlespeed is better than a geared bike ... I'm
just saying that makes a better winter bike and is easier to
maintain.

So, save your fancy rig for the summer months and get a beater or
singlespeed for the winter.

Kevin
"A Caffeinated Hophead"

Wed, 17 Oct 2007:
From: Jimmy Livengood
Subject: mud = bad?

Ride it! If you want a singlespeed or other clunker, fine. But if you
like your gears and suspension, just allocate your clunker $ to spring
maintenance and enjoy the Stumpjumper year round.

Jimmy

Wed, 17 Oct 2007:
From: "Keith Karlick"
Subject: mud = bad?

Mountain bikes are made (in the metaphoric sense) to be ridden in the
slop.
As with any type of riding the more you ride and the harder conditions
you
ride in the more wear your bike takes. If you rode a ton in the super
dry
east side all summer you are doing damage to the linkage with sand and
everything else. The same works in the slop, all the mud will get into
the
bike. Ride your nice bike in the slop!! You did not buy a nice bike to
ride
a piece or crap in the rain. I remember last year riding in February
near mt
rainier and a couple times during the ride I had to get off and bang
some
ice off the rear derailleur. Unless you like having a super nice paper
weight, go ahead and get out there on the nice bike.

All that being said, in my mind, parts are semi disposable. They
break. I
rebuild my bike every other year or so down to the wheels and have to
replace cables, housings, the normal crap. But I have been riding the
same
bottom bracket, cranks, and rear derailleur for 5+ years. Keep
everything
oiled/ greased and when you do work on your bike, in the winter use
grease
liberally. It repels water from all the important parts. Wipe the
extra oil
off the chain though, that can have a tendency to hold mud. When I am
done
with a ride, I swing by a Brown Bear and hose it down. It is important
to
NOT point the nozzle directly at any component with bearings or
grease
fittings. Basically, if you put grease on it, don't high pressure hose
it.
But for the most part it gets all the slop off and then I go home with
a
clean bike. I have noticed though that my FS bike does not like to be
put
away dirty.

In the end. Ride the bike you like. Especially a mountain bike. Road
bikes
are a different story, keep those nice and pretty.

Wed, 17 Oct 2007:
From: "sk00kes"
Subject: mud = bad? No mud = beautiful

Never baby a mountain bike. If i bust my XO's i'll replace it with
something cheaper, they came stock off my bike so i don't care. Plus
i've run an XTR derailluer for over 2 years on my Enduro ridden
through crummy weather and i've yet to shear it off the frame.
Destroyed derailluers are like flat tires in that sometimes you just
run into a string of bad luck and tear them off.
Here's some key info to help you with your drivetrain if you decide to
ride your bike through winter. As soon as your teeth in your cogs get
thin, replace your whole drivetrain. Cassette, chain, and granny cog
w/steel. Depending on how things go, you should be able to make it a
year (probably more). Your new steel granny cog should last you at
least a couple years. Always carry (including summer rides) chain
lube. If you're on a ride where you pick up a bunch of crud use your
water to clean it a bit, and douche that sucker up. Generally you
should only have to do that once during a really gunky ride, as the
rider usually get's tired of the goopy ride, hence making the time
less that bike has to endure these condtions. Hit Preston Petersons
Reiter Pit ride for an example of this...
As far as pivot points, these all vary on different bikes. If you
start getting play in your rear suspension, replace the bearings
before it get's too bad. On an older Enduro and many other FS frames
i had problems, not so much with this newer Enduro (not the newest
Enduro model, i have a 05 i think) as my rear linkage has no play.
Also whats more important is if you're going to clean anything on your
bike. Cleaning the sliders on the shocks is important as it will
prevent grime from reaching the internals eventually ruining the
suspension. If you ride year round be ready to have your shock and
fork internals serviced/cleaned annually.
All this can be helped with properly cleaning your bike. Run water on
super low pressure from a hose or what have you. Scrub/brush debris,
but don't blast with a high power hose at a car wash. Buy some
bicycle cleaning agents at your local bike store if you want your bike
to be immaculate after a dirty ride.
The singlespeed idea is a good idea, but you could always buy a
hardtail thrash bike with an old Zoke fork, some LX/XT shifters, and
old durable parts and ride like a maniac all the same without having
to be limited by lack of gears, for instance if you're riding
somewhere with steep inclines/elevation like Green Mountain/Reiter
Pit...
This again brings me to the question of when or if they're going to
give internal-geared hubs with belt drive a chance to really happen.
Yah yah yah i know they weigh alot....

There is always a danger of wear and tear on a bike, and i think the
danger of breaking components is only marginally increased from wet
season to dry season. Whaddya want your bike to last forever?

Most people who ride burn through a bike every couple of years
anyways.

Couple more tips, when you get your frame you will have sections on
your bike that will have cable rub. Buy some clear plate sealer
(clear sticker) from a motorcycle shop and cut out circular patches.
Introduce grime into a bad area that has cable rub, and you can dig a
mini-trench into your frame.

Plus after all that is said, there are always places to ride where you
will avoid the piggy slop. Some trails are muddier than others. Some
trails mothers are muddier than other trails mothers haha.. smiths...

Good luck.

Wed, 17 Oct 2007:
From: "bob"
Subject: mud = bad? No mud = beautiful

They say bikes with VPP suspension designs are bad on pivots/bearings,
but
I'm going on my third winter and have had no problems. One thing that
seems
to help is Never-seize; it's way better than the stuff used in most
bike
shops. Never-seize holds up against moisture better than regular
grease,
that's what it was designed to do; never-seize is what ya use
offshore; I've
had good luck with it.

I ride all winter long and try to keep to the trails bedded with rock
and
sand; they tend to drain well. Many of the trails at Sawyer are in
good
shape all winter but there are a few trails you don't want to ride;
too
soft, mucky and it does too much damage.

SeaTac is a great place to ride in the winter; water drains off the
trail
better than most areas. Griffin Creek is another good place to ride
when it
gets wet; the rocky trails don't get too mucky.

When our local trails are washed out, Anacortes is a good place to
ride;
Cranberry Lake is usually in good shape. I don't ride on trails when
the mud
gets deep but it occasionally by accident. I've seen some mud pits at
Tolt
that are to be avoided at all cost; very deep. I've seen and heard of
people
loosing their shoes in deep mud, but it's never happened to me; knock
on
wood:)

One thing for sure is you're bike parts will hold up longer if you use
never-seize and don't use a hose to wash it down. Once I started
letting the
mud dry and then wiping it off with a rag, my bike was a lot happier.
Another thing I do is put a coat of wax on after every ride; of course
I use
Turtle Wax: It helps a lot when you go to clean off the mud. My 2
cents

Wed, 17 Oct 2007:
From: "ken h"
Subject: mud = bad? No mud = beautiful

ride, ride, ride.

winter riding is harder on the bike, takes much more time on between
rides and maintenance, and you will wear out parts. as miles davis
said "so what"

many folks on this list have there own way of doing things, from my
experience here's my advice:

-- fleece socks; cold feet are not happy feet. cotton socks lead
quickly to cold feet.
-- other synthetic layers are also worthy. and i've gone years and
years without any type of rain shell.
-- no need to use a hose. i put my bike in my garage after a ride, and
then once the mud is dried it easily wipes off. and then i clean the
drive train & braking surfaces each ride.
-- when replacing the chain and granny, replace the mid-ring too or
visa-versa. with a new chain, chain-suck is much more likely.

ken h.

Thu, 18 Oct 2007:
From: "bcrowley20"
Subject: mud = bad?

You got it. Don't listen to those clean bike nancies :-) It's a
MOUNTAIN bike. Ride it all winter long. Give it a little
maintenance now and then and you will be fine.

Wed, 17 Oct 2007:
From: "Brian"
Subject: mud = bad?

I pretty much do what every one else is doing, I wash after each use
but I do not use any soap, especially any soap that cuts grease, I
just use my hand on painted surfaces with lots of water, I use a nice
stiff brush on my tires and a long soft brush for hard to reach places
like behind my derailers, in-between my shift pods and break levers,
hubs etc.

I bounce my bicycle vigorously a few times then bring it in my kitchen
to drip dry. I run it like that all winter and replace bearings and
bushings that need replacing in late spring and do the shift cables
and a full tune at that time.

I, like you, like my paint... before each ride I use pledge furnisher
polish, its good stuff, it has carnauba in it and it smells great.
don't forget to get some kind of rubber or black electrical tape in
that spot where your shift cables rubs on your head tube, those cables
will eat your paint right off.

lastly, I'd like to add that while I do care about your bicycle, I
don't care about it quite as much as the trails that we share... in
other words, during the long wet winter months the club endorses a
tred lightly kind of trail usage and suggests riding on trails that
are well draining.

Is mud bad for our bikes? Yes, ride it anyway. is mud bad for the
trail? Yes, very bad, use your best judgment and research the best
places to ride that are well built and or well draining
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande

On Oct 17, 8:28 pm, Mike Vandeman wrote:
So much for IMBA's rule against riding wet trails....

I'm a mountain biker, and I don't agree, so I guess it's not
unanimous.

E.P.

On Sat, 20 Oct 2007 02:34:29 -0000, Ed Pirrero
wrote:

On Oct 17, 8:28 pm, Mike Vandeman wrote:
So much for IMBA's rule against riding wet trails....

I'm a mountain biker, and I don't agree, so I guess it's not
unanimous.

Then why haven't you objected to IMBA's weak rules, and BBTC's riding
habits???

E.P.
--
I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is off-limits to
humans ("pure habitat"). Want to help? (I spent the previous 8
years fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of your body that you are fond of!

http://home.pacbell.net/mjvande