Stupid Americans! -- Stupid... Stupid... STUPID!!! ___________ ylojceq

"Chuck Davis" wrote in message
...
| "Tom Sherman" wrote in message
| ...
| ...
| Don't be stupid.
|
| Here is voter turnout data for representative democracies in Europe.
| Except for Switzerland, all are well ahead of the US in voter turnout.
|
http://www.idea.int/publications/voter_turnout_weurope/part%20II%20(78-93).
pdf.
|
| --
| Tom Sherman
|
| Wow! That's a new record! I usually have to say a lot more before I'm
| called "stupid". Your comment "Many recent elections in other countries
| have had voter turnouts of better than 90%, which puts the ~59% of the
2004
| US election to shame." implies a direct relationship between "betterness"
| and voter turnout. That's how I read it.
|
| You certainly know more than I do in that area (no sarcasm intended). I
see
| from your document that Austria, for example, is way up there. I have no
| idea what the issues and candidates are and have been. Maybe most people
| see major shifts in government policy that will affect them directly and
| that motivates them to vote. Conversely, maybe U.S. voters saw it as six
of
| one, a half dozen of the other. Maybe Austria's history is a motivator.
| Why is Switzerland lower than the U.S.? I just don't have enough
| information to judge the shamefulness of a ~59% turnout.
|
| I also noticed that the document you refer to shows the percentage of
| "registered" voters who actually voted. According to
|
| http://www.census.gov/prod/2002pubs/p20-542.pdf
|
| the percentage of "registered" voters in the U.S. who actually voted in
the
| 2000 election is about 85%. I couldn't find a figure for this election.
In
| order to make a more valid comparison, we need the number of eligible
voters
| from those European countries who actually vote. I saw that was referred
to
| as VAP in your document, but I couldn't find any figures.
|
| Regardless, I appreciate each and every person who didn't vote who could
| have - it makes my vote worth that much more.
|
| Chuck Davis
|
....Regardless, I appreciate each and every person who didn't vote who could
have - it makes my vote worth that much more....

Chuck Davis

That's always been my feeling as well.
The perfect election results will only occur when everyone other than myself
stays home.

Further, the 'get-out-the-vote' nonsense is what brings out the newly
registered voter who had to ask: "What does incumbent mean next to this
guy's name?"

ED3

Todd Kuzma wrote:
In article ,
Jim Smith wrote:

Damn. I was thinking of buying something from Yellow Jersey, now
there is no way I can and still sleep at night. Glad I found out
sooner than later though.

I would hope that you aren't serious about that. A number of people
involved in political discussions here own businesses, including me.
I think that we all would like to participate without being punished
for our views.

Then please take it somewhere OTHER than *bicycles" forum.
Business is business IMO - in the store, off the net, on a forum...


--
- Zilla
Cary, NC
(Remove XSPAM)

Todd Kuzma wrote:
In article ,
Jim Smith wrote:

Damn. I was thinking of buying something from Yellow Jersey, now
there is no way I can and still sleep at night. Glad I found out
sooner than later though.

I would hope that you aren't serious about that. A number of people
involved in political discussions here own businesses, including me.
I think that we all would like to participate without being punished
for our views.

Then please take it somewhere OTHER than *bicycles" forum.
Business is business IMO - in the store, off the net, on a forum...


--
- Zilla
Cary, NC
(Remove XSPAM)

"Chalo" wrote
I can't
fathom the twisted lack of ordinary decency that would allow ordinary
folk to actively promote Bush's vile mixture of injustice, lies and
butchery, and frankly I don't wish to understand it. It would only
make me a lesser person to do so.

This is one of the reasons Kerry lost.

Pete

"Chalo" wrote
I can't
fathom the twisted lack of ordinary decency that would allow ordinary
folk to actively promote Bush's vile mixture of injustice, lies and
butchery, and frankly I don't wish to understand it. It would only
make me a lesser person to do so.

This is one of the reasons Kerry lost.

Pete

Rick Warner wrote in message . ..
On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 11:27:04 -0600, Tom Sherman
wrote:


incorrectly counted optically scanned votes in Florida and serious
disagreements with exit polls in Florida, Ohio, and other states).

My favorite at the moment is the precint in Ohio where less than 700
folks voted but W got something like 3600 votes. It was an outsider
scanning the results who noticed the inconsistency, which election
officials are calling an isolated malfunction of a single voting
machine. Hmmmmmm. Brings to mind the old saying 'vote early and
vote often'. Apparently so.

- rick

There have been questions to the veracity of the insinuation of the
'glitch'.

It was in the news last week, all the major carriers were reporting
it. For example, see:
http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/...g.problems.ap/ or
http://finance.lycos.com/qc/news/sto...9_200411051108

- rick

Rick Warner wrote in message . ..
On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 11:27:04 -0600, Tom Sherman
wrote:


incorrectly counted optically scanned votes in Florida and serious
disagreements with exit polls in Florida, Ohio, and other states).

My favorite at the moment is the precint in Ohio where less than 700
folks voted but W got something like 3600 votes. It was an outsider
scanning the results who noticed the inconsistency, which election
officials are calling an isolated malfunction of a single voting
machine. Hmmmmmm. Brings to mind the old saying 'vote early and
vote often'. Apparently so.

- rick

There have been questions to the veracity of the insinuation of the
'glitch'.

It was in the news last week, all the major carriers were reporting
it. For example, see:
http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/...g.problems.ap/ or
http://finance.lycos.com/qc/news/sto...9_200411051108

- rick

Tom Kunich wrote:

Tom Sherman wrote in message ...

Tom Kunich wrote:


"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...


Or maybe both the candidates with a chance of winning did nothing to
inspire people to vote.


I guess that's why this was the biggest turnout in election history.

In US election history for total numbers of voters, yes.

Many recent elections in other countries have had voter turnouts of
better than 90%, which puts the ~59% of the 2004 US election to shame.


So, Tom, how many of these countries had populations exceeding 100 million?

What difference does that make? About as much as what percentage wore
bicycle helmets to the polls.

--
Tom Sherman

Tom Kunich wrote:

Tom Sherman wrote in message ...

Tom Kunich wrote:


"Tom Sherman" wrote in message
...


Or maybe both the candidates with a chance of winning did nothing to
inspire people to vote.


I guess that's why this was the biggest turnout in election history.

In US election history for total numbers of voters, yes.

Many recent elections in other countries have had voter turnouts of
better than 90%, which puts the ~59% of the 2004 US election to shame.


So, Tom, how many of these countries had populations exceeding 100 million?

What difference does that make? About as much as what percentage wore
bicycle helmets to the polls.

--
Tom Sherman

(Chalo) wrote in message . com...
A Muzi wrote:

Well, I did. And I wrote RNC two checks this summer.

I am deeply disappointed that you chose to underwrite the political
manifestation of bigotry, deception, greed, and mass murder. On
ordinary matters of political issues, I am willing to differ, but for
this I am afraid I can no longer count you among my friends.

The pervasive view of this sharp and motivated man of action
as an 'imbecile' or 'moron' works very much to his favor.
Thanks for underestimating him.

Don't you mean "misunderestimating" him?

He is a disgrace to the country and so are his supporters. I can't
fathom the twisted lack of ordinary decency that would allow ordinary
folk to actively promote Bush's vile mixture of injustice, lies and
butchery, and frankly I don't wish to understand it. It would only
make me a lesser person to do so.

Chalo Colina

Dear Chalo,

I hope that you think some more about this.

Are you really so rich in friends that you can
throw us away like this?

What if the rest of your friends start wondering
whether Andrew is losing anything of value?

If this is how you treat friends, what will you
do to strangers who come to your shop?

Carl Fogel