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Horst link bending forces



 
 
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  #91  
Old February 10th 18, 10:48 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Joerg[_2_]
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Default Horst link bending forces

On 2018-02-08 17:48, John B. wrote:
On Thu, 8 Feb 2018 01:32:21 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

On Thursday, February 8, 2018 at 10:19:31 AM UTC+1, Emanuel Berg
wrote:
lou.holtman wrote:

The problem is the capacity of the DA RD. Off course you can
make it work mixing groupset parts but that is not my point. If
you only want it to work buy 105 but then you get also a heavy
groupset with an ugly finish.

Don't take this the wrong way but this sounds like some hang-up.
I mean, I have hang-ups myself so I'm not judgemental. But
especially since you say you don't really feel any difference
except for maybe when not clean and in a 20km 11% hill...? It
sounds like bringing so much stuff to K2 suddenly the caravan
can't continue because to feed all the porters, you need even
more porters?

-- underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573

I don't know what you trying to say. What I'm trying to say is that
there are a lot of people that like the incredible shifting
performance, the low weight, the looks of DA gruppo and are willing
to pay the price but they also need low enough gearing which is not
available in DA. From Shimano marketing point of view I find this
strange because the margine of DA is much larger that of 105 or
Ultegra.

Lou


I might comment that I have substituted various Shimano made
cassettes with various Shimano shifters and crank sets and even made
up "custom" cassettes using Shimano parts taken from other Shimano
cassettes. To data they have all shifted with no problems, assuming
of course that one doesn't try to mix numbers of sprockets, i.e.
don't mix 7 speed and 9 speed, for example. -- Cheers,


I have swapped cogs between 5, 6 and 7-speed. Shifting was fine, maybe
not as speedy and smooth as a clean HG cassette but for non-professional
riders like myself good enough. It just looked odd, black cogs inside a
stack where most others were silver. If I ride on roads a lot they all
turn black soon anyhow.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/
Ads
  #92  
Old February 11th 18, 02:02 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
John B.[_3_]
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Posts: 3,967
Default Horst link bending forces

On Sat, 10 Feb 2018 20:10:03 +0100, Emanuel Berg
wrote:

John B. wrote:

I might comment that I have substituted
various Shimano made cassettes with various
Shimano shifters and crank sets and even made
up "custom" cassettes using Shimano parts
taken from other Shimano cassettes. To data
they have all shifted with no problems,
assuming of course that one doesn't try to
mix numbers of sprockets, i.e. don't mix 7
speed and 9 speed, for example.


I have compiled some info on this, and
especially the 10S narrow casette with
"direction" (?), that seems to work with
105, Ultegra and DA.

Note: The table is probably very incomplete!

BTW except for "direction" which I don't
understand, what does the "CN-" prefix
mean? China?


----------------------------------------------------------------------
CASETTE [1] PIN LENGTH mm PRODUCT
----------------------------------------------------------------------
6 S 7.8 (5/16") KMC Basic 408: 1/2"x3/32" [2]
7 S 7.3 (9/32")
8 S 7.1 (9/32")
9 S 6.6-6.8 (1/4-9/32")
10 S 6.2 (1/4") Campagnolo, Shimano
10 S N 5.88 (7/32") Campa, KMC
10 S N D 5.88 (7/32") Sh. CN-5700, 6700, 7900 [3]
11 S 5.5 (7/32") Campa, KMC, Sh. CN-9000 [4]
----------------------------------------------------------------------

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php...icycle%20chain
[1] speed, narrow, direction
[2] (plate length) x (roller width)
[3] 105, Ultegra, Dura-Ace
[4] Dura-Ace 11S


I'm not sure what some of your dimensions are intended to show but you
might be interested in
http://www.bike.bikegremlin.com/2015...ear-sprockets/
which shows the sprocket thickness and spacing for cassettes ranging
from 6 to 11 cogs.
--
Cheers,

John B.

  #93  
Old February 11th 18, 07:12 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 250
Default Horst link bending forces

On Saturday, February 10, 2018 at 8:10:07 PM UTC+1, Emanuel Berg wrote:
John B. wrote:

I might comment that I have substituted
various Shimano made cassettes with various
Shimano shifters and crank sets and even made
up "custom" cassettes using Shimano parts
taken from other Shimano cassettes. To data
they have all shifted with no problems,
assuming of course that one doesn't try to
mix numbers of sprockets, i.e. don't mix 7
speed and 9 speed, for example.


I have compiled some info on this, and
especially the 10S narrow casette with
"direction" (?), that seems to work with
105, Ultegra and DA.

Note: The table is probably very incomplete!

BTW except for "direction" which I don't
understand, what does the "CN-" prefix
mean? China?


It is Shimano's short for chain followed by a number indication the quality of the chain.

Lou
  #94  
Old February 11th 18, 11:06 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Tim McNamara
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Posts: 6,815
Default Horst link bending forces

On Sat, 10 Feb 2018 14:42:34 -0800, Joerg
wrote:
On 2018-02-10 14:27, Tim McNamara wrote:
I happened to be looking at a drawing of the skeletal structure of
the human shoulder and realized that the collarbone is basically a
Horst link.


Is that why it breaks so often in bicycle crashes?


Only from excessive horsting around.

Ba-da-bump. I'll be here all week. Enjoy the salad.
  #95  
Old February 13th 18, 07:44 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Emanuel Berg[_2_]
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Posts: 906
Default Horst link bending forces

lou.holtman wrote:

It is Shimano's short for chain followed by
a number indication the quality of the chain.


OK, thanks!

Does that mean, if this line is correct

10 S N D 5.88 (7/32") Sh. CN-5700, 6700, 7900

that Shimano has no less than three chains all
the same size, only with different quality, and
they correspond to their 105, Ultegra and
Dura-Ace groups?

So at least on this casette, there is no
problem in theory mixing components from any of
those groups?

This brings me the thought, to what extent do
these groups differ in technology and to what
extent are they the same only with different
quality and detail finish to appeal to
different economic segments of the
cycling world?

--
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
  #96  
Old February 13th 18, 07:46 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Emanuel Berg[_2_]
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Posts: 906
Default Horst link bending forces

John B. wrote:

I'm not sure what some of your dimensions are
intended to show


I'm trying to understand more advanced bikes
but it is very difficult when you don't have
a couple to examine first hand!

Perhaps you can send me a couple of DA-equipped
carbon frames to help me with this problem?

--
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
  #97  
Old February 13th 18, 09:25 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
AMuzi
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Posts: 9,551
Default Horst link bending forces

On 2/13/2018 1:46 PM, Emanuel Berg wrote:
John B. wrote:

I'm not sure what some of your dimensions are
intended to show


I'm trying to understand more advanced bikes
but it is very difficult when you don't have
a couple to examine first hand!

Perhaps you can send me a couple of DA-equipped
carbon frames to help me with this problem?


did you look at all? There's one under every rock:

http://www.bianchiusa.com/bikes/road...-dura-ace-mix/

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #98  
Old February 13th 18, 11:10 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Emanuel Berg[_2_]
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Posts: 906
Default Horst link bending forces

AMuzi wrote:

On 2/13/2018 1:46 PM, Emanuel Berg wrote:

John B. wrote:

I'm not sure what some of your dimensions are
intended to show

I'm trying to understand more advanced bikes but it is very difficult when you don't have a couple to examine first hand!
Perhaps you can send me a couple of DA-equipped carbon frames to help me with this problem?


did you look at all? There's one under every
rock:

http://www.bianchiusa.com/bikes/road...-dura-ace-mix/


This has a "Shimano Ultegra 11sp" chain,
I wonder if that is the same as "Shimano
Ultegra 6800/XT M8000 HG701 11-Speed
Chain" [1].

If "chain width" is the same as "pin length",
this one is 5.62mm which means it isn't in my
table

[1] http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/s.../rp-prod119827

--
underground experts united
http://user.it.uu.se/~embe8573
 




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