Anybody have a good source for reproduction decals?

On 2007-08-17, !Jones wrote:

The subject says it all.

http://stores.ebay.com/Cyclomondo_W0...amesstQQtZk m


--

John )

On Aug 17, 6:43 pm, Ozark Bicycle
wrote:
On Aug 17, 6:12 pm, Hank Wirtz wrote:





On Aug 17, 12:24 pm, (Donald Gillies) wrote:

- Greg Softley in Australia - DECALS ONLY

ebay moniker : cyclomondo

http://stores.ebay.com/Cyclomondo_W0...amefsQ3amesstQ...

Greg has a large selection of Reynolds 531 and Columbus decals, and
has recently started offering full decal sets for often-restored
bikes, such as Colnago Supers, Raleigh Team, Olmo, Merckx,
Pogliaghi, and Cinelli.

Greg is unique in offering turnkey matched decalsets, and that is
the main advantage of his business.

I've bought several tubing repro decals from Greg, and both the decal
quality and service are top-notch. Even having them mailed from
Australia only takes a few (2 or 3) days to arrive in the US. When I
had my PX-10 repainted, I used NOS 531 decals. In retrospect I wish I
would have used Greg's repros because the NOS ones have already
started to crack. I may just get a set of repros and apply them over
the top.

- cyclartwww.cyclart.com-DECALSAND TRANSFERS

has a very good selection of decals, many vintage, many done
in-house. Also offers sssink.com decals. Art that is done in-house
is only available to customers who are restoring bikes at the
Cyclart shop. I have heard it said that Cyclart always makes a
small mistake in each decal, thinking they are avoiding copyright
infringement.

I don't believe that last bit's true. I wrote them about retail sales
of repro decals, and they replied that they only will sell them in
conjunction with a respray, because they have agreements with
rightsholders to only apply the decals to the genuine frame as
appropriate.

A more common, and probably more accurate, explanation is that Cyclart
doesn't want you buying the decals from them and getting your frame
painted elsewhere for less than Cyclart's "king's ransom" prices. This
was especially effective in the past, before decals were more widely
available.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I have a '72 Coppi frame with the original foil headtube sticker, but
CycleArt wanted me to ship it to them to
1. confirm it was real
2. "restore" the paint
3. apply the decals "correctly"

I think Ozark is probably right here.

In article ,
A Muzi wrote:

Bill Sornson wrote:
Sure, here ya go:
http://www.cartoonstock.com/lowres/mpe0048l.jpg
HTH!

Family newsgroup, buddy.

Sure. Putting someone in the family way.

--
Michael Press

On Aug 18, 10:06 pm, still me wrote:
On Sat, 18 Aug 2007 16:43:27 -0000,
wrote:



I don't believe that last bit's true. I wrote them about retail sales
of repro decals, and they replied that they only will sell them in
conjunction with a respray, because they have agreements with
rightsholders to only apply the decals to the genuine frame as
appropriate.

A more common, and probably more accurate, explanation is that Cyclart
doesn't want you buying the decals from them and getting your frame
painted elsewhere for less than Cyclart's "king's ransom" prices. This
was especially effective in the past, before decals were more widely
available.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I have a '72 Coppi frame with the original foil headtube sticker, but
CycleArt wanted me to ship it to them to
1. confirm it was real
2. "restore" the paint
3. apply the decals "correctly"

I think Ozark is probably right here.

I agree. If they told you that "rights" story they are FOS. They're
just trying to protect their market share and get you to go through
them.

I dug up the email:

"We have extensive decal and art files and have the decals you seek.
However:
We're sorry that we cannot sell you the decals you request because the
trademark is owned by others, not us. When we purchase decals from the
manufacturer, or reproduce them for a restoration, we guarantee that
they are applied to the correct frame and that the frame is
roadworthy. To do so we must have the frame here to inspect. In this
way we can assure manufacturers that we are neither causing them
increased liability nor allowing their trade name to be misused or
resold without their control. It is not necessary that we completely
refinish your frame to supply decals. We can replace tattered decals
on frames with original finishes or as part of a touch up. We also
feel that tight control of our reproduction decals helps preserve the
integrity of the collector bicycle market. Note that although painting
is our primary business we are also strong proponents of maintaining
valuable bikes in original finish including "patina".
Sometimes you can obtain replacement decals from the manufacturers
directly.
Thanks for understanding, may we estimate a touch up or complete
refinish for you?"

I agree that their goal is to drum up paint business, but they are
definitely invoking intellectual property rights in their explanation.

On Aug 19, 3:11 am, Hank Wirtz wrote:
On Aug 18, 10:06 pm, still me wrote:



On Sat, 18 Aug 2007 16:43:27 -0000,
wrote:

I don't believe that last bit's true. I wrote them about retail sales
of repro decals, and they replied that they only will sell them in
conjunction with a respray, because they have agreements with
rightsholders to only apply the decals to the genuine frame as
appropriate.

A more common, and probably more accurate, explanation is that Cyclart
doesn't want you buying the decals from them and getting your frame
painted elsewhere for less than Cyclart's "king's ransom" prices. This
was especially effective in the past, before decals were more widely
available.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I have a '72 Coppi frame with the original foil headtube sticker, but
CycleArt wanted me to ship it to them to
1. confirm it was real
2. "restore" the paint
3. apply the decals "correctly"

I think Ozark is probably right here.

I agree. If they told you that "rights" story they are FOS. They're
just trying to protect their market share and get you to go through
them.

I dug up the email:

"We have extensive decal and art files and have the decals you seek.
However:
We're sorry that we cannot sell you the decals you request because the
trademark is owned by others, not us. When we purchase decals from the
manufacturer, or reproduce them for a restoration, we guarantee that
they are applied to the correct frame and that the frame is
roadworthy. To do so we must have the frame here to inspect. In this
way we can assure manufacturers that we are neither causing them
increased liability nor allowing their trade name to be misused or
resold without their control. It is not necessary that we completely
refinish your frame to supply decals. We can replace tattered decals
on frames with original finishes or as part of a touch up. We also
feel that tight control of our reproduction decals helps preserve the
integrity of the collector bicycle market. Note that although painting
is our primary business we are also strong proponents of maintaining
valuable bikes in original finish including "patina".
Sometimes you can obtain replacement decals from the manufacturers
directly.
Thanks for understanding, may we estimate a touch up or complete
refinish for you?"

I agree that their goal is to drum up paint business, but they are
definitely invoking intellectual property rights in their explanation.

Yes, they have have a nice, long-winded "rationale", but it's just a
smokescreen, IMO.

On Fri, 17 Aug 2007 16:12:16 -0700, in rec.bicycles.tech Hank Wirtz
wrote:

I don't believe that last bit's true. I wrote them about retail sales
of repro decals, and they replied that they only will sell them in
conjunction with a respray, because they have agreements with
rightsholders to only apply the decals to the genuine frame as
appropriate.

That could be so; however, consider Harley Davidson: few guard their
trademark as jealously. OTOH, you can buy HD decal sets. Once you
buy the decal (and render unto Ceasar), you may apply the original to
anything you wish as long as you don't copy it.

Why would anyone pay for a decal set and apply it to a different
bicycle? (OK, I used to drive a Dodge that had a "FORD" decal in the
back window, but I was just being an oddball.) Why would a copyright
holder care? Obviously, the product isn't in production; if it were,
there'd be no market for repop decals.

It could also be that the original copyright has expired and that the
graphic shop wants to protect their investment. That, or they want to
sell spray jobs.

Jones

On Sun, 19 Aug 2007 12:23:14 GMT, !Jones wrote:

On Fri, 17 Aug 2007 16:12:16 -0700, in rec.bicycles.tech Hank Wirtz
wrote:

I don't believe that last bit's true. I wrote them about retail sales
of repro decals, and they replied that they only will sell them in
conjunction with a respray, because they have agreements with
rightsholders to only apply the decals to the genuine frame as
appropriate.

That could be so; however, consider Harley Davidson: few guard their
trademark as jealously. OTOH, you can buy HD decal sets. Once you
buy the decal (and render unto Ceasar), you may apply the original to
anything you wish as long as you don't copy it.

Why would anyone pay for a decal set and apply it to a different
bicycle? (OK, I used to drive a Dodge that had a "FORD" decal in the
back window, but I was just being an oddball.) Why would a copyright
holder care? Obviously, the product isn't in production; if it were,
there'd be no market for repop decals.

It could also be that the original copyright has expired and that the
graphic shop wants to protect their investment. That, or they want to
sell spray jobs.

Jones
IF they have an agreement with an existing bicycle manufacturer to
provide replacement decals for that company's bikes, and that company
does not want "clones" of their bikes running around giving them a bad
name, they have every right, and good reason, to control where these
decals are ultimately applied.
In most cases supplying a valid serial number would be sufficient, but
that only guarantees you have seen a genuine bike and got it's serial
number, - it does not guarantee the decal is only applied to that
genuine frame. It also does not guarantee the frame getting the decal
is in roadworthy condition.

I can definitely see their position. I can also see how shipping a
bike frame across the country to get a decal replaced would be a royal
PITA.

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Sun, 19 Aug 2007 13:31:01 -0400, in rec.bicycles.tech clare at
snyder.on.ca wrote:

IF they have an agreement with an existing bicycle manufacturer to
provide replacement decals for that company's bikes, and that company
does not want "clones" of their bikes running around giving them a bad
name, they have every right, and good reason, to control where these
decals are ultimately applied.

Yeah, such an arrangement certainly could exist. OTOH, if the unit is
currently in production, then the manufacturer stocks the decals.

A good repop decal set costs about 40 bucks or so. I suppose that I
could drop them onto some other machine, but why? Of course, I did
once see a '70s era Santana tandem sporting Paramount decals at a
tandem rally; few were fooled and, if they were, then what difference
did it make? If the beholder can't tell one frame from another, then
how does that impact Schwinn's reputation?

Jones

On Aug 19, 6:14 pm, still me wrote:
On Sun, 19 Aug 2007 13:33:58 -0500, !Jones wrote:

Yeah, such an arrangement certainly could exist. OTOH, if the unit is
currently in production, then the manufacturer stocks the decals.

A good repop decal set costs about 40 bucks or so. I suppose that I
could drop them onto some other machine, but why? Of course, I did
once see a '70s era Santana tandem sporting Paramount decals at a
tandem rally; few were fooled and, if they were, then what difference
did it make? If the beholder can't tell one frame from another, then
how does that impact Schwinn's reputation?

Jones

Raleigh never had any such restrictions. But, Cycloartist refused to
sell me decals for an 80's era Raleigh.

They would happily sell you the decals, they just came packaged with a
rather dear paint job!



*note - Raleigh did require that you turn in your old 531 decal to
prove you were entitled to a new one - I always assumed that was an
agreement they had with Reynolds.

On Sun, 19 Aug 2007 17:45:20 -0700, in rec.bicycles.tech Ozark Bicycle
wrote:

They would happily sell you the decals, they just came packaged with a
rather dear paint job!

Why paint a deer?