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Tire-making: questions and answers, but mostly questions



 
 
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Old November 7th 15, 01:10 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
DougC
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Default Tire-making: questions and answers, but mostly questions

I am still going on the tire-making thing. The last machine to convert
to digital control is nearly done.

Some time ago I found a topic on the velomobile.de forum, that was about
"DIY tires". I posted in it to later find out that it wasn't really
about making tires; it was about making home-made wooden 20" tubular
rims, on which to mount cut-down tubular tires.

People talked anyway tho and at one point someone asked how I was
folding the casings I was making: was I folding both edges over to the
same side, or in a Z-arrangement (which he said was described as the
"Italian method").

From that time I would occasionally search online for any information
about this term, or of bicycle casing methods in general, and I've never
found anything. I've even tried searching for pertinent German and
Italian terms, and got nothing.... Is there any info online that any of
you have come across? Or even any books (printed) that delved into the
matter?

There's more info about making tubulars, but then,,, it seems that most
tubulars are made about 98% the same.

------

Once in a while I turn up a bit more info, but it takes a lot of looking
to find even a little something new.
On this page-
http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/...factory-176590
tiny---------
http://tinyurl.com/ppgp5dc

{points are numbered to make arguing easier}

[Item #1]
First is this bit:
"... The first test sees the tyre run against a drum at 50kph
continuously for an entire week — the equivalent of 7,000km — also
receiving three shocks from various angles with every rotation, the
perfect simulation for your average British road surface. ..."

You see one of these machines in the "How It's Made" video for bicycle
tires (that was also made at a Continental factory, IIRC) but they don't
say how fast or how far a tire gets test-run. (~4349 miles @ 31mph, for
the non-conformant among us)

[Item #2]
The next interesting part is this bit:
"... Second, Continental tests how the tyre interacts with the rim. The
rim is lubricated with silicone and the tyre pumped up to twice its
maximum pressure (something in the region of 240psi/16.4 bar) to check
that it will never pop off the rim in real-world use. ..."

This would seem to cast a major question on the validity of the
Brandt/Rinard cut-tire-bead tests.
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/rinard/tirebead.htm
Not that either test was faked--but that it represented an "ideal"
circumstance, of a modern tire on a modern (dry & clean) rim, that
attempted to draw conclusions about all clincher bicycle tires and rims
(even those not modern, nor dry and clean).

[Item #3]
For a great many years, many bicycle rims did not have hooked edges and
yet the tires still remained on them. If it was not due to bead
strength, what other factor was there?

[Item #4]
Also claiming that "bead looseness plays no part" ignores the many many
incidents of people experiencing broken tire beads when trying to use
non-tubeless tires on Stan's NoTubes setups. Usually after a tire would
break its bead cord this way, the tire was useless and would not stay
mounted, even with an inner tube inside (occasionally someone would see
a steel-bead break, but usually when this happened it was a kevlar-bead
tire).

[Item #5]
If you search MTB web forums now, you may well notice that broken beads
on tubeless MTB setups is not nearly as common an issue as it was 4-5
years ago.
That could be for at least two different reasons:
1--tire manufacturers have adopted a more-stringent test for their
products, and tire beads are made stronger now (particularly MTB tire
beads...?)
2--nowadays there are more choices of tubeless rims and tires, so more
people desiring tubeless setups are buying rims and tires made for that
purpose.

 




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