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Returning to cycling



 
 
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  #1  
Old May 14th 05, 07:11 PM
Geoff Lane
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Default Returning to cycling

After years away from cycling, I'd like to get back into recreational
cycling. I'm 6ft 4in tall and so need a large-framed bike. I've got a low
budget and the Giant Cypress SE (23" frame) seemed ideal. My local bike
shop got one for me but there's a problem. In top gear (largest
chainring/smallest rear cog), there is enough flex in the chainset etc. for
the chain to foul the outside of the front changer cage every time I push
down on the right-hand pedal. This only happens when riding the bike (i.e.
no fouling occurs when testing on a stand).

The bike shop have had a go at fixing the bike. They've replaced the
chainset and bottom bracket (I hope that means the axle!) and they say it's
about 95% fixed. However, they tell me that if you really stand on the
pedals in top gear the chain still fouls the front changer.

Is this fouling to be expected with a budget bike in a larger frame size?
Is it acceptable, or should I reject the bike? If the latter, any
recommendations (up to about £250)?

TIA,

--
Geoff Lane
Cornwall, UK
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  #2  
Old May 14th 05, 07:47 PM
Tony Raven
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Default

Geoff Lane wrote:
After years away from cycling, I'd like to get back into recreational
cycling. I'm 6ft 4in tall and so need a large-framed bike. I've got a low
budget and the Giant Cypress SE (23" frame) seemed ideal. My local bike
shop got one for me but there's a problem. In top gear (largest
chainring/smallest rear cog), there is enough flex in the chainset etc. for
the chain to foul the outside of the front changer cage every time I push
down on the right-hand pedal. This only happens when riding the bike (i.e.
no fouling occurs when testing on a stand).

The bike shop have had a go at fixing the bike. They've replaced the
chainset and bottom bracket (I hope that means the axle!) and they say it's
about 95% fixed. However, they tell me that if you really stand on the
pedals in top gear the chain still fouls the front changer.

Is this fouling to be expected with a budget bike in a larger frame size?
Is it acceptable, or should I reject the bike? If the latter, any
recommendations (up to about £250)?

TIA,


It can probably be sorted with proper adjustment of the front derailleur
so that it sits a little further out in top gear. Its not an uncommon
problem on many bikes and usually easily fixed with a bit of tinkering
to find the right balance between far enough out to stop the rubbing and
not so far that it throws the chain off when you change up.

--
Tony

"A facility for quotation covers the absence of original thought" Lord
Peter Wimsey (Dorothy L. Sayers)
  #3  
Old May 14th 05, 07:57 PM
Pete Biggs
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Default

Geoff Lane wrote:
After years away from cycling, I'd like to get back into recreational
cycling. I'm 6ft 4in tall and so need a large-framed bike. I've got a
low budget and the Giant Cypress SE (23" frame) seemed ideal. My
local bike shop got one for me but there's a problem. In top gear
(largest chainring/smallest rear cog), there is enough flex in the
chainset etc. for the chain to foul the outside of the front changer
cage every time I push down on the right-hand pedal. This only
happens when riding the bike (i.e. no fouling occurs when testing on
a stand).

The bike shop have had a go at fixing the bike. They've replaced the
chainset and bottom bracket (I hope that means the axle!) and they
say it's about 95% fixed. However, they tell me that if you really
stand on the pedals in top gear the chain still fouls the front
changer.

Is this fouling to be expected with a budget bike in a larger frame
size? Is it acceptable, or should I reject the bike? If the latter,
any recommendations (up to about £250)?


I can't tell if there's some serious problem or inadequacy with your
cranks or frame but there is always /some/ flex in the cranks, which can
cause rubbing if the derailleur is not adjusted to allow for it. You need
enough margin in there for the flex. It's a very common problem. I would
have a go at adjusting the limit screw, and possibly the angle/height of
the whole derailleur, before worrying about anything more serious.

See http://sheldonbrown.com/derailer-adjustment.html

~PB


  #4  
Old May 14th 05, 08:05 PM
Pete Biggs
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Default

Geoff Lane wrote:
The bike shop have had a go at fixing the bike. They've replaced the
chainset and bottom bracket (I hope that means the axle!) and they
say it's about 95% fixed. However, they tell me that if you really
stand on the pedals in top gear the chain still fouls the front
changer.


Did they not mention anything about the front changer? This is something
bike shops often don't spend enough time adjusting.

~PB


  #5  
Old May 14th 05, 10:08 PM
Geoff Lane
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Default

"Pete Biggs" wrote in
:

Did they not mention anything about the front changer? This is
something bike shops often don't spend enough time adjusting.


Thanks guys.

Yes, the "95% fixed" is after replacing the chainset etc. and adjusting
the front changer to the "optimal" position. The bike is brand new, so I
was expecting everything to work flawlessly.

In the old days, I wouldn't have worried overly - I'd have just adjusted
the outer limit stop and that would be that. However, this bike has
those "new-fangled" Shimano EZ Fire changers, which have only indexed
functionality - so I don't have "on the move" fine control over changer
position. Personally, I hate "quick-fire" shifters (I started cycling
pre-index, when Huret Svelto was brand new) - but "quick fire" seems all
that bikes of today offer.

I guess that, pragmatically, if the chain only rubs in top gear when
really standing on the pedals it's no big deal because I'd normally
changed down rather than push that hard. I'm going to re-check the bike
on Monday and, if it's OK, complete the purchase. I guess that I'm after
a reality check as to whether my expectations are too high.

Thanks again,

--
Geoff Lane
Cornwall, UK
  #6  
Old May 14th 05, 10:35 PM
Simon Brooke
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Posts: n/a
Default

in message , Geoff Lane
') wrote:

After years away from cycling, I'd like to get back into recreational
cycling. I'm 6ft 4in tall and so need a large-framed bike. I've got a
low budget and the Giant Cypress SE (23" frame) seemed ideal. My local
bike shop got one for me but there's a problem. In top gear (largest
chainring/smallest rear cog), there is enough flex in the chainset
etc. for the chain to foul the outside of the front changer cage every
time I push down on the right-hand pedal. This only happens when
riding the bike (i.e. no fouling occurs when testing on a stand).

The bike shop have had a go at fixing the bike. They've replaced the
chainset and bottom bracket (I hope that means the axle!) and they say
it's about 95% fixed. However, they tell me that if you really stand
on the pedals in top gear the chain still fouls the front changer.

Is this fouling to be expected with a budget bike in a larger frame
size? Is it acceptable, or should I reject the bike? If the latter,
any recommendations (up to about £250)?


Frankly yes, but it also has something to do with your pedalling style.
Firstly, all chainsets - even expensive ones - flex. All chainsets with
pressed steel chainrings flex a lot - easily enough to cause the
symptoms you describe. The frame also, obviously, flexes too but this
contributes relatively little to the problem.

But if you 'spin' - stay in lower gears and pedal with a higher cadence
- you put much less stress on the chainset (and, incidentally, on your
knees) than if you 'mash' - use high gears and pedal with a slow
cadence. If you use inappropriately high gears you will get the
symptoms you describe even with a £700 chainset. So no, it isn't really
a problem with the bike. The system will still work. But it will work
better if you develop your pedalling style to be kinder to your body
and the bike.

--
(Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

The Conservative Party is now dead. The corpse may still be
twitching, but resurrection is not an option - unless Satan
chucks them out of Hell as too objectionable even for him.

  #7  
Old May 14th 05, 11:01 PM
Tony Raven
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Posts: n/a
Default

Geoff Lane wrote:

Thanks guys.

Yes, the "95% fixed" is after replacing the chainset etc. and adjusting
the front changer to the "optimal" position. The bike is brand new, so I
was expecting everything to work flawlessly.


That indicates that the bike shop do not really know what they are
doing. Changing the chainset won't make much difference. Changing the
bottom bracket might. It just needs a simple adjustment by someone
competent or else follow Sheldon Brown's excellent instructions
http://sheldonbrown.com/derailer-adjustment.html

--
Tony

"A facility for quotation covers the absence of original thought" Lord
Peter Wimsey (Dorothy L. Sayers)
  #8  
Old May 14th 05, 11:20 PM
Simon Brooke
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Posts: n/a
Default

in message , Geoff Lane
') wrote:

In the old days, I wouldn't have worried overly - I'd have just
adjusted the outer limit stop and that would be that. However, this
bike has those "new-fangled" Shimano EZ Fire changers, which have only
indexed functionality - so I don't have "on the move" fine control
over changer position. Personally, I hate "quick-fire" shifters (I
started cycling pre-index, when Huret Svelto was brand new) - but
"quick fire" seems all that bikes of today offer.


Yes, Shimano are crap from the trimming point of view. However, Shimano
are not the only game in town. SRAM GripShift shifters allow you to
trim the front deraileur, as do Campagnolo Ergo levers. You can get the
SRAM GripShifts from about a tenner upwards, and you can get them in
pull ratios which match Shimano deraileurs.

--
(Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
"This young man has not the faintest idea how socialists think and does
not begin to understand the mentality of the party he has been elected
to lead. He is quite simply a liberal"
-- Ken Coates MEP (Lab) of Tony Blair

  #9  
Old May 15th 05, 09:30 AM
Geoff Lane
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Simon Brooke wrote in news:m6ail2-jc5.ln1
@gododdin.internal.jasmine.org.uk:

Shimano are crap from the trimming point of view. However, Shimano
are not the only game in town. SRAM GripShift shifters allow you to
trim the front deraileur, as do Campagnolo Ergo levers. You can get the
SRAM GripShifts from about a tenner upwards, and you can get them in
pull ratios which match Shimano deraileurs.


Thanks for the info. However, this is a brand new, out-of-the-box bike.
IMO, the manufacturer should have chosen components that work properly
together and the retailer should have assembled and adjusted it correctly.
Obviously there will be problems if either hasn't done their job properly,
so I wouldn't (and probably shouldn't) expect to buy a brand-new bike and
then change components just to get it to work. That said, I may eventually
change the shifters or get used to "quick-fire".

--
Geoff Lane
Cornwall, UK
 




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