Bell Dashboard 100, re-enter odo numbers?

On 2017-07-30 20:35, Ralph Barone wrote:
Graham wrote:

"Joerg" wrote in message
...
On 2017-07-30 02:21, Graham wrote:

"Joerg" wrote in message
...
On 2017-07-29 13:46, Graham wrote:

"Joerg" wrote in message
...
On 2017-07-29 12:16, wrote:
On Saturday, July 29, 2017 at 7:06:59 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-07-29 02:14, Graham wrote:

"Joerg" wrote in message
...
Had to change the battery again on my Bell Dashboard
100 cycling speedometer. Or what they call "cycle
computer" In the manual it says one can re-enter the
odometer reading but nowhere it says how. When I
contacted Bell years ago they said "no, you can't".
Does anyone know a secret trick Bell doesn't know?

I keep a log but it gets old having to calculate to
see when the rear tire or other stuff is nearing
end-of-life. Mainly to avoid a *KAPOW* surprise way out
in the boonies. Many tires don't have TWI.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Looking at your day job from the above link why not just
design a circuit to replicate the job of the magnet which
is only a switch which is creating a pulsed
current/voltage read by the head unit electronics. Then
set the tyre size to maximum and determine the maximum
response frequency of the head unit circuitry and
simulate pulses at that frequency. If the frequency is
reasonably high it should not take too long to reset the
mileage. With a tyre circumference of 9999mm, if it will
take that, then you are looking at 10m per Hz.


Sure I could design a meter that works better than
commercial one. However, I've got enough electronics
projects as it is. When I am fully retired, maybe. But then
I want to ride instead of build replacements for messed-up
commercial designs. On the bikes I already had to do that
for lighting but there it was a necessity.

If I ever build my own it will be like what cars have
since over 100 years. A speedometer that is backlit at
night, works off the central battery and most of all never
forgets its odometer info.

I think that he was suggesting that you pulse the meter until
it reaches the mileage you originally had.


Yes, I misunderstood Graham. If almost all brands contain Reed
switches like Andrew said that might not be so great for the
lifetime of that switch. Also, it would eat up battery because
there will be a limit in the speed and I guess that's not the
same at on a Ferrari Testarossa. So I'd have to let that
artificial wheel run a long time in order to get the usual
4000+ miles back in, and next time 8000+, then 12000+ and so
on. Most likely that takes weeks.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

It looks like you still have not got it. Lets forget the grinder
idea as I agree with Andrew about the read switches and that does
tend to rule that idea out. My first idea was to do it
electronically with a simple circuit that would send relatively
high frequency pulses to the appropriate terminals on the head
unit to simulate the action of the switch. From your decription
of your background surely this is a trivial exercise and I am
sure you will have the required circuit components lying around
on your bench. See my earlier posts as to how long it would take
at different frquency pulsing if you set the tyre circumference
to 9999mm. 4000 miles would take around 180 hours at 1Hz, 18
hours at 10Hz etc and my guess is that the head unit circuit
should at least cope with that. Any higher frequecy response
would be a bonus.


Yeah, I could hack the cable aoart, roach on a MOSFET, wrap the
whole enchilade with duct take and feed pulses from a function
generator :-)
[snip]

Why so dramatic do you just like cludging things with duct tape. Your
head unit has two contacts on the back and my guess is that if you
apply a rapid series of shorts across those two contacts the unit
will display speed. How you might choose to apply those shorts is up
to you: electronically, mechanically eg make a simple rotary switch
driven by an electric drill or even a DPDT relay wired to self
oscillate. The possibilities are almost endless, relatively simple
and do not involve cable hacks and duct tape cludges


I could probably do that but I am sure they have a lowpass filter in
there to mitigate noise and Reed bounce. Or I could pipe out the power
supply to some metal spots such as a couple of the mounting screws and
supply 1.5V while changing the battery. That way it won't forget the
mileage.

OK I give in. I am largely just a lurker in this group and only chip in
when things look like they are, as one might say, "tech". If you are the
"elecy techy" you claim to be then you could have solved this problem
without even troubling this news group. The reply above shows that you
know how to solve this problem so why waste bandwith?

Graham.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus



There's often enough capacitance on the board to keep the CMOS circuitry
running while you change the battery. Just change it quickly.


I have tried, tweezer in left hand, another tweezer with battery
inbetween in right hand. It lost all settings. I guess a 10uF capacitor
would have cost two cents more and that just wasn't in the cards :-)

Providing the same (already created) routine as for entering the wheel
diameter would have cost ... nothing. I guess they didn't hold design
reviews with real cyclists participating. They should.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On 2017-07-31 07:48, wrote:
On Sunday, July 30, 2017 at 9:27:54 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:

Mine quit displaying when the speed drops below about 2.5mph. It
would also happen with a coil but that could be refined by signal
pattern matching. Automatic start-up would still require a few mph
unless you just press a button but afterwards the electronics could
"turn on the super-sniffer".

Jeorg, it just occurred to me how you can reset the mileage - go to
the total mileage and hold both buttons on and the a number will
begin to blink. Then one button changes the number and the other the
position. After you have the mileage reset you hold the buttons on
again and the position you're in will stop blinking.


I had tried that. When you hold both buttons in the odometer mode, or
any other mode, the whole thing will just reset itself to 700c wheel
diameter and zero hours on the clock. Looks like their software
engineers really messed up. Unless there is another undocumented
backdoor trick, hence my question here.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On 2017-07-30 18:22, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 09:59:59 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-07-30 09:53, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/29/2017 2:09 PM, Joerg wrote:
I'd never use Reed or anything mechanical in those, especially in an
environment that is prone to vibration. Like ... a mountain bike.

:-) Joerg would never use what every current cyclometer company (and
therefore almost every mountain biker) uses without problems, because
his situation is just so gnarly!

Classic Joerg!


And, not surprisingly, my clients enjoy electronic designs of cast-iron
reliability and robustness.

Ah but your clients come to you because they want to solve a specific
problem while you take an object that is made to suit the general
public's needs and complain because it doesn't fit what you perceive
as your specific needs.

Your logic is faulty.


You don't know my jobs. A large part of them is designing systems from
scratch. And yes, there we hold design reviews where such flaws will be
flagged. For example, with med tech designs we have real physicians
sitting in on reviews and they are instructed to raise their hand
whenever they see something that should be improved.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On 2017-07-31 07:49, wrote:
On Sunday, July 30, 2017 at 9:53:35 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/29/2017 2:09 PM, Joerg wrote:
I'd never use Reed or
anything mechanical in those, especially in an environment that is prone
to vibration. Like ... a mountain bike.

:-) Joerg would never use what every current cyclometer company (and
therefore almost every mountain biker) uses without problems, because
his situation is just so gnarly!

Classic Joerg!

Actually it's classic Chinese manual.


Surprisingly the Bell manual is written in very good English, doesn't
look light "Designed in Outsourcia" at all. My guess is that their
software engineers simply messed up or they didn't hold design reviews,
or both.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On 2017-07-30 18:08, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 09:30:51 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-07-29 18:20, John B. wrote:
On Sat, 29 Jul 2017 14:48:23 -0700, Joerg
wrote:

On 2017-07-29 13:46, Graham wrote:

"Joerg" wrote in message
...
On 2017-07-29 12:16, wrote:
On Saturday, July 29, 2017 at 7:06:59 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-07-29 02:14, Graham wrote:

"Joerg" wrote in message
...
Had to change the battery again on my Bell Dashboard 100
cycling speedometer. Or what they call "cycle computer" In
the manual it says one can re-enter the odometer reading
but nowhere it says how. When I contacted Bell years ago
they said "no, you can't". Does anyone know a secret trick
Bell doesn't know?

I keep a log but it gets old having to calculate to see
when the rear tire or other stuff is nearing end-of-life.
Mainly to avoid a *KAPOW* surprise way out in the boonies.
Many tires don't have TWI.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Looking at your day job from the above link why not just
design a circuit to replicate the job of the magnet which is
only a switch which is creating a pulsed current/voltage read
by the head unit electronics. Then set the tyre size to
maximum and determine the maximum response frequency of the
head unit circuitry and simulate pulses at that frequency. If
the frequency is reasonably high it should not take too long
to reset the mileage. With a tyre circumference of 9999mm, if
it will take that, then you are looking at 10m per Hz.


Sure I could design a meter that works better than commercial
one. However, I've got enough electronics projects as it is.
When I am fully retired, maybe. But then I want to ride instead
of build replacements for messed-up commercial designs. On the
bikes I already had to do that for lighting but there it was a
necessity.

If I ever build my own it will be like what cars have since
over 100 years. A speedometer that is backlit at night, works
off the central battery and most of all never forgets its
odometer info.

I think that he was suggesting that you pulse the meter until it
reaches the mileage you originally had.


Yes, I misunderstood Graham. If almost all brands contain Reed
switches like Andrew said that might not be so great for the
lifetime of that switch. Also, it would eat up battery because
there will be a limit in the speed and I guess that's not the same
at on a Ferrari Testarossa. So I'd have to let that artificial
wheel run a long time in order to get the usual 4000+ miles back
in, and next time 8000+, then 12000+ and so on. Most likely that
takes weeks.

-- Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

It looks like you still have not got it. Lets forget the grinder idea
as I agree with Andrew about the read switches and that does tend to
rule that idea out. My first idea was to do it electronically with a
simple circuit that would send relatively high frequency pulses to
the appropriate terminals on the head unit to simulate the action of
the switch. From your decription of your background surely this is a
trivial exercise and I am sure you will have the required circuit
components lying around on your bench. See my earlier posts as to how
long it would take at different frquency pulsing if you set the tyre
circumference to 9999mm. 4000 miles would take around 180 hours at
1Hz, 18 hours at 10Hz etc and my guess is that the head unit circuit
should at least cope with that. Any higher frequecy response would be
a bonus.


Yeah, I could hack the cable aoart, roach on a MOSFET, wrap the whole
enchilade with duct take and feed pulses from a function generator :-)

I think in that case the better alternative would be to buy a better
designed meter like the one I have on the MTB (Cateye Padrone) that does
allow odometer re-entry.

I only started this thread to see if someone knows a trick. There is a
discrepancy between the Bell manual and what Bell's customer service
says. The manual explicitly says you should write down the odometer
value before a battery change and then re-enter it after installing a
new battery. Their customer service said that it cannot be done. So one
of them is wrong.

Early on in this thread you mentioned that you "kept a log". If so why
can't you simply add the previous mileage to the present (post battery
change) reading of your bike meter to get total mileage?


That's what I am doing but it would be nice if this could simply be
entered. Which would be just as easy as re-entering the four numbers for
the wheel diameter but it seems their software guys forgot.


What I did was develop a log where I enter one ride's data, distance,
average speed and time. The spreadsheet then calculates and records
several other values from this data. Each log is for one year. I don't
do it but a column for "Meter Battery Change" could easily be added
which could even calculate the estimated future date when the battery
would next require changing, or whatever data you wanted.


The battery is now just on our regular smoke detector checklist and will
get replaced once a year. I don't want to enter all this other stuff,
too much. Mileage is all I need. Main reason being that many bike tires
don't have any TWI and also it's good to swap & rotate chains to
maximize cassette life.


I have an annual log application that I wrote and that is what I do.
Simply enter the last year's total at the top of the new log and the
computer shows the current "lifetime total".


In new-speak that's called "an app". I have that for our cars, for my
beer brewing, and all the biz book-keeping. I'll probably set one up for
the road bike as well. I am using the old MS-Works database for this.

Well, I suppose so. At least for those who use "New Speak" because
they have problems pronouncing long words :-)


I grew up in a country with a "Lego language" where you can create words
that almost do not fit on a whole line of letter-A :-)

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On Monday, July 31, 2017 at 10:02:34 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-07-31 07:49, wrote:
On Sunday, July 30, 2017 at 9:53:35 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 7/29/2017 2:09 PM, Joerg wrote:
I'd never use Reed or
anything mechanical in those, especially in an environment that is prone
to vibration. Like ... a mountain bike.

:-) Joerg would never use what every current cyclometer company (and
therefore almost every mountain biker) uses without problems, because
his situation is just so gnarly!

Classic Joerg!

Actually it's classic Chinese manual.


Surprisingly the Bell manual is written in very good English, doesn't
look light "Designed in Outsourcia" at all. My guess is that their
software engineers simply messed up or they didn't hold design reviews,
or both.

This is extremely weird. This looks like what you need now. I'm sure this one allows you to set the mileage. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wireless-LCD...YAAOSwYshUZQ9G

On 2017-07-31 10:12, wrote:
On Monday, July 31, 2017 at 10:02:34 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-07-31 07:49, wrote:
On Sunday, July 30, 2017 at 9:53:35 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski
wrote:
On 7/29/2017 2:09 PM, Joerg wrote:
I'd never use Reed or anything mechanical in those,
especially in an environment that is prone to vibration. Like
... a mountain bike.

:-) Joerg would never use what every current cyclometer
company (and therefore almost every mountain biker) uses
without problems, because his situation is just so gnarly!

Classic Joerg!

Actually it's classic Chinese manual.


Surprisingly the Bell manual is written in very good English,
doesn't look light "Designed in Outsourcia" at all. My guess is
that their software engineers simply messed up or they didn't hold
design reviews, or both.

This is extremely weird. This looks like what you need now. I'm sure
this one allows you to set the mileage.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wireless-LCD...YAAOSwYshUZQ9G


Yes, I could simply buy a new and better speedometer and then it would
be another brand. In that case I'd buy a Cateye Padrone like I have on
the MTB which allows re-entry. It has a much larger display than others
which helps not to have to wear reading glasses to see the numbers.

However, I really don't like to throw away stuff. As a society we
shouldn't keep chucking stuff whenever something isn't 100% up to snuff.

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

On Monday, July 31, 2017 at 10:21:41 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-07-31 10:12, wrote:
On Monday, July 31, 2017 at 10:02:34 AM UTC-7, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-07-31 07:49, wrote:
On Sunday, July 30, 2017 at 9:53:35 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski
wrote:
On 7/29/2017 2:09 PM, Joerg wrote:
I'd never use Reed or anything mechanical in those,
especially in an environment that is prone to vibration. Like
... a mountain bike.

:-) Joerg would never use what every current cyclometer
company (and therefore almost every mountain biker) uses
without problems, because his situation is just so gnarly!

Classic Joerg!

Actually it's classic Chinese manual.


Surprisingly the Bell manual is written in very good English,
doesn't look light "Designed in Outsourcia" at all. My guess is
that their software engineers simply messed up or they didn't hold
design reviews, or both.

This is extremely weird. This looks like what you need now. I'm sure
this one allows you to set the mileage.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wireless-LCD...YAAOSwYshUZQ9G


Yes, I could simply buy a new and better speedometer and then it would
be another brand. In that case I'd buy a Cateye Padrone like I have on
the MTB which allows re-entry. It has a much larger display than others
which helps not to have to wear reading glasses to see the numbers.

However, I really don't like to throw away stuff. As a society we
shouldn't keep chucking stuff whenever something isn't 100% up to snuff.

Neither should you put up with junk just because it successfully does one thing.

On 7/31/2017 12:02 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-07-31 07:49, wrote:
On Sunday, July 30, 2017 at 9:53:35 AM UTC-7, Frank
Krygowski wrote:
On 7/29/2017 2:09 PM, Joerg wrote:
I'd never use Reed or
anything mechanical in those, especially in an
environment that is prone
to vibration. Like ... a mountain bike.

:-) Joerg would never use what every current cyclometer
company (and
therefore almost every mountain biker) uses without
problems, because
his situation is just so gnarly!

Classic Joerg!

Actually it's classic Chinese manual.


Surprisingly the Bell manual is written in very good
English, doesn't look light "Designed in Outsourcia" at all.
My guess is that their software engineers simply messed up
or they didn't hold design reviews, or both.


One possible explanation, "Our new vendor doesn't have
anyone who could write a manual even in Chinese. Get the
intern to clean up some online manual and then print that."

--
Andrew Muzi
www.yellowjersey.org/
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On 2017-07-31 10:50, AMuzi wrote:
On 7/31/2017 12:02 PM, Joerg wrote:
On 2017-07-31 07:49, wrote:
On Sunday, July 30, 2017 at 9:53:35 AM UTC-7, Frank
Krygowski wrote:
On 7/29/2017 2:09 PM, Joerg wrote:
I'd never use Reed or
anything mechanical in those, especially in an
environment that is prone
to vibration. Like ... a mountain bike.

:-) Joerg would never use what every current cyclometer
company (and
therefore almost every mountain biker) uses without
problems, because
his situation is just so gnarly!

Classic Joerg!

Actually it's classic Chinese manual.


Surprisingly the Bell manual is written in very good
English, doesn't look light "Designed in Outsourcia" at all.
My guess is that their software engineers simply messed up
or they didn't hold design reviews, or both.


One possible explanation, "Our new vendor doesn't have anyone who could
write a manual even in Chinese. Get the intern to clean up some online
manual and then print that."


Ok, but a company such as Bell?

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/