Internal geared BB and enclosed chain transmission mountain bike.

On Monday, June 6, 2016 at 5:41:38 PM UTC+1, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, June 6, 2016 at 8:45:42 AM UTC-7, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Mon, 06 Jun 2016 14:20:15 +0700, John B.
wrote:

You are lucky, the second hand bike shops in Bangkok sell whole
bicycles and rarely will sell parts. I did come across one shop that
had imported a number of aluminum road bike frames and was selling
those but his main business was entire bicycles.

We have several local thrift shops. Most of them only sell complete
and rideable bicycles. However, one of them (now defunct) would sell
literally anything including parts. Over the years, I picked up about
5 assorted frames, all of which were partially cannibalized for parts.
I have no idea where they came from and the staff was not very
cooperative when I asked. I've also purchased some frames that needed
brazing, straightening, or painting, and were deemed unworthy of
repair. However, I don't do that any more as it's too time consuming
and I'm not very good at it.

We also have a bike shop of sorts run as a charity, commune,
collective, non-profit, or whatever:
http://bikechurch.santacruzhub.org
Most of what they have is junk, but they do sell used parts and
pieces. Frames are scarce as anything that's rideable is soon built
up into a complete bicycle and sold.

We have a number of used bike stores -- regular commercial enterprises and charities, including the Community Cycling Center: http://www.communitycyclingcenter.or...s-accessories/

I've given those guys some really good stuff -- Campy track wheels, Phil hubs, etc. Let them make the profit.

City Bikes is unique: http://www.citybikes.coop/used-bike-parts/

It is both a bike shop and a beacon to the uncivilized world, much like the Oneida Community or Amana Colonies -- or Leningrad:

"Citybikes exists to provide a livelihood for our workers. We adhere to a non-hierarchical personnel structure that focuses on all workers taking responsibility for the business. Through cooperation, we hope to make our work enjoyable and to get our jobs done efficiently by utilizing each others strengths.

We believe a work force consisting of people from varied backgrounds provides us with the strongest foundation for the informed decision-making. Citybikes hires people on the basis of the shop’s need, with gender balance and diversity as goals. Citybikes is a resource for information of all kinds regarding cycling, bicycles and cooperative business structure."

I don't even understand the first sentence of the second paragraph. Perhaps they should diversify into good English. If you look at their hiring page (http://www.citybikes.coop/hiring/), one benefit of working there is "no traditional boses":

"Benefits:
Competitive wages based on experience
Generous employee rates on purchases
Health stipend and sick leave
No traditional bosses
Ownership track options/off-season potential
Ability to learn different areas of a bike shop rather than stick to one role

Citybikes strives to have an environment in which any cooperator can work in a safe and accepting environment, free from prejudice and/or discrimination of a person’s race, color, ancestry, place of origin, political beliefs, religion, martial status, family status, physical disability including HIV and AIDS, mental disability, sex, gender, sexual orientation, or age, or otherwise. Individuals who identify as people of color, women, trans, and/or non-binary are strongly encouraged to apply."

I much prefer working with non-binary individuals, except, of course, when I'm looking for help with my computer or smart phone. Bicycles are more analog, so non-binary individuals probably make good mechanics. I wonder if they feel constrained by torque wrenches. They are so didactic, so judgmental -- so binary. I wonder if "chain whip" is a trigger word? How about "saddle" or "grease my crank"?

-- Jay Beattie.
Owner of 100% vegan saddle.

How long has City Bikes been in non-hierarchical operation?

Andre Jute
Sigmund Freud's influence will live when Karl Marx is long forgotten. Nobidy forgets his mother.

On Tue, 07 Jun 2016 07:04:55 +0700, John B.
wrote:

I suspect there is a difference in cultural values between countries,
or maybe even regions, as "thrift shops" don't seem at all popular
here.

In the USA, it's a regional thing. Various synonyms are junk store,
indoor flea market, cut-rate store, recycle center, bazaar, midnight
parts, outlet store, consignment store, hock shop, pawn shop, tailgate
parts store, fence, etc. I'm sure there are others:
http://brandongaille.com/41-clever-and-catchy-thrift-store-names/

There have been several started, generally as a sort of
"consignment" ship where you could leave something, designating the
price that you wanted to get for it, and the "shop" would add a
specified markup and offer it for sale. I remember two such places, in
perhaps the last 20 years, both of which failed after about a year.

It seems that the thrift shops do best when the economy collapses.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Tue, 07 Jun 2016 07:04:55 +0700, John B.
wrote:

I suspect there is a difference in cultural values between countries,
or maybe even regions, as "thrift shops" don't seem at all popular
here. There have been several started, generally as a sort of
"consignment" ship where you could leave something, designating the
price that you wanted to get for it, and the "shop" would add a
specified markup and offer it for sale. I remember two such places, in
perhaps the last 20 years, both of which failed after about a year.

Around here, we seem to reserve "thrift shop" for shops run by
charities. You donate stuff that you want to get rid of -- the local
Goodwill is a great convenience in cleaning house -- and they sell it
very cheap.

I can remember when it was Goodwill Industries: I thought it poetic
that they used discarded things to reclaim discarded people. But they
have long since ceased accepting "repairable discards", and
concentrate on getting people jobs with other firms. I suppose some
of the check-out people might be training for retail work. There are
signs all over saying things like "My old suit just aced a job
interview." Well over half the floor space is clothing.

We had a Salvation Army store when we first moved here, but it outgrew
its space, decided that it couldn't afford a bigger space, and closed.
They still have a whatever-they-call-it near where the store used to
be, but I think the nearest store is in Goshen. I tried to ask Google
Maps, and they gave me Goodwill and Our Father's House. Search
engines are too deleted helpful. (Ah! I searched "near Goshen" and
found one in Elkhart, then searched "Columbia City" and found one in
Fort Wayne. Among a plethora of other-charity thrift shops.)

There's a long-persisting consignment shop next to the comic-book
store that has almost exclusively clothing. (I haven't checked lately
to see whether it is still there; that new space in the comic-book
shop might be where they used to be.)

And I think the consignment shop that sells things children have
outgrown will stick. It replaces the early-last-century hand-me-down
circuits.

But yes, most consignment shops are just quietly not there the next
time you drop in.

--
Joy Beeson, U.S.A., mostly central Hoosier,
some Northern Indiana, Upstate New York, Florida, and Hawaii
joy beeson at comcast dot net http://wlweather.net/PAGEJOY/
The above message is a Usenet post.
I don't recall having given anyone permission to use it on a Web site.

(Since this is an A.U.E.-type post, I used my A.U.E. signature.)

On Mon, 06 Jun 2016 17:47:03 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
wrote:

On Tue, 07 Jun 2016 07:04:55 +0700, John B.
wrote:

I suspect there is a difference in cultural values between countries,
or maybe even regions, as "thrift shops" don't seem at all popular
here.

In the USA, it's a regional thing. Various synonyms are junk store,
indoor flea market, cut-rate store, recycle center, bazaar, midnight
parts, outlet store, consignment store, hock shop, pawn shop, tailgate
parts store, fence, etc. I'm sure there are others:
http://brandongaille.com/41-clever-and-catchy-thrift-store-names/

When I was a kid, in up-state New England there was a "second hand
store" in town that a fellow ran all his life, I guess. After he died
my mother mentioned that "he left a surprising large estate". So I
guess it can be a reasonably good business.

Then, of course, there are the antique dealers.

There have been several started, generally as a sort of
"consignment" ship where you could leave something, designating the
price that you wanted to get for it, and the "shop" would add a
specified markup and offer it for sale. I remember two such places, in
perhaps the last 20 years, both of which failed after about a year.

It seems that the thrift shops do best when the economy collapses.

Logically so :-)

(but I don't think my wife would appreciate a second hand toaster for
her birthday :-)
--
cheers,

John B.

On Monday, June 6, 2016 at 11:40:14 AM UTC-7, Andre Jute wrote:
On Monday, June 6, 2016 at 5:41:38 PM UTC+1, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, June 6, 2016 at 8:45:42 AM UTC-7, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Mon, 06 Jun 2016 14:20:15 +0700, John B.
wrote:

You are lucky, the second hand bike shops in Bangkok sell whole
bicycles and rarely will sell parts. I did come across one shop that
had imported a number of aluminum road bike frames and was selling
those but his main business was entire bicycles.

We have several local thrift shops. Most of them only sell complete
and rideable bicycles. However, one of them (now defunct) would sell
literally anything including parts. Over the years, I picked up about
5 assorted frames, all of which were partially cannibalized for parts..
I have no idea where they came from and the staff was not very
cooperative when I asked. I've also purchased some frames that needed
brazing, straightening, or painting, and were deemed unworthy of
repair. However, I don't do that any more as it's too time consuming
and I'm not very good at it.

We also have a bike shop of sorts run as a charity, commune,
collective, non-profit, or whatever:
http://bikechurch.santacruzhub.org
Most of what they have is junk, but they do sell used parts and
pieces. Frames are scarce as anything that's rideable is soon built
up into a complete bicycle and sold.

We have a number of used bike stores -- regular commercial enterprises and charities, including the Community Cycling Center: http://www.communitycyclingcenter.or...s-accessories/

I've given those guys some really good stuff -- Campy track wheels, Phil hubs, etc. Let them make the profit.

City Bikes is unique: http://www.citybikes.coop/used-bike-parts/

It is both a bike shop and a beacon to the uncivilized world, much like the Oneida Community or Amana Colonies -- or Leningrad:

"Citybikes exists to provide a livelihood for our workers. We adhere to a non-hierarchical personnel structure that focuses on all workers taking responsibility for the business. Through cooperation, we hope to make our work enjoyable and to get our jobs done efficiently by utilizing each others strengths.

We believe a work force consisting of people from varied backgrounds provides us with the strongest foundation for the informed decision-making. Citybikes hires people on the basis of the shop’s need, with gender balance and diversity as goals. Citybikes is a resource for information of all kinds regarding cycling, bicycles and cooperative business structure."

I don't even understand the first sentence of the second paragraph. Perhaps they should diversify into good English. If you look at their hiring page (http://www.citybikes.coop/hiring/), one benefit of working there is "no traditional boses":

"Benefits:
Competitive wages based on experience
Generous employee rates on purchases
Health stipend and sick leave
No traditional bosses
Ownership track options/off-season potential
Ability to learn different areas of a bike shop rather than stick to one role

Citybikes strives to have an environment in which any cooperator can work in a safe and accepting environment, free from prejudice and/or discrimination of a person’s race, color, ancestry, place of origin, political beliefs, religion, martial status, family status, physical disability including HIV and AIDS, mental disability, sex, gender, sexual orientation, or age, or otherwise. Individuals who identify as people of color, women, trans, and/or non-binary are strongly encouraged to apply."

I much prefer working with non-binary individuals, except, of course, when I'm looking for help with my computer or smart phone. Bicycles are more analog, so non-binary individuals probably make good mechanics. I wonder if they feel constrained by torque wrenches. They are so didactic, so judgmental -- so binary. I wonder if "chain whip" is a trigger word? How about "saddle" or "grease my crank"?

-- Jay Beattie.
Owner of 100% vegan saddle.

How long has City Bikes been in non-hierarchical operation?

Since 1990. http://www.citybikes.coop/about-citybikes/history/ There was a worker revolt, resulting in the death of the former owner and his entire family, although it is rumored that one daughter survived.

Ride Bikeski, comrade.

-- Jay Beattie.

On Mon, 06 Jun 2016 23:06:25 -0300, Joy Beeson
wrote:

On Tue, 07 Jun 2016 07:04:55 +0700, John B.
wrote:

I suspect there is a difference in cultural values between countries,
or maybe even regions, as "thrift shops" don't seem at all popular
here. There have been several started, generally as a sort of
"consignment" ship where you could leave something, designating the
price that you wanted to get for it, and the "shop" would add a
specified markup and offer it for sale. I remember two such places, in
perhaps the last 20 years, both of which failed after about a year.

Around here, we seem to reserve "thrift shop" for shops run by
charities. You donate stuff that you want to get rid of -- the local
Goodwill is a great convenience in cleaning house -- and they sell it
very cheap.

I can remember when it was Goodwill Industries: I thought it poetic
that they used discarded things to reclaim discarded people. But they
have long since ceased accepting "repairable discards", and
concentrate on getting people jobs with other firms. I suppose some
of the check-out people might be training for retail work. There are
signs all over saying things like "My old suit just aced a job
interview." Well over half the floor space is clothing.

We had a Salvation Army store when we first moved here, but it outgrew
its space, decided that it couldn't afford a bigger space, and closed.
They still have a whatever-they-call-it near where the store used to
be, but I think the nearest store is in Goshen. I tried to ask Google
Maps, and they gave me Goodwill and Our Father's House. Search
engines are too deleted helpful. (Ah! I searched "near Goshen" and
found one in Elkhart, then searched "Columbia City" and found one in
Fort Wayne. Among a plethora of other-charity thrift shops.)

There's a long-persisting consignment shop next to the comic-book
store that has almost exclusively clothing. (I haven't checked lately
to see whether it is still there; that new space in the comic-book
shop might be where they used to be.)

And I think the consignment shop that sells things children have
outgrown will stick. It replaces the early-last-century hand-me-down
circuits.

Back in the day, when your kids out grew something you bundled it up
and sent it to your sister for her kids :-)

When my wife was having babies, neighbors and friends would shower us
with second hand diapers when a new addition arrived. Of course, this
was long before pampers became indispensable.

A well used (and washed, of course) diaper makes a splendid rag for
the final polishing when you are waxing the car.. or the furniture :-)

A bit of nostalgia... remember when the "newspaper" came on dead tree
material and one had heaps of paper to make dress patterns and "drop
cloths" and to put down under the cat's box when there were new
kittens, or the baby's high chair, or cover thing up when you wanted
to do a bit of spray painting?



But yes, most consignment shops are just quietly not there the next
time you drop in.
--
cheers,

John B.

On Monday, June 6, 2016 at 2:40:14 PM UTC-4, Andre Jute wrote:
On Monday, June 6, 2016 at 5:41:38 PM UTC+1, jbeattie wrote:
On Monday, June 6, 2016 at 8:45:42 AM UTC-7, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Mon, 06 Jun 2016 14:20:15 +0700, John B.
wrote:

You are lucky, the second hand bike shops in Bangkok sell whole
bicycles and rarely will sell parts. I did come across one shop that
had imported a number of aluminum road bike frames and was selling
those but his main business was entire bicycles.

We have several local thrift shops. Most of them only sell complete
and rideable bicycles. However, one of them (now defunct) would sell
literally anything including parts. Over the years, I picked up about
5 assorted frames, all of which were partially cannibalized for parts..
I have no idea where they came from and the staff was not very
cooperative when I asked. I've also purchased some frames that needed
brazing, straightening, or painting, and were deemed unworthy of
repair. However, I don't do that any more as it's too time consuming
and I'm not very good at it.

We also have a bike shop of sorts run as a charity, commune,
collective, non-profit, or whatever:
http://bikechurch.santacruzhub.org
Most of what they have is junk, but they do sell used parts and
pieces. Frames are scarce as anything that's rideable is soon built
up into a complete bicycle and sold.

We have a number of used bike stores -- regular commercial enterprises and charities, including the Community Cycling Center: http://www.communitycyclingcenter.or...s-accessories/

I've given those guys some really good stuff -- Campy track wheels, Phil hubs, etc. Let them make the profit.

City Bikes is unique: http://www.citybikes.coop/used-bike-parts/

It is both a bike shop and a beacon to the uncivilized world, much like the Oneida Community or Amana Colonies -- or Leningrad:

"Citybikes exists to provide a livelihood for our workers. We adhere to a non-hierarchical personnel structure that focuses on all workers taking responsibility for the business. Through cooperation, we hope to make our work enjoyable and to get our jobs done efficiently by utilizing each others strengths.

We believe a work force consisting of people from varied backgrounds provides us with the strongest foundation for the informed decision-making. Citybikes hires people on the basis of the shop’s need, with gender balance and diversity as goals. Citybikes is a resource for information of all kinds regarding cycling, bicycles and cooperative business structure."

I don't even understand the first sentence of the second paragraph. Perhaps they should diversify into good English. If you look at their hiring page (http://www.citybikes.coop/hiring/), one benefit of working there is "no traditional boses":

"Benefits:
Competitive wages based on experience
Generous employee rates on purchases
Health stipend and sick leave
No traditional bosses
Ownership track options/off-season potential
Ability to learn different areas of a bike shop rather than stick to one role

Citybikes strives to have an environment in which any cooperator can work in a safe and accepting environment, free from prejudice and/or discrimination of a person’s race, color, ancestry, place of origin, political beliefs, religion, martial status, family status, physical disability including HIV and AIDS, mental disability, sex, gender, sexual orientation, or age, or otherwise. Individuals who identify as people of color, women, trans, and/or non-binary are strongly encouraged to apply."

I much prefer working with non-binary individuals, except, of course, when I'm looking for help with my computer or smart phone. Bicycles are more analog, so non-binary individuals probably make good mechanics. I wonder if they feel constrained by torque wrenches. They are so didactic, so judgmental -- so binary. I wonder if "chain whip" is a trigger word? How about "saddle" or "grease my crank"?

-- Jay Beattie.
Owner of 100% vegan saddle.

How long has City Bikes been in non-hierarchical operation?

Andre Jute
Sigmund Freud's influence will live when Karl Marx is long forgotten. Nobidy forgets his mother.

hahahhahahhhahhahhhaahehehehhehhhehhe....

the first sentence ( 2-5) sez we hire select and dedicated experienced bike thieves.

On Tue, 07 Jun 2016 09:49:54 +0700, John B.
wrote:

(but I don't think my wife would appreciate a second hand toaster for
her birthday :-)

Whatever happened to "Something Old, Something New, Something
Borrowed, Something Blue"? Take the toaster apart and clean it out
thoroughly. Replace anything that looks worn. Polish the enclosure
on a buffer. Then, try using that line and let us know if you
survive.

My father once gave me a choice of birthday gifts. I could have
something small but new, or something much bigger but used. He asked
me to think about it carefully, which at age 13 was about 10 minutes.
I chose big and used, and was given a cousins bicycle that he had
outgrown. We then spent a few afternoons cleaning, polishing,
repairing, and touching it up. Lesson learned.

However, I still have a problem when I give someone a gift, and they
exchange it for cash or turn around and sell it.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Mon, 06 Jun 2016 23:06:25 -0300, Joy Beeson
wrote:

I can remember when it was Goodwill Industries: I thought it poetic
that they used discarded things to reclaim discarded people. But they
have long since ceased accepting "repairable discards", and
concentrate on getting people jobs with other firms. I suppose some
of the check-out people might be training for retail work. There are
signs all over saying things like "My old suit just aced a job
interview." Well over half the floor space is clothing.

Clothing sells well. Much of my wardrobe comes from Goodwill and
other thrift shops. My father was a tailor and later a lingerie
manufacturer. My mother did alterations at home. I learned early and
today, alterations and repairs are not a big deal.

Goodwill stores are a franchise:
https://www.google.com/#q=goodwill+franchise
While the organization does many good things with its part of the
$3.5 billion/year revenue from the thrift shops, the stores are
largely independent businesses that operate within the rules and
framework set up by the franchisor.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goodwill_Industries
I don't know if this is a good or bad thing.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Tue, 07 Jun 2016 13:07:54 +0700, John B.
wrote:

Of course, this
was long before pampers became indispensable.

Huh? Pampers are easily dispensed with a built in dispenser:
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=pampers+dispenser

[I would normally apologize for the bad pun, but after voting in
todays California primary election, I consider it an improvement over
the candidates and propositions.]


--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558