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Build it and they will come?



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 30th 18, 04:22 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
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Posts: 10,538
Default Build it and they will come?

"Build it and they will come!"

Um... Hey, wait a minute, where did they go???

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...sus-data-show/


--
- Frank Krygowski
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  #2  
Old September 30th 18, 05:42 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
JBeattie
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Posts: 5,870
Default Build it and they will come?

On Sunday, September 30, 2018 at 8:22:13 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
"Build it and they will come!"

Um... Hey, wait a minute, where did they go???

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...sus-data-show/


Without getting into the need for or desirability of bicycle facilities, it would be interesting to find out why the number of commuter cyclists dropped in Seattle. It may be things like scooters and Uber/Lyft. Better mass transit? Bad weather? The notion that all the construction made it difficult for cyclists usually works the opposite way. You're better off on a bike when the roads are choked because of construction. A lot of construction around here, though, has been of the separated facilities themselves -- which may have driven down numbers since some percentage doesn't want to ride on the parallel road.

-- Jay Beattie.

  #3  
Old September 30th 18, 06:50 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Jeff Liebermann
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Posts: 4,018
Default Build it and they will come?

On Sun, 30 Sep 2018 09:42:58 -0700 (PDT), jbeattie
wrote:

On Sunday, September 30, 2018 at 8:22:13 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
"Build it and they will come!"

Um... Hey, wait a minute, where did they go???

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...sus-data-show/


Without getting into the need for or desirability of bicycle facilities, it would be interesting to find out why the number of commuter cyclists dropped in Seattle. It may be things like scooters and Uber/Lyft. Better mass transit? Bad weather? The notion that all the construction made it difficult for cyclists usually works the opposite way. You're better off on a bike when the roads are choked because of construction. A lot of construction around here, though, has been of the separated facilities themselves -- which may have driven down numbers since some percentage doesn't want to ride on the parallel road.

-- Jay Beattie.


I was thinking along similar lines. So, I went to the US Census Burro
web pile and tried to find the original source of the information
which the Seattle Times conveniently forgot to include in the article.
The new and improved user interface is new to me, so I'm not finding
anything useful. I suspect the data part of the latest ACS (American
Community Survey) such as this article that appears to have been
derived from a recent ACS report:
"The Stubborn Bike Commuter Gap Between American Cities"
https://www.wired.com/story/cycling-census-commuter-data-gap/
Kinda odd that Seattle isn't even mentioned.

I just ran out of time, but try your luck:
https://factfinder.census.gov/faces/nav/jsf/pages/index.xhtml

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
  #4  
Old September 30th 18, 07:37 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
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Posts: 10,538
Default Build it and they will come?

On 9/30/2018 1:50 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

... I went to the US Census Burro
web pile...
The new and improved user interface is new to me, so I'm not finding
anything useful.


That's a frequent complaint of mine. Web and software people are usually
OK with programming, but often terrible at operator interface. And they
are FAR too willing to scramble those interfaces every few years. Look,
dudes, "new" isn't always "better," and why make everyone re-learn
everything?

I'm glad the "operating system" of my adjustable wrench is just a thumb
screw. If it had anything electrical at all, someone would re-program it
to make it "better," or say it's no longer compatible with Bolt Standard
2.11, or hack it.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #5  
Old September 30th 18, 08:33 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Roger Merriman[_4_]
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Posts: 385
Default Build it and they will come?

jbeattie wrote:
On Sunday, September 30, 2018 at 8:22:13 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
"Build it and they will come!"

Um... Hey, wait a minute, where did they go???

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...sus-data-show/


Without getting into the need for or desirability of bicycle facilities,
it would be interesting to find out why the number of commuter cyclists
dropped in Seattle. It may be things like scooters and Uber/Lyft. Better
mass transit? Bad weather? The notion that all the construction made it
difficult for cyclists usually works the opposite way. You're better off
on a bike when the roads are choked because of construction. A lot of
construction around here, though, has been of the separated facilities
themselves -- which may have driven down numbers since some percentage
doesn't want to ride on the parallel road.

-- Jay Beattie.



It does also need a culture shift, I commute from south of Heathrow to
north of it, south has a fair bit of cycle traffic around the fairly well
heeled suburbs, which I link up various parks but once north I have a
segregated bike path, which is completely deserted generally, it’s
something of note if I see another bike, plenty of traffic a few meters
away so the route is used. Just not by bikes or by foot, for most part.

Roger Merriman

  #6  
Old October 1st 18, 12:45 AM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Jeff Liebermann
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Posts: 4,018
Default Build it and they will come?

On Sun, 30 Sep 2018 14:37:59 -0400, Frank Krygowski
wrote:

On 9/30/2018 1:50 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

... I went to the US Census Burro
web pile...
The new and improved user interface is new to me, so I'm not finding
anything useful.


That's a frequent complaint of mine. Web and software people are usually
OK with programming, but often terrible at operator interface. And they
are FAR too willing to scramble those interfaces every few years. Look,
dudes, "new" isn't always "better," and why make everyone re-learn
everything?


I beg to differ slightly. Individual programmers and small companies
can usually produce a usable user interface after the 30th rewrite.
Things can get a bit strange if there is a change in design
consultants or personnel, but in general, they do all right.

However, this is the US Census Burro, a gigantic bureaucracy that
probably outsources everything including their web pile. If I dig
deep, I'm fairly certain that I'll find multiple overlapping design
committees, an army of consultants, unique variations inspired by
managerial imperatives, a general lack of testing, little effective
user feedback, and probably more "white space" than useful output if
the consultants were paid by the page.

The good news is that given a heroic herculean effort to understand
the web pile, I'm sure that I can eventually find the bicycle
commuting ACS for Seattle. After all, someone did that successfully
in order to write those articles. Of course, once I learn how to
navigate the site, the next massive rewrite will reset my learning
curve back to zero.

I'm glad the "operating system" of my adjustable wrench is just a thumb
screw. If it had anything electrical at all, someone would re-program it
to make it "better," or say it's no longer compatible with Bolt Standard
2.11, or hack it.


I guess you haven't used many "security" screws. Each type of bolt
head is different. Some are unique.
https://img.wonderhowto.com/img/95/34/63497736798281/0/nuts-and-bolts-steampunk-using-right-screws-for-job.w654.jpg
It's like Linux. All the various Linux mutations found on
Distrowatch:
https://distrowatch.com
are based on the LSB (Linux Standard Base) and immediately diverges
from the
https://wiki.linuxfoundation.org/lsb/start
Getting a program crafted to run on one Linux mutation to run on a
different mutation is rather difficult.

Some day, you might buy the latest pocket laser interferometer to
replace your vernier calipers. It will have an operating system,
require regular upgrades, can be hijacked to produce strange
measurements, and cannot be repaired, adjusted, calibrated, or even
opened by mere users. Only the authorized factory service center can
do those. Progress lurches forward.

Ok, back to replacing some decking before it rains Monday night.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
  #7  
Old October 1st 18, 04:36 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
Frank Krygowski[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,538
Default Build it and they will come?

On 9/30/2018 7:45 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
... If I dig
deep, I'm fairly certain that I'll find multiple overlapping design
committees, an army of consultants, unique variations inspired by
managerial imperatives, a general lack of testing, little effective
user feedback, and probably more "white space" than useful output if
the consultants were paid by the page.


Heh. This weekend I was chatting with a friend whose business is buying
and selling CNC machinery. He talked about arriving at his warehouse at
8 AM to find the scheduled local trucker sitting there three hours
before his appointed 11 AM arrival time.

The trucker said he liked to arrive early to make sure nothing went
wrong. "And they pay me by the hour anyway. I like the overtime."

So he got paid three hours overtime for sitting and drinking coffee.

--
- Frank Krygowski
  #8  
Old October 1st 18, 07:34 PM posted to rec.bicycles.tech
[email protected]
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Posts: 1,261
Default Build it and they will come?

On Monday, October 1, 2018 at 8:37:01 AM UTC-7, Frank Krygowski wrote:
On 9/30/2018 7:45 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
... If I dig
deep, I'm fairly certain that I'll find multiple overlapping design
committees, an army of consultants, unique variations inspired by
managerial imperatives, a general lack of testing, little effective
user feedback, and probably more "white space" than useful output if
the consultants were paid by the page.


Heh. This weekend I was chatting with a friend whose business is buying
and selling CNC machinery. He talked about arriving at his warehouse at
8 AM to find the scheduled local trucker sitting there three hours
before his appointed 11 AM arrival time.

The trucker said he liked to arrive early to make sure nothing went
wrong. "And they pay me by the hour anyway. I like the overtime."

So he got paid three hours overtime for sitting and drinking coffee.

--
- Frank Krygowski


Frank - how has the weather been up there for the last couple of years. Usually when it's dry commuters might chose bicycles but they don't like it in the wet. Especially these days when traffic cops no longer ticket traffic offenders.
 




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