Which rims for Big Apple?

Anyone with experience of Scwalbe's Big Apple tyre?

1.Is it true that the Big Apple is a good substitute for a suspension
fork and a suspended setpost?


2. What size tyre? What size rim? What make rim?


3. What size rim would in your opinion be better?

4. Anyone else with an opinion of what width and which make of rim
would be best for Big Apple in 50mm and 60mm widths?

****
For the record, according to Schwalbe's FAQ, E|RTRO says you can fit
tyres up to 62mm on 21mm rims. And you can even fit them on 17 to 19mm
rims, if you do not inflate above certain limits )eg 45psi for a 60mm
tyre).

Andre Jute
http://members.lycos.co.uk/fiultra/B...20CYCLING.html

Andre Jute wrote:
Anyone with experience of Sc[h]walbe's Big Apple tyre?

1.Is it true that the Big Apple is a good substitute for a suspension
fork and a suspended setpost?


2. What size tyre? What size rim? What make rim?


3. What size rim would in your opinion be better?

4. Anyone else with an opinion of what width and which make of rim
would be best for Big Apple in 50mm and 60mm widths?
...

Mr. Colina, Mr. Jute is on line 1.

"Yep. There's nothing else like them (though with any luck that will
change in due time). It's a real shame that only a few bikes to date
are able to fit them." [1] - Chalo commenting on the Schwalbe Big Apple
60-622 tire on RBT.

[1]
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.bicycles.tech/browse_thread/thread/7d1c60b04448e4aa/34d65721d1e1802e?hl=en&lnk=gst&q=chalo+big+apple#3 4d65721d1e1802e.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

I had the opportunity recently to set up my father's old Trek 850 with
a pair of 60-559 Big Apples. My normal bike is a Giant Reign 3 with
47-559 on the rear and 35-559 on the front (both kept around 40-50
psi), so I was interested to see how the 60mm tires compared to the
Reign's suspension. I pumped the Big Apples to around their minimum
recommended pressure so they would give me the very soft ride, but on
the really poorly kept roads I was riding them on, it was still quite
a bouncy ride. I couldn't ride at my normal 30kph off curbs and over
pot holes without getting out of the seat. Also at that pressure there
was noticeable bounce when I put a lot of force into the pedals. So
maybe compared to very short travel suspensions they might be an
adequate substitution, but they're nothing like a nice FS bike.

tiborg wrote:
I had the opportunity recently to set up my father's old Trek 850 with
a pair of 60-559 Big Apples. My normal bike is a Giant Reign 3 with
47-559 on the rear and 35-559 on the front (both kept around 40-50
psi), so I was interested to see how the 60mm tires compared to the
Reign's suspension. I pumped the Big Apples to around their minimum
recommended pressure so they would give me the very soft ride, but on
the really poorly kept roads I was riding them on, it was still quite
a bouncy ride. I couldn't ride at my normal 30kph off curbs and over
pot holes without getting out of the seat. Also at that pressure there
was noticeable bounce when I put a lot of force into the pedals. So
maybe compared to very short travel suspensions they might be an
adequate substitution, but they're nothing like a nice FS bike.


Agreed. For a noticeable suspension you need to go very low on pressure.
The front handling is very poor then.

Lou

In article
,
Andre Jute wrote:

Anyone with experience of Scwalbe's Big Apple tyre?

1.Is it true that the Big Apple is a good substitute for a suspension
fork and a suspended setpost?

Compared to what? A 25 mm tire at 8 bar? Perhaps.

--
Michael Press

Andre Jute wrote:

Anyone with experience of Scwalbe's Big Apple tyre?

Yep. I've used 60-559, 60-622, and 50-622 sizes extensively, and I
have some experience with the 60-406 size. For the purposes of this
discussion I'm going to limit myself to commenting on the 60-559 and
60-622 sizes, since they are the ones that really stand apart from the
usual selections in those rim diameters. I'd only use the 50mm
versions if my bike was unable to fit the 60mm ones.

1.Is it true that the Big Apple is a good substitute for a suspension
fork and a suspended setpost?

Yes, in that they can attenuate shocks to a similar degree (similar to
a telescopic seatpost, anyway). But you have to run very low
pressures to get that sort of benefit from them, and how low you can
safely go depends on how wide your rims are.

I weigh about 350 lbs., and I can run these tires on relatively crappy
city streets at 2 bar, or about 29 psi. I have had no pinch flats to
date at such pressure. Rolling resistance at 29 psi is surprisingly
OK; while I'm sure it is slower than at the tires' max 65 psi rating,
I don't notice a speed difference. I only notice a difference in
cushiness and in handling/traction.

2. What size tyre? What size rim? What make rim?

My favorite size of the Big Apple is 60-622 or 29 x 2.35". Between
the width of the tire, the flexibility of the tire, and the diameter
of the wheel, I've found no better ride quality in the cycling world.
It bridges gaps, absorbs bumps, steps up gently onto raised edges, and
finds a secure footing on irregular surfaces like no other street
tire.

I've run the 60-622 Big Apple on three kinds of rims: Mavic T519 (an
ordinary touring bike rim), Sun Rhyno Lite 700c (a 27.5mm wide MTB
rim) and Kris Holm 29er mountain unicycle rim (a 38mm wide downhill-
style rim). Not surprisingly, it works best on the widest rim. It is
on the 38mm wide rim that I can use sub-30 psi pressures without
noticing any lateral casing deflection in hard corners. The Sun Rhyno
Lite is almost as good in that regard, but mounted on the Mavic rim
the tire is significantly less stable at high lean angles. However,
the tire's shock absorbtion seems slightly better at any given
pressure when the tire is mounted on the narrower rim.

http://www.unicycle.uk.com/shop/shop...?catalogid=674
http://www.ebikestop.com/sun_rhyno_l...lve-RM8438.php

3. What size rim would in your opinion be better?

Diameter? 700c, no question.

4. Anyone else with an opinion of what width and which make of rim
would be best for Big Apple in 50mm and 60mm widths?

Width? Something wide; I'm not sure it matters all that much. I
understand that there are a lot more wide stadtfiets-type rims
available in Europe than there are here in the States. Anything from
622-20 on up should be appropriate. In the USA, that pretty much
limits the choices to just the Sun Rhyno Lite 700c and the Kris Holm
29er.

For 26" rims, the choices get a lot more accommodating. Sun Metal
alone offers the Rhyno Lite, Rhyno Lite XL, Mammoth, King Pin, Double
Wide, Single Wide, Double Track, and probably others that are all
559-21 or wider. There is a bewildering proliferation of wide rims
intended for downhill and jumping MTBs, but many of these have no
brake tracks and must be used with hub brakes. For best ride quality,
I would not bother with any rim wider than about 559-35.

Chalo

Lou Holtman wrote:

tiborg wrote:

So
maybe compared to very short travel suspensions they might be an
adequate substitution, but they're nothing like a nice FS bike.

Agreed. For a noticeable suspension you need to go very low on pressure.
The front handling is very poor then.

For good handling, ride quality, and traction at low tire pressures,
the rim width must be a good match to the tire width. When the inside
width of the rim is about half of the tire's inflated width, the tire
should be quite stable at any ridable pressure while still allowing
decent compliance over bumps. At the same time, the soft tire's
ability to conform to the contours of the ground surface provides
additional traction.

I have a mountain bike fitted with 26 x 3.0 siped slicks mounted on
45mm wide rims. Despite my approximately 350 pound weight, I can run
these tires at 16-18 psi for a very soft ride. At the same pressures,
the traction this bike offers in corners is superior to that of any
other bike I have ridden. Sometimes I use higher pressures up to 40
psi to diminish rolling resistance, but there are no discernible
handling benefits from doing so.

Chalo

In article
,
Andre Jute wrote:

Anyone with experience of Scwalbe's Big Apple tyre?

1.Is it true that the Big Apple is a good substitute for a suspension
fork and a suspended setpost?


My every day/commute bike has 2-inch (50-559) Schwalbe Marathon tires,
which are similar to the Big Apple. Although fine on unpaved roads,
there is still much more vibration/shaking compared to my mountain bike
with front suspension fork. But compared to my old commute bike with
700x28C, the wider tires are far more comfortable (and also safer, I
think), and in the city I don't worry about potholes or a tire getting
caught in tram tracks. Any difference in speed or rolling resistance is
so minor that I don't notice it.

So 25 years later I have overcome my indoctrination by Eugene Sloan's
"Complete Book of Bicycling".

Ned

Ned Mantei wrote:
In article
,
Andre Jute wrote:

Anyone with experience of Scwalbe's Big Apple tyre?

1.Is it true that the Big Apple is a good substitute for a suspension
fork and a suspended setpost?


My every day/commute bike has 2-inch (50-559) Schwalbe Marathon tires,
which are similar to the Big Apple. Although fine on unpaved roads,
there is still much more vibration/shaking compared to my mountain bike
with front suspension fork. But compared to my old commute bike with
700x28C, the wider tires are far more comfortable (and also safer, I
think), and in the city I don't worry about potholes or a tire getting
caught in tram tracks. Any difference in speed or rolling resistance is
so minor that I don't notice it.

So 25 years later I have overcome my indoctrination by Eugene Sloan's
"Complete Book of Bicycling".

Indeed. I often had comments from roadies on how wide my 32-406 tires
were, so I of course replaced them with 47-406 tires for better ride,
traction, handling and decreased rolling resistance.

--
Tom Sherman - Holstein-Friesland Bovinia
The weather is here, wish you were beautiful

On Sun, 06 Jul 2008 06:48:42 -0500, Tom Sherman
wrote:

I often had comments from roadies

Where are you riding? On trails? In fields?