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#11
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Frame design influenced by riding positon?
John B. -
seat post angles forward of the BB...this allows upper torso leaning forward, thighs backward down to the BB...linear...for running forward on pedals post backward over BB allows maneuverability around tree stumps with weight on back wheel...maneuver over power. Tho you can stand up n power. I'll bet EXRX knows if arms are up or down when sitting for abdominal power to thighs. |
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#12
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Frame design influenced by riding positon?
On Sunday, March 30, 2014 5:14:03 AM UTC-7, Sir Ridesalot wrote:
Read somewhere recently that riding upright is more efficient than riding bent over but riding bent over is better in the wind or at speeds where perceived wind is a factor due to the force exerted upon a less aerodynamic upright riding position. That got me to wondering. Are bicycle frame designs influenced much by the intended riding position? 1. There is a third consideration, right? In addition to wind resistance and efficiency, there is also ease of breathing, I think, at least for those of us with a belly. I can't hang out on the drops right now cuz I can't breathe! :-( 2. Would handlebar design not have much more to do with riding position than frame design? Old fashioned swept-back bars meet the hands much better and more naturally than a straight bar, right? Yet with the advent of mtn bikes, the former were dropped for the latter. Yielding momentarily to the temptation to put words in Jobst's mouth, I think he would say that this is for economic reasons, straight bars being both easier to manufacture and better selling due to their resemblance to what is being raced. And this trend has done a significant disservice to most of the world's cycling population - all of 'em except mtn bike racers and road riders. Since the bars are, once fixed to the frame, experienced by the rider as having become a part of the frame itself, I think the answer to the question is a resounding no. dkl |
#13
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Frame design influenced by riding positon?
On Sunday, March 30, 2014 11:30:14 AM UTC-5, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
Besides being more efficient, upright is also more comfortable. Really? Maybe this is true for very short rides of a few miles and minutes.. But for long rides of tens or hundreds of miles and many hours, upright is extremely uncomfortable. Being bent over on a diamond frame with some of the weight supported by the arms/hands reduces the weight borne by the rump. Greatly improving comfort. |
#14
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Frame design influenced by riding positon?
On 01/04/14 05:46, Doug Landau wrote:
On Sunday, March 30, 2014 5:14:03 AM UTC-7, Sir Ridesalot wrote: Read somewhere recently that riding upright is more efficient than riding bent over but riding bent over is better in the wind or at speeds where perceived wind is a factor due to the force exerted upon a less aerodynamic upright riding position. That got me to wondering. Are bicycle frame designs influenced much by the intended riding position? 1. There is a third consideration, right? In addition to wind resistance and efficiency, there is also ease of breathing, I think, at least for those of us with a belly. I can't hang out on the drops right now cuz I can't breathe! :-( 2. Would handlebar design not have much more to do with riding position than frame design? Old fashioned swept-back bars meet the hands much better and more naturally than a straight bar, right? Yet with the advent of mtn bikes, the former were dropped for the latter. Yielding momentarily to the temptation to put words in Jobst's mouth, I think he would say that this is for economic reasons, straight bars being both easier to manufacture and better selling due to their resemblance to what is being raced. And this trend has done a significant disservice to most of the world's cycling population - all of 'em except mtn bike racers and road riders. Since the bars are, once fixed to the frame, experienced by the rider as having become a part of the frame itself, I think the answer to the question is a resounding no. I bought a MTB a few years back. The straight bars are ok for riding off road - really off road that is. But I find the bars particularly uncomfortable to use on the road. The main reason is that at the width required to fit all the levers and knobs, the bars set my hands to far apart. What I think I need is a narrower flat bar with a skinny centre section, so that the levers and knobs can be fitted close to the stem, and bar ends in an integrated fashion, with brake hods and extra brake levers perhaps. I haven't quite worked it all out, but it annoys me the way it is. -- JS |
#15
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Frame design influenced by riding positon?
straight bars yield turning torque n control...and fewer broken wrists.
the arm to abdomen to glutes/thighs power is.....in the TdF position close to the body. so practice pedaling leaning forward out o the saddle. |
#16
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Frame design influenced by riding positon?
On Tue, 01 Apr 2014 08:58:34 +1100, James
wrote: On 01/04/14 05:46, Doug Landau wrote: On Sunday, March 30, 2014 5:14:03 AM UTC-7, Sir Ridesalot wrote: Read somewhere recently that riding upright is more efficient than riding bent over but riding bent over is better in the wind or at speeds where perceived wind is a factor due to the force exerted upon a less aerodynamic upright riding position. That got me to wondering. Are bicycle frame designs influenced much by the intended riding position? 1. There is a third consideration, right? In addition to wind resistance and efficiency, there is also ease of breathing, I think, at least for those of us with a belly. I can't hang out on the drops right now cuz I can't breathe! :-( 2. Would handlebar design not have much more to do with riding position than frame design? Old fashioned swept-back bars meet the hands much better and more naturally than a straight bar, right? Yet with the advent of mtn bikes, the former were dropped for the latter. Yielding momentarily to the temptation to put words in Jobst's mouth, I think he would say that this is for economic reasons, straight bars being both easier to manufacture and better selling due to their resemblance to what is being raced. And this trend has done a significant disservice to most of the world's cycling population - all of 'em except mtn bike racers and road riders. Since the bars are, once fixed to the frame, experienced by the rider as having become a part of the frame itself, I think the answer to the question is a resounding no. I bought a MTB a few years back. The straight bars are ok for riding off road - really off road that is. But I find the bars particularly uncomfortable to use on the road. The main reason is that at the width required to fit all the levers and knobs, the bars set my hands to far apart. What I think I need is a narrower flat bar with a skinny centre section, so that the levers and knobs can be fitted close to the stem, and bar ends in an integrated fashion, with brake hods and extra brake levers perhaps. I haven't quite worked it all out, but it annoys me the way it is. I did the exact same thing. I even tried a set of "cow horn", or what ever you call them, bars - cut most of the dropped section off an old set of road bars and mount them up side down. I ended up using bar end shifters in a set of road bars. The straight bars seemed to cause arm wrist and hand pain while the change in orientation of the hands on the road bars does not. -- Cheers, John B. |
#17
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Frame design influenced by riding positon?
On Monday, March 31, 2014 8:09:24 PM UTC-4, John B. wrote:
On Tue, 01 Apr 2014 08:58:34 +1100, James wrote: On 01/04/14 05:46, Doug Landau wrote: On Sunday, March 30, 2014 5:14:03 AM UTC-7, Sir Ridesalot wrote: Read somewhere recently that riding upright is more efficient than riding bent over but riding bent over is better in the wind or at speeds where perceived wind is a factor due to the force exerted upon a less aerodynamic upright riding position. That got me to wondering. Are bicycle frame designs influenced much by the intended riding position? 1. There is a third consideration, right? In addition to wind resistance and efficiency, there is also ease of breathing, I think, at least for those of us with a belly. I can't hang out on the drops right now cuz I can't breathe! :-( 2. Would handlebar design not have much more to do with riding position than frame design? Old fashioned swept-back bars meet the hands much better and more naturally than a straight bar, right? Yet with the advent of mtn bikes, the former were dropped for the latter. Yielding momentarily to the temptation to put words in Jobst's mouth, I think he would say that this is for economic reasons, straight bars being both easier to manufacture and better selling due to their resemblance to what is being raced. And this trend has done a significant disservice to most of the world's cycling population - all of 'em except mtn bike racers and road riders. Since the bars are, once fixed to the frame, experienced by the rider as having become a part of the frame itself, I think the answer to the question is a resounding no. I bought a MTB a few years back. The straight bars are ok for riding off road - really off road that is. But I find the bars particularly uncomfortable to use on the road. The main reason is that at the width required to fit all the levers and knobs, the bars set my hands to far apart. What I think I need is a narrower flat bar with a skinny centre section, so that the levers and knobs can be fitted close to the stem, and bar ends in an integrated fashion, with brake hods and extra brake levers perhaps. I haven't quite worked it all out, but it annoys me the way it is. I did the exact same thing. I even tried a set of "cow horn", or what ever you call them, bars - cut most of the dropped section off an old set of road bars and mount them up side down. I ended up using bar end shifters in a set of road bars. The straight bars seemed to cause arm wrist and hand pain while the change in orientation of the hands on the road bars does not. -- Cheers, John B. EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE No, you're doing apples and pears. bars were developd from need then produced as useful to a particular groups use in a specific way. Here you're not moving around in rougher terrain stimulating muscles and hand circulation nor are you used to or trained into that area. |
#18
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Frame design influenced by riding positon?
On 3/31/2014 5:58 PM, James wrote:
I bought a MTB a few years back. The straight bars are ok for riding off road - really off road that is. But I find the bars particularly uncomfortable to use on the road. The main reason is that at the width required to fit all the levers and knobs, the bars set my hands to far apart. What I think I need is a narrower flat bar with a skinny centre section, so that the levers and knobs can be fitted close to the stem, and bar ends in an integrated fashion, with brake hods and extra brake levers perhaps. I haven't quite worked it all out, but it annoys me the way it is. I find those super-wide bars irritating, too. Not only for comfort, but because our nearby woods are quite dense. When I got my first mountain bike, I was having to be very careful that the bars didn't get hooked on trees & shrubs alongside the single track trails. A few minutes with a hacksaw made things much better; but those bars had none of the modern bulges, so inward space wasn't a big problem. -- - Frank Krygowski |
#19
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Frame design influenced by riding positon?
On Monday, March 31, 2014 5:58:34 PM UTC-4, James wrote:
On 01/04/14 05:46, Doug Landau wrote: On Sunday, March 30, 2014 5:14:03 AM UTC-7, Sir Ridesalot wrote: Read somewhere recently that riding upright is more efficient than riding bent over but riding bent over is better in the wind or at speeds where perceived wind is a factor due to the force exerted upon a less aerodynamic upright riding position. That got me to wondering. Are bicycle frame designs influenced much by the intended riding position? 1. There is a third consideration, right? In addition to wind resistance and efficiency, there is also ease of breathing, I think, at least for those of us with a belly. I can't hang out on the drops right now cuz I can't breathe! :-( 2. Would handlebar design not have much more to do with riding position than frame design? Old fashioned swept-back bars meet the hands much better and more naturally than a straight bar, right? Yet with the advent of mtn bikes, the former were dropped for the latter. Yielding momentarily to the temptation to put words in Jobst's mouth, I think he would say that this is for economic reasons, straight bars being both easier to manufacture and better selling due to their resemblance to what is being raced. And this trend has done a significant disservice to most of the world's cycling population - all of 'em except mtn bike racers and road riders. Since the bars are, once fixed to the frame, experienced by the rider as having become a part of the frame itself, I think the answer to the question is a resounding no. I bought a MTB a few years back. The straight bars are ok for riding off road - really off road that is. But I find the bars particularly uncomfortable to use on the road. The main reason is that at the width required to fit all the levers and knobs, the bars set my hands to far apart. What I think I need is a narrower flat bar with a skinny centre section, so that the levers and knobs can be fitted close to the stem, and bar ends in an integrated fashion, with brake hods and extra brake levers perhaps. I haven't quite worked it all out, but it annoys me the way it is. -- JS I used a tubing cutter to take about three inches off of each side of the straight bars on my MTB come "pick em up and grocery" bike. Makes it much easier to switch from road bike to that bike in ters of comfort due to spacing of hands and is a fair bit more aero too and is also a lot easier to get through doorways. Cheers |
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