#21
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New Trek Pricing
On Mon, 08 Apr 2019 09:43:36 -0500,
AMuzi wrote: On 4/8/2019 9:04 AM, AMuzi wrote: On 4/7/2019 11:54 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Mon, 08 Apr 2019 09:43:57 +0700, wrote: To be honest, in this day and age it makes little sense to manufacture in the U.S. True. We have successfully exported most of our industrial capacity to foreign countries. ...as the standard of living increases in former counties with currently low labor rates, they will simply find other 3rd world countries with similarly low labor rates to exploit. Our US trade magazine just dropped Italy from the quarterly import report and replaced them with Vietnam (now 10X Italy's volume). Meanwhile these guys are a going concern and just extended their order to ship times by a few weeks: dammit here's the actual link https://waterfordbikes.com/ DOH! At first glance I read that address as 816 Bobke Ave and thought WTF is he up to now!? -- Ted Heise West Lafayette, IN, USA |
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#22
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New Trek Pricing
On Mon, 8 Apr 2019 16:53:51 +0000 (UTC), Theodore Heise
wrote: DOH! At first glance I read that address as 816 Bobke Ave and thought WTF is he up to now!? I'll pretend to ignore the implications of that Freudian slip. For those unfamiliar with Yiddish or Polish, bobke literally translates to sheep or goat droppings. It's typically used as an exclamation of disagreement in the same manner as nonsense, rubbish, bull s**t, hog wash, etc. https://waterfordbikes.com I see the problem. You might suggest to the Waterford Precision Cycles people to have their web designer change the font to something that is less compressed and more readable, preferably one that has some additional white space between the characters. Without my glasses, the address was unreadable. With the glasses, only slightly better. -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
#23
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New Trek Pricing
On Mon, 08 Apr 2019 11:46:00 -0700,
Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Mon, 8 Apr 2019 16:53:51 +0000 (UTC), Theodore Heise wrote: DOH! At first glance I read that address as 816 Bobke Ave and thought WTF is he up to now!? I'll pretend to ignore the implications of that Freudian slip. For those unfamiliar with Yiddish or Polish, bobke literally translates to sheep or goat droppings. It's typically used as an exclamation of disagreement in the same manner as nonsense, rubbish, bull s**t, hog wash, etc. That's hilarious! Did not know that, but am not surprised. https://waterfordbikes.com I see the problem. You might suggest to the Waterford Precision Cycles people to have their web designer change the font to something that is less compressed and more readable, preferably one that has some additional white space between the characters. Without my glasses, the address was unreadable. With the glasses, only slightly better. Yeah, it's not ideal. On the other hand, I don't care enough about it to bother saying anything to them. Maybe Andrew does. -- Ted Heise West Lafayette, IN, USA |
#25
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New Trek Pricing
On Mon, 08 Apr 2019 09:43:36 -0500, AMuzi wrote:
On 4/8/2019 9:04 AM, AMuzi wrote: On 4/7/2019 11:54 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Mon, 08 Apr 2019 09:43:57 +0700, wrote: To be honest, in this day and age it makes little sense to manufacture in the U.S. Given the cost of labor and overhead in the U.S. you can make the same product in a foreign country much cheaper and if you are a competent manager of the same quality. True. We have successfully exported most of our industrial capacity to foreign countries. In return we get cheap manufactured products. When we export most of our research and design, the US will cease to be a major manufacturing nation. Trek can then remove the "Designed in Wisconsin" sticker. For example, the U.S. minimum salary is now in the $10/hour range I'm told while in Thailand the minimum salary is 300 baht, about US$9..60... a day. As we slowly blunder towards a world economy, such pay imbalances are unlikely to continue. Initially, as the standard of living increases in former counties with currently low labor rates, they will simply find other 3rd world countries with similarly low labor rates to exploit. Maybe a few small wars might be needed to equalize the pay scale. My crystal ball isn't very clear beyond that point. Our US trade magazine just dropped Italy from the quarterly import report and replaced them with Vietnam (now 10X Italy's volume). Meanwhile these guys are a going concern and just extended their order to ship times by a few weeks: dammit here's the actual link https://waterfordbikes.com/ I notice that site doesn't seem to include prices... is that to prevent heart attacks amongst their potential customers? -- cheers, John B. |
#26
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New Trek Pricing
On 4/8/2019 6:30 PM, John B. wrote:
On Mon, 08 Apr 2019 09:43:36 -0500, AMuzi wrote: On 4/8/2019 9:04 AM, AMuzi wrote: On 4/7/2019 11:54 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Mon, 08 Apr 2019 09:43:57 +0700, wrote: To be honest, in this day and age it makes little sense to manufacture in the U.S. Given the cost of labor and overhead in the U.S. you can make the same product in a foreign country much cheaper and if you are a competent manager of the same quality. True. We have successfully exported most of our industrial capacity to foreign countries. In return we get cheap manufactured products. When we export most of our research and design, the US will cease to be a major manufacturing nation. Trek can then remove the "Designed in Wisconsin" sticker. For example, the U.S. minimum salary is now in the $10/hour range I'm told while in Thailand the minimum salary is 300 baht, about US$9..60... a day. As we slowly blunder towards a world economy, such pay imbalances are unlikely to continue. Initially, as the standard of living increases in former counties with currently low labor rates, they will simply find other 3rd world countries with similarly low labor rates to exploit. Maybe a few small wars might be needed to equalize the pay scale. My crystal ball isn't very clear beyond that point. Our US trade magazine just dropped Italy from the quarterly import report and replaced them with Vietnam (now 10X Italy's volume). Meanwhile these guys are a going concern and just extended their order to ship times by a few weeks: dammit here's the actual link https://waterfordbikes.com/ I notice that site doesn't seem to include prices... is that to prevent heart attacks amongst their potential customers? The accepted wisdom of so-called web experts today is to start with a popular and functional website and then change it frenetically and mercilessly until whatever you seek is hard to find: https://waterfordbikes.com/pricing/ -- Andrew Muzi www.yellowjersey.org/ Open every day since 1 April, 1971 |
#27
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New Trek Pricing
On Sunday, April 7, 2019 at 5:58:12 PM UTC-7, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Sun, 07 Apr 2019 10:09:22 +0700, wrote: There is a law that covers a "Made in U.S.A." statement. From memory it doesn't mean that the entire thing was made in the U.S. but that the majority was, or something of that nature. "Complying with the Made in USA Standard" https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/business-center/guidance/complying-made-usa-standard Marketers and manufacturers that promote their products as Made in USA must meet the "all or virtually all" standard. Note that this document was scribbled in 1998 and is probably in need of revision. So the "Designed in Wisconsin" probably means that the design and specifications were done there and the actual manufacturing done elsewhere. https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/business-center/guidance/complying-made-usa-standard Example: A company designs a product in New York City and sends the blueprint to a factory in Finland for manufacturing. It labels the product "Designed in USA - Made in Finland." Such a specific processing claim would not lead a reasonable consumer to believe that the whole product was made in the U.S. The Customs Service requires the product to be marked "Made in," or "Product of" Finland since the product is of Finnish origin and the claim refers to the U.S. Actually this type of design - manufacture process is not uncommon. Caterpillar, for example, manufacturers several types of their equipment in Indonesia, Cummins makes several models of their diesel engines in China, and so on. Both Cat and Cummins give exactly the same guarantee for the Asian made equipment as they do for the U.S. made. I would think that Trek should have labeled their bicycles as "Made in China - Designed in Wisconsin". "Are Trek Bikes Made in the USA"? https://allamericanreviews.com/trek/ -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 Well, how do you suppose they measure that since at least the group set and the tires are made outside of the USA? The most common saddles and seat posts are made outside of America. The most common stems and handlebars are made outside o the USA? Trek probably uses Bontrager seat posts, saddles, stems and bars. I do not believe that they are made in the USA. |
#28
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New Trek Pricing
On Sunday, April 7, 2019 at 7:44:00 PM UTC-7, John B. wrote:
On Sun, 07 Apr 2019 17:58:09 -0700, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Sun, 07 Apr 2019 10:09:22 +0700, wrote: There is a law that covers a "Made in U.S.A." statement. From memory it doesn't mean that the entire thing was made in the U.S. but that the majority was, or something of that nature. "Complying with the Made in USA Standard" https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/business-center/guidance/complying-made-usa-standard Marketers and manufacturers that promote their products as Made in USA must meet the "all or virtually all" standard. Note that this document was scribbled in 1998 and is probably in need of revision. So the "Designed in Wisconsin" probably means that the design and specifications were done there and the actual manufacturing done elsewhere. https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/business-center/guidance/complying-made-usa-standard Example: A company designs a product in New York City and sends the blueprint to a factory in Finland for manufacturing. It labels the product "Designed in USA - Made in Finland." Such a specific processing claim would not lead a reasonable consumer to believe that the whole product was made in the U.S. The Customs Service requires the product to be marked "Made in," or "Product of" Finland since the product is of Finnish origin and the claim refers to the U.S. Actually this type of design - manufacture process is not uncommon. Caterpillar, for example, manufacturers several types of their equipment in Indonesia, Cummins makes several models of their diesel engines in China, and so on. Both Cat and Cummins give exactly the same guarantee for the Asian made equipment as they do for the U.S. made. I would think that Trek should have labeled their bicycles as "Made in China - Designed in Wisconsin". "Are Trek Bikes Made in the USA"? https://allamericanreviews.com/trek/ To be honest, in this day and age it makes little sense to manufacture in the U.S. Given the cost of labor and overhead in the U.S. you can make the same product in a foreign country much cheaper and if you are a competent manager of the same quality. For example, the U.S. minimum salary is now in the $10/hour range I'm told while in Thailand the minimum salary is 300 baht, about US$9..60... a day. -- cheers, John B. I don't think you understand just how much cheap automation America uses anymore. Cars for instance, are build with components that are engineered from the beginning to be molded and used for 10 years worth of vehicles. Each and every component is designed for the least possible part count. It is absolutely amazing to see an automobile assembly line that has 15 stations instead of the old 200. |
#29
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New Trek Pricing
On Monday, April 8, 2019 at 1:10:00 AM UTC-5, jOHN b. wrote:
When I was first married I used to give my wife 500 baht (about US$ 25.00 at the time) a month to run the house, pay the lights and water, etc. Now... I give her about US$775 for the same purpose. cheers, John B. You still have a wife? I'm guessing your wife is NOT American or western European or from any modern, civilized, democratic, rich type country. I ride with a bunch of dirty old men. All married. I'm guessing their wives would whip the hide off their arse if they tried anything like that. |
#30
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New Trek Pricing
On Mon, 8 Apr 2019 21:39:54 +0000 (UTC), Theodore Heise
wrote: On Mon, 08 Apr 2019 11:46:00 -0700, Jeff Liebermann wrote: On Mon, 8 Apr 2019 16:53:51 +0000 (UTC), Theodore Heise wrote: DOH! At first glance I read that address as 816 Bobke Ave and thought WTF is he up to now!? I'll pretend to ignore the implications of that Freudian slip. For those unfamiliar with Yiddish or Polish, bobke literally translates to sheep or goat droppings. It's typically used as an exclamation of disagreement in the same manner as nonsense, rubbish, bull s**t, hog wash, etc. That's hilarious! Did not know that, but am not surprised. To be more accurate, the usual spelling is bubkes which is the plural form of bobke. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bubkes https://waterfordbikes.com I see the problem. You might suggest to the Waterford Precision Cycles people to have their web designer change the font to something that is less compressed and more readable, preferably one that has some additional white space between the characters. Without my glasses, the address was unreadable. With the glasses, only slightly better. Yeah, it's not ideal. On the other hand, I don't care enough about it to bother saying anything to them. Maybe Andrew does. It's easy. Just use the form to send them an email: https://waterfordbikes.com/contact-us/ Be sure to also mention that the light gray text makes some things even more difficult to read. I have the gamma on my monitor set to increase contrast and to be rather non-linear. That makes dark lines darker, and dim lines lighter. With a white background, the light gray text just fades into the background. -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
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