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Bottom Bracket/General Frustration advice please?



 
 
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  #1  
Old April 10th 04, 08:46 PM
Saint
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Default Bottom Bracket/General Frustration advice please?

Prior to Xmas I bought a new bike at a shop which is not my LBS but
nonetheless seemed ok. I wanted a second bike for general buggering about
on. They were selling it quite cheap whereas my LBS has a reputation for
being rather pricey.

However, having now done a good few hundred miles on it I have noticed that
the shifting, particularly at the front, continues to be very hit and miss
and the bottom bracket creaks like hell, which is driving me absolutely
nuts. I initially put the shifting down to general cable stretch and duly
took it back to the shop (3rd time) where I bought it who inform me that
they again adjusted/stripped it all and that the creaking was due to the
aluminium/steel relationship between frame and bracket and that this was
normal. They have now made 3 attempts to sort it out and its no better. The
set is Tiagra and it generally starts after about 10 mins riding - hence the
fact it doesn't happen on the stand or outside the shop!!

Anyway, first ride out today post latest 'fix' and the problem is worse than
ever. Added to which the bloody chain kept coming off. I know I should take
it back but I have lost confidence on the shop's competence and am looking
at other options:

1. Swapping the bike altogether - shame as I really like it. But also like
the look of the Cannondales that get rave reviews, except that I ride only
for fitness and around 80 miles per week - I dunno if these would be a bit
OTT for me?

Can anyone comment on the R500? Must admit I tend to feel more comfortable
on a flat bar though so any other recommendations welcome.

2. Upgrading the bottom bracket/chainring and derailleurs to something like
Ultegra - would this make a difference? Also how much would this cost
(roughly?)

The moral of this story is of course to deal only with your LBS. They may
be dearer but at least you can build a relationship with them. Now I have
to go in red faced and admit I 'cheated' on them and bought from a
competitor.......I know I will have to pay the price. Upside is that their
mechanic is red hot and can fix most stuff.

Cheers.

S


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  #2  
Old April 10th 04, 09:00 PM
Pete Biggs
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Posts: n/a
Default Bottom Bracket/General Frustration advice please?

Saint wrote:
Prior to Xmas I bought a new bike at a shop which is not my LBS but
nonetheless seemed ok. I wanted a second bike for general buggering
about on. They were selling it quite cheap whereas my LBS has a
reputation for being rather pricey.

However, having now done a good few hundred miles on it I have
noticed that the shifting, particularly at the front, continues to be
very hit and miss and the bottom bracket creaks like hell, which is
driving me absolutely nuts. I initially put the shifting down to
general cable stretch and duly took it back to the shop (3rd time)
where I bought it who inform me that they again adjusted/stripped it
all and that the creaking was due to the aluminium/steel relationship
between frame and bracket and that this was normal. They have now
made 3 attempts to sort it out and its no better. The set is Tiagra
and it generally starts after about 10 mins riding - hence the fact
it doesn't happen on the stand or outside the shop!!

Anyway, first ride out today post latest 'fix' and the problem is
worse than ever.


Are you quite sure it's the BB that's creaking? What else have you
eliminated and how?

Added to which the bloody chain kept coming off. I
know I should take it back but I have lost confidence on the shop's
competence and am looking at other options:

1. Swapping the bike altogether - shame as I really like it.


Don't then. Although creaks can be hard to track down, the problems are
not serious and can be fixed. Try another bike shop or learn to DIY.

2. Upgrading the bottom bracket/chainring and derailleurs to
something like Ultegra - would this make a difference?


If it does, it'll just be coincidence.

Also how much
would this cost (roughly?)


See www.wiggle.co.uk to get an idea of bike shop prices (for Shimano).
Few quid extra for fitting.

~PB


  #3  
Old April 11th 04, 12:20 AM
JBB
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Posts: n/a
Default Bottom Bracket/General Frustration advice please?


"Saint" wrote in message
...
Prior to Xmas I bought a new bike at a shop which is not my LBS but
nonetheless seemed ok. I wanted a second bike for general buggering about
on. They were selling it quite cheap whereas my LBS has a reputation for
being rather pricey.

However, having now done a good few hundred miles on it I have noticed

that
the shifting, particularly at the front, continues to be very hit and miss
and the bottom bracket creaks like hell, which is driving me absolutely
nuts. I initially put the shifting down to general cable stretch and duly
took it back to the shop (3rd time) where I bought it who inform me that
they again adjusted/stripped it all and that the creaking was due to the
aluminium/steel relationship between frame and bracket and that this was
normal. They have now made 3 attempts to sort it out and its no better.

The
set is Tiagra and it generally starts after about 10 mins riding - hence

the
fact it doesn't happen on the stand or outside the shop!!

Anyway, first ride out today post latest 'fix' and the problem is worse

than
ever. Added to which the bloody chain kept coming off. I know I should

take
it back but I have lost confidence on the shop's competence and am looking
at other options:

1. Swapping the bike altogether - shame as I really like it. But also

like
the look of the Cannondales that get rave reviews, except that I ride only
for fitness and around 80 miles per week - I dunno if these would be a bit
OTT for me?

Can anyone comment on the R500? Must admit I tend to feel more

comfortable
on a flat bar though so any other recommendations welcome.

2. Upgrading the bottom bracket/chainring and derailleurs to something

like
Ultegra - would this make a difference? Also how much would this cost
(roughly?)

The moral of this story is of course to deal only with your LBS. They may
be dearer but at least you can build a relationship with them. Now I have
to go in red faced and admit I 'cheated' on them and bought from a
competitor.......I know I will have to pay the price. Upside is that their
mechanic is red hot and can fix most stuff.

Cheers.

S

Dunno but if I got creaking noises I'd suspect the tightness of the cranks
first. A quick check there could pay dividends.
Julia


  #4  
Old April 11th 04, 08:09 AM
DG
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Posts: n/a
Default Bottom Bracket/General Frustration advice please?

"JBB" wrote in message
...

"Saint" wrote in message
...
Prior to Xmas I bought a new bike ...
However, having now done a good few hundred miles on it I have noticed

that the shifting, particularly at the front, continues to be very hit and

miss
and the bottom bracket creaks like hell,


Have a similar problem myself.

Bought bike last November. Done less than 150 miles so far (OK, I know I've
been lazy).

Some front changing problems and chain rub. Most likely down to poor
adjustment, which I will sort out. However, since a wet ride home from work
a couple of days ago, a squeak has developed from the left hand crank.

If, as JBB suggests, this is down to tightness of the cranks, just how tight
should they be? Should I use any lube between crank and spindle? If so,
what?

Cheers,

DG


  #5  
Old April 11th 04, 01:34 PM
jtaylor
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Posts: n/a
Default Bottom Bracket/General Frustration advice please?


Saint wrote in message
...
Prior to Xmas I bought a new bike at a shop which is not my LBS but
nonetheless seemed ok. I wanted a second bike for general buggering about
on. They were selling it quite cheap whereas my LBS has a reputation for
being rather pricey.

However, having now done a good few hundred miles on it I have noticed

that
the shifting, particularly at the front, continues to be very hit and miss
and the bottom bracket creaks like hell, which is driving me absolutely
nuts. I initially put the shifting down to general cable stretch and duly
took it back to the shop (3rd time) where I bought it who inform me that
they again adjusted/stripped it all and that the creaking was due to the
aluminium/steel relationship between frame and bracket and that this was
normal. They have now made 3 attempts to sort it out and its no better.

The
set is Tiagra and it generally starts after about 10 mins riding - hence

the
fact it doesn't happen on the stand or outside the shop!!


With the above characterisics I'd suspect a loose crank-to-ring bolt. They
creak, can affect shifing, and when you let it sit the oxide will build up -
starting off there's no creak, then the oxide rubs off and it does.

  #6  
Old April 11th 04, 04:21 PM
Saint
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Bottom Bracket/General Frustration advice please?


"jtaylor" wrote in message
...

Saint wrote in message
...
Prior to Xmas I bought a new bike at a shop which is not my LBS but
nonetheless seemed ok. I wanted a second bike for general buggering

about
on. They were selling it quite cheap whereas my LBS has a reputation

for
being rather pricey.

However, having now done a good few hundred miles on it I have noticed

that
the shifting, particularly at the front, continues to be very hit and

miss
and the bottom bracket creaks like hell, which is driving me absolutely
nuts. I initially put the shifting down to general cable stretch and

duly
took it back to the shop (3rd time) where I bought it who inform me that
they again adjusted/stripped it all and that the creaking was due to the
aluminium/steel relationship between frame and bracket and that this was
normal. They have now made 3 attempts to sort it out and its no better.

The
set is Tiagra and it generally starts after about 10 mins riding - hence

the
fact it doesn't happen on the stand or outside the shop!!


With the above characterisics I'd suspect a loose crank-to-ring bolt. They
creak, can affect shifing, and when you let it sit the oxide will build

up -
starting off there's no creak, then the oxide rubs off and it does.


Well I got lucky todat in the respct that I found a shop open who took a
look at it. They agree that the noise is the bottom bracket but say that
it's clean, greased, fitted and tightened properly and the problem may be
that it is just 'bedding in'.

That's the second shop telling me that there's nothing wrong but I don't buy
it at all - you don't buy a new bike and expect it to make such a din - it's
maddening when riding.

Is it difficult to fit a new crank? Does it involve removing the frone mech
et al? Are there special tools needed?

Cheers

Saint


  #7  
Old April 11th 04, 05:12 PM
Pete Biggs
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Posts: n/a
Default Bottom Bracket/General Frustration advice please?

Saint wrote:

Is it difficult to fit a new crank?


I doubt you need a new crank, but they're not difficult to fit if you have
the right tools.

Does it involve removing the
frone mech et al?


No

Are there special tools needed?


Need a "crank puller" to get the old one off. Best to use a torque wrench
to fit new crank.

~PB


  #8  
Old April 11th 04, 06:50 PM
Thomas Letherby
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Posts: n/a
Default Bottom Bracket/General Frustration advice please?

In message , Saint
writes

Well I got lucky todat in the respct that I found a shop open who took a
look at it. They agree that the noise is the bottom bracket but say that
it's clean, greased, fitted and tightened properly and the problem may be
that it is just 'bedding in'.

That's the second shop telling me that there's nothing wrong but I don't buy
it at all - you don't buy a new bike and expect it to make such a din - it's
maddening when riding.

Is it difficult to fit a new crank? Does it involve removing the frone mech
et al? Are there special tools needed?


Just before you spend any money, check the seatpost is greased where it
sits in the frame (unless it's carbon) and the saddle clamp is cinched
up tightly, both can cause a creak that can sound a lot like a bottom
bracket, especially with an aluminium frame.

To check if it is this, stand up and pedal, if the sound goes away then
it's probably that, if not then look at the cranks again. With creaks
it's a long process of elimination, but check each set of bolts in turn
until you find what has affected it. Also take a look at your pedals,
seen a spd style pedal creak a bit like a bb too...

To be fair both shops should have told you this, trying each bit in turn
until you don't get the squeak, the mechanic really should have taken it
for a test ride for such creaks, or even ride along side you to see if
that helps.

Then chuck money at it

--
Thomas Letherby

  #9  
Old April 11th 04, 07:16 PM
Saint
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Posts: n/a
Default Bottom Bracket/General Frustration advice please?


"Pete Biggs" wrote in message
...
Saint wrote:

Is it difficult to fit a new crank?


I doubt you need a new crank, but they're not difficult to fit if you have
the right tools.

Does it involve removing the
frone mech et al?


No

Are there special tools needed?


Need a "crank puller" to get the old one off. Best to use a torque wrench
to fit new crank.

~PB


Thanks again, as ever, Pete. To be honest I would agree in principle that
the bike 'shouldn't' need a new crank - it's done less than 500 miles.
However if you were to ride it I would guarantee that, within 5 miles, you
would want to chuck the thing down the nearest cliff!! It really is
maddening and I just may have to accept that I may have a duff one.

Now I just need to fathom out how to fit one! All part of the fun and I am
learning all the time.

Cheers

S


  #10  
Old April 12th 04, 12:11 AM
Pete Biggs
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Posts: n/a
Default Bottom Bracket/General Frustration advice please?

Saint wrote:
Now I just need to fathom out how to fit one! All part of the fun
and I am learning all the time.


Get remover tool from LBS or:
http://www.mwdyason.ltd.uk/shop.asp?..._company=TOOLS

Instructions for the most common type of cranks:
www.parktool.com/repair_help/FAQrCarm.shtml

It'll be well worth removing and refitting the existing cranks yourself
before replacing them. Grease the spindle* (and bolts) and get cranks
nice and tight. You might do a better job than the bike shops, seriously.
Don't forget that you're not just tightening a bolt but actually wedging
the crank up the spindle so quite some force is needed (but don't go
completely bonkers on it!). You might also need considerable force on the
tool to remove - use a wrench or large adjustable spanner on tool if
necessary.

Also check chainring bolts are tight; grease pedal threads and tighten,
keep on trying to eliminate things.

* Opposite to standard practice but it works for me and is advocated by
Jobst Brandt:
http://draco.acs.uci.edu/rbfaq/FAQ/index.html - 8f

~PB


 




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