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Pre-RFD: uk.rec.cycling.moderated
Below is a draft of the formal RFD I plan to use to start the official
newsgroup creation process. I've been informally advised by a member of the usenet.org.uk Committee that we should sort out the exact proposed charter before taking the matter forward. So please take a look at the message below, and put forward your opinions. In particular: * Have I got the core of the charter right ? * Is this the right moderation policy ? * Is this the right crossposting policy ? * Is it right to make discussion of the moderation policy on topic in urcm ? * Is everyone happy for me to host the moderation panel email list and the moderation robot ? (I've had contributions of some good-looking code changes to STUMP so I imagine we'll be using that.) Also, we need some moderators. If you would like to put yourself forward, or suggest someone else, please post here in this thread. If you have problems with potential moderators, feel free also to email me privately if you prefer. I think we should be looking for a panel of around six moderators. I'm willing to volunteer. If you think I'd be a bad choice, please say so here or privately. Note that I have many of the trolls firmly killfiled. So please don't reply to the trolls in this thread, or reply to anyone else's replies to the trolls. Otherwise I may miss your important contributions. From: Ian Jackson Subject: RFD: uk.rec.cycling.moderated Newsgroups: uk.rec.cycling,uk.net.news.config,uk.net.news.anno unce Followup-to: uk.rec.cycling,uk.net.news.config uk.rec.cycling has for some time been suffering from an infestation of trolls, nym-shifters and forgeries. Many of these posters are hostile to cycling. There has even been real-world harassement such as abusive late night phone calls. Repetitive flamage now constitutes 50-75% of the group by number of articles. This ongoing and worsening problem has been making the group nearly unuseable for ordinary discussion. I therefore propose that we should create: uk.rec.cycling.moderated Cycling in the UK (Moderated) CHARTER This group is for the discussion of all matters relating to cycling in the UK. Recreational cycling, cycling for transport, racing, and other forms of cycling are all on-topic. Moderation will be used to ensure that the group remains civil, pleasant, and sympathetic to cyclists and cycling. The moderators may, as they see fit to achieve these goals: approve, reject, robomodorate, whitelist, blacklist, make enquiries, write and change detailed procedures or policies, delegate, and/or take other reasonable measures. In case of disagreement amongst the moderators, the majority of the moderation panel shall prevail. The moderation panel may vote to dismiss or appoint moderators. Crossposting to uk.rec.cycling is not normally permitted. Constructive discussion of the moderation policy is permitted in the newsgroup itself. uk.rec.cycling will remain as an unmoderated alternative; articles which are unsympathetic to cycling (for example, vehement opposition to cycling or cyclists, and full and frank discussions of transport policy) may be posted there or to other unmoderated groups in uk.*. Initial Moderators: To be determined INITIAL MODERATION POLICY Postings should be conducive to a civil and pleasant atmosphere, and remain sympathetic to cyclists and cycling. Each moderator will accept or reject postings based on their own judgement. The moderators will operate a whitelist system: new posters' messages will be manually moderated by whichever moderator happens to get to them first. Individual moderators may, when they consider a poster sensible, add the poster to the whitelist; whitelisted posters' messages will thereafter be posted automatically. Individual moderators may remove a poster from the whitelist, when they post inappropriate or borderline messages. Decisions by individual moderators to approve or reject postings may be appealed to the whole moderation panel. The panel would prefer this to be done privately to make it easier for the panel to overrule a mistaken moderator without anyone losing face. This policy will be updated by the moderation panel as they see fit. The moderators can be reached at http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/urcm/ DISCUSSION Discussion should be crossposted to uk.rec.cycling and uk.net.news.config. Only messages posted to uk.net.news.config form part of the official discussion. Readers from uk.rec.cycling are encouraged to read the discussion in uk.net.news.config just in case some articles are not properly crossposted to urc. Readers in uk.net.news.config should be aware that this proposal is likely to attract opposition from the trolls, and that many of the likely readers of uk.rec.cycling.moderated have those trolls killfiled - so adverse conclusions should not be drawn if such posts sometimes go unanswered. -- Ian Jackson personal email: These opinions are my own. http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~ijackson/ PGP2 key 1024R/0x23f5addb, fingerprint 5906F687 BD03ACAD 0D8E602E FCF37657 |
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Pre-RFD: uk.rec.cycling.moderated
On 26 May, 17:25, Ian Jackson wrote:
DRAFT RFD Hi Ian, Thank you very very much for starting this off. It looks pretty good to me at a first glance, but will think about it some more. I am certainly happy for you to be a moderator, and host the moderation list email and the robot. I will need to think further about whether or not discussion of the moderation policy is on topic - I feel it should be probably, but there are risks attached. If I go silent for a few days it is because I will be in Edinburgh and mostly away from email/usenet etc Rudi PS I am happy to volunteer as one of a panel of moderators if this is appropriate. Of course the people who have so disrupted urc will put themselves forwards as moderators. Obviously if this attempt to get a cycling friendly group is to succeed this should be prevented. |
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Pre-RFD: uk.rec.cycling.moderated
On May 26, 5:50*pm, RudiL wrote:
On 26 May, 17:25, Ian Jackson wrote: DRAFT RFD Hi Ian, * * * * *Thank you very very much for starting this off. It looks pretty good to me at a first glance, but will think about it some more. I am certainly happy for you to be a moderator, and host the moderation list email and the robot. I will need to think further about whether or not discussion of the moderation policy is on topic - I feel it should be probably, but there are risks attached. If I go silent for a few days it is because I will be in Edinburgh and mostly away from email/usenet etc Rudi PS I am happy to volunteer as one of a panel of moderators if this is appropriate. Of course the people who have so disrupted urc will put themselves forwards as moderators. Obviously if this attempt to get a cycling friendly group is to succeed this should be prevented. This all makes sense. Anything to stop these safespeed loons from disrupting the forum further- they forced the closure of Cycling Plus via similar threats and intimidation. |
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Pre-RFD: uk.rec.cycling.moderated
spindrift wrote:
On May 26, 5:50 pm, RudiL wrote: On 26 May, 17:25, Ian Jackson wrote: DRAFT RFD Hi Ian, Thank you very very much for starting this off. It looks pretty good to me at a first glance, but will think about it some more. I am certainly happy for you to be a moderator, and host the moderation list email and the robot. I will need to think further about whether or not discussion of the moderation policy is on topic - I feel it should be probably, but there are risks attached. If I go silent for a few days it is because I will be in Edinburgh and mostly away from email/usenet etc Rudi PS I am happy to volunteer as one of a panel of moderators if this is appropriate. Of course the people who have so disrupted urc will put themselves forwards as moderators. Obviously if this attempt to get a cycling friendly group is to succeed this should be prevented. This all makes sense. Anything to stop these safespeed loons from disrupting the forum further- they forced the closure of Cycling Plus via similar threats and intimidation. Be careful what you wish for! A very good case could be made for censoring the majority of both Doug's and your posts as being "loons" |
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Pre-RFD: uk.rec.cycling.moderated
You think?
What have I posted that justifies that please? |
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Pre-RFD: uk.rec.cycling.moderated
spindrift wrote:
You think? I do. What have I posted that justifies that please? I don't have any reference to hand( I delete posts as a I read them, and you have been killfiled for months) but your repeated postings of news about non-cycling traffic events/offences for example. To be honest I'm not at all keen on any sort of "moderation", but I would imagine that many of those that clamour for "them" to be shut up/out would also be clamoured against( Grammar?) by others. Want to put money on the nuxx thing , the judith thing and the new bod thing all wanting to see Guy censored? |
#7
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Pre-RFD: uk.rec.cycling.moderated
Ian Jackson wrote:
Moderation will be used to ensure that the group remains civil, pleasant, and sympathetic to cyclists and cycling. Postings should be conducive to a civil and pleasant atmosphere, and remain sympathetic to cyclists and cycling. Each moderator will accept or reject postings based on their own judgement. Does this include the idea of 'critical friend'? In as much as illustrating poor cycling habits but not of the '****wit runs red lights' variety which is common as muck in all cycling (and many non-cycling) ng's. Having trained adults to cycle I reckon they should all at least be able to do this lot (from local council website for adult cycle training) (how many can manage no. 13?) Level 1 Complete beginner You will be able to: 1. Carry out a simple bike check 2. Demonstrate understanding of safety equipment and clothing 3. Get on and off the bike 4. Start off and pedal 5. Stop the bike 6. Ride along independently 7. Make the bike go where they wish it to go (control the bike) 8. Use the gears correctly (if applicable) 9. Stop quickly and under control 10. Swerve to avoid objects 11. Look all around including behind, with control 12. Signal right and left with control 13. Look behind whilst signalling left and right with control Damn, here come the trolls -- Come to Dave & Boris - your cycle security experts. |
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Pre-RFD: uk.rec.cycling.moderated
'your repeated postings of news
about non-cycling traffic events/offences for example. ' Um, I've never done that. What are you talking about? |
#9
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Pre-RFD: uk.rec.cycling.moderated
On 26 May, 17:50, RudiL wrote:
On 26 May, 17:25, Ian Jackson wrote: DRAFT RFD Hi Ian, * * * * *Thank you very very much for starting this off. It looks pretty good to me at a first glance, but will think about it some more. I am certainly happy for you to be a moderator, and host the moderation list email and the robot. I will need to think further about whether or not discussion of the moderation policy is on topic - I feel it should be probably, but there are risks attached. If I go silent for a few days it is because I will be in Edinburgh and mostly away from email/usenet etc Rudi PS I am happy to volunteer as one of a panel of moderators if this is appropriate. Of course the people who have so disrupted urc will put themselves forwards as moderators. Obviously if this attempt to get a cycling friendly group is to succeed this should be prevented. Hi Ian, I am not sure about not normally allowing cross-posting to urc. This may be sensible as it would keep moderator work down as we wouldn't get quite so much trolling in reply to perfectly ordinary posts. However wouldn't the robomoderator mechanism deal with most of this? I am *not* arguing cross-posting should be allowed, just expressing some uncertainty in my view. Additionally I would like to propose the new group should have a regular (weekly?) posting to urc to advertise the existence of urcm to any regular cyclists who drop in there expecting to see normal cycling related discussions. Rudi |
#10
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Pre-RFD: uk.rec.cycling.moderated
spindrift wrote:
'your repeated postings of news about non-cycling traffic events/offences for example. ' Um, I've never done that. "Of course you haven't Malcolm!" What are you talking about? I'll point it out to you the next time you start? |
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