I'm absolutely furious!

Simon Brooke wrote:

And that helps someone with a bent trike how, precisely?

Thinking about this between the sodding stupid barriers on a bit of
off-road NCN1 last year it occurred to me that a 'bent trike of the
handcycle variety should be the benchmark for this sort of thing, with
nobody but its operator to get it around obstacles.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

John Hearns wrote:

I must grudgingly admit that these barriers aren't that bad to negotiate
when on a bike.

For differing values of "bike" it's not necessarily so easy though.
Anything with a long wheelbase, such as a tandem, or long frame such as
a 'bent, or something both long and wide like a cargo bike, will make it
much harder. I don't see it helps encourage cycling, even of just the 2
wheeled variety, if tandems are effectively excluded, especially as
that's exactly the sort of vehicle a disabled rider would be likely to
be on.

Grrrrr.

Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/

Simon Brooke wrote:

A bit of Googling reveals that there are standards for how such
barriers should be laid out. I made a quick visit with a tape measure,
and lo and behold these ones measured up.
The barriers need to be constructed thus (from above):

0--------------------0



0---------------0 0----------------0



And that helps someone with a bent trike how, precisely?


Surely if it's a bent trike it'll fit through? The straight ones might
have problems, though. :-)

R.

On Wed, 11 May 2005 08:40:29 +0100, Peter Clinch wrote:

John Hearns wrote:

I must grudgingly admit that these barriers aren't that bad to negotiate
when on a bike.

For differing values of "bike" it's not necessarily so easy though.
Anything with a long wheelbase, such as a tandem, or long frame such as
a 'bent, or something both long and wide like a cargo bike, will make it
much harder. I don't see it helps encourage cycling, even of just the 2
wheeled variety, if tandems are effectively excluded, especially as
that's exactly the sort of vehicle a disabled rider would be likely to
be on.
I agree.
And as I said before, I agree with your earlier post regarding barriers.
Why should 'we' - we meaning the normal people who walk, go shopping,
push prams, ride bikes, take children out on bikes, use wheelchairs,
be inconvenienced because some yobboes ride their idiot scooters up
and down?
Said scooter riders will find a way round barriers anyway, either
bypassing them or cutting down fences.

Simon Brooke wrote:
in message , John Hearns
') wrote:
A bit of Googling reveals that there are standards for how such
barriers should be laid out. I made a quick visit with a tape measure,
and lo and behold these ones measured up.
The barriers need to be constructed thus (from above):

0--------------------0



0---------------0 0----------------0

And that helps someone with a bent trike how, precisely?

Make it benter?

Colin

in message , Peter Clinch
') wrote:

Simon Brooke wrote:

And that helps someone with a bent trike how, precisely?

Thinking about this between the sodding stupid barriers on a bit of
off-road NCN1 last year it occurred to me that a 'bent trike of the
handcycle variety should be the benchmark for this sort of thing, with
nobody but its operator to get it around obstacles.

Absolutely. Russ, are you reading this? Would you be a campaign
posterboy?

--
(Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; 99% of browsers can't run ActiveX controls. Unfortunately
;; 99% of users are using the 1% of browsers that can...
[seen on /. 08:04:02]

"Colin Blackburn" wrote in message
...
Simon Brooke wrote:
in message , John Hearns
') wrote:
A bit of Googling reveals that there are standards for how such
barriers should be laid out. I made a quick visit with a tape measure,
and lo and behold these ones measured up.
The barriers need to be constructed thus (from above):

0--------------------0



0---------------0 0----------------0

And that helps someone with a bent trike how, precisely?

Make it benter?

Colin

I have a set of gates like that on one route on my commute, only there are
only two overlapping railings to create the "gate", bordered by walls. It's
easy to get through on a normal bike, and now that I have 1200km on my
hurricane, I can get through most times without putting a foot down on that.
Pretty difficult, so it really makes my day when I get through both sets of
gates without touching down.

On 2005-05-10 14:51 +0000, Peter Clinch wrote:
wrote:

According to sustrans, I am not the only one who has complained about
this particular gate. Apparently it has been constructed by the
Environment Agency itself to "deter motorcyclists". I find this
particularly amusing because:

a) I have *never* *ever* seen a motorcyclist on the tow path

Well, that shows how well it works... ;-/

Nor me... before the gate went in, that is. Or after.

b) It is impossible to see how a motorcyclist could gain any advantage
by using the tow path as compare to local road

I imagine its intention is to stop yoof zooming up and down on it on the
sort of thing that would get them arrested toot sweet if they tried it
on the Queen's Highway.

I've not seen yooves yobbing it on PTWs down that way, but it seems to be
quite a popular yoof activity elsewhere in Oxford. The canal towpath in
question links the ring road cycle path (and thus several estates),
central Oxford, and Abingdon.

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?ll=51....12680,0.013131
The gate is right next to a manned lock, so it might be worth asking the
lockkeeper how much of a problem he's seen.

That said, it's a *crap* gate: it's almost impossible to fit a standard-
sized bike into the middle space, heaven help anyone on a trike,
recumbent, or tandem. Obviously you have to dismount, and the design is
such that it would be quite easy to damage your machine.
It also has a silly little sign on it, next to the RADAR padlock,
declaring that the gate is not locked. So, er, why does it have the lock
in the first place?

--
Andrew Chadwick

Simon Brooke wrote:
in message , Peter Clinch
Simon Brooke wrote:

And that helps someone with a bent trike how, precisely?

Thinking about this between the sodding stupid barriers on a bit of
off-road NCN1 last year it occurred to me that a 'bent trike of the
handcycle variety should be the benchmark for this sort of thing, with
nobody but its operator to get it around obstacles.

Absolutely. Russ, are you reading this? Would you be a campaign
posterboy?

For another possible benchmark, http://www.greenspeed.com.au/Darke384.jpg
is a recumbent tandem tricycle handcycle - a second person, but a more
awkward vehicle.

More on Karen, the paraplegic rider, he
http://www.bluedome.co.uk/MoutainBik.../alpbikes.html
http://www.equaladventure.co.uk/interventure/team.htm
(She's a friend of a friend.)

John Hearns wrote:

And as I said before, I agree with your earlier post regarding barriers.
Why should 'we' - we meaning the normal people who walk, go shopping,
push prams, ride bikes, take children out on bikes, use wheelchairs,
be inconvenienced because some yobboes ride their idiot scooters up
and down?
Said scooter riders will find a way round barriers anyway, either
bypassing them or cutting down fences.


Perhaps a simple answer would be to amend the law on homicide to extend
the circumstances where homicide is legal to encompass the killing of
any motorised vehicle driver/rider who drives/rides a vehicle in a
public place where the vehicle is not permitted.

It would be something like the ancient idea of making someone an outlaw,
i.e. someone who is not protected by the law. My guess is that this
would be a considerable deterrent and few people would actually be
killed. It might even be possible, if the figures for deaths caused by
such people at present are at all significant and are taken into
account, to argue there will be fewer deaths.

--
Joe * If I cannot be free I'll be cheap