Going clipless

Tom Sherman schreef:
Lou Holtman wrote:
Tom Sherman schreef:
Andre Jute wrote:
Since my Brooks saddle seems to permit me to pedal more powerfully, I
thought I might reinforce efficiency with positive location of my feet
on the full rotation of the pedal stroke.

Is this a good idea for someone who all his life has used platform
pedals?

Is there any reason, if I decide to go ahead, not to buy the Shimano
PD-M520 SPD pedals?

Would the PD-M424 dual platform/SPD pedals be a better choice for me?
Or the 324, which can take the SH56 cleats?

Should I order a set of SM-SH56 Multi-Release Cleats with whichever
pedals I decide on or are the Single-Release Cleats easy to learn to
use?

A less expensive alternative to clipless systems and easier for the
novice to use are Power Grips: http://powergrips.mrpbike.com/.



Geez Tom, clipping and unclipping isn't rock science you know. Less
expensive? Shimano PD-M520 are 20 euro's. Andre doesn't need more
unless he wants a stainless steel axle. I think his bike is over 3000
euro now, I think he can manage 20 euro's more.

You missed the point. Andre Jute (or anyone else) can ride in normal
shoes with Power Grips, unlike SPuDs or other clipless systems which
require special shoes, most of which look like something a court jester
might have worn.

Another data point is Andrew Muzi, who rides to work with clips, straps
and traditional smooth soled leather dress shoes. Power Grips would work
with dress shoes, SPuDs and other clipless systems would not.



Oh, you had me confused with the 'easier for the novice' and 'less
expensive alternative'. IMO you look more like a dork trying to 'race'
with smooth soled leather dress shoes and power grips than with a
'moderate' looking SPD shoes an clipless pedals. Well, lots of choices.

Lou

Lou Holtman wrote:
Tom Sherman schreef:
Lou Holtman wrote:
Tom Sherman schreef:
Andre Jute wrote:
Since my Brooks saddle seems to permit me to pedal more powerfully, I
thought I might reinforce efficiency with positive location of my feet
on the full rotation of the pedal stroke.

Is this a good idea for someone who all his life has used platform
pedals?

Is there any reason, if I decide to go ahead, not to buy the Shimano
PD-M520 SPD pedals?

Would the PD-M424 dual platform/SPD pedals be a better choice for me?
Or the 324, which can take the SH56 cleats?

Should I order a set of SM-SH56 Multi-Release Cleats with whichever
pedals I decide on or are the Single-Release Cleats easy to learn to
use?

A less expensive alternative to clipless systems and easier for the
novice to use are Power Grips: http://powergrips.mrpbike.com/.



Geez Tom, clipping and unclipping isn't rock science you know. Less
expensive? Shimano PD-M520 are 20 euro's. Andre doesn't need more
unless he wants a stainless steel axle. I think his bike is over 3000
euro now, I think he can manage 20 euro's more.

You missed the point. Andre Jute (or anyone else) can ride in normal
shoes with Power Grips, unlike SPuDs or other clipless systems which
require special shoes, most of which look like something a court
jester might have worn.

Another data point is Andrew Muzi, who rides to work with clips,
straps and traditional smooth soled leather dress shoes. Power Grips
would work with dress shoes, SPuDs and other clipless systems would not.



Oh, you had me confused with the 'easier for the novice' and 'less
expensive alternative'. IMO you look more like a dork trying to 'race'
with smooth soled leather dress shoes and power grips than with a
'moderate' looking SPD shoes an clipless pedals. Well, lots of choices.

Based on the past posts of Andre Jute, we can assume with relative
certainty that he will be riding for fitness/recreation and not racing.

--
Tom Sherman - 42.435731,-83.985007
LOCAL CACTUS EATS CYCLIST - datakoll

GaryX wrote:
On Mar 19, 7:09 pm, Andre Jute wrote:
Since my Brooks saddle seems to permit me to pedal more powerfully, I
thought I might reinforce efficiency with positive location of my feet
on the full rotation of the pedal stroke.

Is this a good idea for someone who all his life has used platform
pedals?


I've never known anybody who has tried clipless to go back to flats.

The principal advantage to clipless is that they remove the need to keep
pressure on the pedal through the full cycle (to prevent slippage). That
is the source of their efficiency. "Pulling up" isn't a good idea from a
safety point of view and it gains nothing.

Is there any reason, if I decide to go ahead, not to buy the Shimano
PD-M520 SPD pedals?

I've used many models of Shimano SPD, they've all been very good.


Would the PD-M424 dual platform/SPD pedals be a better choice for me?
Or the 324, which can take the SH56 cleats?

I have had a pair of dual platform/SPD pedals for several years, they're
currently on my errand bike. They work fine. If you are going to use
cleated shoes exclusively I wouldn't bother with them, as they're a
slight nuisance to flip over to engage. It is nice to be able to have at
least one bike that you can ride with whatever you happen to have on
your feet though.

Should I order a set of SM-SH56 Multi-Release Cleats with whichever
pedals I decide on or are the Single-Release Cleats easy to learn to
use?

Opinions vary. I much prefer the multi-release cleats, but I seem to be
in a minority. The difference between the two is that single release
only releases with a "yaw" (in or out) motion of the heel. Multi-release
does that and also releases with a "roll" of the foot. The complaint
usually levied on the latter is that it's too easy to inadvertently roll
out of the pedals. I don't find this to be true. I find the roll motion
more natural to disengage and have never had a problem with
unintentional releases. I don't think there's any difference in ease of
learning, and they relative advantages of one cleat over the other are
relatively small, I don't mean to overstate them.

It's important to adjust the cleats (side-to-side) when initially
mounting to the shoe so that the cleats are centered with respect to the
foot force, there's about 1/2" of adjustment built in to the cleat. It's
also extremely important to set the "toe in" angle of the cleats,
getting this wrong can put a lot of stress on the knee. Finally, most
shoes have a pretty large range of front-to-back adjustment (multiple
sets of holes in the mounting plate). That adjustment is less critical
but can affect ankle articulation.


The bottom line with cleats vs. flat pedals is that with cleats your
foot can't find its natural position. You have to know what that
position is and set up the cleats accordingly. Observe how your foot
lies on the flat pedal and try to match it. Be wary of any initial
discomfort and make adjustments soon.

Peter Cole wrote:
"Pulling up" isn't a good idea from a
safety point of view and it gains nothing.


"Pulling up" may be necessary when climbing steep hills out of the
saddle. I use Shimano PD-M520 pedals and have never had a problem
pulling up on them.

Art Harris

I hate riding in anything except cycling shoes or sandals. Always
clipped in. I have the SPD 520 pedals. They work fine. I think I
have both the single release and multi release SPD cleats. Both work
fine. Can't tell which one I am using where. Since I only use
cycling shoes, I do not want that extra platform around the SPD
mechanism interfering with the clipping in and sole of the shoe. No
platform pedals for me.




On Mar 19, 6:09*pm, Andre Jute wrote:
Since my Brooks saddle seems to permit me to pedal more powerfully, I
thought I might reinforce efficiency with positive location of my feet
on the full rotation of the pedal stroke.

Is this a good idea for someone who all his life has used platform
pedals?

Is there any reason, if I decide to go ahead, not to buy the Shimano
PD-M520 SPD pedals?

Would the PD-M424 dual platform/SPD pedals be a better choice for me?
Or the 324, which can take the SH56 cleats?

Should I order a set of SM-SH56 Multi-Release Cleats with whichever
pedals I decide on or are the Single-Release Cleats easy to learn to
use?

Thanks.

Andre Jute
Exploring ways and means

Andre Jute wrote:
Since my Brooks saddle seems to permit me to pedal more powerfully, I
thought I might reinforce efficiency with positive location of my feet
on the full rotation of the pedal stroke.

Is this a good idea for someone who all his life has used platform
pedals?


Yes, definitely. At first set the release tension near minimum.
Practice clipping in and out a few times with one foot on the ground
to get the feel of it. Riding on a trainer is even better. On your
first real ride with them, stay very focused. Anticipate unclipping as
you approach intersections. After a few rides, it will become second
nature.


Is there any reason, if I decide to go ahead, not to buy the Shimano
PD-M520 SPD pedals?


That would be a good choice. I've been using them on two bikes for
several years. I would recommend getting touring style shoes, rather
than hard core MTB shoes that have clunky soles.

Would the PD-M424 dual platform/SPD pedals be a better choice for me?
Or the 324, which can take the SH56 cleats?


Do those have a platform on one side and click-in on the other? I
think you would be better off with dual SPD for ease of clicking in
without having to look down.



Should I order a set of SM-SH56 Multi-Release Cleats with whichever
pedals I decide on or are the Single-Release Cleats easy to learn to
use?


Multi-release cleats are more prone to accidental release which is not
a good thing.

Make sure you install the cleats so that the ball of your foot is
either directly over the pedal spindle, or slightly forward of the
spindle. Get the cleat bolts tight, and re-check them after the first
couple of rides. If the bolts get loose, you won't be able to unclip.

Art Harris

On 20 Mar, 11:49, Tom Sherman
wrote:


You missed the point. Andre Jute (or anyone else) can ride in normal
shoes with Power Grips, unlike SPuDs or other clipless systems which
require special shoes, most of which look like something a court jester
might have worn.

Another data point is Andrew Muzi, who rides to work with clips, straps
and traditional smooth soled leather dress shoes. Power Grips would work
with dress shoes, SPuDs and other clipless systems would not.

A less outrageous look would be a heavy toestrap used alone. Set up
at an angle just like the PGs. I didn't use them like this, but I
know a man who did.

TJ

Tom Sherman schreef:
Lou Holtman wrote:
Tom Sherman schreef:
Lou Holtman wrote:
Tom Sherman schreef:
Andre Jute wrote:
Since my Brooks saddle seems to permit me to pedal more powerfully, I
thought I might reinforce efficiency with positive location of my
feet
on the full rotation of the pedal stroke.

Is this a good idea for someone who all his life has used platform
pedals?

Is there any reason, if I decide to go ahead, not to buy the Shimano
PD-M520 SPD pedals?

Would the PD-M424 dual platform/SPD pedals be a better choice for me?
Or the 324, which can take the SH56 cleats?

Should I order a set of SM-SH56 Multi-Release Cleats with whichever
pedals I decide on or are the Single-Release Cleats easy to learn to
use?

A less expensive alternative to clipless systems and easier for the
novice to use are Power Grips: http://powergrips.mrpbike.com/.



Geez Tom, clipping and unclipping isn't rock science you know. Less
expensive? Shimano PD-M520 are 20 euro's. Andre doesn't need more
unless he wants a stainless steel axle. I think his bike is over
3000 euro now, I think he can manage 20 euro's more.

You missed the point. Andre Jute (or anyone else) can ride in normal
shoes with Power Grips, unlike SPuDs or other clipless systems which
require special shoes, most of which look like something a court
jester might have worn.

Another data point is Andrew Muzi, who rides to work with clips,
straps and traditional smooth soled leather dress shoes. Power Grips
would work with dress shoes, SPuDs and other clipless systems would not.



Oh, you had me confused with the 'easier for the novice' and 'less
expensive alternative'. IMO you look more like a dork trying to 'race'
with smooth soled leather dress shoes and power grips than with a
'moderate' looking SPD shoes an clipless pedals. Well, lots of choices.

Based on the past posts of Andre Jute, we can assume with relative
certainty that he will be riding for fitness/recreation and not racing.


I put race between quotes. Andre's goal is a more powerful/efficient
pedalstroke. With his scientific approach he will make the right choice
and with no doubt give us a full report of his findings ;-)

Lou

In article
,
bookieb wrote:

shoe selection.
I like the cheaper end of the Shimano shoe range, particularly the
touring shoes, but I have narrow feet. Some people with wider feet
complain that Shimano shoes are a narrow fit.

Problem with some Shimano shoes is not the width.
The width is typically wide enough. For some
inexplicable reason they do not put in enough
top on some models. Bizarre. Turn a perfectly
good sole into the Spanish Inquisition.

--
Michael Press
Did not expect that, did you?

Michael Press wrote:
In article
,
bookieb wrote:

shoe selection.
I like the cheaper end of the Shimano shoe range, particularly the
touring shoes, but I have narrow feet. Some people with wider feet
complain that Shimano shoes are a narrow fit.

Problem with some Shimano shoes is not the width.
The width is typically wide enough. For some
inexplicable reason they do not put in enough
top on some models. Bizarre. Turn a perfectly
good sole into the Spanish Inquisition.

Now that you mention it, the greater size of the top is the main
difference between the Shimano and SiDi Mega shoes of the same nominal
size, as the soles have almost identical footprints, but the Shimano
shoes are much tighter on my forefeet.

--
Tom Sherman - 42.435731,-83.985007
LOCAL CACTUS EATS CYCLIST - datakoll