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Schwalbe Marathon Plus Failure



 
 
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  #31  
Old September 8th 08, 06:23 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Pete Biggs
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Posts: 1,801
Default Schwalbe Marathon Plus Failure

Roger Merriman wrote:

Except in special cases for special bikes, sidewalls are reinforced
to make the sidwalls more durable, not to make the tyre more
pinch-flat resistant. Skinwalls are prone to getting cut and split.

some are, some are talking about pinch flats.


They might be talking BS - which wouldn't be an unusual thing for a tyre
manufacturer to do.

I didn't notice very much difference anyway when comparing M+ to
Specialzed Nimbus EX. (Same bike, same size tyres, same pressure).
The Nimbuses have skinny sidewalls.


what sizes? rember i'm talking ballon tires really, 35-38mm i noticed
quite a lot of differance between the various tires i've had on there.


Same here, 38mm. Not on one of my own bikes, to be fair, so I haven't
ridden it a great deal, but one I do the odd job on. In fact I'll be
fitting a new wheel to it soon and transfering the tyre, so I'll remind
myself what the M+ sidewalls feel like. I don't remember them being much
out of the ordinary.

~PB


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  #32  
Old September 8th 08, 06:32 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Roger Merriman
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Posts: 2,108
Default Schwalbe Marathon Plus Failure

Pete Biggs wrote:

Roger Merriman wrote:

A pinch flat happens when the tyre gets completely compressed.

Feel how easy it is to completely compress the tyre when it is
uninflated. Compare it to the inflated tyre and think how many times
harder it is. The difference in resistance between the M+'s
sidewalls and the skinniest sidewalls possible is dwarfed by the
tremendous force of the compressed air.

lots of companies would disagree, since a fair number produce tires
with reforced sidewalls, from MTB to BMX and all between, and around.


Except in special cases for special bikes, sidewalls are reinforced to make
the sidwalls more durable, not to make the tyre more pinch-flat resistant.
Skinwalls are prone to getting cut and split.

some are, some are talking about pinch flats.

we are not talking 200PSI here but 80PSI most tires have a bit of give
at that pressure,


Of course there is give, but it takes many more times the force to get that
give (compress the air) than it takes to compress the sidewalls. Try
completely compressing your tyres at 80 psi with your fingers (you won't be
able to). Now try at 0 psi (you will be able to easily). Note the huge
difference.

That alone should prove to you that the sidewalls can do hardly anything to
prevent pinch flats. The force from your fingers is nothing compared to the
force of hitting a bump with your weight on the bike.

marthons compared to some tires give a much harsher ride, for given
pressure, compared to the three types of tires on before the Marthon
pluses are harsh, not just I rereviews it comes up.


The whole tyre material, not just the sidewalls, contributes to rolling
resisance and how harsh a tyre feels. M+ has an unusually thick layer under
the tread. But still it's very little compared to the resistance from
compressed air.

i don't think the plus feel much differnet to the standard which i have
on another bike and feels equally fairly harsh.

I didn't notice very much difference anyway when comparing M+ to Specialzed
Nimbus EX. (Same bike, same size tyres, same pressure). The Nimbuses have
skinny sidewalls.


what sizes? rember i'm talking ballon tires really, 35-38mm i noticed
quite a lot of differance between the various tires i've had on there.

I'm still skeptical that your differing experience was anything to
do with the amount protection that the tyres themselves provided.
I'm thinking maybe they were actually inflated differently, or it
was just coincidence.

i kept the land cruisers for a while and upped the pressures to
100PSI from the max psi of 65PSI but it still got the odd pinch
flats, with the marthon + at a lower PSI of 80 or lower i've never
had a pinch flat.

Something funny was going on to get pinch flats (if that's what they
were) with wide tyres at 100 psi, and it was nothing to do with the
sidewall, IMHO.

as almost all my weight is on the rear, with all the gear in the
paniers the bike is 50lb unlaided, i don't hang about nor care too
much with that bike as to speed bumps etc, even with the pluses you
can feel a fair amount of give as the tire deflects a bit, i'm fairly
brutish to that bike as it's the work horse, it gets the job done.

Sometimes a problem with the rim or rim tape can cause a puncture
that looks like a pinch-flat. Or you may be riding differently now,
or having better luck with what you don't hit.

unlikely as I feel the rim hit, much as one would pre suspention going
though rock gardens if you fluffed your line.


A big impact with a hard tyre can feel lke the rim is hitting when it
actually isn't. But if the rim really is hitting then you need even higher
pressure. +10 psi will make far more difference than that from different
sidewalls.

same "oof" but if you bottom out you'll feel the rim touch down, and
think oh shoot or what ever.

with the marthons i can feel the tire bulge under the load but it
doesn't attaully bottom out.

I feel sorry for your wheels! :-)

you should do the rears last no time at all, few months maybe then the
hubs give out, get to the point where i have two wheel stearing...

~PB


roger
--
www.rogermerriman.com
  #33  
Old September 8th 08, 11:55 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
[email protected]
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Posts: 257
Default Schwalbe Marathon Plus Failure

On Sep 9, 2:23*am, "Pete Biggs"
p...@pomegranateremovehighlyimpracticalfruitbiggs .tc wrote:
Roger Merriman wrote:
Except in special cases for special bikes, sidewalls are reinforced
to make the sidwalls more durable, not to make the tyre more
pinch-flat resistant. Skinwalls are prone to getting cut and split.


some are, some are talking about pinch flats.


They might be talking BS - which wouldn't be an unusual thing for a tyre
manufacturer to do.


While I am agnostic about the value of tougher sidewalls for pinch
flats, it should be noted that the pinch requires not only that the
walls are pushed together, but that the pressure between them is high
enough to cut through the inner tube. It seems plausible that a
thicker sidewall might help with this by spreading out the pressure
point, blunting the impact a bit.

James
  #35  
Old September 9th 08, 09:12 AM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Pete Biggs
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Posts: 1,801
Default Schwalbe Marathon Plus Failure

Roger Merriman wrote:

rember i'm talking ballon tires really, 35-38mm i noticed
quite a lot of differance between the various tires i've had on there.


Were your previous tyres 35mm and your current ones 38mm? 35mm tyres need
more psi to get the same protection.

with the marthons i can feel the tire bulge under the load but it
doesn't attaully bottom out.


It will bottom out just as easily as any other tyre (I can do it with my
fingers when uninflated), but perhaps the thick padding under the tread
makes it feel as if it isn't.

I feel sorry for your wheels! :-)

you should do the rears last no time at all, few months maybe then the
hubs give out, get to the point where i have two wheel stearing...


Boringly, I would ride more carefullly!

~PB


  #36  
Old September 9th 08, 11:06 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Tom Anderson
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Posts: 746
Default Schwalbe Marathon Plus Failure

On Mon, 8 Sep 2008, Pete Biggs wrote:

Roger Merriman wrote:

Except in special cases for special bikes, sidewalls are reinforced to
make the sidwalls more durable, not to make the tyre more pinch-flat
resistant. Skinwalls are prone to getting cut and split.


some are, some are talking about pinch flats.


They might be talking BS - which wouldn't be an unusual thing for a tyre
manufacturer to do.


Really? I would have thought they'd be more likely to be talking DIN.



tom

--
Baby got a masterplan. A foolproof masterplan.
  #37  
Old September 10th 08, 02:39 AM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Rob Morley
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Posts: 7,173
Default Schwalbe Marathon Plus Failure

On Tue, 9 Sep 2008 23:06:44 +0100
Tom Anderson wrote:

On Mon, 8 Sep 2008, Pete Biggs wrote:

are, some are talking about pinch flats.

They might be talking BS - which wouldn't be an unusual thing for a
tyre manufacturer to do.


Really? I would have thought they'd be more likely to be talking DIN.

Is that your coat by the door? :-)

  #38  
Old September 10th 08, 05:33 PM posted to uk.rec.cycling
Tom Anderson
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Posts: 746
Default Schwalbe Marathon Plus Failure

On Wed, 10 Sep 2008, Rob Morley wrote:

On Tue, 9 Sep 2008 23:06:44 +0100
Tom Anderson wrote:

On Mon, 8 Sep 2008, Pete Biggs wrote:

are, some are talking about pinch flats.

They might be talking BS - which wouldn't be an unusual thing for a
tyre manufacturer to do.


Really? I would have thought they'd be more likely to be talking DIN.


Is that your coat by the door? :-)


I'm here all week, folks!

tom

--
And dear lord, its like peaches in a lacy napkin. -- James Dearden
  #39  
Old November 21st 17, 06:59 AM posted to uk.rec.cycling
[email protected]
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Posts: 1
Default Schwalbe Marathon Plus Failure


I had the exact same failure on my last Schwalbe Marathon rear tyre after 6 months of light use. Unfortunately it was one week out of warranty and the seller refused any service and also censored my polite but honest review of the product on their website.

I have been through a few marathons before and not had this problem, so I hope this is a one-off but now I'm on a cheaper competitor's tyre and so far so good.
 




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